Who?mikejones! said:

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We've had the proven winner, we've had the upstart, we've had a super bowl winning coach, we've had a defensive coaching legend. We've had perhaps the greatest ever to do it.

We have had all types of coaches lead our program. Guess we need to circle back to getting a future great

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Who was our super bowl winning coach?

Bryanisbest said:

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Common denominator in our failure?

Coaches? Administrators?

Coaches and administrators have come and gone for years. Losing always predominates .

So what is the common denominator? I say it's culture.

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Yep. When it comes to football, I think it's the fact that we've always had donors/fanbase that care more about being known as the nice guys, than doing what it takes to win. After watching football the past 15 or so years, winning doesn't seem to be a priority at Texas A&M.

Nice guys don't win ****

superunknown said:

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Who?mikejones! said:

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We've had the proven winner, we've had the upstart, we've had a super bowl winning coach, we've had a defensive coaching legend. We've had perhaps the greatest ever to do it.

We have had all types of coaches lead our program. Guess we need to circle back to getting a future great

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Who was our super bowl winning coach?

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Pretty sure he's referring to Gary Kubiak.

The athletic department prioritizes revenue and profit over winning. They are content with mediocre finishes as long as they have a strong financial outlook. Until the athletic department stops accepting mediocrity, we won't win anything meaningful in one of the Big 3 college sports. I have learned to expect mediocrity and hope for excellence.

Football: Since winning the Big 12 in 1998, we have lost 4+ games in 24 of 26 years, and the only exceptions were when we finished 11-2 (6-2 SEC) in 2012 and 9-1 (8-1 SEC) in 2020. We have never made a playoff appearance, and the closest we came was in 2020.

Men's Basketball: We have never even reached the elite 8 and have not reached the Sweet 16 since 2018.

Baseball: We have reached the College World Series 8 times in 1951, 1964, 1993, 1999, 2011, 2017, 2022, 2024, but we have never won the national championship. The closest we came was losing 6-5 to Tennessee in Game 3 of the College World Series Final.

45-70Ag said:

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The A&M athletic culture is exactly what big money donors want. A club like atmosphere where they control what they want to control.

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Like a bunch of mini Jerries

IMO it's not a tolerate problem specifically although it is a result of a bigger issue.

It's the culture of believing them to be great before they prove it. The players and teams get put on pillars.

The best example of it is " we didn't lose we just ran out of time."

We pump the teams up so that they believe they are better than they are. And accountability and drive and desire to improve and work ethic are all affected somewhat.

And in athletics the margin between winning and losing is so small that it keeps being a problem,

I will say I think the fan base is finally getting sick and tired of the constant underperforming. Of never playing up to their potential.

2thFixinAg said:

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IMO it's not a tolerate problem specifically although it is a result of a bigger issue.

It's the culture of believing them to be great before they prove it. The players and teams get put on pillars.

The best example of it is " we didn't lose we just ran out of time."

We pump the teams up so that they believe they are better than they are. And accountability and drive and desire to improve and work ethic are all affected somewhat.

And in athletics the margin between winning and losing is so small that it keeps being a problem,

I will say I think the fan base is finally getting sick and tired of the constant underperforming. Of never playing up to their potential.

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The whole "we didn't lose, we ran out of time" thing is clearly tongue-in-cheek. If you were taking it literally, well, that sucks for you, I guess.

The "fan base" is not getting sick of anything, demonstrably. Ticket sales are higher than ever (https://www.kbtx.com/2024/06/28/texas-am-football-season-tickets-sold-out-2024/) and the AD is making record money and profits (https://www.kbtx.com/2025/02/01/texas-am-athletics-made-227-million-net-revenue-during-fiscal-year-2024/). A few people online circle jerking negativity isn't indicative of anything.

So, what can the fanbase do? Must don't have season tickets, most aren't members of the 12th Man Foundation, etc.

Who?mikejones! said:

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Aggie Dad 26 said:

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Cajun Ag 86 said:

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Tolerate failure, even of historic proportion, and no accountability. Sad. This retention of a terrible coaching hire is the biggest of all red flags for all of our sports. We are a culture that tolerates losing.

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Absolutely

Its what I've been trying to drive here for months. Until that changes, we will continue to see the same results each season.

We have too many people trying to be "good fans." This isn't supposed to be a show where people are trying to impress their family, friends, and fellow fans around them of how good of a fan they are by being overly optimistic or nice

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Actually it is.

This isnt a pro team. This is absolutely about rooting on your university and Alma mater with your fellow students, past and future generations and family. Its about the traditions schools hold desr. Its absolutely about that first, then winning.

Sorry that hurts you. Maybe go to root for any generic school if you wish.

I'll stay here.

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i i'll root for the ags no matter what but by definition players that are paid are professionals. at the bare minimum college sports is semi pro/ minor leagues.

for this reason i do think it is fair to have a slightly different view of college sports in general. when you have players making millions coaches making millions how is it not fair to adjust your expectations and voice them differently. these kids are hired guns wearing our school colors.

will still always root for the guys in my colors but i am not naive to think they chose texas a&m cause they just always wanted to be an aggie.

texag101 said:

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Who?mikejones! said:

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Aggie Dad 26 said:

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Cajun Ag 86 said:

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Tolerate failure, even of historic proportion, and no accountability. Sad. This retention of a terrible coaching hire is the biggest of all red flags for all of our sports. We are a culture that tolerates losing.

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Absolutely

Its what I've been trying to drive here for months. Until that changes, we will continue to see the same results each season.

We have too many people trying to be "good fans." This isn't supposed to be a show where people are trying to impress their family, friends, and fellow fans around them of how good of a fan they are by being overly optimistic or nice

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Actually it is.

This isnt a pro team. This is absolutely about rooting on your university and Alma mater with your fellow students, past and future generations and family. Its about the traditions schools hold desr. Its absolutely about that first, then winning.

Sorry that hurts you. Maybe go to root for any generic school if you wish.

I'll stay here.

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You're out of touch. This is pro team. We pay the players to play. If we didn't, they wouldn't be here. We rebuilt Kyle Field for $.5B. The AD generated $266.4M last year. We paid a coach $75M to stop coaching our team. Our 2024 NIL budget was $20M+. This most certainly is NOT merely about camaraderie or traditions. You can get that somewhere else for a lot less. It's fine if you don't care about winning, but don't lecture with a holier-than-thou, false premise.

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This! Seriously, if we are not serious about actually doing what it takes to win, aside from throwing money around and have BMAs participate in some sort of dick measuring contest, then embrace the suck and do things for a lot less money. We can go on saying "golly gee, we were outscored," or "we just ran out of time," or "we didn't quit," or "we won halftime," or etc..... We can go to our tailgates, fill Kyle Field, talk about the good old days, and so on. Pretty much just like we do right now, but don't spend near as much money. Maybe that is exactly what Trev's and General Welsh's missions are, but we don't know it yet???

Sgt. Schultz said:

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texag101 said:

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Who?mikejones! said:

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Aggie Dad 26 said:

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Cajun Ag 86 said:

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Tolerate failure, even of historic proportion, and no accountability. Sad. This retention of a terrible coaching hire is the biggest of all red flags for all of our sports. We are a culture that tolerates losing.

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Absolutely

Its what I've been trying to drive here for months. Until that changes, we will continue to see the same results each season.

We have too many people trying to be "good fans." This isn't supposed to be a show where people are trying to impress their family, friends, and fellow fans around them of how good of a fan they are by being overly optimistic or nice

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Actually it is.

This isnt a pro team. This is absolutely about rooting on your university and Alma mater with your fellow students, past and future generations and family. Its about the traditions schools hold desr. Its absolutely about that first, then winning.

Sorry that hurts you. Maybe go to root for any generic school if you wish.

I'll stay here.

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You're out of touch. This is pro team. We pay the players to play. If we didn't, they wouldn't be here. We rebuilt Kyle Field for $.5B. The AD generated $266.4M last year. We paid a coach $75M to stop coaching our team. Our 2024 NIL budget was $20M+. This most certainly is NOT merely about camaraderie or traditions. You can get that somewhere else for a lot less. It's fine if you don't care about winning, but don't lecture with a holier-than-thou, false premise.

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This! Seriously, if we are not serious about actually doing what it takes to win, aside from throwing money around and have BMAs participate in some sort of dick measuring contest, then embrace the suck and do things for a lot less money. We can go on saying "golly gee, we were outscored," or "we just ran out of time," or "we didn't quit," or "we won halftime," or etc..... We can go to our tailgates, fill Kyle Field, talk about the good old days, and so on. Pretty much just like we do right now, but don't spend near as much money. Maybe that is exactly what Trev's and General Welsh's missions are, but we don't know it yet???

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Sounds good to me.

What a lot of people can't understand is that winning a national title in college football is basically relegated to a special few. In the past 60 years, all but 5 titles won by the AP national champion have been spread amongst 15 schools. Penn State, Ohio State, Michigan, Notre Dame, Clemson, Georgia, Florida, FSU, Miami, Bama, LSU, Texas, Oklahoma, Nebraska, and USC. Tennessee, Auburn, and Pitt have won one title, but have won titles previously in the decades prior to the 1960s. Only BYU and Colorado have won titles in the last 60 years without have ever won one before or since.

IOW, A&M is no different than every other Power Program not listed above. You can argue about wasted $$$, resources, location, etc... but they have the same complaints in Oregon, Washington, UCLA, Michigan State, Iowa, Wisconsin, Virgina Tech, North Carolina, Arkansas, and others, too.

Who says we tolerate losing? Few losers still believe the time ran out excuse but most of us demand winning. We just have had bad luck. Only reason tu can win is bc they bribe their players. None of them are loyal or want to play there. We get all of our players bc they want to come here. Even if we didn't pay they would come. That's the Aggie family.

So is it your belief that none of the BMAs care about winning at all? Are you suggestive no we need to stop taking their dollars because they don't care about winning?
How do we solve this culture piece? There a ton of folks on TA that get on here hourly/daily complaining about it, but there are never any proposed solutions other than fire the AD, fire all the coaches, get rid of the BoR, etc. We tried that over and over again- since the beginning of athletic teams at TAMU, we've fired every single coach we had, in every single sport we've played with very few exceptions. We've had 15 ADs in our history- four since 2012. The BoR turns over on a regular basis. Same results with all of that change.

TXAGBQ76 said:

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So is it your belief that none of the BMAs care about winning at all? Are you suggestive no we need to stop taking their dollars because they don't care about winning?
How do we solve this culture piece? There a ton of folks on TA that get on here hourly/daily complaining about it, but there are never any proposed solutions other than fire the AD, fire all the coaches, get rid of the BoR, etc. We tried that over and over again- since the beginning of athletic teams at TAMU, we've fired every single coach we had, in every single sport we've played with very few exceptions. We've had 15 ADs in our history- four since 2012. The BoR turns over on a regular basis. Same results with all of that change.

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I have posted variations of the following multiple times

We have changed coaches
We have changed players
We have bought players - before NIL
We have changed conferences
We have built new facilities
We have changed AD's
We have changed university presidents
We have changed BORs
We have changed a lot of things

Aside for about a 10 or so year stretch in the late 80s to late 90s, we have been mediocre for most of my 62+ years of life. My gosh, its been 27 years since the Ags have won a conference championship, and even that was a 2OT "upset." We've had a blip of success here and there but for the most part, we are Texas 8&4.

So what is the answer? Its a serious question. The only thing I can come up with is it that it is a culture thing. We tend to anoint hero status to the players without them having earned any it. Like government, we tend to throw money at things without thinking it through. We have a great facilities for the most part but that has not translated into championships.

We seriously need a very business, results oriented approach to conducting athletics. You don't perform, you are out. But alas, we tend to be far more concerned about the atmosphere and being nice to opposing fans. Look at the stupid stuff that is posted on here regarding hype videos and entrance songs, and whether or not a random visiting school fan says we were gracious hosts. All of that is well and good but it does not contribute one single thing to winning.

There were posts on this thread that mentioned BMAs were bragging about their "access" to and "influence" with the program. What has all of this gotten us? Not a damn thing but mediocrity and ridiculously stupid, one-sided contracts. What kind of business acumen does it take to draw up these stupid contracts. If Texas A&M is what we all think that it is, we should be a whole heck of a lot smarter than we have been.

The solution is basically its time for the paid athletes to perform or else we'll replace them with somebody that will. If we don't adopt this mindset, we will continue to be golly gee, nice, gomer pyle, Texas 8&4. If folks are ok with that, then accept being mediocre and we don't have to subject ourselves to always having to raise money.

I agree with a majority of your comments. I guess the one thing I scratch my head about is the coaching contract. Stupid contracts seem to be the way of the world these days, look at LSU (of course the AD that wrote that contract is the same one that wrote Jimbo's), Michigan State, etc. while not $72M stupid, there are a number of one sided contracts out there for "good" coaches.

It is certainly frustrating.

Sgt. Schultz said:

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TXAGBQ76 said:

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So is it your belief that none of the BMAs care about winning at all? Are you suggestive no we need to stop taking their dollars because they don't care about winning?
How do we solve this culture piece? There a ton of folks on TA that get on here hourly/daily complaining about it, but there are never any proposed solutions other than fire the AD, fire all the coaches, get rid of the BoR, etc. We tried that over and over again- since the beginning of athletic teams at TAMU, we've fired every single coach we had, in every single sport we've played with very few exceptions. We've had 15 ADs in our history- four since 2012. The BoR turns over on a regular basis. Same results with all of that change.

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I have posted variations of the following multiple times

We have changed coaches
We have changed players
We have bought players - before NIL
We have changed conferences
We have built new facilities
We have changed AD's
We have changed university presidents
We have changed BORs
We have changed a lot of things

Aside for about a 10 or so year stretch in the late 80s to late 90s, we have been mediocre for most of my 62+ years of life. My gosh, its been 27 years since the Ags have won a conference championship, and even that was a 2OT "upset." We've had a blip of success here and there but for the most part, we are Texas 8&4.

So what is the answer? Its a serious question. The only thing I can come up with is it that it is a culture thing. We tend to anoint hero status to the players without them having earned any it. Like government, we tend to throw money at things without thinking it through. We have a great facilities for the most part but that has not translated into championships.

We seriously need a very business, results oriented approach to conducting athletics. You don't perform, you are out. But alas, we tend to be far more concerned about the atmosphere and being nice to opposing fans. Look at the stupid stuff that is posted on here regarding hype videos and entrance songs, and whether or not a random visiting school fan says we were gracious hosts. All of that is well and good but it does not contribute one single thing to winning.

There were posts on this thread that mentioned BMAs were bragging about their "access" to and "influence" with the program. What has all of this gotten us? Not a damn thing but mediocrity and ridiculously stupid, one-sided contracts. What kind of business acumen does it take to draw up these stupid contracts. If Texas A&M is what we all think that it is, we should be a whole heck of a lot smarter than we have been.

The solution is basically its time for the paid athletes to perform or else we'll replace them with somebody that will. If we don't adopt this mindset, we will continue to be golly gee, nice, gomer pyle, Texas 8&4. If folks are ok with that, then accept being mediocre and we don't have to subject ourselves to always having to raise money.

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Very well said.

Remember Nick Saban benching Jalen Hurts after Hurts won them like 20 games in a row including a Natty for Tua?

We need to have that attitude.