So pretty much if that was their average defense against golden state's average or even a little below average offense, the cavs don't get close to winning even with Lebron's offensive output.

Without being sarcastic, I really want to keep this thread related to the topic and this is definitely a topic we can go at in the off-season. Gonna file this one away for a few weeks as I'm sure it will be brought up on ESPN following the series.

James has been great so far. Best I have seen him play.... 1st game was phenomenal until the end. That loss is on him. He has 8 seconds in reg and instead of taking his man down (GS had not been doubling much in the 1st game), he settles for a fade away 3???????

That is why Jordan is better. Jordan rarely settled for the fade away anything and took people to the rack or posted them up. He also elevated in traffic (something I have not seen James do much). When you take a fade-away in the final seconds, it takes you out of the rebound. Bad basketball decision.

Last night, James got to the free throw line (should have been more, missed calls) and that is where you win games..... not on fade-away threes.

Also; Jordan would eliminate Thompson if he were playing in place of James. Lebron (also a great defender) cannot guard guards like Jordan could (even at the end of his career). The Cavs with Jordan instead of James against GS might be a better defensive match-up. Offense is a push. With Tsip Thompson and the Russian, Jordan shouldn't need to rebound, he is a better scorer but not as good at distributing and with this cavs group, that might be a good thing.

That's my 2 cents.

I was thinking the same thing. He resorted to many fade away jumpers back in the day. People tend to think Jordan was close to perfect and was totally flawless at times.

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James Harden got so much heat for the last play in Game 2. In tonight's game the MVP down 2 throws the ball away.

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The real MVP is averaging over 40 in the Finals*

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*While averaging 36.5 shot attempts.

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41.5/12/8.5, while averaging 36.5 shot attempts.*

And doing it with a team of spares and the being guarded by basically the entire GS roster every time down the floor.

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And playing hard and well on defense. LeBron is the best player in the league, as well as the true MVP, and will continue to be so until he starts to decline. It's crazy how much Cleveland puts on LeBron on both ends of the court, and they still almost won the first two games of the Finals on the road. The league consider others players for the MVP just for the sake of variety.

Having said all that, Cleveland has to find a way to lighten the load on LeBron. Relying on him to bring the ball up, initiate the offense, be the go-to scorer and make plays for everyone else, play defense against one of the Warriors big scorers, rebound, all without getting much rest--- it's just too much. I just don't see how someone his size can keep that level of exertion up for a whole series. You can see how much he's dragging by the end of the game.

I may have mentioned in the thread or not, can't remember, but after game 1, the Cavs immediately said they still thought they could win and that's due to defense. They have the size and defensive ability, and they knew they had to bring game to a crawl and grind it out if they wanted to a chance. They did just that, almost missed their chance for the 2nd game in a row, but overtime did not work nearly as well for the Warriors as it did in game 1.

I agree about having to ease the burden on Lebron, but at this point it's just so difficult. If they go down by 20+ in the 2nd half of a game, I'd pull him and let him sit the rest of the night. Other than that, they need him in as much as possible, even when they are up 8, 10, 12, etc...because the Warriors are going to shoot themselves back in to any game. Cavs will have to win 4 close ones IMO if they want to win it all. Look how fast an 11 point lead went down to 5 last night late in the game. They can't afford to sit Lebron when they have a lead. They need him to continue controlling the offense.

Another guy in his 5th consecutive finals via following Bron...James Jones provided great minutes last night. His length really bothers the perimeter shooters for GS, and he was a pest, often picking up full court just like Delly last night. If he can keep draining some key shots here and there, the Cavs would be a red-hot shooting night from JR or Mike MIller away from having a puncher's chance.

james jones is like robert horry in that you didn't hear much about him until the playoffs. He just shows up big time in the playoffs

That and he is smartly following Lebron and hitching on to that wagon. Definitely Horry-esque. Go be a nothing guy on a contender, spend the year working with the younger players, shooting as many 3's as possible, and be ready to contribute if needed in the playoffs.

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Having said all that, Cleveland has to find a way to lighten the load on LeBron. Relying on him to bring the ball up, initiate the offense, be the go-to scorer and make plays for everyone else, play defense against one of the Warriors big scorers, rebound, all without getting much rest--- it's just too much. I just don't see how someone his size can keep that level of exertion up for a whole series. You can see how much he's dragging by the end of the game.

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yep. his late game scoring became worse because he is just wearing down. Even his touch around the rim. If they just had one more dang person to create their own offense. I think they will relax on him after game 3. they know their chances of winning are small so they are going all in right now. I expect him to play the majority of Game 3 again, and hope to take a series lead. Then give him a little rest during game 4 as the series reaches the mid point.

But at the end of the day I have no idea and I dont think they do either. They are winging it at this point.

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james jones is like robert horry in that you didn't hear much about him until the playoffs. He just shows up big time in the playoffs

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not really...he didnt even play in the finals of one of lebrons championships. He is only playeing significant miniutes right now due to the injuries. He would be a 5-10 minute guy at best if they were healthy.

A testament to how insanely poor their roster is right now.

James Jones plays a few mop-up minutes here and there. Even on the crapfest that was the Heat roster by the end of last year's playoffs he managed a whole 8 minutes per game and didn't play in five games. That's hardly Horry-esque.

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James Jones plays a few mop-up minutes here and there. Even on the crapfest that was the Heat roster by the end of last year's playoffs he managed a whole 8 minutes per game and didn't play in five games. That's hardly Horry-esque.

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Hopping from contender to contender was what I meant with "horry-esque,"

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More Jordan revisionist history here. Jordan was well known for his fadeaway and 'settled' for it a ton. Hell, the fadeaway was a staple of
the ISO days on the early 90's to late 00's games. The second Bulls
three peat Jordan's deadly fadeaway shot was his go-to offensive weapon.

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A fade-away from the 3-point line? Never saw it.
Also; Jordan did not use his postup fade-away much in the early 90's. Second set of championships is when it became a staple.
I have less issue with a post up fadeaway near or in the paint... 3 point line step-back or fade away when you have time, are in an iso and are 25lbs bigger is shameful.

James's game has grown a ton since the Mavs controlled him with a guard. If he would have posted up Kidd a couple more times, the Mavs would have switched out and the Heat may have won that series. He came back the next year with a solution to that problem. But in crunch time, he still has a tendency to revert back to that timid style of play. He will get over that.... he did it right last night.

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A fade-away from the 3-point line? Never saw it.
Also; Jordan did not use his postup fade-away much in the early 90's. Second set of championships is when it became a staple.
I have less issue with a post up fadeaway near or in the paint... 3 point line step-back or fade away when you have time, are in an iso and are 25lbs bigger is shameful.

James's game has grown a ton since the Mavs controlled him with a guard. If he would have posted up Kidd a couple more times, the Mavs would have switched out and the Heat may have won that series. He came back the next year with a solution to that problem. But in crunch time, he still has a tendency to revert back to that timid style of play. He will get over that.... he did it right last night.

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No crawfishing... You said Jordan rarely settled on his fadeaway... And even pre-retirement championship years, that's not really true. Direct from the post fadeaway? You might be right... But the jab step, step back jumper and fadeaway always set every move up for Jordan. It was a bread and butter move of his long before the baseball hiatus.

The other factor in this is lebron the shooter >>>>>> Jordan the shooter. Jordan was a pretty crappy 3 point shooter every year but the ones where the line got moved in. If he were a better 3 point shooter, i'm sure he'd lob some fadeaway 3's up too like many elite shooters do in today's game.

Anyhow, I'm rambling here. Pointing to that particular shot amidst Lebrons entire resume at this point and saying he reverts to being timid in crunch time is candidly one of the dumbest things I've seen on this thread.

Wow. Even Perkins thinks Bron traveled.

Yea I saw that live and figured I missed something.

I am pretty sure this is a game that the Warriors win tonight but if they dont...this is going to get insanely interesting. I really hope the Cavs pull it out.

Yeah I'm considering loading up on Golden State as well. Then I saw the line. Hate going against home dogs.

GS is -1.5 (-130).

Heavy money is saying GS.

That national anthem

Cavs looking good

I wonder where Johnny is sitting

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I wonder where Johnny is sitting

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The section that doesn't serve/allow booze

Liked that delly took the blatant moving screen takedown on the first defensive possession from Green and immediately got up and took green to the ground subtly. Nice response as the Warriors immediately wanted to send a message to him if he's gonna continue to fight through screens as hard as last game

Warriors out of sync on offense again. The Cavs are in their heads.

This crowd
The King

Warriors poor shooting again. 1/5 from 3.

Tristan Thompson already has 6 boards

Cavs getting sloppy. LeBron going with his left top much

I like how he's attacking the basket though he's shooting at a low percentage currently. Thristian Thompson is playing outta his mind right now