Good one,GS. Polynesians, for sure.

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Do we count the Norsemen as Normans?
If so, don't forget Russia. Weren't they the Rus?

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It's a little more complicated than this, but the short answer is yes. I'll have to put together a thread on this sometime.

most overrated for me is medieval scotland. i get tired of people talking bragging about stuff they dont know about because they have seen braveheart and they have some scottish blood in them. yea there were some battles and some pretty castles, but so what. the holy grail isnt in scotland, and shortbread isnt even that good. the average american blows scotland's importance way out of proportion so that is the basic reason for my pick.



underrated?

i never hear anyone really talk about the swiss. banking, chocolate, women, guards, templar mystique

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The saying goes that Rome conquered Greece, but Greece conquered Rome.

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That saying is the basis for my choice for underrated: Rome. Greece is deservedly considered a pinnacle of culture, but we wouldn't know about it if it weren't for the Romans. The Romans aren't looked upon as favorably as the Greeks, but the Romans were great copiers and great organizers. They spread the ideas they copied from Greece (and Egypt) much further throughout the world than the Greeks ever would have.

I think India is underrated also. 'Arabic' numerals actually came from India.

On the issue of corruption, you should note that more of the world is like that than like us. Ever try getting anything done in Russia? Also, our culture has its own corruptions, they're just different. Don't kid yourself.

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They spread the ideas they copied from Greece (and Egypt) much further throughout the world than the Greeks ever would have.

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The Hellenistic kingdoms after Alexander spread Greek culture to India & Egypt. The Greeks also had Magna Grecia in Southern Italy & quite a few Greek City states in Sicily such as Syracuse. Not sure how that compares to the Roman Empire, but it's pretty expansive.

Speaking as a Christian, I marvel that Alexander lived and conquered just long enough to make Greek the lingua franca of most of the known world and then the Romans built the roads to take the gospel to those places. Just a thought.

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most overrated for me is medieval scotland. i get tired of people talking bragging about stuff they dont know about because they have seen braveheart and they have some scottish blood in them. yea there were some battles and some pretty castles, but so what. the holy grail isnt in scotland, and shortbread isnt even that good. the average american blows scotland's importance way out of proportion so that is the basic reason for my pick.

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Medieval Scotland isn't near the most overrated.
First country to be literate.
Published the first textbook on surgery
Logarithms invented
Golf
Bicycle

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First country to be literate.

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How do you justify this statement? Many other societies were literate in the past...

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Published the first textbook on surgery

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Didn't some of the Middle Eastern cultures (Persians/Arabs) have some sort of documentation on surgical procedure? Or do you mean mass-produced?

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I think India is underrated also. 'Arabic' numerals actually came from India.

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AMF is right. The numeral system came from India and taken to Arabia through merchants. Thats how the West got to know and called it Arabic numerals. I read that in Arabia even today they are called "Hindu/Indian numerals". Can anyone confirm this?

How about the Chinese for underrated?

Developed bureaucracy (a dirty word now, but still)

Very advanced astronomy and trade.

Built a giant navy in the middle ages.

Have basically the longest continuous culture in the world.

Unfortunately for them they were at a weak point when the west was becoming very strong.

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How do you justify this statement? Many other societies were literate in the past...

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Many other societies had people who were literate. Scotland was the first country with mass literacy.

The Chinese get the Civilization award for "Don't know a good thing when they see it".

They invented gunpowder, but it took Europeans to develop its full potential.

They had the most advanced navy in the world, but chose to trash their fleet because they felt there was nothing in the world they needed.

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Scotland was the first country with mass literacy.

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What constitutes mass literacy? I'm not trying to discredit you, I'd just like a little more information.. a link perhaps?

I am cut up with the History Channel because they don't show anything about the Indian Civilization. That leads a lot of Americans (and others) to base their thinking about the Indian civilization merely in terms of poverty, caste system, cows, snake charmers, arranged marriage, Gandhi etc.

The History channel seems to be enamored by Egypt and Mesopotamia, and to a lesser degree with the Chinese civilization. I wonder if it is somehow politically incorrect to talk about the greatness of ancient India.

For example, how many have heard of Sushruta, who performed plastic surgery 600 years before Christ?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sushruta

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Sushruta (also spelled Susruta or Sushrutha) (c. 6th century BC) was a renowned surgeon of ancient India, and the author of the book Sushruta Samhita. In his book, he described over 120 surgical instruments, 300 surgical procedures and classifies human surgery in 8 categories. He lived and taught and practiced his art on the banks of the Ganga in the area that corresponds to the present day city of Varanasi in North India.

Because of his seminal and numerous contributions to the science and art of surgery he is also known by the title "Father of Surgery." Much of what is known about this inventive surgeon is contained in a series of volumes he authored, which are collectively known as the Susrutha Samhita. The "Samhita" has some writings that date as late as the 1st century, and some scholars believe that there were contributions and additions to his teachings from generations of his students and disciples. Sushruta is also the father of Plastic Surgery and Cosmetic Surgery since his technique of forehead flap rhinoplasty (repairing the disfigured nose with a flap of skin from the forehead),that he used to reconstruct noses that were amputated, is practiced almost unchanged in technique to this day. The Susrutha Samhita contains the first known description of several operations, including the uniting of bowel, the removal of the prostate gland, the removal of cataract lenses and the draining of abscesses. Susrutha was also the first surgeon to advocate the practice of operations on inanimate objects such as watermelons, clay plots and reeds; thus predating the modern practice of the surgical workshop by half a millennium.

Sushruta was also a notable teacher. He told his pupils that one could become a good physician only if one knew both theory and practice. He advised his pupils to use carcases and models for practice before surgery.In addition to classifying worms that infect the human body, leeches for bloodletting, medicinal herbs, alkalies and metals, Sushruta gave a vague classification of animals.

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There are several others like Aryabhatta, Bhaskara etc.

[This message has been edited by IndianAggie98 (edited 2/27/2008 9:28a).]

[This message has been edited by IndianAggie98 (edited 2/27/2008 9:31a).]

I've never had a thread last a year. I feel so, so proud

IndianAggie:

Don't forget Elephants, we think of Elephants too ... and Tigers, we think of Tigers too but that's about it.

Now if India had UFOs or Ice Road Truckers or had cracked the Da Vinci Code, than the History Channel might pay attention .

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The Hellenistic kingdoms after Alexander spread Greek culture to India & Egypt. The Greeks also had Magna Grecia in Southern Italy & quite a few Greek City states in Sicily such as Syracuse. Not sure how that compares to the Roman Empire, but it's pretty expansive.

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Good point, Apache, I was thinking more in terms of the West. Although the Romans also had influence in the East, it may not have been as extensive as the Greeks.

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it may not have been as extensive as the Greeks.

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The Parthian & Sassanids pretty much hemmed in the Romans/Byzantines to the east, so no; Rome didn't have the direct influence in that region like the Greek did.

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I am cut up with the History Channel because they don't show anything about the Indian Civilization

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You must be missing it because I've watched a show about the Mughal Empire in the past month. There's also some show about the Kama Sutra that shows up on one of those history channels alot. Or was that Cinemax?

It was History International.
I was "globalizing" myself.

Hey, I learned something new about India from CNN, don't go crosstie walking there, you might step on doodie:

http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/asiapcf/02/28/india.baby.ap/index.html

Incas. built their structures with no beast of burden bigger than a llama as well. Europe had oxen and horses.

Big difference.

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Published the first textbook on surger

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Galin was a surgeon for Rome around the 1st century AD. His texts were so advanced, they were not fully understood until the 16th century, and a lot of bad medicine was practiced because doctors didn't understand what he meant, and were focusing on the wrong points. Looking back, he was a breath away from discovering (aka identifying and understanding) the circulatory system.

He performed brain surgeries, including the removal of sections of skull to alleviate pressure. He performed cataract corrections, using tools that are much the same as the tools used today.