Our neighbor has been running cattle on our place for the past couple of decades. He's decided to get out of the business and now I have to figure out what to do to keep the ag exemption on ~800 acres in Comanche county. What is the easiest solution? Do I just need to figure it out by the end of the year or is there a minimum amount of time required?

You could probably have someone new bringing their cows in and paying more by the end of the day.

Pastureland is a hot commodity.

You have to show Ag activity in 5 out of any 7 years. So conceivably, you could go up to 2 years without doing anything, as long as it was continuously used for Ag the previous 5 years. The easiest thing to do is either find somebody else who wants to lease the land to run cattle on it, or switch over to a wildlife habitat valuation.

You could let it ride until you're caught but that would be dishonest. I would contact my local extension agent. They should be able to talk to you about how many cows per acre you have to have, how long they have to be there during a years time etc. they could probably get you in touch with potential leasees if you don't want to buy your own cows.

Do you pay more in tax with wildlife vs ag?

Whereabouts in Comanche county? I may be interested in running some cows to help y'all out.

You will have no problem finding someone else to lease your place to run cows. In fact, you can and should be very particular on who you lease to and the lease terms.

Call the Comanche County extension agent and let them know you are looking to lease your land for grazing, you can also reach out to the Texas Southwestern Cattle Raisers Association and ask for the contact information of the representatives in the region that Comanche County is located.

Thanks for all the input so far. We are in SE Comanche county north of 36. I know there are a million factors that go into it, but anyone have an idea of going rates for a cattle lease? The neighbor has been paying next to nothing with the agreement that they would keep up the fences and roads. They've slipped a little over the past few years, so we really need to do some fencing work before bringing on any new cattle. Not looking to make this a business, just something to pay the tax bill every year and cover costs for fencing/etc would be nice.

On the wildlife habitat valuation, what all is involved with that? Same tax breaks as ag?

K_P said:

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Do you pay more in tax with wildlife vs ag?

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no

WL is still 1D1. Its a subset

agstudent said:

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Thanks for all the input so far. We are in SE Comanche county north of 36. I know there are a million factors that go into it, but anyone have an idea of going rates for a cattle lease? The neighbor has been paying next to nothing with the agreement that they would keep up the fences and roads. They've slipped a little over the past few years, so we really need to do some fencing work before bringing on any new cattle. Not looking to make this a business, just something to pay the tax bill every year and cover costs for fencing/etc would be nice.

On the wildlife habitat valuation, what all is involved with that? Same tax breaks as ag?

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going rates are "next to nothing" in most cases. He's doing you a favor by maintaining your fences and roads (not cheap) and saving you property tax. It's called symbiosis.

Switch to wildlife or get bees. Wildlife is heavily paperwork intensive if you do it right. Bees are labor intensive. Pick your poison.

I cut hay on mine. Not sure if it is an option for you but if it is an option. It is an easy answer.

Another good reference would be some of the local banks. Ask the main lender who they'd recommend as a good tenant. They'd be hard pressed to recommend a guy in the overdraft and on the past due reports.

State average is about $6-7 an acre per year, but "it depends." do you have water developed on this 800. How much road are you expecting him to fix/maintain, what about fence? What is the current status of your pasture. Solid and producing, or worn out from mis-management. It all plays a role.

Send me an email. I'd love to get to either come take a look at the place or look at an aerial to get a lay of the land to see if it's something that works for my operation. I'd definitely be interested in a long term lease if we make it that far.

Username @ gmail

The easiest solution is to have someone trustworthy lease it to run cattle on.
I'm curious if there are any bob white quail and turkey on your ranch and if you lease it for hunting.

I would be interested in coming to look at it for running cattle or discussing with you how to transition over to wildlife exemption. I'm not too far away in Coryell county either, just shoot me an email when you get a chance.

Ag exemption requires the land to be used for ag 5 out of 7 years.

Assuming its been leased continually for several years you could probably take a year or even two to "rest" the pasture before you graze it again.

That said it seems every county interprets things a little different so you might call the Comanche CAD.

Yes. You will not get hammered immediately, so you have time to find a new operation or convert to wildlife management.


And also yes, the folks running your CAD will be a big factor in how easy or hard this turns out.

I will add that I do some consulting on the side where I do wildlife exemption plans among other wildlife and land management tasks. In the very near future this will become more of my primary business but I would enjoy the opportunity to help you get to your goals for the place.

Mas89 said:

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...if you lease it for hunting.

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Beat me to it but following for the answer.

Growing up, the local County Extension Agent kept his cows fat on folks like you. Give them a call, If they don't have their own cows to run, they'll know someone else looking for grass.

Mas89 said:

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The easiest solution is to have someone trustworthy lease it to run cattle on.
I'm curious if there are any bob white quail and turkey on your ranch and if you lease it for hunting.

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Sorry, I don't lease it for hunting. Had tons of quail and no turkeys about 15-20 years ago. Then the quail disappeared, but now turkeys are everywhere. I did see my first covey of quail in several years a few months ago, so hoping they make a comeback.

agstudent said:

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Mas89 said:

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The easiest solution is to have someone trustworthy lease it to run cattle on.
I'm curious if there are any bob white quail and turkey on your ranch and if you lease it for hunting.

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Sorry, I don't lease it for hunting. Had tons of quail and no turkeys about 15-20 years ago. Then the quail disappeared, but now turkeys are everywhere. I did see my first covey of quail in several years a few months ago, so hoping they make a comeback.

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TPWD has several projects for restoring quail habitat.

If your rancher was managing for grass only and spraying to kill "weeds," he likely destroyed all the quail habitat.

Not sure if Comanche County is in the targeted restoration areas, but your biologist will know. USDA has similar programs if you can stomach dealing with the the feds.

BrazosDog02 said:

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Switch to wildlife or get bees.

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Quote:

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~800 acres in Comanche county

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Great to hear there are still some quail there. Had several great hunts close to your place in the late 80s.

With 800 acres only 20 acres can qualify for bees

Your 2 options are

1)wildlife (not that bad)
2) keep it in livestock production

Either way call the CAD and ask for the Ag and wildfire guidelines

Talk to neighbors about leasing your land and/or call the Ag extension agent to see if he has any leads on people looking for land.


Technically in years the property isn't principally devoted to a qualified Ag practice the property should be taxed at market value. Ag history is different then actually having Ag.

If your fences will do it, I would do Spanish goats or dorper sheep.

Otherwise, I bet the is a good Ag here in that area or knows of someone reliable that could run a few cows to help you out.

My neighbors all run cattle or cut hay. All the wildlife is on my place, but it lost its exemption a few years back so I pay about ten times what they do in taxes and carry more of the local wildlife load to boot.

It sucks that you have to first develop land to get the exemption to then "restore it" to wildlife habitat.

I've thought about bees, and growing wildflowers in my pastures for them.

Then every neighborhood and subdivision and virtually every piece of land in Texas would have a taxable value 99% lower.

What are you doing to get it back?

MouthBQ98 said:

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My neighbors all run cattle or cut hay. All the wildlife is on my place, but it lost its exemption a few years back so I pay about ten times what they do in taxes and carry more of the local wildlife load to boot.

It sucks that you have to first develop land to get the exemption to then "restore it" to wildlife habitat.

I've thought about bees, and growing wildflowers in my pastures for them.

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you can have your neighbors run their cattle on your property as part of their livestock operation to regain that ag exemption. They don't have to have cattle on your property year round. Just have them graze is for short durations several times a year. then once you get AE back, go the wildlife route.

its not a perfect solution but it is a way to lower your taxes.

Fishin Texas Aggie 05 said:

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Technically in years the property isn't principally devoted to a qualified Ag practice the property should be taxed at market value. Ag history is different then actually having Ag.

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Do you have a citation to support that? Because just about every county I have looked at simply says that you can maintain an ag valuation as long as you can show that the principal use of the property was ag for at least 5 of the previous 7 years. When they send an appraiser out to check on you, they ask to see your records showing the use for the past 7 years, and even if you can't show any ag for 2 of those years, they are not going to try to charge you taxes on a higher valuation for those 2 years.

One thing to keep in mind though is that the basis for the valuation is that the "principal use" of the property must by ag in order to achieve the valuation. So you do have to meet whatever the county guidelines define as the minimum intensity of ag use to establish that. Just running a few goats or having neighbors run cattle for a few weeks won't necessarily get you there.

texag_89 said:

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If your fences will do it, I would do Spanish goats or dorper sheep.

Otherwise, I bet the is a good Ag here in that area or knows of someone reliable that could run a few cows to help you out.

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If they have just been running cattle up until now, I highly doubt the fences would be suited for goats. 3 strand barbed wire won't keep goats in at all. Goat panel fencing is not cheap, but without it, you aren't keeping goats in.

txags92 said:

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Fishin Texas Aggie 05 said:

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Technically in years the property isn't principally devoted to a qualified Ag practice the property should be taxed at market value. Ag history is different then actually having Ag.

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Do you have a citation to support that? Because just about every county I have looked at simply says that you can maintain an ag valuation as long as you can show that the principal use of the property was ag for at least 5 of the previous 7 years. When they send an appraiser out to check on you, they ask to see your records showing the use for the past 7 years, and even if you can't show any ag for 2 of those years, they are not going to try to charge you taxes on a higher valuation for those 2 years.

One thing to keep in mind though is that the basis for the valuation is that the "principal use" of the property must by ag in order to achieve the valuation. So you do have to meet whatever the county guidelines define as the minimum intensity of ag use to establish that. Just running a few goats or having neighbors run cattle for a few weeks won't necessarily get you there.

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You want a source?

How about the tax code sec 23.51

TAX CODE

TITLE 1. PROPERTY TAX CODE

SUBTITLE D. APPRAISAL AND ASSESSMENT

CHAPTER 23. APPRAISAL METHODS AND PROCEDURES
SUBCHAPTER D. APPRAISAL OF AGRICULTURAL LAND

Sec. 23.51. DEFINITIONS. In this subchapter:
(1) "Qualified open-space land" means land that is currently devoted principally to agricultural use to the degree of intensity generally accepted in the area and that has been devoted principally to agricultural use or to production of timber or forest products for five of the preceding seven years.

So for a land to qualify for the special use valuation it must 1) be used for a qualifying Ag use for 5-7 years and 2) be used to the minimum degree of intensity

So if the property is not being being used to the minimum degree of intensity it does not qualify for Ag. But if some qualified Ag production is still occurring then that year won't count as a non history year.

You and I read that differently. To me, that reads that in any given year, in order to quality for an ag valuation, the property has to have been used for ag at the minimum intensity in at least 5 of the last 7 years. As long as at least 5 of the previous 7 meet the minimum intensity, the property qualifies for Ag valuation. I have never heard of any appraisal district anywhere attempting to change the valuation on somebody based on a single year below the minimum intensity when they still meet that history and intensity requirement.