Garrett at a Jayz concert

spherical said:

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Bunk Moreland said:

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BostonAg74 said:

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spherical said:

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BMX Bandit said:

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Rudolph's denial seems too absolute to be believable

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Huh?

If someone falsely accuses you of something saying something that would make you a pariah, you definitely are absolute about it

If Rudolph had said the quibbling jibberish you suggested, he'd be laughed at. He either said it or he didn't it

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Yea- but the "I've never used a racial slur" is a bit too much. Zero chance that's true.

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Exactly my point. Denying that he said it in this circumstance is one thing. Denying that he has ever used any racial slur defies belief and puts the specific denial in question.

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Lol at the mental gymnastics

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Ever hear "The lady doth protest too much"?

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Without Googling it can you tell me the actual quote, what character said it, and from what work it is quoted?

Lateralus Ag said:

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spherical said:

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Bunk Moreland said:

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BostonAg74 said:

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spherical said:

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BMX Bandit said:

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Quote:

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Rudolph's denial seems too absolute to be believable

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Huh?

If someone falsely accuses you of something saying something that would make you a pariah, you definitely are absolute about it

If Rudolph had said the quibbling jibberish you suggested, he'd be laughed at. He either said it or he didn't it

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Yea- but the "I've never used a racial slur" is a bit too much. Zero chance that's true.

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Exactly my point. Denying that he said it in this circumstance is one thing. Denying that he has ever used any racial slur defies belief and puts the specific denial in question.

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Lol at the mental gymnastics

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Ever hear "The lady doth protest too much"?

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Without Googling it can you tell me the actual quote, what character said it, and from what work it is quoted?

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Not even a little bit - in fact there is a non zero chance that I only know it from a Calvin and Hobbes strip

spherical said:

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Lateralus Ag said:

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spherical said:

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Bunk Moreland said:

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BostonAg74 said:

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spherical said:

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BMX Bandit said:

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Quote:

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Rudolph's denial seems too absolute to be believable

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Huh?

If someone falsely accuses you of something saying something that would make you a pariah, you definitely are absolute about it

If Rudolph had said the quibbling jibberish you suggested, he'd be laughed at. He either said it or he didn't it

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Yea- but the "I've never used a racial slur" is a bit too much. Zero chance that's true.

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Exactly my point. Denying that he said it in this circumstance is one thing. Denying that he has ever used any racial slur defies belief and puts the specific denial in question.

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Lol at the mental gymnastics

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Ever hear "The lady doth protest too much"?

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Without Googling it can you tell me the actual quote, what character said it, and from what work it is quoted?

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Not even a little bit - in fact there is a non zero chance that I only know it from a Calvin and Hobbes strip

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Nicely done.

BostonAg74 said:

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spherical said:

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BMX Bandit said:

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Quote:

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Rudolph's denial seems too absolute to be believable

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Huh?

If someone falsely accuses you of something saying something that would make you a pariah, you definitely are absolute about it

If Rudolph had said the quibbling jibberish you suggested, he'd be laughed at. He either said it or he didn't it

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Yea- but the "I've never used a racial slur" is a bit too much. Zero chance that's true.

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Exactly my point. Denying that he said it in this circumstance is one thing. Denying that he has ever used any racial slur defies belief and puts the specific denial in question.

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People are stretching with their interpretations of their recollections. Rudolph's exact quote "I did not, have not, and would not utter a racial slur."

He has not put any timeframe on his comment. Is he saying on the field? Since he got out of college? It's open to interpretation. Those who want to dig back to when he was a teenager are always pretty sad. Kids say stupid things. Problem with Myles' recollection is that he has ZERO corroboration. If Rudolph used a racial slur, I would think Garrett would be screaming "what did you call me?" on the field. Pouncey would have had issue with Rudolph. He fully supports his QB Even Garrett's teammates said that Myles said nothing to them after the game about a racial slur. My bet is his agent came up with the allegation to save Myles from a longer suspension, and Myles has gone along with it.

djktamu said:

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BostonAg74 said:

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spherical said:

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BMX Bandit said:

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Quote:

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Rudolph's denial seems too absolute to be believable

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Huh?

If someone falsely accuses you of something saying something that would make you a pariah, you definitely are absolute about it

If Rudolph had said the quibbling jibberish you suggested, he'd be laughed at. He either said it or he didn't it

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Yea- but the "I've never used a racial slur" is a bit too much. Zero chance that's true.

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Exactly my point. Denying that he said it in this circumstance is one thing. Denying that he has ever used any racial slur defies belief and puts the specific denial in question.

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People are stretching with their interpretations of their recollections. Rudolph's exact quote "I did not, have not, and would not utter a racial slur."

He has not put any timeframe on his comment. Is he saying on the field? Since he got out of college? It's open to interpretation. Those who want to dig back to when he was a teenager are always pretty sad. Kids say stupid things. Problem with Myles' recollection is that he has ZERO corroboration. If Rudolph used a racial slur, I would think Garrett would be screaming "what did you call me?" on the field. Pouncey would have had issue with Rudolph. He fully supports his QB Even Garrett's teammates said that Myles said nothing to them after the game about a racial slur. My bet is his agent came up with the allegation to save Myles from a longer suspension, and Myles has gone along with it.

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But the suspension is in the past? Why repeat it?

Whoever is advising Myles should be fired. All he had to do was just not address anything after the initial round of interviews, and it would just fade away.

The train left the station. After something gets momentum, it's hard to stop. As long as the media has interviews where other players and coaches portray Garrett as a liar, he is obligated to fight that narrative. Unfortunately this type of story is divisive and easily exploited. The media wins and everyone involved loses.

Not that it matters, but it looks like former Browns GM Dorsey has confirmed that Myles told them about it post game. It's not something that he just came up with days later.

mugwurt said:

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Keeper of The Spirits said:

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Myles is on record on his view on the word. Regardless of you position on the word, Rudolph wrote a check his ass couldn't cash.

I believe Myles account because of reputation, his lack of attention whoring ever, the fact he didn't release it to the media, and that he doubled down after he was in the clear. That's how he is different than Jussie Smollie.

It his also possible that Rudolph didn't say it but Myles thought he did. The heat of a brawl can be hell on the senses.Rudolph did start it. While their are a ton of mics on the field I doubt all of them actively record, I also doubt the NFL would release the clip for fear for Rudolph's safety and they would have to enforce any punishment equally on both white and black athletes, which is not practical.

My Venn Diagram comment is that if you believe Rudolph over Garrett (even though Garrett is one of ours with an impeccable public record) your opinion is likely tinged with some racial bias.

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It has nothing to do with racial bias. It has to do with not instantly believing damning accusations with zero supporting evidence, no matter who is involved, where they went to school, or the color of their skin.

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You're automatically calling Myles a liar and comparing him to Jussie simply because they're both black, despite being in two very different situations. So what do you call that if not capital R racist?

Body By Fisher said:

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mugwurt said:

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Keeper of The Spirits said:

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Myles is on record on his view on the word. Regardless of you position on the word, Rudolph wrote a check his ass couldn't cash.

I believe Myles account because of reputation, his lack of attention whoring ever, the fact he didn't release it to the media, and that he doubled down after he was in the clear. That's how he is different than Jussie Smollie.

It his also possible that Rudolph didn't say it but Myles thought he did. The heat of a brawl can be hell on the senses.Rudolph did start it. While their are a ton of mics on the field I doubt all of them actively record, I also doubt the NFL would release the clip for fear for Rudolph's safety and they would have to enforce any punishment equally on both white and black athletes, which is not practical.

My Venn Diagram comment is that if you believe Rudolph over Garrett (even though Garrett is one of ours with an impeccable public record) your opinion is likely tinged with some racial bias.

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It has nothing to do with racial bias. It has to do with not instantly believing damning accusations with zero supporting evidence, no matter who is involved, where they went to school, or the color of their skin.

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You're automatically calling Myles a liar and comparing him to Jussie simply because they're both black, despite being in two very different situations. So what do you call that if not capital R racist?

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False. I never said Myles is a liar, and i never compared him to Jussie.

I have been painfully clear in my stance of not default believing accusations, with no supporting evidence, period.

Let me repeat my post you quoted...

It has to do with not instantly believing damning accusations with zero supporting evidence, no matter who is involved, where they went to school, or the color of their skin.

This recent trend we are seeing in society of condeming anyone who does not default believe accusations and calling them racist, sexist, etc. is very disturbing, and scary.

The evidence in this case is an eye or ear witness account. Its also fair to point out that generally Myles account would be discounted because he was a party to the fight and eye witness testimony is unreliable at best (about 30% of wrongful convictions had an eye witness). Not that the legal system has any bearing on this, as it is currently a matter between employees and their employer.

The question is do you believe Rudolph or Garrett and why? If you don't have enough information to make a call that is fair, but that doesn't make Garrett the bad guy.

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i never compared him to Jussie.

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I just went back through the thread and see you weren't the one quoting the Jussie comment. My bad, I apologize for directing that exclusively to you when it should have just been a comment on the thread.

I just have a problem with immediately throwing this into some larger political context, when we have detailed video of the specific actions.

The videos show Rudolph grabbing Myles around the head, mouthing something, trying to kick Myles in the crotch, and trying to hit him again from behind his teammates - after Myles had been kicked on the ground by Rudolph's teammates.

That was a specific series of actions. Sure, Myles could have just walked away with his hands in the air, but I don't see how anyone thinks that he was the instigator or sole bad actor in the situation. I do not see where any observer who is not affiliated with either team would automatically take Rudolph's side over Myles, so the racial bias question is absolutely fair to bring up in this thread, IMO.

I do have a problem with anyone comparing it to the Juicy Smallier scam.

Interestingly, none of Rudolph's teammates (or uninformed internet commenters) have come forward to say what they think Rudolph was really saying to Myles, they have only called Myles a liar and attempted to hurt Myles' reputation and earning potential. That's complete and utter B.S.

Body By Fisher said:

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Quote:

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i never compared him to Jussie.

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I just went back through the thread and see you weren't the one quoting the Jussie comment. My bad, I apologize for directing that exclusively to you when it should have just been a comment on the thread.

I just have a problem with immediately throwing this into some larger political context, when we have detailed video of the specific actions.

The videos show Rudolph grabbing Myles around the head, mouthing something, trying to kick Myles in the crotch, and trying to hit him again from behind his teammates - after Myles had been kicked on the ground by Rudolph's teammates.

That was a specific series of actions. Sure, Myles could have just walked away with his hands in the air, but I don't see how anyone thinks that he was the instigator or sole bad actor in the situation. I do not see where any observer who is not affiliated with either team would automatically take Rudolph's side over Myles, so the racial bias question is absolutely fair to bring up in this thread, IMO.

I do have a problem with anyone comparing it to the Juicy Smallier scam.

Interestingly, none of Rudolph's teammates (or uninformed internet commenters) have come forward to say what they think Rudolph was really saying to Myles, they have only called Myles a liar and attempted to hurt Myles' reputation and earning potential. That's complete and utter B.S.

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Most people I have seen assign blame to both parties, and think Rudolph deserved punishment as well for his role.

That is a separate discussion on whether or not we should default believe the claim of the racial slur or not.

We have video evidence proving Rudolph was not innocent in the scuffle, and from that we can reasonably conclude Rudolph deserved punishment for his actions.

The only evidence we have for the racial slur claim is 2 opposing claims from the accuser and the accused. Without anything else, how do you objectively decide to believe the accuser over the accused?

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The only evidence we have for the racial slur claim is 2 opposing claims from the accuser and the accused. Without anything else, how do you objectively decide to believe the accuser over the accused?

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You can't 100% decide. Without exculpatory uninterrupted and unedited audio, damning audio or admission by either side we will never know. The right thing to do, is probably not to weigh in, but then this message board would be pretty dull. If you want to pick a side, there are things I considered:

• The character of the individuals involved (Myles has always been a class act, I know nothing about Rudolph)
• The audio/video we do have (No proof of words, but certainly showed Rudolph as less than an innocent victim)
• The actions of the accuser (Reported to Browns immediately after, did not go to the media, did not back away from it when questioned)

Agsuffering@bulaw said:

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You make a good point. Here's mine:

(1) Myles is one of ours
(2) Mason is a poon trying to fight on the ground
(3) Sometimes acting like a poon gets your head bashed in

F--- Mason Rudolph, Roger Goodell and everybody else. Even if Myles lied about the racial remarks, I dont care. I am glad he bashed Mason's head in. It was awesome to watch!

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How did we all know you were going to say this!

So lawyers ... what is the legal definition of a "racial slur?"

ashley said:

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Agsuffering@bulaw said:

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You make a good point. Here's mine:

(1) Myles is one of ours
(2) Mason is a poon trying to fight on the ground
(3) Sometimes acting like a poon gets your head bashed in

F--- Mason Rudolph, Roger Goodell and everybody else. Even if Myles lied about the racial remarks, I dont care. I am glad he bashed Mason's head in. It was awesome to watch!

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How did we all know you were going to say this!

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I'm too lazy to find THIS OP, but it's an interesting take to say the least.

P.S. I have an Ag Tag