And I really need more of your expertise. Pittenger wants me to call him next week. He wants to show me how the board has saved us .2 cents per 100 and justify how these schools can pay for themselves. I also expect answers to my questions. You can always pm me on the FB page.

Since you are so opposed to this bond, what would your plan be for the districts continued growth, and a high school that in a few years will be at max capacity?

OutdoorAg said:

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Since you are so opposed to this bond, what would your plan be for the districts continued growth, and a high school that in a few years will be at max capacity?

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I don't have to come up with a plan. The district has one. It's called the black option.

http://m.kdhnews.com/news/committee-favors-two-belton-high-schools/article_673a3962-09b4-11e5-b3c8-b3b2d2fcd1e8.html?mode=jqm

But you tell me how how we can pay for tax supported debt outstanding per student of $46.5 thousand?

Of course by 2025 we'll have 14,000 projected students and that will reduce the debt per student to $36,000 each.

And you do realize if this doesn't pass, the super and board will come up with a more palatable bond election for November?

So I take it you were for the black option with the price tag of $118 to $139 miiliom?

I keep reading that elementary and middle schools only cost $25 million each to build. I have no idea where they came up with that amount. But yes, I think more career and tech training at the high school benefits our students more. $80-$100 million ought to get all that done.

Gotcha. Well, I can respect your opinion on that. Your posts and the Facebook page you created have all been about finances, so I was under the impression that you were against any type of bond to build schools. I couldnt understand because with the growth we are, and will be experiencing, more schools is a must.

Frisco ISD is the fastest growing district in the state, yet they were off on growth projections and will have to delay openings and enforce a one year salary freeze. I blame their voters for passing the bonds to build the schools in the first place, I don't blame them for voting no to a tax increase due to cuts in state funding. Voters will only take so much.


https://www.google.com/amp/www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/Frisco-ISD-Could-Delay-Opening-of-New-Schools-396731711.html%3Famp%3Dy

mazzag said:

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Now Belton needs 3 high schools.

http://m.tdtnews.com/news/article_a078150a-1371-11e7-9ef1-e7e876b3fbda.html?mode=jqm

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So I learned today that Temple is cheaper to build in because the city of Temple has more money than the city of Belton for roads, sewage, water etc...
WTH did they buy it? And elementary schools will be needed every 6 years, based on projections but our bond capacity is 50cents per $100. We'll have 4.3cents if this current bond passes. Remember folks, Chisholm Trail on the south side is bursting at the seams. And southwest & pirtle haven't been touched in 12 years.

The school sites located in Belton that I heard about are at FM93/Loop 121, FM 436 and now Loop 121 by the Expo. All of those roads are controlled and maintained by TXDOT, not the city. Chisholm Trail elementary was built on a city street (Wheat Road), and the portion within the city limits was redone by the city before the school opened. I don't know the specifics on the water and sewer, but it seems like the areas around the BISD school sites are served, so I can't imagine they are that far from being able to tap into utilities.

The city of Temple has a plan to redo the roads around the new Temple elementary, but cities typically have a "plan" for every road. Last I heard the actual reconstruction of the road was neither scheduled nor funded. At the moment, it's about as good as my "plan" for the Aggies to win the MNC next fall.

texaggie2009 said:

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The school sites located in Belton that I heard about are at FM93/Loop 121, FM 436 and now Loop 121 by the Expo. All of those roads are controlled and maintained by TXDOT, not the city. Chisholm Trail elementary was built on a city street (Wheat Road), and the portion within the city limits was redone by the city before the school opened. I don't know the specifics on the water and sewer, but it seems like the areas around the BISD school sites are served, so I can't imagine they are that far from being able to tap into utilities.

The city of Temple has a plan to redo the roads around the new Temple elementary, but cities typically have a "plan" for every road. Last I heard the actual reconstruction of the road was neither scheduled nor funded. At the moment, it's about as good as my "plan" for the Aggies to win the MNC next fall.

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I knew that slimy jerk didn't make sense about infrastructure. He also said 436 property was too far out of the way as well as the property north of 2305 and east of 317, that's why they've picked the fuster cluck of carriage house to BUY and build on. FWIW, an at large trustee up for reelection is an original developer of carriage house. WTH does BISD own land it says doesn't meet it's needs?

Captain Pablo said:

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Is that all that unusual? The area north of the Leon is the new area. That is where new housing is going, and that is where the growth is. New schools will be built there and they will be, by virtue of the fact that they are newer, nicer than the old stuff. I'm not sure how that's different than any other school district that has new schools and old schools. New stuff is nicer than old stuff

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BISD has a terrible habit of not enforcing attendance boundaries. Randy says they only allow it for overcrowding or convenience for parents on their way to work but I know of 2 cases where that's BS. I've read so much about the district demographics this week I want to poke my eyes out. This won't just become new schools vs old schools, it will create a white flight from the south to north and the district will just let it happen. I'm sorry, I gotta admit it's time to close down SW & MH. Those schools will never reach capacity. The student to teacher ratio at Miller heights is 12-1. Is that normal?


And while NBMS is almost over capacity, lake Belton and South Belton middles schools are well under capacity. And the demographics at SBMS are not in line at all with the district %'s and other 2 middle schools.

mazzag said:

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BISD has a terrible habit of not enforcing attendance boundaries. Randy says they only allow it for overcrowding or convenience for parents on their way to work but I know of 2 cases where that's BS. I've read so much about the district demographics this week I want to poke my eyes out. This won't just become new schools vs old schools, it will create a white flight from the south to north and the district will just let it happen. I'm sorry, I gotta admit it's time to close down SW & MH. Those schools will never reach capacity. The student to teacher ratio at Miller heights is 12-1. Is that normal?


And while NBMS is almost over capacity, lake Belton and South Belton middles schools are well under capacity. And the demographics at SBMS are not in line at all with the district %'s and other 2 middle schools.

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they make people that live at UMHB take their kids all the way to Southwest as opposed to LH or Sparta which are insanely closer.

they can't fix the demographics issue without drawing a clear line in the town TBH.

Leon Heights is over capacity. I've been told by a teacher friend it's because a lot of teachers, who get priority, have their kids go there. It truly is a private school setting in a public school district. My son went there. It's a great environment. But at capacity, while Sparta, Miller heights and southwest are well under. Leon Heights seems to be the only elementary in the south that's not title 1. A lot of the crowding issues could be addressed with stricter attendance boundaries. I like Georgetown's a lot.
http://www.georgetownisd.org/Page/9072
But Randy feels students and parents should have choice.

Some get a choice. I have a friend who's kid started at Southwest this year. He requested a transfer based on their work location and were denied. That reason only works for certain members of the community.

There is a huge development over off 1670 called Three Creeks. For perspective, it is over twice the size of the subdivision that was used to justify the building of High Point Elementary. When Three Creeks finishes building out, Southwest, Miller and Chisholm will all be full.

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texaggie2009 said:

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There is a huge development over off 1670 called Three Creeks. For perspective, it is over twice the size of the subdivision that was used to justify the building of High Point Elementary. When Three Creeks finishes building out, Southwest, Miller and Chisholm will all be full.

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There's also a duplex neighborhood off of Connell, more homes behind the justice complex on Huey drive, 22 high end lots being developed around 121 on 93, the apartments on 93, mystic river, high end homes from Bobby Arnold at S31 and Taylor's valley, etc...
that's just south of the river. But high point is far from capacity. As are all of the elementary schools north/west except Pirtle.
I'm not blind to the current construction but the ISD's 2014 predictions of 2016/2017 enrollment were off.
And es11 on Poison Oak makes no sense. That road is a death trap. It also makes no sense that school is costing $10 million more than Chisholm trail and high point.
Edit to add, I have friends that just bought in 3 creeks. Her boys go to academy and his daughter goes to KISD. I'm curious how many folks that live there will try and transfer into Salado. Academy, Troy, Salado and holland get the majority of out transfers out. BISD gets none to barely any of their OOD transfers.

I just saw a youtube advertisement for the new high school. Any of y'all see it? Seems like an odd way to spend funds. I can't seem to find a link to the ad though, it just popped up on a video.

I've seen the one with the cute kids but it wasn't specific to the high school.

There is a facebook ad I have seen for the bond. They are using media to try to influence the voters.

Yeah, I think that was the one. Had some kid talking about some numbers on a dry erase board, how the high school will be over capacity or something.

And a complaint should filed against them. The rules are very clear and a sappy ass ad about projections sold as facts by a cute kid are clear violations. They have a local PAC that could run those ads. If it keeps raining and I keep twiddling my thumbs, I'll probably do it.

mazzag said:

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And a complaint should filed against them. The rules are very clear and a sappy ass ad about projections sold as facts by a cute kid are clear violations. They have a local PAC that could run those ads. If it keeps raining and I keep twiddling my thumbs, I'll probably do it.

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did you ever have the call with Pittenger?

I did. Interesting to say the least. I said something about NBMS costing $25million and he said "it was a lot more than that". Which makes no sense when looking at the 2012 bond amount total spent on 3 schools. I think they are out of touch with how people feel about some schools vs others in the district and basically he said kids and parents should have "choices " and that's why they are lax on enforcing attendance boundaries. That would help A LOT. Not a long term solution but a start.

But I really need this rain to stop.

And thoughts and prayers to Salado ISD.

Information coming out about the school. Teachers will all float and not have classrooms. This has been tried before at a place I taught. No comment from me on it. It works for colleges, but they give profs offices. The other interesting thing is they said no central large cafeteria. Only concern I would have about that is supervision. How many will have to be on lunch duty for kids eating all over the place.

Thanks 3rd gen for the info. Floating teachers are typically used for schools at capacity and they have to resort to other methods. I'm sorry y'all. I just keep digging and I need to take a bath. We don't need another elementary school 1.5 miles from an existing one. Get in your cars. Drive thru three creeks (plenty of Aggie employees). And then drive around Miller Heights and Southwest. Three creeks is zoned for Chisholm Trail. That school is past capacity and has already turned computer labs into classrooms (f the kids) and the teachers lounge is next. The admin is sheeting on the south and knob slobbering the north and they have plenty of capacity. As far as a new high school, I can't help you. We can't afford it. For example, Hayes Consolidated ISD has a bond for $250million with NO tax increases. The ISD is gambling on future growth, meanwhile this does not solve any issues.

And FWIW, 1/2 of the taxes BISD collects is from Belton city limits. So don't tell me west temple pays its fair share. BISD collects from city of Morgans point, city of temple BISD residents and folks like me that live outside the city limits.

Gut feeling: bond Pass out Fail?

Passes because reasonable voters know we are past the time for a 2nd high school.