The stats don't seem to show it worked.third coast.. said:
If you eliminate 50% of the possible pitches coming that is a huuuuuuuge advantage. These guys also know the tendencies of the pitchers theybare facing. They have so much info, knowing the general speed and location of a pitch is massive.
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One of the biggest things is also knowing not to chase an offspeed. If it starts out a ball and you know it's about to drop or slide, easier to lay off.
That was what the Farquhar incident shows
That was what the Farquhar incident shows
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https://www.mlb.com/amp/news/best-hitters-against-each-pitch-type-2019-season.html
Best hitters by pitch type....Yes, Trout but Yordan not too shabby
Best hitters by pitch type....Yes, Trout but Yordan not too shabby
Plus you get to pay freight. Funny stuff.
I'm choosing to believe the Astros are going to use this as a rallying call.
I am curious about future years now though and am slightly worried.
I am curious about future years now though and am slightly worried.
Any guesses on when the investigation into the Red Sox cheating in 2018 will conclude? Anyone holding their breathe?
Wabs said:
Any guesses on when the investigation into the Red Sox cheating in 2018 will conclude? Anyone holding their breathe?
It just started today. Astros investigation was about 2 months. Cora is going to get fooked
I want to know the other 8 teams. If MLB is going to do this to the Astros, it needs to fully investigate the others.
Guessing Cora with a ban and Red Sox with a fine. Nowhere near the punishment given to the Astros...despite Boston having recent history using tech to steal signs. Yankees will walk.
This is the way.
This is the way.
Rosenthal thinks Crane, Manfred and the players all shoulder the burden.
Quote:
Yes, forgive me for being just slightly cynical about everyone connected to this shameful episode, including former Astros bench coach Alex Cora, who is prominently mentioned in Manfred's nine-page report, but will not be disciplined until baseball concludes its investigation of the Red Sox's sign-stealing with Cora as manager in 2018, first reported by The Athletic last week.
As in the Steroid Era another period in baseball history in which broad rules and lax enforcement created a lawless environment people at every level of the sport bear responsibility for this mess.
Fumbleruski said:
Guessing Cora with a ban and Red Sox with a fine. Nowhere near the punishment given to the Astros...despite Boston having recent history using tech to steal signs. Yankees will walk.
This is the way.
If that happens someone from the Stros better go scorched earth.
Rosenthal can EAD.redline248 said:
Rosenthal thinks Crane, Manfred and the players all shoulder the burden.Quote:
Yes, forgive me for being just slightly cynical about everyone connected to this shameful episode, including former Astros bench coach Alex Cora, who is prominently mentioned in Manfred's nine-page report, but will not be disciplined until baseball concludes its investigation of the Red Sox's sign-stealing with Cora as manager in 2018, first reported by The Athletic last week.
As in the Steroid Era another period in baseball history in which broad rules and lax enforcement created a lawless environment people at every level of the sport bear responsibility for this mess.
Literally F Rosenthal. He has had it out for the organization since the Osuna deal. Then he really had it out for the organization after the Taubman incident. Unless I'm thinking of someone different.
agdaddy04 said:Fumbleruski said:
Guessing Cora with a ban and Red Sox with a fine. Nowhere near the punishment given to the Astros...despite Boston having recent history using tech to steal signs. Yankees will walk.
This is the way.
If that happens someone from the Stros better go scorched earth.
After today, this is not going to happen. Crane is not going to rock the boat.
That should have been what they did today.
Curious if they interviewed Martin and if so did they ask about what he brought to the Twins last season.
If I remember correctly, Ken Rosenthal and Evan Drellich were the ones who broke this whole story, and assumingly were the ones who Mike Fiers went on the record with.Beat40 said:
Literally F Rosenthal. He has had it out for the organization since the Osuna deal. Then he really had it out for the organization after the Taubman incident. Unless I'm thinking of someone different.
This particular article isn't so much anti Astros as it is a big "shame on you" to everyone in the sport, imo. I think he's being particularly critical of Manfred.
He also said anyone that thinks the Astros should lose the WS title is a moron and should stfu
He also said anyone that thinks the Astros should lose the WS title is a moron and should stfu
agproducer said:
I want to know the other 8 teams. If MLB is going to do this to the Astros, it needs to fully investigate the others.
Since they used us to send the message, other teams will get no where near the harshness. I doubt we'll ever know the other teams outside of the Red Sox. MLB was forced into issuing penalties from the article that came out 3 months back. If that article doesn't come out, no one is investiagated.
redline248 said:
This particular article isn't so much anti Astros as it is a big "shame on you" to everyone in the sport, imo. I think he's being particularly critical of Manfred.
He also said anyone that thinks the Astros should lose the WS title is a moron and should stfu
I didn't read it, admittedly, so that is a decen thing. Still, that dude wanted Lunhow fired over the Taubmen incident.
agdaddy04 said:Fumbleruski said:
Guessing Cora with a ban and Red Sox with a fine. Nowhere near the punishment given to the Astros...despite Boston having recent history using tech to steal signs. Yankees will walk.
This is the way.
If that happens someone from the Stros better go scorched earth.
There's nobody left to rock the boat. Hell, there's nobody even in the boat. The 3 guys running the thing got canned. Crane and his son are the only ones left and Crane went belly up.
Beat40 said:redline248 said:
This particular article isn't so much anti Astros as it is a big "shame on you" to everyone in the sport, imo. I think he's being particularly critical of Manfred.
He also said anyone that thinks the Astros should lose the WS title is a moron and should stfu
I didn't read it, admittedly, so that is a decen thing. Still, that dude wanted Lunhow fired over the Taubmen incident.
To be fair, he did go on a bit about the so called culture problem. He wasn't easy on the Astros by any means, and put some of the onus on Crane.
that crossed my mind too. Marwin was probably close to Beltran and Cora.
also have to wonder about McCann --- gotta think a catcher was consulted
also have to wonder about McCann --- gotta think a catcher was consulted
They won't. Crane and the rest of the ownership will keep their head down. The press conference today basically laid out the fact that the Stros will be taking it. Sign stealing using technological methods is obviously a systemic issue in modern baseball today, but MLB will not mess with their market flagship teams. Regardless of what some of us Houston fans like to think, the Astros are not a MLB blue blood in the eyes of the sport. Handing down a harsh penalty to a mid level team was an easy way for the league to say that they've dealt with the issue without upsetting their key markets.
I honestly didn't read it because I canceled my Athletic sub because of Rosenthal/Drellich. I will never forgive them for that article along with how over the top Rosenthal was over the Taubman incident.redline248 said:
This particular article isn't so much anti Astros as it is a big "shame on you" to everyone in the sport, imo. I think he's being particularly critical of Manfred.
He also said anyone that thinks the Astros should lose the WS title is a moron and should stfu
Beat40 said:agproducer said:
I want to know the other 8 teams. If MLB is going to do this to the Astros, it needs to fully investigate the others.
Since they used us to send the message, other teams will get no where near the harshness. I doubt we'll ever know the other teams outside of the Red Sox. MLB was forced into issuing penalties from the article that came out 3 months back. If that article doesn't come out, no one is investiagated.
It is just wishful thinking. Some teams will still do it after this.
If MLB was truly serious about rooting out all of it, they'd go after all the other teams.
But, think about it: The Astros are giving up $5 million and 4 high draft picks for WS title. We also lose Luhnow and Hinch. Was it worth it?
And just FYI, when people start claiming Altuve didn't deserve the 2017 MVP, have them check out his home/road splits that season. His OPS was .250 points higher on the road.
BoSox will not be punished as an organization because MLB has dick punched the Astros and now players will clam up just in time for the other investigations to get started. Astro players were rubes and figured it was not that big of a deal, everyone was doing it to some degree. Players knew Astros had filed official complaints against several organizations and it was a systemic issue across all of MLB.
Now, knowing that people will get serious suspensions and loss of draft picks, the information well will dry up very quickly as everyone clams up and it will just go down in history as an Astro problem instead of what it really was.
Cora will get a punishment based on being a lower level employee of the Astros during this scandal, nothing will come of the 2018 Red Sox because no one will talk. I figure he will get a 60 day suspension for being an assistant coach who was never told by leadership to stop the practice.
Now, knowing that people will get serious suspensions and loss of draft picks, the information well will dry up very quickly as everyone clams up and it will just go down in history as an Astro problem instead of what it really was.
Cora will get a punishment based on being a lower level employee of the Astros during this scandal, nothing will come of the 2018 Red Sox because no one will talk. I figure he will get a 60 day suspension for being an assistant coach who was never told by leadership to stop the practice.
agsquirrel97 said:
BoSox will not be punished as an organization because MLB has dick punched the Astros and now players will clam up just in time for the other investigations to get started. Astro players were rubes and figured it was not that big of a deal, everyone was doing it to some degree. Players knew Astros had filed official complaints against several organizations and it was a systemic issue across all of MLB.
Now, knowing that people will get serious suspensions and loss of draft picks, the information well will dry up very quickly as everyone clams up and it will just go down in history as an Astro problem instead of what it really was.
Cora will get a punishment based on being a lower level employee of the Astros during this scandal, nothing will come of the 2018 Red Sox because no one will talk. I figure he will get a 60 day suspension for being an assistant coach who was never told by leadership to stop the practice.
I think Cora will be getting a lifetime ban
I'm an Astros fan and will always be but it's hard not to be bitter as hell towards Major League Baseball unless they actually lay down some big punishments against some of these other organizations.
Yes. A championship is always worth it.
ccaggie05 said:
I'm an Astros fan and will always be but it's hard not to be bitter as hell towards Major League Baseball unless they actually lay down some big punishments against some of these other organizations.
As I said earlier, name the 8 teams. But, the MLB won't. It will make the Astros as an example in hopes of scaring the other teams straight.
Sign stealing is part of the game. MLB brought the live video to dugouts. When it started, there wasn't anything clearly stated about the use of electronics.
The Red Sox and Yankees got caught using Apple watches, and MLB didn't do anything. Just a memo threatening harsh penalties. Red Sox, Yankees and Dodgers got pissed they lost in 2017, so they pressured MLB to investigate the Astros.
Cora may get the permaban, but I think this will likely be it for team punishment because MLB won't do anything to those historic clubs.
Kashchei said:
Yes. A championship is always worth it.
Abso-****ing-lutely!
If there are no other organizations getting any severe punishments it speaks volumes in regards to what's really going on.
The fact that so many guys were hitting better on the road tells you quite a bit as well. Hitting a damn trash can trash at the last second is almost less effective than just looking for a pitcher tipping.
Just think, if only Beltran and Cora hadn't played together in 2009 with the Mets. This crap probably goes back to then.
The fact that so many guys were hitting better on the road tells you quite a bit as well. Hitting a damn trash can trash at the last second is almost less effective than just looking for a pitcher tipping.
Just think, if only Beltran and Cora hadn't played together in 2009 with the Mets. This crap probably goes back to then.
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