When I'm at my best I'm the same.

Jbob04 said:

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I've kinda adopted the Saladino diet but not as many carbs as him. I eat meat, eggs, fruit, whey protein, and raw milk. The only carbs I really eat are in the fruit and the little bit of raw milk but it's more berries than anything which are lower in carbs.

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I really like the "protein forward" approach as well for my overall eating

I know this kinda contradicts what I said earlier, but I actually believe a "meat + fruit" diet is absolutely perfect for weight loss. If you keep it mostly to lean cuts and/or lean animal sources, and then throw in whatever fruit you want, it allows for so much flexibility while also keeping you full. I especially love using fruit just to keep me full - because the worst part of being on a diet is just the hunger.

Ok but if you think lean meat plus fruit is good then why do you feel like fatty meats are bad?

bam02 said:

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Ok but if you think lean meat plus fruit is good then why do you feel like fatty meats are bad?

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Do you mean for weight loss? Because fat has more calories than carbs, so for me it's just a numbers thing. And if you're not careful with overeating fatty meat on a weight loss plan, you might just be spinning your wheels without getting anywhere. So for me, lean meats + fruit is great because the lean meat will keep me full without adding too much fat, and the fruit is great for something sweet without destroying my calorie budget- and the fiber is a nice plus

I don't think fatty meats are bad. I think using them exclusively as your sole food source is not a great strategy for long-term cardiovascular health.

But thankfully, weight loss is a QUICK process. So using fatty meats for weight loss can be a good short-term eating strategy to get the weight off. It's unlikely you're gonna accrue significant atherosclerosis in a 12-week weight loss diet

Yes fat is double the cals per gram but it's also more satiating.

bam02 said:

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Yes fat is double the cals per gram but it's also more satiating.

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Sure, fat is filling. But I love carbs since I am very active and lift frequently, so I like some good complex carbs. The more complex, the more filling for me. Even if I overdue the carbs, I have a good deal of muscle so it will mostly just get stored as glycogen in the muscle. More muscle = more glycogen storage = better prevention of high blood sugar issues

I would argue that protein is best at satiety…and bonus that it's more useful because it doubles as needed amino acids for body structure (and maybe extra muscle if you're training!).

Jbob04 said:

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I've kinda adopted the Saladino diet but not as many carbs as him. I eat meat, eggs, fruit, whey protein, and raw milk. The only carbs I really eat are in the fruit and the little bit of raw milk but it's more berries than anything which are lower in carbs.

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It fascinates me that college educated people drink raw milk. Crazy world.

Jbob04 said:

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anaggieshusband said:

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Watch:
Dr. Ken Berry
Dr. Nadir Ali
Dr. Robert Lustig
Dr. Anthony Chaffee

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This right here. Time to go carnivore

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Horrible advice.

Bonfire97 said:

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I just found out I have a calcium score of 1005 with most of the calcium in the LAD (so called Widowmaker artery). Dr. told me stay off of anything with processed meats, processed sugars, or processed grains. So, that wipes out a lot of stuff. Said pork and beef were ok (surprised at this). I am wondering if things like 100% whole grain bread are OK. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

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Man, that's spooky. I'm sorry to hear that.

Did they say you need to cut weight?

I would start here: Stay on the outside of the grocery aisle. Vegetables, beef, chicken, fish, pork. Try to limit processed food (ie, stuff you pull out of a wrapper). Carbs: brown rice, sweet potato, oatmeal, even white rice and normal potatoes (will probably need to measure theses out to actually see how much you are eating). Bread, I mean a bit is fine, but may consider something like Ezekiel bread.

Once you get comfortable doing that, you can start dialing it in even more.

You probably need to start getting some exercise in. Even walking 30 minutes 3 times a week can be effective.

Don't necessarily be afraid of carbs. Just be aware of them. (Really, fat is more of your enemy than anything, carbs can fuel workouts, protein builds muscle, fat doesn't do much of anything metabolically. Your protein should be about .8-1 gram of protein per pound of body weight (in your case, if you are heavier, you can probably go a bit less than that). Adjust from there.

Obviously, there are lots of opinions out there, and do your own research, but I found that a good balance of everything (just less), is way better than anything drastic that clearly defies common sense.

I wasn't told I need to cut weight. I am 6' 1" @ 206lbs so I am probably slightly overweight. However, I am going to try and trim back to about 195. I have already started jogging/walking for 20min every day. Regarding the diet stuff, the consensus of the advise on this board is to shop the edge of the grocery store. That is what I have been trying to do since I found out about all of this. That also matches my doc's advise. I am cutting out alcohol too, with the exception for some light social drinking here and there.

Bonfire97 said:

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I wasn't told I need to cut weight. I am 6' 1" @ 206lbs so I am probably slightly overweight. However, I am going to try and trim back to about 195. I have already started jogging/walking for 20min every day. Regarding the diet stuff, the consensus of the advise on this board is to shop the edge of the grocery store. That is what I have been trying to do since I found out about all of this. That also matches my doc's advise. I am cutting out alcohol too, with the exception for some light social drinking here and there.

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Yeah, you definitely aren't a "fat" dude (which Im sure is super frustrating to have this, and not visibly be out of shape). I too have high LDL, its genetic. Just did a calcium score, it was zero, thank goodness, but still.

You think about hitting the gym? Just something to consider as you stay on your fitness journey. Resistance training becomes even more important as we get older.

There is a great Weightlifting thread here if you want to hop on and ask some questions.

Regardless, you are doing the right things to get kicked off.

Dr Kiltz talks about the importance of fat and also Dr Berry.
I think Saladino's diet will work for someone who exercises a lot.

anaggieshusband said:

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I do have some calcification due to the 20 years of the Standard American diet, too much processed food (oil and sugar)

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We can agree here. Too much processed food is definitely the worst thing for you.

While we can argue about how much fat should be in average diet (as a part beef, chicken, pork, etc), there is no question that highly processed foods are a highway to bad health.

Carbs are way WAY too demonized right now. Complex carbs are an important part of well rounded diet. That said, they are difficult to control without planning for them. Most people don't, get them from processed food, and overeat because they are super palletable.

Carbs are not necessary for a long healthy life, but they do make it more enjoyable

I can go days or weeks without carbs, and feel great, but also feel bored

anaggieshusband said:

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Carbs are not necessary for a long healthy life, but they do make it more enjoyable

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I disagree to an extent. With the caveat that we should all be getting regular exercise, there is no better fuel for the body than carbs. I lift regularly, and if I try cutting carbs down dramatically my energy levels in the gym aren't great. Yes, I adjust my carbs based on what I am doing on any given day, but I absolutely have better workouts when getting enough carbs (what is enough obviously varies from person to person).

jtraggie99 said:

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anaggieshusband said:

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Carbs are not necessary for a long healthy life, but they do make it more enjoyable

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I disagree to an extent. With the caveat that we should all be getting regular exercise, there is no better fuel for the body than carbs. I lift regularly, and if I try cutting carbs down dramatically my energy levels in the gym aren't great. Yes, I adjust my carbs based on what I am doing on any given day, but I absolutely have better workouts when getting enough carbs (what is enough obviously varies from person to person).

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Agreed. If your goal is to grow muscle, then you're doing yourself a disservice and leaving gains on the table by avoiding carbs

When I'm full on carnivore I definitely see an overall strength/ volume reduction lifting weights. This is high intensity 5x5 lifting in the 3 and 4 hundred lbs ranges.
However through experimentation it takes very little carbs to offset the reduction. I try to only get them through small amounts of veggies and fruits on lift days. Especially any leg days. I also tend to notice more volume reductions than reductions in amount of weight I can move which I'm sure impacts gain potential significantly.

Everyone is different I suppose with different levels of activity.

But mother of gawd, if I don't get enough carbs my workouts SUCK. This is lifting heavy (for me) and really pushing it. Not just some hard "cardio." Not only that, I don't think as well without them.

As far as I am concerned, complex carbs are an essential part of the human diet.

Too many people...way too many, have fallen into the trap of "cutting carbs to lose weight" and that its some magical way to lose weight. It isn't. Carbs are easy to overeat and go over your maintenance. Cut them out, getting below maintenance is easier.

40 percent Protein, 40 percent carb, 20 percent fat. Happy camper.

Quote:

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Carbs are not necessary for a long healthy life, but they do make it more enjoyable

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I suppose this is correct (dont' know about the long part), as you can live off animal protein only. But you aren't going to be as healthy or as strong as someone who eats balanced.

Definitely

Good timing for this video to come out, considering our discussion on this thread

OK. So, I am about half way through "Deep Nutrition". Thanks again for the recommendation above. The Dr. who wrote this is very well informed and provides reasoning on a cellular level. I am completely on board.

I do have a question for everyone trying to strictly follow a heart healthy diet. Do you ever give yourself a break? Like the other day, someone had Mexican food brought in at work. After several weeks of salads and bringing cooked vegetables and chicken to work, I really wanted to tear into it. In a situation like that, is it OK to do it every once in awhile? Or, maybe join the group and eat so you don't look like an outcast, but just eat some meat and beans (no tortillas and other bad parts)? Just wondering what everyone's thoughts are on this.

Bonfire97 said:

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OK. So, I am about half way through "Deep Nutrition". Thanks again for the recommendation above. The Dr. who wrote this is very well informed and provides reasoning on a cellular level. I am completely on board.

I do have a question for everyone trying to strictly follow a heart healthy diet. Do you ever give yourself a break? Like the other day, someone had Mexican food brought in at work. After several weeks of salads and bringing cooked vegetables and chicken to work, I really wanted to tear into it. In a situation like that, is it OK to do it every once in awhile? Or, maybe join the group and eat so you don't look like an outcast, but just eat some meat and beans (no tortillas and other bad parts)? Just wondering what everyone's thoughts are on this.

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Establish your baseline of healthy eating first where you do it and not even think about it on a daily basis. (This is to rewire how you think about food).

But, of course every once in awhile is perfectly fine. Remember, life is for living. I can tell you with 100% certainty that you are going to die no matter what you eat.

Eating good food with good company is a big part of living. (But just be choosey how you shoot those shots). In a given week would you rather (a) eat some office lunch that is mid at best, or (b) eat a great meal with friends and family.

Bonfire97 said:

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OK. So, I am about half way through "Deep Nutrition". Thanks again for the recommendation above. The Dr. who wrote this is very well informed and provides reasoning on a cellular level. I am completely on board.

I do have a question for everyone trying to strictly follow a heart healthy diet. Do you ever give yourself a break? Like the other day, someone had Mexican food brought in at work. After several weeks of salads and bringing cooked vegetables and chicken to work, I really wanted to tear into it. In a situation like that, is it OK to do it every once in awhile? Or, maybe join the group and eat so you don't look like an outcast, but just eat some meat and beans (no tortillas and other bad parts)? Just wondering what everyone's thoughts are on this.

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This is why I am not a fan of extreme elimination diets- they have real shortcomings when you're up against social situations or family eating styles or even budget. And when people "cheat" on them, it makes people feel bad- and it makes it less likely that they'll stick with that elimination diet for the long term- and ultimately stall out on weight loss. It happened to me countless times

My friend, if you want to enjoy someone's Mexican lunch with all the tortillas, go for it. Give yourself the mental break of your diet fatigue and enjoy that food. Don't even think bad about it. Because in the global context of your weight loss plan, it's a small blip. Weight loss is a LONG game, not a short game- and having those occasional diet breaks can be so mentally relieving that it revives you to push on again with your diet.

Thanks for the feedback yall.

True Anomaly said:

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Bonfire97 said:

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OK. So, I am about half way through "Deep Nutrition". Thanks again for the recommendation above. The Dr. who wrote this is very well informed and provides reasoning on a cellular level. I am completely on board.

I do have a question for everyone trying to strictly follow a heart healthy diet. Do you ever give yourself a break? Like the other day, someone had Mexican food brought in at work. After several weeks of salads and bringing cooked vegetables and chicken to work, I really wanted to tear into it. In a situation like that, is it OK to do it every once in awhile? Or, maybe join the group and eat so you don't look like an outcast, but just eat some meat and beans (no tortillas and other bad parts)? Just wondering what everyone's thoughts are on this.

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This is why I am not a fan of extreme elimination diets- they have real shortcomings when you're up against social situations or family eating styles or even budget. And when people "cheat" on them, it makes people feel bad- and it makes it less likely that they'll stick with that elimination diet for the long term- and ultimately stall out on weight loss. It happened to me countless times

My friend, if you want to enjoy someone's Mexican lunch with all the tortillas, go for it. Give yourself the mental break of your diet fatigue and enjoy that food. Don't even think bad about it. Because in the global context of your weight loss plan, it's a small blip. Weight loss is a LONG game, not a short game- and having those occasional diet breaks can be so mentally relieving that it revives you to push on again with your diet.

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This.

I had a few months of meeting with a nutritionist (check your insurance, mine was completely free through Nourish) because of some LDL results and me in general wanting to improve my running. I also have a familial history of heart disease so always wanting to stay ahead of that best I could.

For me it came down to common sense of what we all know, but don't want to do/eat. She was big on taking the focus away from carbs being the enemy, but make better choices and timing of them. Baked potato good, French fries bad. Apple good, white bread, not so good. But if I'm out with family at an Italian place, don't feel bad about getting the regular old spaghetti, it's just moderation.

I run in the morning so I started waking up, eat a cliff bar or banana for some morning carbs before the run.
Protein and fiber shake after the run.
Mid morning snack with some protein like hard boiled eggs or beef jerky.
Protein focus for lunch with some greens (ie salad with chicken)
little afternoon snack, like hard boiled egg or something
Dinner was again protein focus with veggies on the side. If making a pasta dish, swapping regular pasta for something with protein like chickpea pasta (honestly really good). Avoid the garlic bread and other side carb heavy things, but have a baked potato or sweet potato on the side.
Oh and lots and lots of water.

Since working with her, I'm down about 2.5% body fat at the same general weight but have been able to push up my miles per week without being hungry or blah all the time and I have been sleeping a lot better. Don't have my next blood work for another 6 months, so I'm hopeful to see some good results there then.

BQ2001 said:

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I had a few months of meeting with a nutritionist (check your insurance, mine was completely free through Nourish) because of some LDL results and me in general wanting to improve my running. I also have a familial history of heart disease so always wanting to stay ahead of that best I could.

For me it came down to common sense of what we all know, but don't want to do/eat. She was big on taking the focus away from carbs being the enemy, but make better choices and timing of them. Baked potato good, French fries bad. Apple good, white bread, not so good. But if I'm out with family at an Italian place, don't feel bad about getting the regular old spaghetti, it's just moderation.

I run in the morning so I started waking up, eat a cliff bar or banana for some morning carbs before the run.
Protein and fiber shake after the run.
Mid morning snack with some protein like hard boiled eggs or beef jerky.
Protein focus for lunch with some greens (ie salad with chicken)
little afternoon snack, like hard boiled egg or something
Dinner was again protein focus with veggies on the side. If making a pasta dish, swapping regular pasta for something with protein like chickpea pasta (honestly really good). Avoid the garlic bread and other side carb heavy things, but have a baked potato or sweet potato on the side.
Oh and lots and lots of water.

Since working with her, I'm down about 2.5% body fat at the same general weight but have been able to push up my miles per week without being hungry or blah all the time and I have been sleeping a lot better. Don't have my next blood work for another 6 months, so I'm hopeful to see some good results there then.

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Absolutely the right thing to do. Easy peasy.

MRB10 said:

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I've been largely meat(mostly red meat) and fruit for over a year. 16:8 Intermittent fasting routine. 24 BMI. Single digit BF%.

Lipid panel from yesterday.

Total Cholesterol: 192
HDL: 53
Triglycerides: 61
LDL: 124

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