Please email CSISD admin-unfair advantage to some kids

3,151 Views | 20 Replies | Last: 18 days ago by Goat Man
Vulcan
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Please email feedback@csisd.org now to ask for a policy change. Virtual learners will have access to their notes, google, etc during quizzes & tests. In-person learners will not. Every point counts for GPA and class rank. Please ask admin to allow in-person learners to use their notes and devices on all quizzes and tests. Thank you!
Sailor
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Vulcan, was this spelled out in the latest email today from CSISD? If so, then yes, that is BS to those who will attend school physically.
chickencoupe16
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AG
The problem is that there is no way to keep someone from cheating on an online test. Even a proctored one that uses webcam monitoring. If you are clever enough and desperate enough, there is always a way. I knew someone that taped note cards to their screen for proctored tests. When they spun the camera around to show that the desk and surroundings were clear, the notecards stayed out of view. So it becomes a problem of only the rule followers will not cheat and will be hurt because they are following the rules. So if you know that some will use notes then you might as well let all of them do it.

The real issue is allowing students to take tests online while requiring that others take them in person. There are three possible fixes taht I can see: 1) allow even the students in school to use notes; 2) have the distance learners drive to school and take their exams sitting in their car while a teacher proctors the parking lot (I know of one area school that is seriously considering this); 3) change the weight of distance learning classes (ie, its only possible to obtain 3.5 GPA points vs the 4.0 from an in person class).
Mathguy64
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AG
As someone who spent the spring and summer sessions dealing with the whole idea and implementation of proctoring exams for online courses, I can safely say that this area is a hot flaming mess

I'm of the opinion that the whole idea of assessment went out the window March 15 and that we all (college, K12) need to rethink how we assess students. Proctored exams for the masses are no longer logistically realistic.
cavscout96
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AG
mathguy86 said:

As someone who spent the spring and summer sessions dealing with the whole idea and implementation of proctoring exams for online courses, I can safely say that this area is a hot flaming mess

I'm of the opinion that the whole idea of assessment went out the window March 15 and that we all (college, K12) need to rethink how we assess students. Proctored exams for the masses are no longer logistically unrealistic right now.
Turf96
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There is a simple solution to it all. Everybody could just go back to life the old way and get back to work. That won't happen because one group wants total control. What is mentioned above it correct we need to base way less on grades and way more of quality of individual applying for admittance. Problem with this is if you allowed A&M current leadership to select students you may as well light a match to it all. We need great minds with work ethic and maturity. That doesn't sound like what most are after. Our lives will never be fair again as we have now lost many freedoms. This is just another erosion of the system.get used to it our world has gone mad.
1.618
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Maybe the online tests and quizzes will be more difficult? More short answer/essay perhaps and less multiple choice/fill in blank? I know that as a kid, I never preferred open book/open note testing as it was typically more difficult.
AggieBaseball06
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AG
1.618 said:

Maybe the online tests and quizzes will be more difficult? More short answer/essay perhaps and less multiple choice/fill in blank? I know that as a kid, I never preferred open book/open note testing as it was typically more difficult.



This. I had a teacher in high school that told us every test would be open notes, but the difficulty of it would reflect that. It was designed so that if you didn't KNOW the material and how it all connected, you were going to get smoked.
TAMU1990
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AG
That only works IF the teachers have two different quizzes/tests for each assessment.
Vulcan
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Please email feedback@csisd.org soon...board meeting Tuesday night!
LOYAL AG
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AG
I mean for all of this the online kids will also have access to their helicopter parents to do their homework for them. I fully expect we'll see grade inflation for those that stay home. IMO we're setting up the online teachers to fail when we get to year end and the expected correlation between GPA and STAAR isn't there because, while Little Johnny is a dumbass, his mother is still capable of doing 5th grade math and "helps" more than she should on his day to day assignments and tests.
kraut
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AG
One solution is to have long multiple choice tests that are timed. The student would have a certain amount of time to finish the test after logging on to take it, which would make looking up most or all of the answers very time consuming if they don't know the material. Once the allotted time is done the student gets logged off.
cavscout96
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AG
LOYAL AG said:

I mean for all of this the online kids will also have access to their helicopter parents to do their homework for them. I fully expect we'll see grade inflation for those that stay home. IMO we're setting up the online teachers to fail when we get to year end and the expected correlation between GPA and STAAR isn't there because, while Little Johnny is a dumbass, his mother is still capable of doing 5th grade math and "helps" more than she should on his day to day assignments and tests.
easy solution. kill the staar test. it was the first thing scrapped this year so, quite obviously, it's not critical to our kids' education.
LOYAL AG
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AG
cavscout96 said:

LOYAL AG said:

I mean for all of this the online kids will also have access to their helicopter parents to do their homework for them. I fully expect we'll see grade inflation for those that stay home. IMO we're setting up the online teachers to fail when we get to year end and the expected correlation between GPA and STAAR isn't there because, while Little Johnny is a dumbass, his mother is still capable of doing 5th grade math and "helps" more than she should on his day to day assignments and tests.
easy solution. kill the staar test. it was the first thing scrapped this year so, quite obviously, it's not critical to our kids' education.
I'm all for that but then all we know about Little Johnny is that his mom can do 5th grade math. Grade inflation is going to be a problem for the online kids, STAAR just gives us a chance to see that it happened. We won't do anything about it so I'm not sure it matters.

Just glad my youngest is done.
AggieMom_38
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Cheating will be a big issue. It was in the spring and that's when grades didn't even count. There is no software or exam development strategy that can completely eliminate cheating (I have some expertise in this area). The other broader issue is simply consistency in assessment modes. You cannot have two groups of kids have their grades (and class rank etc) arrived at via different assessment tools. I'm not sure if that's even "legal" but certainly any school district would be opening themselves up to grade appeals and likely lawsuits. May sound extreme, but the top 10% rule exists in Texas and thus class rank has real consequences (& of course GPA broadly affects colleges admission, scholarships...) not sure of the solution other than requiring online students to come on to campus to take exams (they'll likely be coming in for sports/activities anyway) or just not having grades count once again until school is "back to normal." Simply having every student take exams online doesn't address the cheating issue that will occur. I couldn't agree with OP more. This is a big deal and the school districts need to know it's a big deal (and that just "trying to make parallel exams, implement timed exams for online kids, purchasing software that tries to screen for cheating..." is not going to effective. Too many ways around it and the stakes are high for many kids)
cavscout96
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AG
I agree with you both. I too have experience in this area. Online testing is an absolute waste.

Standardized testing, in general, is too IMO.

I'd like to see students WRITE what they know. I can tell you from experience that the ability of the average student to produce coherent thought in writing is abysmal.
Vulcan
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CSISD board meeting tonight 7:00pm
JaxDad
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AG
If you ask 100 people what should happen you will get 100 different answers, each feeling their ideas are best. If I have learned nothing else as a teacher the vast majority of parents want all kids to get a great education, just my child first.

This school year will be changing left and right and trying to adjust daily. I'm planning to do evening tutorial/reteach because some kids can't get to a device until then based on family dynamics. The school officials and administration are working on various plans but the rules keep changing all the time.
katlong
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AG
AggieBaseball06 said:

1.618 said:

Maybe the online tests and quizzes will be more difficult? More short answer/essay perhaps and less multiple choice/fill in blank? I know that as a kid, I never preferred open book/open note testing as it was typically more difficult.



This. I had a teacher in high school that told us every test would be open notes, but the difficulty of it would reflect that. It was designed so that if you didn't KNOW the material and how it all connected, you were going to get smoked.


Totally agree. Good assessments are effective regardless of getting to use notes. But if we are just talking regurgitation of information, sure, having notes will help.
Carnwellag2
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Vulcan said:

Please email feedback@csisd.org now to ask for a policy change. Virtual learners will have access to their notes, google, etc during quizzes & tests. In-person learners will not. Every point counts for GPA and class rank. Please ask admin to allow in-person learners to use their notes and devices on all quizzes and tests. Thank you!
uhhh... i think in person learners will have the advantage as they get to actually be taught by a live person. They get to ask questions real time.

and if it is an advantage and you are worried about it.....then opt for virtual learning. [choose the best choice].
Goat Man
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AG
Turf96 said:

There is a simple solution to it all. Everybody could just go back to life the old way and get back to work. That won't happen because one group wants total control. What is mentioned above it correct we need to base way less on grades and way more of quality of individual applying for admittance. Problem with this is if you allowed A&M current leadership to select students you may as well light a match to it all. We need great minds with work ethic and maturity. That doesn't sound like what most are after. Our lives will never be fair again as we have now lost many freedoms. This is just another erosion of the system.get used to it our world has gone mad.
Here is a voice of reason. I do not have more than one blue star to give you unfortunately.
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