You get an F in logic 101.

the fans, alumni, and season ticket holders are still at Penn State; therefore, the people involved in the incident are not all gone. They created the beast that allowed Sandusky to go on for years --- they need to be punished for the full 4 years

A lot of people here are way overestimating the power the NCAA holds in this day and age. The sanctions were dropped by the NCAA before they were forced to be dropped otherwise. The NCAA is losing regulation power day by day.

People talking death penalty are out of touch with the powers that be. The death penalty will never happen again, at least not by the hand of the NCAA.

Not out of touch. Just discussing what they deserved. What one deserves vs what one would realistically get are often two different things.

There's a difference between what can legally happen and what SHOULD have happened. Personally I don't know about the death penalty in this case. But however we got here I think the NCAA owes all institutions that have ever been hit with an institutional control infraction an apology. Penn State as an institution was at fault for plenty here.

I agree that it is two different discussions.

Just saying.. whether a team deserves the death penalty is irrelevant because it simply won't happen as it is now. Unless we're trying to push for a change here.

Desperation decision must've been influenced by fear that B1G conference is becoming mid-major

NCAA rules are primarily in place to prevent schools from gaining a competitive advantage over other schools by providing unfair benefits to amateur athletes. (Or by allowing unfair benefits to be received via "lack of institutional control" over boosters, agents or something similar)

I'd like someone to explain how the NCAA believes that Penn State was providing an advantage to their players because of this criminal activity. It's a legal matter, pure and simple - and those that committed a crime, or conspired to impede an investigation should be prosecuted. And I believe they have been.

It has absolutely ZERO to do with the NCAA. They just jumped on a huge story as a play to create some positive PR and goodwill in the public as "champions of the children" or some such nonsense. Absolutely despicable. Nowhere near the horror of the actual crime, but despicable nonetheless.

They were trying to avoid bad publicity which would have lost recruits, which would have resulted in the program's decline. Avoiding a program's decline, i.e. decreased competitiveness, tv, bowl's (recruits like this stuff and therefore benefits them), general tarnishing of image is the same motivating factor that leads some institutions to attempt to gain an advantage.

Why were high placed officials at Penn State impeding the investigstion to begin with? What was their motivation if not for football? Seems that they took on quite a bit of risk to their own detriment. Why would they risk going to jail if not to avoid problems for the football program?

Yep. Joe Pa built his entire program upon a "we are holier than thou" attitude and image.

This^.

And joepa was not the only one to benefit from that image.

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NCAA rules are primarily in place to prevent schools from gaining a competitive advantage over other schools by providing unfair benefits to amateur athletes. (Or by allowing unfair benefits to be received via "lack of institutional control" over boosters, agents or something similar)

I'd like someone to explain how the NCAA believes that Penn State was providing an advantage to their players because of this criminal activity. It's a legal matter, pure and simple - and those that committed a crime, or conspired to impede an investigation should be prosecuted. And I believe they have been.

It has absolutely ZERO to do with the NCAA. They just jumped on a huge story as a play to create some positive PR and goodwill in the public as "champions of the children" or some such nonsense. Absolutely despicable. Nowhere near the horror of the actual crime, but despicable nonetheless.

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Good point....but it could be argued that the lack of institutional control at PSU allowed the University to hide some really sick stuff for a long time....so what about all those years when the sick stuff was being hidden, yet PSU and it's legendary coach had a stellar reputation and they were able to recruit at a very high level because of that false reputation? Isn't that an unfair advantage?....especially after considering how Paterno was perceived as some kind of god by the media all those years? Paterno was a brand all by himself....and it helped PSU's football team......and in hindsight, it shouldn't have, because Paterno was a POS that knew Sandusky was a pedophile.

Coupland boy - I appreciate your reasoned response. However, I personally think it's a stretch. I think the analogy would be if Tom Osborne hypothetically shot someone on the Nebraska campus and Pellini possibly knew about it and didn't fully report it. In my mind, it has nothing to do with football or the program. For goodness sake, Sandusky hadn't been a coach there in years.

Anyway, I know I'm in the minority on this one, but it's such a strange case that I have a hard time thinking this is a NCAA matter. It seems like it should be a straight-up case for Johnny Law to throw the book at these bastages - not the joke that is the NCAA. I was disgusted by what I thought was grandstanding by the NCAA in the face of a tragedy.

Sanctions were bull**** from the start. Justice system needs to act on those that were in the wrong. Outside of that, let the rest of those college athletes play and go to school. Glad they were lifted, though it was obviously for conference reasons... which is wrong.

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Coupland boy - I appreciate your reasoned response. However, I personally think it's a stretch. I think the analogy would be if Tom Osborne hypothetically shot someone on the Nebraska campus and Pellini possibly knew about it and didn't fully report it. In my mind, it has nothing to do with football or the program. For goodness sake, Sandusky hadn't been a coach there in years.

Anyway, I know I'm in the minority on this one, but it's such a strange case that I have a hard time thinking this is a NCAA matter. It seems like it should be a straight-up case for Johnny Law to throw the book at these bastages - not the joke that is the NCAA. I was disgusted by what I thought was grandstanding by the NCAA in the face of a tragedy.

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Couldn't agree more, touchdown.

The people that did the crime paid the price and they are gone. Everyone else being blamed whether they were there are not is irrelevent and would never be proven and was not proven. All you doing the blame need a course in hypocrisy.

Eff jo pa and the pedestal he put himself on. He was the emperor of penn state. If he knew the slightest thing about what went on then I am glad he is gone from this earth and wish it had happened sooner. Eff him!

I dont think you can argue for or against sanctions purely on the facts of the Sandusky case...

Penn St's problem was the football culture became the most powerful entity on campus. They were above oversight - and had the power to cover up crimes to the extreme detriment of the university and the victims.

NCAA w/ support of decent Penn Taxpayers, politicans and school admin had no choice but to sanction the football program to take that power back - and to send a message to the rest of NCAA member schools.

I dont know if lifing the sanctions now is apporpriate based on the original agreement...but IMO, Penn St shouldve rec'd the death penalty. What SMU did to deserve the death penalty isnt even close to what Penn St football culture did...not even close.

Regarding the Tom Osborne analogy - if the AD, the university president, an assistant head coach (I demoted the accomplice in this case because in the Penn State scenario the responsible party was a high ranking asst. Instead if THE MAN) turned a blind eye then I would have to wonder about the motivation for them all to do so.

Again, why didn't the powers that be at the university just go to the police and turn in a pedophile? Even in prison they are considered the lowest ofbthe low.

I have a dishwasher to fix and the wife will be home soon! Someone else can try to explain the same thing several different ways.

Yeah - This stuff is making me upset thinking about it, and I need to run some errands anyway. Good luck with the dishwasher! (insert spouse-related joke)

And BTHO Rice!

From the NCAA D1 Manual 2011-2012

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2.4 THE PRIN CIPLE OF SPOR TSMANS HIP AND ETHICAL CONDUCT

For intercollegiate athletics to promote the character development of participants, to enhance the integrity of
higher education and to promote civility in society, student-athletes, coaches, and all others associated with these
athletics programs and events should adhere to such fundamental values as respect, fairness, civility, honesty and
responsibility. These values should be manifest not only in athletics participation, but also in the broad spectrum
of activities affecting the athletics program. It is the responsibility of each institution to: (Revised: 1/9/96)
(a) Establish policies for sportsmanship and ethical conduct in intercollegiate athletics consistent with the educational
mission and goals of the institution; and (Adopted: 1/9/96)
(b) Educate, on a continuing basis, all constituencies about the policies in Constitution 2.4-(a). (Adopted: 1/9/96)

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32.6.3 Statute of Limitations. Allegations included in a notice of allegations shall be limited to possible
violations occurring not earlier than four years before the date the notice of inquiry is forwarded to the institution
or the date the institution notifies (or, if earlier, should have notified) the enforcement staff of its inquiries into
the matter. However, the following shall not be subject to the four-year limitation: (Revised: 10/12/94, 4/24/03)
(a) Allegations involving violations affecting the eligibility of a current student-athlete;
(b) Allegations in a case in which information is developed to indicate a pattern of willful violations on the part
of the institution or individual involved, which began before but continued into the four-year period; and
(c) Allegations that indicate a blatant disregard for the Association's fundamental recruiting, extra-benefit, academic
or ethical-conduct regulations or that involve an effort to conceal the occurrence of the violation. In
such cases, the enforcement staff shall have a one-year period after the date information concerning the matter
becomes available to the NCAA to investigate and submit to the institution a notice of allegations concerning
the matter.

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I think it can be argued that this could give the NCAA the authority to act. I think the NCAA could have and should have stuck to their guns and left the sanctions intact.

NCAA just has to be horrified by B1G's poor showing...no way those guys are going to do anything to further hurt Penn St or the B1G - regardless of how justafiable it would be...

Remember - those are the same guys who have +1M annual salaries and had no problem making $$ off the likeness of their athletes while denying them the ability to cash in on it themselves

NCAA and Penss State are rot

If you support then being reinstated then you believe raping children is a non issue. Disgusting.

Exactly. The entire football team and student body should be jailed immediately. (Sarcasm)

I 100% agree with it. The people involved are gone and being punished. Stop punishing people who had nothing to do with it.

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Soooo you should punish those that weren't there? That makes sense

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almost all serious infractions and sanctions are imposed on coaches and players that were not there at the time...

And that has never made a lick of since. ^. Just because that's how it's always been doesn't make it right. Glad they are doing the right thing.

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And that has never made a lick of since. ^. Just because that's how it's always been doesn't make it right. Glad they are doing the right thing.

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Like many have already pointed out... if all it takes for an institution to avoid sanctions is to clean house and get a reset, then that's exactly what all institutions will do. That would set a precedent. Do what you can until you get caught, remove all humans culpable leaving some with reasonable deniability, rinse and repeat.

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If you support then being reinstated then you believe raping children is a non issue. Disgusting.

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Seriously? Way to take the discussion down a level or two.

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I 100% agree with it. The people involved are gone and being punished. Stop punishing people who had nothing to do with it.

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Go back and read some of my posts and others like it and try again.

It offends me greatly that a fan base that rallied in front of Joe Pa's house when all this became known and was led in yells of 'Penn State!' by the man himself is now being called innocent. No, they didn't abuse anyone, but their behavior that night, during that time, and the holier than though attitude long before then enabled it!

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What happened at PSU was a criminal act that had nothing to do with football

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It had everything to do with football. If Jerry Sandusky was Jerome the Janitor who a few people saw maybe doing something funny with kids at a football camp, he would have been fired and put in prison; because Sandusky was good at his job, and because his job was part of the 1 thing that Penn State is most known for and makes money by being good at, it was covered up repeatedly.

And don't tell me everyone involved is gone - did all the board of regents resign? Are all the mega boosters out of the stadium? Don't tell me all of those guys were oblivious to what happened. Yet not a one of them did anything about it. They covered up for a guy committing a crime - and not insider trading, or being a drug addict or skimming money from the petty cash fund - they covered up for a guy who was using his power and position to RAPE CHILDREN.

Penn State should not play football any more.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Second_Mile

Should have gotten the death penalty.

I didnt take any discussion down, obviously now I know how you stand.