aggiepaintrain said:

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wasn't 2020 "the" year?

Now we are rebuilding?

ok

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Typing error... should read 2030.

Cassius said:

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lil_frog8 said:

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slyfox07 said:

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My Name Is Judge said:

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Zero games are must win during the first 7 years of a 10 year 75 mil guaranteed contract

Just try to enjoy watching the rebuild...

We're probably still 2-3 years away from competing for anything worthwhile

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What kind of rebuild takes 6 years?

That doesn't make any sense.

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1 year to instill the culture and run off anyone from the old regime that doesn't buy in. Then another 5 to have a full set of redshirt seniors plus underclassman that have had no influence from the previous regime.

We are still combating old Sumlin mindset players In year 3 and the two underclassman classes Jimbo has recruited have to overcome that mentality

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so Jimbo is not able to change the mindset of the Sumlin recruits?! What does that say about Jimbo?

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That's silly. Just like it's silly when Florida State fans are blaming Jimbo for the Seminoles being so bad three years later

slyfox07 said:

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My Name Is Judge said:

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Zero games are must win during the first 7 years of a 10 year 75 mil guaranteed contract

Just try to enjoy watching the rebuild...

We're probably still 2-3 years away from competing for anything worthwhile

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What kind of rebuild takes 6 years?

That doesn't make any sense.

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The kind that involves taking green freshman and turning them into elite seniors.

It's not like we can trade a veteran to our team.

My Name Is Judge said:

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Zero games are must win during the first 7 years of a 10 year 75 mil guaranteed contract

Just try to enjoy watching the rebuild...

We're probably still 2-3 years away from competing for anything worthwhile

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So, if we lose, I guess you could say he's no Dan Mullen.

If this team is still struggling even after Jimbo has 4 full recruiting classes, including a QB who can run his system (Mond simply can't) then get the pitchforks

But I'm not ready to light the torches just yet

I compared Florida's schedule to our schedule over the past two years. Dan Mullen went 21-5, and Jimbo Fisher went 17-9 with a tougher schedule. In both years, they played Florida State instead of Clemson and avoided Alabama. In games against common opponents, Mullen went 6-4, and Fisher went 5-5. The difference was their 24-13 win over Auburn on 10/4/19, and Fisher is 0-2 against Auburn. Mullen is 0-2 vs Georgia, and Fisher is 0-1 vs Georgia. Mullen is 1-1 vs Kentucky, and Fisher is 1-0 vs Kentucky. Both coaches went 2-0 vs South Carolina and 1-1 vs LSU. Mullen is 1-0 against Mississippi State, and Fisher is 1-1 vs Mississippi State.

Both coaches are 2-0 in their respective bowl games. Mullen has NY6 bowl wins over 10-2 Michigan in the 2018 Peach Bowl and 9-4 ACC Coastal Division champion Virginia in the 2019 Orange Bowl. Fisher has bowl wins over 9-3 North Carolina State in the 2018 Gator Bowl and 8-4 Oklahoma State in the 2019 Texas Bowl. Because Florida finished second in the SEC East in each of the last two years, they have played in more prestigious bowls.

This game would be an excellent opportunity for Fisher to prove he is better than Mullen. Because this game is at home, we won't be able to use road struggles (2-7 in true road games since 2018) as an excuse for losing. If we lose a close game, it will be disappointing, but understandable. If we get blown out, it's going to be a disaster.

Completely unrealistic. Jimbo didn't inherit much in terms of culture and team dynamic. We are still recovering from QB debacle of 2015 (see Kellen Mond being the best we can do). It's gonna take time. That's why we gave Jimbo 10 years. Also COVID is a thing and this can't be treated like a normal year.

We aren't winning this game Saturday. I hope I'm wrong about that. But I'll be watching and cheering on the Ags because it's the only thing I know how to do on CFB Saturday.

94chem said:

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My Name Is Judge said:

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Zero games are must win during the first 7 years of a 10 year 75 mil guaranteed contract

Just try to enjoy watching the rebuild...

We're probably still 2-3 years away from competing for anything worthwhile

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So, if we lose, I guess you could say he's no Dan Mullen.

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Fans will either say Dan Mullen is a better coach than Jimbo Fisher or inherited a better team.

ABATTBQ87 said:

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It also took us 5 coaches in 18 years (1967 to 1985) to win a SWC title

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And now we're currently 4 coaches in 22 years AND COUNTING since our last conference title.

Must win for a decent season.
Not a must win for Jimbo.

Everyone said we would be 1-2 after this weekend before the season started.

That is the expectation of 90% of this board.

So if we lose no one should be whining, but we all know that won't happen.

Nothing is must-win for me til year 5. If we still look the same at that time, I'll start getting worried.

Ags can fall to Florida and still finish 8 - 2.

Hope we beat the Gators, but I don't see this as a "must win."

I am willing to be patient. Rebuilding a program is not easy. Especially with a quarterback that isn't dynamic. I am not trying to let Jimbo off easy but I am trying to trust the process. He preaches to be process oriented. Dabo did not start getting Clemson on track until his 4th-5th year. I still believe Jimbo is our guy.

Dabo's Record:

ironmanag said:

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Everyone said we would be 1-2 after this weekend before the season started.

That is the expectation of 90% of this board.

So if we lose no one should be whining, but we all know that won't happen.

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I care way less about winning than I do about putting a competitive and entertaining product on the field. Thus far we have done neither. Under no circumstances do I accept blowouts.

One thing I will say is that Jimbo needs to start showing something on the field before it starts to impact what he's done on the recruiting trail. Or else, we will enter a Sumlin type swoon.

Almost everyone expected us to be 1-1 through the first two games, but I expected an improved point differential in SEC games. We were 30.5 point favorites over Vanderbilt but won by just 5 points. Our very uninspiring 17-12 home win over Vanderbilt reminded me of how we squeaked by Arkansas 24-17 on 9/29/18 and 31-27 on 9/28/19. During both wins, Arkansas was in the midst of a 20-game SEC losing streak before upsetting Mississippi State 21-14 on the road. One common factor in those tight games is bad turnovers (usually committed by Mond) that keep the games close. It seems like every time we are about to establish control in those games, we shoot ourselves in the foot.

Against Alabama, I was hoping that we would stay within 14 points of Alabama. We ended up losing by 28 points because of three missed scoring opportunities, a pick-six, and a horrible pass defense. If we had made the missed field goal on the opening drive, scored one more touchdown, and avoided a pick-six, we still would've lost 45-34. But I would have been happier with that score because it would have meant a competitive and entertaining product on the field. Before the season, many people, including myself, thought the Florida game would be a toss-up. I just hope our offense can score enough points to compete with Florida, but I won't be surprised if we lose by double digits at home.

slyfox07 said:

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My Name Is Judge said:

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Zero games are must win during the first 7 years of a 10 year 75 mil guaranteed contract

Just try to enjoy watching the rebuild...

We're probably still 2-3 years away from competing for anything worthwhile

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What kind of rebuild takes 6 years?

That doesn't make any sense.

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What kind of rebuild takes less than 3 years? That doesn't make any kind of sense.

All kidding aside we are not close to being able to "reload, not rebuild" as of now, like the Bama's and Georgia's of the world are. We had a good 2018 season, and then lost all of our best players on both sides of the ball sans Madubuike on D. Not to mention that 2018 wasn't a full recruiting class for Jimbo, and understandably has not performed as well as the following recruiting classes so far. Last year, our upperclassmen were simply not good enough across all positions to compete against top-tier teams. Our 2019 and 2020 classes are filled with talented players, but they are still freshmen and sophomores. And no matter how many 4&5 star sophomores we have, we'll be at a disadvantage against teams with 4&5 star upperclassmen across the board.

These kinds of things take time. We aren't Clemson, we don't get to mask our growing pains with a terrible in-conference schedule. Yes we want to win, we should never "expect" to lose, but we are in a rebuild while playing in the best division in the best conference in football. The only reason this ever might have been "our year" was because of an incredibly favorable schedule, which Covid threw out the window.

In short, we need to be patient.

Alpha Texan said:

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slyfox07 said:

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My Name Is Judge said:

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Zero games are must win during the first 7 years of a 10 year 75 mil guaranteed contract

Just try to enjoy watching the rebuild...

We're probably still 2-3 years away from competing for anything worthwhile

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What kind of rebuild takes 6 years?

That doesn't make any sense.

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uh well Clemson's took like 4 and they're in the ACC. We could go 11-2 on average in the ACC in the right division (the one that doesn't host Clemson). Plus that program adjusted to their new coaches demands of perfection in just a couple years while we still have mentally filthy players left over from Sumlin.

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We have had mentally filthy players since way before Sumlin. This is a societal entitlement issue where our inner city kids feel that they are oppressed even while receiving a full college scholarship and the adoration of millions for playing a game. I believe it is the reason that A&M and Texas (along with other schools who recruit heavily from our largest cities - USC, UCLA, Notre Dame, Michigan, etc.) have failed to consistently compete at a high level compared to other programs that recruit from more rural populations or cherry pick nationally (most of the SEC, Clemson, tOSU, OU, etc.). The attitude of kids from Louisiana, Florida, Alabama, Georgia, etc. is just different than the kids from Dallas and Houston and we are seeing the results in how our guys approach their "job". I am hoping that Jimbo can transform the entitled culture within the program, but it isn't an easy task.

I am disappointed in the slow progress and feel like Jimbo would benefit from a dynamic play caller/OC, but I also see a team that appears to be getting tougher and looks like an SEC team from a size perspective, they just aren't mentally strong enough to prepare to compete at the level they need to in this conference.

slyfox07 said:

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What kind of rebuild takes 6 years?

That doesn't make any sense.

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Clemson under Dabo.

Cassius said:

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so Jimbo is not able to change the mindset of the Sumlin recruits?! What does that say about Jimbo?

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He has had success for many but it's very probably that there are still a few cancers in the team. Those need to be flushed out. We can judge him only once he has his own recruits.

Florida is a top 10 team with similar talent level as A&M. The game is at Kyle field. Two top 6 recruiting classes. Developing players for 3 years with a championship level coaching staff. Yes you must win this game. If not Jimbo deserves criticism.

Clemson isn't in the SEC West. If they were, I expect their rise under Dabo might have taken a slower track. And that isn't meant to be disparaging toward their coach or program. Just saying it isnt an apples to apples comparison.

Hoax virus; over 200,000 dead.

Hell of a hoax !

Dr Lane Trowlan said:

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Dabo at Clemson
Year 4: First year with double digit wins
Year 8: First Championship

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I want to agree with this, but I looked it up and Dabo took over at Clemson half way through 2008 - coached the last 6 reg season games and went 4-2 + bowl win against unranked Nebraska

In 2009 they went 8-5, including the ACC Championship game, losing to Ga Tech + won their bowl game against UR Kentucky

2010 was a bit of a set back, going 6-6 reg season and losing to UR South Fla in bowl (by your count above this is Dabo's 3rd season - actually 2 1/2 seasons, compare to 2020 for Jimbo)

2011 - went 10-3 including win over Va Tech in ACC championship, but lost bowl game to #23 W Vir.

2012 - went 10-2 + bowl win over #8 LSU (based on what I see here on Texags I think a lot of you would not believe this is good enough in Jimbo's 4th or 5th yr - 2021 - even with an SEC schedule)

2014 - went 9-3 + bowl win over UR OU - also other than 2008 this was first year Dabo beat in state rival S Car after 4 straight losses.

2015 - 12-0 + ACC Championship + playoff win (OU), then lose to Bama in Nat'l Championship

2016 - Win Nat'l Championship, had 1 reg season loss to UR Pitt.

However ACC schedule not as tough as SEC schedule. In 2008-11 he was 5-9 vs ranked teams (ranked at time of game). Highest ranked team played was #10 Miami (W). Avg rank of 14 games was 16.

Jimbo is 3-8 vs ranked teams. Best win against #7 LSU. Avg rank of 11 games is 6 (6 times ranked either 1 or 2).

Florida does not have the clear talent advantage on us that Alabama did. I'm not saying we should win, but the coach who makes the best in game adjustments will win. I think that is what Jimbo is being paid to do.

We should win this game.
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This ain't Fran out there coaching

This is our chance to separate ourselves from texas for these in state recruits.

Those clowns in Austin give us so many opportunities, it's time to take advantage of one.

OP and like minded Ags are going to be very sad this weekend

My Name Is Judge said:

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Do you think we're a year away from competing for titles?

This year essentially gets thrown out bc of hoax virus

Jimbo has had 2 complete recruiting classes thus far... he presumably needs 2-3 more to get things exactly how he wants it.. he's pretty set in his ways

So yea if we compete before then, great... I just don't see it

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Can you expand on how this was a Hoax? I've had 3 friends die from it, with no underlying issues and my wife has been working front line on this since the beginning.

Number 2 and number 4. We aren't ranked top ten. Pollsters can be wrong but claiming you wouldn't expect losses is borderline delusional.

Now what changed? Our schedule primarily. Subtract four easier ooc opponents and add a top five and a top 15. We are on track to win some games, but have four teams ranked head of us still left to play. And a couple of teams that probably are toss ups.

Expectations ratchet, but doing that ahead of schedule is self-loathing.

Dr Lane Trowlan said:

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slyfox07 said:

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My Name Is Judge said:

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Zero games are must win during the first 7 years of a 10 year 75 mil guaranteed contract

Just try to enjoy watching the rebuild...

We're probably still 2-3 years away from competing for anything worthwhile

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What kind of rebuild takes 6 years?

That doesn't make any sense.

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Dabo at Clemson
Year 4: First year with double digit wins
Year 8: First Championship

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Clemson was in FAR worse shape in 2008 than A&M was in 2018. 5 fewer wins in the previous 6 years against much weaker competition. Bowden, in the previous 6 years before he left Clemson, beat 2 10-win teams. Hell, he only played 11 during that stretch! Sumlin beat 2 10-win teams his first freakin' year! 2 more the next year. After that, it got a little thin, but he played 17 total. I'm no Sumlin fan -- wanted him out earlier than most on here because I saw he had no commitment to defense. But he recruited fairly well and left the program in much better shape than Bowden left Clemson.

The Dabo comparison, as has been pointed out on here, is just misplaced at best and totally bogus at worst.

The problem with Jimbo is not the time but the question: what is he doing to make us better? And the question: what is he doing or not doing that is keeping us from getting better? I'm far more afraid of the answers to those questions than I am about the answer to "how long do we give him."

slyfox07 said:

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My Name Is Judge said:

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Zero games are must win during the first 7 years of a 10 year 75 mil guaranteed contract

Just try to enjoy watching the rebuild...

We're probably still 2-3 years away from competing for anything worthwhile

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What kind of rebuild takes 6 years?

That doesn't make any sense.

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It makes perfect sense when you come in and recruit 4th best in your conference.

saw em off said:

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ABATTBQ87 said:

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It also took us 5 coaches in 18 years (1967 to 1985) to win a SWC title

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And now we're currently 4 coaches in 22 years AND COUNTING since our last conference title.

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well, doofus if you would have read my post 2 above the one you replied to you would have noticed I addressed that exact topic.

Quote:

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We are on year 22 since our last Conference Championship, and have had 5 coaches in that period.

Looks like we actually need to quit chasing rainbows and unicorns and be more patient, because this is the way its always is done ain't working too well

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ABATTBQ11 said:

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My Name Is Judge said:

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Zero games are must win during the first 7 years of a 10 year 75 mil guaranteed contract

Just try to enjoy watching the rebuild...

We're probably still 2-3 years away from competing for anything worthwhile

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We've been rebuilding for 20 years

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Nope, we've been rebuijlding since Sherrill stepped down for the lack of Texas A&M not backing him for fear, scared sh@tless is a better word for it, of being put on probation. Loyalty runs one way at A&M, from the bottom up, none from the upper muckity mucks!!!! Unless you've got the mega big time $$$$$!!??