How long is a flexible nat gas hose can you realistically run? That's my big hold up on this whole thing at the moment, my gas is very far from my panel

Doubt it

I run a 50' 3/4" hose on mine with no problems. I just installed a 1/4" bleed valve to vent the air in the hose before I open the valve to the generator. The natural gas comes into your home at 0.25 psig from a distance, so I don't think that's a limiting factor. I could be wrong tho.

drumboy said:

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AgLiving06 said:

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After the freeze, I got serious about my setup. It powers my whole house (4 ton ac with hard start). My brother has 2 ac's and his 12000 version just powered both on nat gas.

If I had to guess, this all in for me was $3500. The more handy you are the cheaper it could be done. I wanted to make sure everything was done right and I have no desire to mess with electrical.

Setup
Duromax 13000EH (with conversion to tri-fuel). They now offer a tri-fuel 13,000kw.
50A interlock
3/4 inch nat gas line
Quick connect on the natural gas meter for the house to connect to.
50A RV connection from my generator to the interlock
Whole home surge protector
I also have ~120 lbs of propane and 3- 5 gallon gas cans.

The primary upside of the tri-fuel over a whole home generator is the fuel flexibility and cost. If for some reason natural gas hit a pinch point, you have other alternatives.

The primary downside is you have to set it up yourself which during a big storm could mean waiting a bit.

There was concern expressed about THD. This is from Duromax website:

Quote:

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DuroMax portable generators will output an industry standard total harmonic distortion (THD) rating of about 12%-20% depending on load applied. They will produce a sine wave, not a modified or square wave. This is perfectly acceptable for running common commodities found in your home such as TVs, computers, your appliances, etc.

THD is a measure of the deviation of a sine wave from a "perfect" sine wave. All electricity, including power company electricity, has measurable THD.

If you have a specific item that requires less than 5% THD such as a UPS style battery backup, a pellet stove, or high efficiency furnace control board, we recommend purchasing a DuroMax Inverter Generator that provides a less than 5% THD.

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An inverter currently doesn't have tri-fuel options (not sure if it can be added), and it's quite a bit more expensive, but if you have a real sensitive equipment that you must use during an outage, that's the best option. You can just plan to spend an extra thousand or 2.

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How long does the 120 lbs of propane last?

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I've never run it all at once. I use the propane for maintenance running (i.e. after oil change, spark plug change, run it every couple months). If the outage is sustained (storm, planned outage, etc), I just go straight to natural gas.

I've also never run gasoline in it and hope to never have to.

However, one guy posted in the facebook generator group this:

"Total outage time 115 hours. Total generator run time 97.25 hours. Total average fuel usage 2.29#/ hour, approximately 225# of propane total, cost $135. Firman T07571, purchased 2020, 30 amp interlock hook up running whole house including AC."

So 120 lbs should roughly last 50-52 hours or so.

Interesting, I think I need about 75' but still probably a cheaper solution than a home generator

terradactylexpress said:

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Interesting, I think I need about 75' but still probably a cheaper solution than a home generator

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You could likely get away with a 3/4" tube.

Site I'm on says:

"Select appropriate size based on size of generator and length of hose needed.

• 12,000W 1/2" up to 24ft: more than 24' needs 3/4"
• 13,000W 3/4" up to 85ft, even 100ft works
• 15,000W 3/4 up to 35ft then 1"
  
  https://ab3power.com/natural-gas-hose-with-quick-disconnect-kit/

ab3power is the hose I have. They are excellent, though not cheap.

Does anyone use one of the tri-fuel portable generators that has a Carrier variable speed Infinity AC system? Our AC system seems to be so sensitive to the smallest issues, that I'm wondering if I'd just be asking for problems trying to get it to run on one of these generators.

Ag_07 said:

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Waste of money

Way more cost efficient to just get a portable generator (gas, propane, or hard plumbed from the nat gas line) big enough to power the essentials and get a electrician to set up with breakers.

Easy and way cheaper

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I have a whole home generator (installed by previous owner) and I will second this. I've been in my house for 6 years and the most I have used it at once was for about 24 hours. Other than that, most of the time has been 20 minutes here and there with a couple 3-6 hour stints in there.

It is very nice, no doubt, but a trifuel portable to run the big things via an interlock and a smaller inverter used the old fashioned way with extension cords for some electronics would be my setup if I was starting from scratch.

Quote:

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The cheapest option and best option is a Honda EU2200. Nothing offers the bang for the buck that offers. Going from zero to ~1800 kilowatts to run a fridge, lamps, fans, and charge electronics while sipping a gallon of gas every 12 hours is an insane boost for about a grand.

I honestly think every home in this area should have one.

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Back when we'd tailgate the A&M games a decade or so ago, my dad bought 2 Honda EU2000's and a parallel kit to power my uncle's camper that he'd bring to Reed. They also bought an extended run gas kit so they'd only have to fill that up on the way to CS.

Anyway, I didn't have a generator when Harvey hit, so he gave me one of the Hondas to use and just told me to keep it. I think I've used twice since then and drained the gas before I put it in the garage last time. A few weeks ago I did my annual maintenance on the Generac and decided to change the oil in the Honda as well since it was a few years old. I bought some ethanol free gas from the local Ace and I'll be if that thing didn't start right up after a half dozen pulls. Ran like a champ. Highly recommend that everyone has one to use in a pinch. Just follow the long-term storage instructions and it'll be good when you need it.

drumboy said:

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Anyone have experience with the Predator inverter generators from HarborFreight?

My Honda EG3500 has been great but I'd like something bigger, quieter, and burns less fuel. Thinking of getting two of these to daisy chain.
https://www.harborfreight.com/generators-engines/generators/5000-watt-dual-fuel-super-quiet-inverter-generator-with-remote-start-and-co-secure-technology-70143.html

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This is what my dad uses now to run his RV when they go places that do not have hookups and he loves it (he has the 3500). Quiet and reliable. Also, if there's an issue, Harbor Freight is easy to find.

Go to YouTube and you'll see all sorts of generator tests on the smaller inverter generators by several brands (Predator, Cummins, Westinghouse, Champion, etc) and they're all pretty much the same and will be there when you need it as long as you do the necessary maintenance and don't fill it with gas and let it set for 2 years.

Somewhat similar story. I bought my EU2000s in 2012 to power my RV in Lot R.

Fast forward a few years and the freeze of 2021 hit. I don't think I'd run my EU2000s in five years.

I go pull them out of my storage shed and set them on my back deck. About pull number 12 on each they both fire up. I happened to have some fresh gas and topped them off after 12 hours of running. Both ran like champs providing power for the basics we needed for a few days.

Thanks to those generators I went to bed every night in my underwear partially due to our gas fireplace which kept our house toasty. We had Internet the whole time.

Without those little Hondas I don't have either.

I'm as big of a Harbor Freight fan as they come but if I were buying a small generator it would be a Honda EU2000/2200.

Theyre freaking bullet proof. I'm not gonna mess around with some knock off. When the time comes and you want power the Hondas are gonna deliver.

I have a whole house generator but I did replace the carbs last summer just because they needed replacing.

I loaned them out to a friend during this storm and they fired up right away. 12 years old and they fire up like they're new.

I'm a fan.

First quote

More than my first 3 cars combined

AgLiving06 said:

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After the freeze, I got serious about my setup. It powers my whole house (4 ton ac with hard start). My brother has 2 ac's and his 12000 version just powered both on nat gas.

If I had to guess, this all in for me was $3500. The more handy you are the cheaper it could be done. I wanted to make sure everything was done right and I have no desire to mess with electrical.

Setup
Duromax 13000EH (with conversion to tri-fuel). They now offer a tri-fuel 13,000kw.
50A interlock
3/4 inch nat gas line
Quick connect on the natural gas meter for the house to connect to.
50A RV connection from my generator to the interlock
Whole home surge protector
I also have ~120 lbs of propane and 3- 5 gallon gas cans.

The primary upside of the tri-fuel over a whole home generator is the fuel flexibility and cost. If for some reason natural gas hit a pinch point, you have other alternatives.

The primary downside is you have to set it up yourself which during a big storm could mean waiting a bit.

There was concern expressed about THD. This is from Duromax website:

Quote:

---

DuroMax portable generators will output an industry standard total harmonic distortion (THD) rating of about 12%-20% depending on load applied. They will produce a sine wave, not a modified or square wave. This is perfectly acceptable for running common commodities found in your home such as TVs, computers, your appliances, etc.

THD is a measure of the deviation of a sine wave from a "perfect" sine wave. All electricity, including power company electricity, has measurable THD.

If you have a specific item that requires less than 5% THD such as a UPS style battery backup, a pellet stove, or high efficiency furnace control board, we recommend purchasing a DuroMax Inverter Generator that provides a less than 5% THD.

---

An inverter currently doesn't have tri-fuel options (not sure if it can be added), and it's quite a bit more expensive, but if you have a real sensitive equipment that you must use during an outage, that's the best option. You can just plan to spend an extra thousand or 2.

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This is exactly what we are doing. My BF bought his last summer on a tax free weekend. I just bought one today, and they are on sale for $1799 (with tax, it's slightly cheaper than what he paid).

Have an electrician lined up to do the wiring for $300 per house. He's a procrastinator and hasn't finished out the install. I mentioned to him the other day that he better get on it, given the predictions for hurricane season. So he got on my case again about buying one of my own.

I want mine plumbed into my natural gas line (haven't got a quote for that, yet). My BF has used his with propane.

My issue is I don't want to have to be moving it, so I want a little "dog house" to keep it outside and have it be protected. I'm not sure this is a great idea (mainly because Houston heat and humidity is so brutal), but we've been brainstorming ideas.

I don't have a soft start, so I don't know that I'd run my A/C. BF seems to think if things are sequenced properly I could run it. But my main interest is being able to run the fridge/freezer, have working lights and outlets in my bathroom, and run some ceiling fans.

I grew up on the MS Gulf Coast with no central heat and air until I was a teenager. The power outage during the freeze was way worse for me than being without A/C in the summer.

I'd like to go the portable generator route that powers whole home. We have a variable speed AC which I'm told means we should have no trouble getting it to start up on the generator, even without a soft start installed. (Variable speed AC is basically a built-in soft start.)

Problem is, THD on a portable is likely too high for the sensitive electronics in our Carrier Infinity AC system. Not sure how to get around that with a portable generator. I'm told it needs to be less than 5% to comfortably avoid damaging any sensitive electronics. The portable is probably between 12-20%.

Anyone else have any experience with a portable generator and running a pretty sensitive variable speed AC?

AJ02 said:

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I'd like to go the portable generator route that powers whole home. We have a variable speed AC which I'm told means we should have no trouble getting it to start up on the generator, even without a soft start installed. (Variable speed AC is basically a built-in soft start.)

Problem is, THD on a portable is likely too high for the sensitive electronics in our Carrier Infinity AC system. Not sure how to get around that with a portable generator. I'm told it needs to be less than 5% to comfortably avoid damaging any sensitive electronics. The portable is probably between 12-20%.

Anyone else have any experience with a portable generator and running a pretty sensitive variable speed AC?

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I'm scared of this so looking at running two inverters in parallel but neighbors run big Furmans and Champions with no damage.

I see some generators labeled as "inverter generator", and some labeled as "generator with inverter". Are they the same thing?

The guy running the Generator group on Facebook has a variable AC and runs the DuroMax tri-fuel without issues or concerns. Facebook Link

I'd probably research whether Carrier has expressed issues or not.

Perk of the variable is you really don't need a hard/soft start because it is such an easy start.

The biggest concern on the dog house is making sure it's well ventilated to avoid CO2 build up. Many generators will have a CO2 sensor that could cause the generator to shutdown.

Edit: Have your AC or even the electrician put a hard start on. It's pretty quick and easy to do and relatively cheap. If he's out there already, he might be willing to do it.

Soft starts are better, but also more expensive.

BF said his A/C guy could prob install a soft start on my unit. Haven't gotten a price, yet.

I agree about the dog house. We were discussing the ventilation issue earlier.

Cross posting my portable generator for sale. Ran the 3 ton HVAC without a soft start.
https://texags.com/forums/50/topics/3461736

Yeah, not sure I want to take the risk on a new $25k AC system we just had installed less than a year ago. Looking for a generator with low THD. Think I might've found a Westinghouse big enough that specifically stated THD <5%. It's not an inverter generator, but says it's good for sensitive electronics.

one MEEN Ag said:

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I've done now two whole house generator installs. My parents and then mine.

Biggest 'hidden' cost drivers are:
-How close are your gas and electrical lines together
-How far away to do you want to put the generator from the house

When I went with a generac supercenter quote it assumed that the gas and electrical panels are within 15 feet of each other and that the generator is also within the same 15 feet. That can get expensive in a hurry if they are not.

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No kidding. In my last house this probably doubled the cost . My gas meter was on one side of the house and the electric panel was on the other. The generator was going to be between the two. So they had to run a lot of gas and a lot of electric line.

lancevance said:

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First quote

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How big are your A/C units and do you have electric stove and water heaters? That quote is $7k more than what I paid for a 20kw that can run my two 4 ton units and I can run all the lights and TV and use the electric dryer and microwave at the same time. I can pretty much do anything in my house as long as I don't want to do everything at one time.

Cibalo said:

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lancevance said:

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First quote

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How big are your A/C units and do you have electric stove and water heaters? That quote is $7k more than what I paid for a 20kw that can run my two 4 ton units and I can run all the lights and TV and use the electric dryer and microwave at the same time. I can pretty much do anything in my house as long as I don't want to do everything at one time.

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Single AC, 3 ton ( I think). Dryer, water heater and stove are gas. Yeah I think this quote is too high. I will keep looking.

Lance- how many quotes have you gotten? I had a 26kw generac installed a few weeks ago. I got 3 quotes and two were in the 13-15k range and one was about 30k. I ended up going with Grasten who's been recommended many times on TexAgs.

26 kw seems like way overkill if you have a single 3 ton unit…..

For Lance, I don't disagree. For me, it's what I needed. From a pricing perspective, simply offering a point of comparison.

For us, having the whole house generator insta was worth it and got a great deal since it was the low season when we committed to it.

Our neighborhood is so bad about losing power, any thunderstorm and the bet is how long until we lose power and not when. For this storm, being in Spring we didn't get the worst of it and only were without power for about 8 hours.

We had ours it installed in February and it's had to go to work for 26 hours in only 3 months! Last year in late June we were without power for almost 4 days.

So the bottom line, is it worth it? Depends on your situation.

Got my first round of quotes in, and they are 3k apart for the exact same unit and install.

The higher quote had a "free" warranty, with a service agreement commitment built into it the language. They did offer an instant 500 off for same day sign up….

Seriously thinking about GCing this myself.

Mind sharing the companies and which one was higher?

lancevance said:

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Cibalo said:

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lancevance said:

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First quote

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How big are your A/C units and do you have electric stove and water heaters? That quote is $7k more than what I paid for a 20kw that can run my two 4 ton units and I can run all the lights and TV and use the electric dryer and microwave at the same time. I can pretty much do anything in my house as long as I don't want to do everything at one time.

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Single AC, 3 ton ( I think). Dryer, water heater and stove are gas. Yeah I think this quote is too high. I will keep looking.

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You could handle that easily with a portable for a fraction of the price.

P.H. Dexippus said:

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lancevance said:

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Cibalo said:

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lancevance said:

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First quote

---

How big are your A/C units and do you have electric stove and water heaters? That quote is $7k more than what I paid for a 20kw that can run my two 4 ton units and I can run all the lights and TV and use the electric dryer and microwave at the same time. I can pretty much do anything in my house as long as I don't want to do everything at one time.

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Single AC, 3 ton ( I think). Dryer, water heater and stove are gas. Yeah I think this quote is too high. I will keep looking.

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You could handle that easily with a portable for a fraction of the price.

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Going to be about 1600 bucks