(X-posted to real estate board.)

Wifey and I are moving to Houston, have pending option on home which has stucco on a portion of the front side only. We asked for an invasive stucco inspection and seller denied it. Reason given is "it will potentially mar the cosmetics" and the "sealant could fail."

Their realtor emailed last night to say their inspector, when they bought it last August, he did a "non invasive" inspection. Of course, inspection report we have mentions nothing about that. We don't have any record of last time stucco was looked at. Home was built in 2014. Sellers are two previously engaged 20-somethings that I think don't know what they're talking about on that point

Other than just walking away, which trust me we are tempted to do, we're trying to figure out a way to make it work. We don't want to walk away over what might be a perfectly good wall but obviously aren't planning on walking into a large repair bill.

I know we could ask for some money at closing for repairs but we don't know if there will be any repairs needed. We thought about saying we'll get it inspected right after we close, we're not trying to "harm the house" and then walk away, but we would need some contingency money set aside although I don't know if that's kosher.

Thoughts?

TXAggie2011 said:

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Thoughts?

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Houston is full, have you tried El Paso?

Do you have reason to believe the stucco is faulty? If you want to tear out a chunk of someone else's house, you should also offer enough additional earnest money to repair the hole that was created.

Depends. If you plan on voting for democrats, back out and don't move here.

If not, I wouldn't be overly concerned.

TXAggie2011 said:

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Thoughts?

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"Wifey" is more cringey than "the rib."

as far as I know, there is no effective way to test stucco without making those holes. As far as taking "chunks" out of the home, that's a bit of hyperbole. We're talking about holes smaller than the diameter of a pencil - that will be filled with sealant.

It's not ideal, but neither is spending $50-$100K on stucco repair/replacement after buying a home.

I have seen enough stucco system failures over the years to where I would never advise a client to move forward without doing a full, "invasive" inspection.

I would suggest you tell the seller that you won't move forward without the inspection. They can find another sucker to take the home and pray things are great behind the scenes.

agnerd said:

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Do you have reason to believe the stucco is faulty? If you want to tear out a chunk of someone else's house, you should also offer enough additional earnest money to repair the hole that was created.

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It's Houston? Isn't that reason enough to get it looked at?

We pay for the inspection. That includes repairing the holes.

This is Houston - invasive inspection or find another home if evidence shows on passive.

Might get flamed for this, but stucco and Houston/humid swampy climates do not mix very well. Large % chance you are going to have problems every few years which can be costly in many cases. I personally will never own a home that has anything more than just minimal stucco.

He says portion, so I'm thinking some sort of accent wall vs entire exterior?

House is 11yo, if I was seller I'd probably not allow it either

terradactylexpress said:

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He says portion, so I'm thinking some sort of accent wall vs entire exterior?

House is 11yo, if I was seller I'd probably not allow it either

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I imagine it is the front exterior with cement board siding on the sides and back. My house (built in '12) is similar and nothing was wrong with the front stucco exterior during my inspection.

If there is visual evidence of a problem, I'd go invasive, but if a passive doesn't show anything and I really liked the house, I'd probably gamble it (as I did on my current home).

Plenty of homes in Houston without stucco. Wifey will always be concerned. Move on and don't worry about it.

Are you moving from Arizona?

Houstonian pro tip: Don't buy a house with stucco in Houston.

terradactylexpress said:

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He says portion, so I'm thinking some sort of accent wall vs entire exterior?

House is 11yo, if I was seller I'd probably not allow it either

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It's the front exterior only of floor 2 and front exterior of a portion only of 3 of the townhome. (It's standalone, though, so no risk of our neighbor taking bad care of theirs and it's damaging ours)

Is there anything that you can imagine would make you comfortable as the current owner to allow it?

TXAggie2011 said:

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terradactylexpress said:

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He says portion, so I'm thinking some sort of accent wall vs entire exterior?

House is 11yo, if I was seller I'd probably not allow it either

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It's the front exterior only of floor 2 and front exterior of a portion only of 3 of the townhome. (It's standalone, though, so no risk of our neighbor taking bad care of theirs and it's damaging ours)

Is there anything that you can imagine would make you comfortable as the current owner to allow it?

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Oh so it's a patio home w/ stucco? Those generally don't seem to be built very well, you're asking for it getting one w/ stucco. I'd get the inspector to check for previous water damage all over as I've heard from lots of friends with those about leaking roofs & wet ceiling/walls. IMO the most quality-built patio home (Silver & Dart) of anyone I know still has had water damage from heavy rains.

If you proceed just know that when you sell they'll be pressing for the inspection that you're being denied. Maybe negotiate a discount for half the cost of potential repair. I can see why the seller would deny the test as if they find something they'll have to fix or disclose it to future buyers if you back out.

It's not a patio home in the sense I understand that to mean but point well taken.

They certainly would love to sell it with minimal inspections, but one would think if they want to sell it, they're likely going to have to come around on something regarding the stucco.


We mentioned the other day in an email that we'd have to consider pulling out of the contract. We've asked our agent to tell them we will in fact be pulling out of the contract if we do not come to an agreement on something. Turns out their agent is on vacation so they have had a fill in the past two days that's just been forwarding emails, probably not helpful to solving the disagreement.

one of the issues with stucco is that even if it's installed properly (seemingly rare), it still requires fairly routine maintenance, or you can have moisture penetration issues.

Every stucco guy I talk to says that you should caulk/reseal the areas around windows/cut-outs annually. I guarantee 95%+ of owners out there are not doing that.

If you do have flashing issues and water is getting behind the stucco, it could be years before that becomes obvious. All the while, your structure is rotting from the inside out. Visual inspections aren't typically going to cut it.

I think (at least ITL) patio homes are freestanding houses where you own the land but yard is minimal and there's a community fee that takes care of common areas, gate, pool (if there is one), etc. Townhouses are the same but share at least one wall.

Patio homes OTL are more like normal houses w/ small yards and the HOA does landscaping I believe.

Not a realtor but that was what I gathered when we looked at patio homes & townhouses 15 years ago.

Another issue I saw pretty regularly can occur when the listing agent was also the buyer's agent when the home was purchased.

They may not have known to push for a stucco inspection. Consequently, when is comes time to sell, they will be hesitant to push for a test to be done as it highlights their own mistakes. I learned this the hard way with one of my friends places.

If you want to email me the MLS number/address, I'm happy to give you any background I may have. Our office was in Rice Military for a long while, so we dealt with our fair share of stucco townhomes.

scottrose@gmail.com

if the current owner has been there less than a year...that means they basically know nothing about the history of the stucco and its performance.

Houston has had a few extreme weather events since 2014 that would stress the stucco

Spare yourself the headache if you plan to stay in this house for more than five years and walk away. Don't buy stucco in Houston. Definitely don't buy stucco w/o an "invassive" inspection

I'll pile on

No stucco or EIFS. Our labor pool down here can't install it correctly and even if properly installed gotta keep maintenance up.

Guess I don't understand. Since you knew there was stucco when you made your offer, why didn't you include destructive testing in the original offer if it's a big deal to you? Or price in the replacement of the stucco. You might need a new realtor that can better write an offer that will meet your needs. You're wasting your own time if uninspected stucco is a deal breaker.

So I sold a house 75% stucco and we looked into one with 15% recently and went down the rabbit hole of stucco inspections. From all my construction contacts / realtor friends there was no consensus on a company that even does quality inspections for stucco. The townhome community I was in when I owned the 75% stucco home had 3 of 6 get facelifts within a 3 year timeframe running ~$15-18k to demo and replace.

My advice...just steer clear of stucco all together if possible. If they won't let you inspect it's likely because they know there is an issue or they fear their negligence to regularly maintain would show up on a report.

Lastly, you are in a buyer's market. Make the demands and price concessions you want. If they say no, move on to another option.

Lone Star always did a good job for us on inspections.

As far as it being a buyers market...one would think so with these rates, but areas like Rice Military are sitting at 2 months inventory, so still very much a sellers market. In any case, I would walk regardless of the market if they don't allow the inspection.

I don't totally disagree with you about avoiding stucco. That is tough with townhomes though as buyers love the "modern style" townhomes so that's what gets built. Right now, for active and pending homes in Rice Military, 89 of 108 listings have stucco in some form.

agnerd said:

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Guess I don't understand. Since you knew there was stucco when you made your offer, why didn't you include destructive testing in the original offer if it's a big deal to you? Or price in the replacement of the stucco. You might need a new realtor that can better write an offer that will meet your needs. You're wasting your own time if uninspected stucco is a deal breaker.

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The option period is partially for stuff like this.

The buyers can fight about it before they send the contract or they can fight about it after they get it under contract, it's off the market and the sellers can no longer back out unless the buyer defaults.

This shouldn't be a problem. Stucco testing is part of owning and selling a home with stucco. The sellers should have understood that before they bought the house. Unfortunate this might fall apart over something borderline irrational.

But, are you saying put it in the contract and hope the other side doesn't read it?

As someone who lives in the area and runs a lot. It's really, really common to see stucco repair companies working on homes. In the last couple months we've had two on our street.

It's also quite common for posts on nextdoor *****ing about their "****ty builder" and "****ty stucco" and a sob story about how much it'll cost to repair.

There's a reason it has the reputation it does….

But I also understand where the seller is coming from. They could just as easily sell to someone else, so why deal with it.

Or, and I have learned this the hard way, just get the house under contract and deal with all of the bs in the option period.

I have seen stucco done well in south Florida so I think it can be done in wetter climates. I am in Austin with a stucco house around this age and we have for sure seen issues in our neighborhood despite being quite a bit drier than Houston. I

I think there a lot of people who just don't know what they are doing. I have seen a few hairline cracks in mine but I had them filled and the whole house repainted with a higher quality paint that the builders put on it. But there are a few houses in my neighborhood that look really bad with all the cracks and the discoloration.

Oddly enough my FIL lives in New York in an 100 year English tudor home that has stucco on it. I would hate to be the person who buys that home and fix it up. It is constructed really well but he has neglected the maintenance on it over the years.

I think we just don't have people in Texas that really know what they are doing with stucco.

If you buy a stucco house in Houston, just be prepared to repair and replace the stucco constantly.

So is OP buying the stucco home?

Where in Houston?

If you wait long enough you'll get a bullet hole or three or a police chase crash into the house, then you can inspect.

I agree. It sounds like someone needs to move from south Florida to Texas and start and business and train people how to do stucco work properly. But maybe that's the business plan. Do work that will fail and pay another company to poorly work to "fix" the original work that was bad to begin with. It feeds itself.