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NFA stamp stampede...

27,200 Views | 196 Replies | Last: 16 days ago by kyledr04
txags92
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BenderRodriguez said:

txags92 said:

They are not allowed to keep records of normal firearm purchases from background checks, etc.


Yes, I'm sure the agency who promoted the guy in charge of running guns to the cartels to make American gun stores and owners look bad is very, very concerned with what they are allowed to do by law.

Theres no way they are keeping records illegally.

That would be unimaginable.

I didn't say they weren't. They have been sued over it before under Clinton I believe. I was just clarifying that they are actually allowed to have the NFA database, which was what I was talking about with my joking comment hoping the hackers deleted it for them.
kyledr04
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Sounds like good news. We'll see how they handle it.





techno-ag
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More changes possibly afoot.

The left cannot kill the Spirit of Charlie Kirk.
kyledr04
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https://www.outdoorlife.com/guns/atf-suppressor-guidance/?fbclid=IwdGRjcAUjr8BjbGNrBSOvb2V4dG4DYWVtAjExAHBkb2YFc3J0YwZhcHBfaWQMMzUwNjg1NTMxNzI4AAEexBJ6pTjzBVaMJ8bWMI9oMbHVCBOrB2HAS0PZdhfFtqO6u6ITvGcWNf0TL3Y_aem_VGtbfneQ4UAgRvNp0HlhDA


Guidance coming soon. Agents already being told to allow transfer without a stamp.
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Milwaukees Best Light
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kyledr04 said:

https://www.outdoorlife.com/guns/atf-suppressor-guidance/?fbclid=IwdGRjcAUjr8BjbGNrBSOvb2V4dG4DYWVtAjExAHBkb2YFc3J0YwZhcHBfaWQMMzUwNjg1NTMxNzI4AAEexBJ6pTjzBVaMJ8bWMI9oMbHVCBOrB2HAS0PZdhfFtqO6u6ITvGcWNf0TL3Y_aem_VGtbfneQ4UAgRvNp0HlhDA


Guidance coming soon. Agents already being told to allow transfer without a stamp.

It is quite refreshing to read an article as well written as this one. Journalism has gotten so poor lately. This one covered the main points, the backstory and didn't give the authors opinion. Great job.
fburgtx
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Yup. My dealer told me that the only "hold up", now, is just the ATF waiting on the official "public comment" period to pass (Oct 5, mentioned in that OL article, I believe), and then the ATF is going to give the go-ahead to just do them on a 4473.

It'd be really great if that (the 4473) wasn't used (since it's essentially a firearm "part" and not the receiver), but maybe that'll get sorted out between now, and the end of Trump's term, as well…..
AvsB
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So what does this mean for person to person sales of used suppressors? Just like a firearm now…or soon?
BenderRodriguez
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AvsB said:

So what does this mean for person to person sales of used suppressors? Just like a firearm now…or soon?


That would be great!

I just bought a used suppressor from a member here last month. We handled the eform paperwork over the phone, waited a couple days for the approval and were able to meet in a gas station parking lot to hand it over.

Bit different from my first can that took over 180 days for an approval and required to me go to the dealer in person afterwards.
AvsB
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BenderRodriguez said:

AvsB said:

So what does this mean for person to person sales of used suppressors? Just like a firearm now…or soon?


That would be great!

I just bought a used suppressor from a member here last month. We handled the eform paperwork over the phone, waited a couple days for the approval and were able to meet in a gas station parking lot to hand it over.

Bit different from my first can that took over 180 days for an approval and required to me go to the dealer in person afterwards.

Yes it would. I have a couple standard baffle suppressors that I would like to move to someone wanting to get into the Shhhh game. Being a lefty, LBP and flow through(TM) are super helpful. Didn't know what I didn't know when I started.
BenderRodriguez
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AvsB said:

Didn't know what I didn't know when I started.


My first can was a Rugged Micro30.

So believe me when I say I know exactly what you mean.
Milwaukees Best Light
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How long until they start building them into the rifles? Wouldn't that be something!
dubi
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Quote:

Being a lefty, LBP and flow through(TM) are super helpful. Didn't know what I didn't know when I started.

Can you explain what makes a suppressor "super helpful" for a lefty?
kyledr04
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Milwaukees Best Light said:

How long until they start building them into the rifles? Wouldn't that be something!


Lots of 22lr are like that. Integral suppression or something like that. Depending on how this effects SBR it might get more popular especially for AR setups.
normaleagle05
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After the lawsuit was filed I suggested such a market innovation might become popular and the shouting from the resident fuds here made it too toxic to even discuss. Good luck.
AvsB
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dubi said:

Quote:

Being a lefty, LBP and flow through(TM) are super helpful. Didn't know what I didn't know when I started.

Can you explain what makes a suppressor "super helpful" for a lefty?

redneck explanation here....just an engineer or audiologist

The new generation of suppressors are Flow Through (huxwrx trademarked) so everyone is now using low back pressure or reduced back pressure as their terminology.

Standard baffle stack suppressors traps most of the explosive gas. That sends more gas than normal back through the gas tube and into the receiver. As a lefty, that ejection port is smack dab in our face.

With the introduction of additive material manufacturing (aka 3D printing) suppressor geometry can be designed and achieved that would never be capable in standard manufacturing. These new baffle and cores of LBP suppressors still trap the gas but allow it to vent out the front of the suppressor vs. back into the receiver and into my face! There are tradeoffs currently, LBP suppressors are typically more expensive and made of some exotic expensive metals like titanium and inconel. LBP suppressors are also a a few dBs louder as they choose less gas to face than total sound reduction. But from what I gather, dBs are not linear. So they are still "hearing safe" but typically louder. But most supersonic rounds, (ex: 5.56, 115g 9mm just to name couple) even with suppressors, will damage your hearing regardless with repetition and duration.

With a low back pressure suppressor, gas busting charging handle, weighted buffer and down vent BCG...as a lefty I can dump a full 30 round mag in FRT and not be crying or breathing out like it's my breathe on a cold winter day.

most of this is a moot point when you start talking bolt action rifles...but even there, these new 3d printed suppressors are lighter so perfect to trek with on a hunt.
AvsB
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kyledr04 said:

Milwaukees Best Light said:

How long until they start building them into the rifles? Wouldn't that be something!


Lots of 22lr are like that. Integral suppression or something like that. Depending on how this effects SBR it might get more popular especially for AR setups.

I've got the angstadt arms 22lr integral suppressed barrel. I got the 12" so it was still a two-stamp gun. But the 16" barrel would be a one stamp (no stamp soon) gun as the barrel and suppressor are one in the same and at least 16"

I also have the Novox Research SD barrel on an AR9. It is just a ported/vented barrel that you still attach a suppressor to. But it slows even 115g 9mm to subsonic speeds and is laughably quiet with 124 and 147s.
AvsB
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AvsB said:

kyledr04 said:

Milwaukees Best Light said:

How long until they start building them into the rifles? Wouldn't that be something!


Lots of 22lr are like that. Integral suppression or something like that. Depending on how this effects SBR it might get more popular especially for AR setups.

I've got the angstadt arms 22lr integral suppressed barrel. I got the 12" so it was still a two-stamp gun. But the 16" barrel would be a one stand gun as the barrel and suppressor are one in the same and at least 16"

I also have the Novox Research SD barrel on an AR9. It is just a ported/vented barrel that you still attach a suppressor to. But it slows even 115g 9mm to subsonic speeds and is laughably quiet with 124 and 147s.

I think you will see more and more of these options on bolt action and blow back rifles. Just not sure how they would do it on DI guns like standard ARs. But you could have an 12" barrel with pin/weld or other permanently affixed suppressor to total length of 16" and get it that way.

I think the bigger issue that currently most people don't buy a suppressor for every gun. They like to swap it from rifle to rifle. Until they become readily available and affordable and at any store.

In the UK it is either law or at least a societal no-no to even think about shooting without a suppressor attached. They are seen as health and safety first...not like here in the US where only killers and assassins use them.

agracer
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Justice Department failed to appeal the injunction today.

Guidance supposedly coming from the ATF to all dealers later this week.

https://www.outdoorlife.com/guns/doj-wont-challenge-otc-suppressor-sales/

Quote:

As expected, the federal government has declined to challenge over-the-counter suppressor purchases. The ATF is promising to clarify what's legal and what's not this week.


___

In a win for gun owners the Department of Justice will not appeal the ruling of a Texas judge in August that effectively deregulated suppressors for qualified buyers so they could be purchased over the counter with a standard background check.

U.S. solicitor general D. John Sauer formally announced the DOJ would not appealSilencer Shop Foundation v. ATF in a letter dated Sept. 24 and filed Oct 1. The deadline for that appeal is Monday, Oct. 5.

lazuras_dc
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AvsB said:

So what does this mean for person to person sales of used suppressors? Just like a firearm now…or soon?


Anyone have any more info on this ?
AvsB
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lazuras_dc said:

AvsB said:

So what does this mean for person to person sales of used suppressors? Just like a firearm now…or soon?


Anyone have any more info on this ?

NOT A LAWYER...but here is what I am taking away from stuff right now and wanting a much clearer opinion from ATF/GOA/SAF etc....before I go trying to sell.

1) If you have a suppressor that is on your NFA roster then it would still need to go Form 4 to sell second hand. That is the only way I can think of officially getting that suppressor of your NFA items and onto the buyer's list correctly. So that means form 4, photo, fingerprints...

2) If you just purchased a suppressor on a 4473, then down the road you could sell that like any other firearm you own.
txags92
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ATF expands Jensen ruling nationwide:

https://www.shootingnewsweekly.com/gun-nation/atf-releases-guidance-on-suppressors-sbrs-and-sbss-after-jensen-silencer-shop-foundation-ruling/
kyledr04
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https://www.atf.gov/news/press-releases/atf-issues-guidance-national-firearms-act-transfers-short-barreled-rifles-short-barreled-shotguns-suppressors-and-certain-other-firearms?fbclid=Iwb21leAU2P7FjbGNrBTY_gmV4dG4DYWVtAjExAHBkb2YFc3J0YwZhcHBfaWQMMzUwNjg1NTMxNzI4AAEeFnglFGi3eUmSWMODmpnWuM6VersNBFKFrzSCRSHb-LoF-nMCiGkUZ9dgqyQ_aem_ZmFrZWR1bW15MTZieXRlcw
 
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