Holy crap

Santana might get another AB with the bases loaded. Swing for the fences!

It would be the most Rangers thing ever if we somehow swept the A's here, and built up some potential hope. Like, of course we somehow come out and win 11-3 after gallo getting surgery and it looking like we will for sure sell

Lost in all the fireworks was Jurado's performance.

His line last night: 7.0 IP, 3 H, 3 ER, 2 BB, 6 SO

He started out: 2B, BB, FO, BB, 1B - 2H and 2BB to 4 of the 1st 5 guys.
He had 1st & 3rd, 2 Runs scored and only 1 Out. There was no way he was getting out of the 1st inning.
He gave up 1 H the rest of the way - 6.2 IP. Most importantly, Khris Davis was 0-3, 1RBI.

The value for Santana is certainly high. Whether we trade him or keep him, he has had a great season.

jstanley - It would be a Rangers thing to trade Santana to an AL team, and he end up winning the batting title. That alone would be an indication to keep him.

wbt5845 said:

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Good article about possible Minor trades.

https://theathletic.com/1096097/2019/07/25/trading-mike-minor-a-series-of-hypothetical-deals-texas-could-make-over-the-next-week/

The idea I like the best.

Quote:

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Texas trades Mike Minor, Nomar Mazara, righthander Jonathan Hernandez (AA) and infielder Andy Ibanez (AAA) to the Diamondbacks for outfielder Kristian Robinson (Low-A), righthander Jon Duplantier (AAA), righthander Matt Tabor (Low-A) and catcher Daulton Varsho (AA).

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Kristian Robinson is a Bahamian STUD!

To Bill Brasky

bigcat22 said:

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To Bill Brasky

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I hear when it rains... the Yankees use Bill Brasky's foreskin as a tarp

https://instagr.am/p/B0ZB6KFBm85

Gotta accept throws like that, when you move Santana around as much as we are.

DallasAg 94 said:

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Gotta accept throws like that, when you move Santana around as much as we are.

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Something tells me shortstop and 3rd base are the most difficult for him out of his viable positions.

He actually looks decent in left field and first base.

Grapesoda2525 said:

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DallasAg 94 said:

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Gotta accept throws like that, when you move Santana around as much as we are.

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Something tells me shortstop and 3rd base are the most difficult for him out of his viable positions.

He actually looks decent in left field and first base.

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3B is difficult for everyone, because the ball gets on you so quick, and you have to have a cannon for an arm. They repeated last night that he was taking more and more IF at 3B and will likely see some time there this season.

IMO, SS is not an easy position to be good at... harder than 2B, but both are incredibly hard mentally.

In our banter between Santana and Odor, we argue different value propositions. You focus on Santana's hitting and assume as a MLB player he can play 2B and that he is a better 2B because you don't like the fact Odor Ks too much and hits a smashing pop-up, when he only needed to move the runner around. I get that. It frustrates me.

Santana comes across as someone who is just thankful to be on the team (which he is), where as, Odor comes across arrogant and entitled (which he is), because he has had sustained success. When a ball is hit to Odor, I have a lot of confidence he is giving maximum effort and more than likely makes the play. When the ball is hit to Santana (when in the IF), I've hopeful he makes the play, but my expectations are lower. In part... because he is in a utility role... but also because I haven't seen him play the entire season at 2B.

Keep in mind... 30 MLB teams passed on Santana being at the MLB level. The team he is with had him in the minors to start the season.

I hope the Rangers keep Santana. I don't care what position he plays. I think 3B would be a nice option... with thoughts of him ultimately being an OF/LF.

Josh Jung is playing in Hickory (A-RHB). In 9 G, 38 AB, he is hitting .368, a .400 OBP, and 0 HRs. I don't know why, but he reminds me of Teixeira. Teixeira was drafted 6/2001 made his debut in April 2003. He started at A+ in 2002. It would not surprise me to see Jung on the opening day roster in 2021. We also have Andy Ibanez (26-AAA-RHB) hitting .282, 11 HR, 6 SB in 90GP, who could be our 3B in 2020.

What none of us know... is what position Santana feels most comfortable. Right now, all I get is he doesn't care, as long as he is in the lineup. But, like Profar... he'll want a specific regular position. I know from watching an interview of him... he is willing to play 1B because he wants ABs and to play, but I think that not a position he wants to play full time.

DallasAg 94 said:

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Grapesoda2525 said:

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DallasAg 94 said:

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Gotta accept throws like that, when you move Santana around as much as we are.

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Something tells me shortstop and 3rd base are the most difficult for him out of his viable positions.

He actually looks decent in left field and first base.

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3B is difficult for everyone, because the ball gets on you so quick, and you have to have a cannon for an arm. They repeated last night that he was taking more and more IF at 3B and will likely see some time there this season.

IMO, SS is not an easy position to be good at... harder than 2B, but both are incredibly hard mentally.

In our banter between Santana and Odor, we argue different value propositions. You focus on Santana's hitting and assume as a MLB player he can play 2B and that he is a better 2B because you don't like the fact Odor Ks too much and hits a smashing pop-up, when he only needed to move the runner around. I get that. It frustrates me.

Santana comes across as someone who is just thankful to be on the team (which he is), where as, Odor comes across arrogant and entitled (which he is), because he has had sustained success. When a ball is hit to Odor, I have a lot of confidence he is giving maximum effort and more than likely makes the play. When the ball is hit to Santana (when in the IF), I've hopeful he makes the play, but my expectations are lower. In part... because he is in a utility role... but also because I haven't seen him play the entire season at 2B.

Keep in mind... 30 MLB teams passed on Santana being at the MLB level. The team he is with had him in the minors to start the season.

I hope the Rangers keep Santana. I don't care what position he plays. I think 3B would be a nice option... with thoughts of him ultimately being an OF/LF.

Josh Jung is playing in Hickory (A-RHB). In 9 G, 38 AB, he is hitting .368, a .400 OBP, and 0 HRs. I don't know why, but he reminds me of Teixeira. Teixeira was drafted 6/2001 made his debut in April 2003. He started at A+ in 2002. It would not surprise me to see Jung on the opening day roster in 2021. We also have Andy Ibanez (26-AAA-RHB) hitting .282, 11 HR, 6 SB in 90GP, who could be our 3B in 2020.

What none of us know... is what position Santana feels most comfortable. Right now, all I get is he doesn't care, as long as he is in the lineup. But, like Profar... he'll want a specific regular position. I know from watching an interview of him... he is willing to play 1B because he wants ABs and to play, but I think that not a position he wants to play full time.

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Sounds like one of those things that can be worked out in the offseason. I'm glad that we both agree that he should be on the team next year. Some people are looking at it as a "sell high" situation, but he's been playing like an all star this year and I'd rather take the chance to see if that performance level is "for real" with us.

Even if he isn't as good next year, Santana would be a very valuable player for us if he played almost every position again and hit .280 with a .800 ops. There's room for regression there. At the end of the day, if he turns back into a pumpkin, he's only making minimum wage or close to that.

I'd also be skeptical of getting rid of cheap and controllable talent when we have several holes on the infield. We don't have a 1st baseman or 3rd baseman for next year as of right now and our catching tandem is the worst offensively in the majors. Our pathetic ownership group needs to step up this offseason, we've been running the team like we're Tampa bay or Oakland the last few years.

Grapesoda2525 said:

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Sounds like one of those things that can be worked out in the offseason. I'm glad that we both agree that he should be on the team next year. Some people are looking at it as a "sell high" situation, but he's been playing like an all star this year and I'd rather take the chance to see if that performance level is "for real" with us.

Even if he isn't as good year, Santana would be a very valuable player for us and if he played almost every position again and hit .280 with a .800 ops. There's room for regression there. At the end of the day, if he turns back into a pumpkin, he's only making minimum wage or close to that.

I'd also be skeptical of getting rid of cheap and controllable talent when we several holes on the infield. We don't have a 1st baseman or 3rd baseman for next year as of right now and our catching tandem is the worst offensively in the majors. Our pathetic ownership group needs to step up this offseason, we've been running the team like we're Tampa bay or Oakland the last few years.

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I agree it will need to be worked out in the off-season. We have always agreed that Santana is having a great season and warrants playing time. You've always contended it is either Odor or Santana, and the FO is biased towards Odor and punishing Santana.

Here is where I first posted about Santana's debut Triple and subsequent squeeze play (a couple posts on the page by me about Santana). Personally, I love the player willing to do what he is asked. It is a rub against Odor, that sometimes (many times) he seems to do what he wants, and doesn't put the team first.

IKF was supposed to be the C this season and Mathis is who we got. We didn't keep Chirinos because the FO wanted to bring in a mentor to help IKF. Trevino is supposed to be the heir. I agree it is a hole, but it is a hole for most teams. We were spoiled with Pudge.

Condor has been a disappointment. But, I think at 24, he could still deliver in 2020. He is now where he needs to be this year. I think Santana has more value than to play 1B, but if that gets him AB... great.

Santana went through a mental rehabilitation. He had a solid rookie season (at 23) and high expectations. Since his rookie season, he struggled to deliver on the expectations set on him... realistic or not. He got off to a great start to the season, and I (like most) expected him to fall off and struggle. He did.

April/March: 15G, .339, 2 HR, 5 SB, .355 OBP
May: 20G, .241, 2 HR, 1 SB, .323 OBP

There it was... the mediocre journeyman turned utility bench guy was who he had become.

Sell HIGH... Sell High, before anyone notices. Every player slumps and struggles during the season.

For whatever reason... Santana actually got it turned around.
June: 24G, .308, 5 HR, 3 SB, .325 OBP
Then followed that up with:
July: 17G, .368, 5 HR, 3 SB, .386 OBP

WOW. Was it Woody? The hitting coach? Santana? All of the above? I've said several times, that Woody really likes Santana. Woody has made it clear that he sees Santana as an every-day player and Woody has done everything to show Santana he wants him in the lineup every day. For a struggling player, when the coach puts you out there everyday, it develops trust.

It would have been easy to justify Woody giving Santana fewer ABs after May. Other than the fact Woody had 3 other guys struggling worse (DD, Odor, Guzman)... make that 4 players (Cabrera)... no... make that 5... Catcher. Injuries among other things have kept him in the lineup with little need to worry about getting benched.

I trust Woody as a coach. He seems to be a good mix of a players' coach and a strategic X's and O's coach. I'm sure JD equally trusts him, which is why I don't believe Woody gets pressure setting the lineup.

I trust Woody handling the players. If he felt Santana was ready to play 3B. Santana would be at 3B tonight. And he would have Cabrera accepting. Cabrera, Forsythe, Pence and Santana know they were brought in to play a role on the team.

Odor and Woody seem to still be doing the machismo dance. We'll have to see how that relationship develops.

#WallOfWords

Diekman traded to Oakland.

Nobody claimed Tocci after being dfa'd by Rangers. Returns to Nashville.

So you're saying he is comparable to a former perennial all star and NL MVP?

bigcat22 said:

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So you're saying he is comparable to a former perennial all star and NL MVP?

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I guess if you're looking for a positive spin on it.... sure

bigcat22 said:

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So you're saying he is comparable to a former perennial all star and NL MVP?

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This dude loves to be mediocre

Grapesoda2525 said:

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bigcat22 said:

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So you're saying he is comparable to a former perennial all star and NL MVP?

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I guess if you're looking for a positive spin on it.... sure

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Odor hasn't given us much of anything to be positive about this year so you gotta dig really hard to find positive spins when you see them.

bigcat22 said:

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Grapesoda2525 said:

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bigcat22 said:

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So you're saying he is comparable to a former perennial all star and NL MVP?

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I guess if you're looking for a positive spin on it.... sure

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Odor hasn't given us much of anything to be positive about this year so you gotta dig really hard to find positive spins when you see them.

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I'm sure one or two posters on here can find some positive slants, but the overall body of work leaves much to be desired.

Interesting late game action in Oakland.


It's fun to watch when you don't really care about wins or losses anymore. Just entertainment.

Grapesoda2525 said:

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bigcat22 said:

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Grapesoda2525 said:

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bigcat22 said:

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So you're saying he is comparable to a former perennial all star and NL MVP?

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I guess if you're looking for a positive spin on it.... sure

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. Odor hasn't given us much of anything to be positive about this year so you gotta dig really hard to find positive spins when you see them.

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I'm sure one or two posters on here can find some positive slants, but the overall body of work leaves much to be desired.

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Where is Odor ranked in hitting on the Rangers?
#1 in RBIs (58). Mazara #2 @ 54
#2 in HRs (18)

Where is he among AL 2B'ers?
#2 in HRs, behind Torres (20)
#2 in RBIs, behind LeMahieu (71). LeMahieu bats 1st.

Not bad for your #6... #7 hitter.

Not bad for a guy who has been hurt, "loves to be mediocre" and "hasn't given us much of anything to be positive about this year."

Career HRs by a 2B? At 25, Odor is 39th All-Time with 124 HRs.

He has 3 more years of guaranteed money... and likely gets at least 25 HRs/Yr... SO, he projects to 199 HRs @ 28. That would put him at 17th Career, just behind Robbie Alomar (210) who retired at 36.

252 would Tie him @Top 10 with Brett Boone... who also retired at 36.

Grapesoda2525 said:

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It's not all about the long ball. People generally want to see consistency and a level head out of players who play 150+ games a year. He provides neither of those things.

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That's not what she said. /Michael Scott

That sounds like the old... "It's not you... it's me routine.

It is ALL about the long ball. MLB allowed PEDs... and allows PEDs today, because it is all about the long ball.

What was the controversy over the ASB? The balls are juiced allowing more HR. Verlander complained and MLB Sat him down for a chat.

A's scored 5 R tonight... all of which were scored on HRs.

Nobody comes out to the games and says, "I hope I see someone get a single."

Odor has driven in a bunch of Runs. Runs win games.

DallasAg 94 said:

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Grapesoda2525 said:

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It's not all about the long ball. People generally want to see consistency and a level head out of players who play 150+ games a year. He provides neither of those things.

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That's not what she said. /Michael Scott

That sounds like the old... "It's not you... it's me routine.

It is ALL about the long ball. MLB allowed PEDs... and allows PEDs today, because it is all about the long ball.

What was the controversy over the ASB? The balls are juiced allowing more HR. Verlander complained and MLB Sat him down for a chat.

A's scored 5 R tonight... all of which were scored on HRs.

Nobody comes out to the games and says, "I hope I see someone get a single."

Odor has driven in a bunch of Runs. Runs win games.

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The rangers are currently on pace for the single season strikeout record by a team.

This hero ball / swing for the fences stuff isn't working for this team. A hit to the gap and a race to the plate is just as exciting, if not more so, then a home run. I'd rather have a lineup that's known for being a tough out, tough to strike out, with an emphasis on putting the ball in play over swinging for the fences every AB.

Odor has been fortunate that most of his hits have come with men on base. A lot of guys in our lineup come up to the plate with the bases empty because of hero ball.

What's funny about this tweet is that I was thinking Lemahieu would've been a good pickup in the offseason, but I knew it never would happen because of odor.

DJ was signed for 2 years and 24 million total.

Evan Grant's article makes sense to me. Rangers aren't going to organically compete next year either unless Odor and/or Mazara come around.

Grapesoda2525 said:

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The rangers are currently on pace for the single season strikeout record by a team.

This hero ball / swing for the fences stuff isn't working for this team. A hit to the gap and a race to the plate is just as exciting, if not more so, then a home run. I'd rather have a lineup that's known for being a tough out, tough to strike out, with an emphasis on putting the ball in play over swinging for the fences every AB.

Odor has been fortunate that most of his hits have come with men on base. A lot of guys in our lineup come up to the plate with the bases empty because of hero ball.

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They are 4th in Runs scored. Tell me how this "hero ball" isn't working for this team.

This isn't Ice Capades or a Musical. Baseball isn't basketball or ice hockey. Tom Lites already tried to change it to that type of atmosphere and darn near lost ALL of the fans.

And there you go with the "most of his runs came against crappy pitchers." The guy hits 6th and 7th. You can't tell me he gets more ABs with men on base, when Santana is usually hitting after Choo, who is almost always on base.

The difference is Choo gets walked and Santana hits a single. The inning ends with Choo on 3rd and Santana on 2nd.

You don't have to like the way baseball is played today, but to say what Odor is doing is ineffective is dump.

Moneyball effectively said a Sac Bunt is a wasted out. Statistics proved it has lost it's value based on hitters driving the ball. I love a good Sac Bunt... and the Rangers have increased them this season.

Rangers are 4th in Runs scored... and Odor is leading the way. The BA as a measure of success is antiquated. The Rangers are winning games because they are scoring lots of Runs. They are losing games because they are giving up Runs.

Oakland had 6 Runs last night, all scored on the 4 HRs. And they won the game. Rangers had 11 Hits. Look back and asterisk this game as a Rangers victory, because they won the Hit battle 11-6.

Regarding Odor, one thing we can all agree on is that he's got to lay off this pitch. Nothing good can come of swinging at something that high