A group of wealthy East Tx businessmen have purchased large tracts of land in Val Verde County and selling it to the Chinese. The Chinese conglomerate is called Brazos Highland Properties.the lands they have acquired total over 100,000 acres mostly on the Devils River watershed with one property on the Pecos watershed . The Devils River Conservacy has started a Web Site ( valverdevistas.org ) to explain the issues , a petition to sign and a donation site if any is so inclined. The Web Site needs to go viral. The Hill Country has successfully, through public sentiment,stopped the efforts of these Wind Energy Companies. Outdoor type Aggies need to be aware that the same thing could happen in their areas also. Please go on the site and at least sign the petition!

So the landowners in the area are upset about a Chinese company that has bought land to set up wind farms in a Texas border region?

And upset about what a property owner is doing on its own land?

We may need some clarification about what your real complaint is.

I need to read more, but I know that I don't like the idea of selling land to non citizens. Chinese non citizens in particular given their track record of responsible use of resources. Obviously the government needs to stay out of the business of private land owning citizens, but I don't think this is the same thing.

I was confused too so I went to the site and this is the summary of why they are saying its bad. It sounds like a lot of NIMBY stuff which I get but its also on private property which makes it challenging. Feels like this is going to be tough battle for them win and prevent this from happening.

From the website:

Wind farm development in Val Verde County:

• Compounds border security challenges
• Creates airspace hazards for Air Force pilots in training
• Degrades the frontier legacy character of the region
• Sacrifices future generation opportunities for limited short-term benefits to external interests
• Does not respect others' private property rights
• Devalues real estate
• Causes light pollution
• Produces energy to be utilized elsewhere
• Deteriorates shared natural scenic views
• Negatively impacts bats, birds, butterflies, and other wildlife
• Permanently scars viewscapes and night skies
• Is bad for hunting, fishing and other nature-dependent tourism
• Diminishes the natural beauty of public treasures;
  
  • Lake Amistad National Recreation Area
  • Devils River State Natural Areas
  • Seminole Canyon State Park and Historical Site
• Only benefits the foreign operator partnered with foreign investors to take advantage of U.S. subsidies

Quite honestly it is the landowners prerogative what to do with his land. If the Chinese are the highest bidder, they are setting the market. Don't like it, outbid them. That's the beauty of supply and demand.

Now, would I ever sell the 1500 acres we own in Moore county? NEVER! But I see very little value in restricting what a landowner wants to do with their property and that can turn into a slippery slope.

It's not uncommon to restrict what landowners can do on their private property for the greater good or to protect adjacent land owners. We restrict through permitting, zoning, etc.

Fairview said:

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I was confused too so I went to the site and this is the summary of why they are saying its bad. It sounds like a lot of NIMBY stuff which I get but its also on private property which makes it challenging. Feels like this is going to be tough battle for them win and prevent this from happening.

From the website:

Wind farm development in Val Verde County:

• Compounds border security challenges
• Creates airspace hazards for Air Force pilots in training
• Degrades the frontier legacy character of the region
• Sacrifices future generation opportunities for limited short-term benefits to external interests
• Does not respect others' private property rights
• Devalues real estate
• Causes light pollution
• Produces energy to be utilized elsewhere
• Deteriorates shared natural scenic views
• Negatively impacts bats, birds, butterflies, and other wildlife
• Permanently scars viewscapes and night skies
• Is bad for hunting, fishing and other nature-dependent tourism
• Diminishes the natural beauty of public treasures;
  
  • Lake Amistad National Recreation Area
  • Devils River State Natural Areas
  • Seminole Canyon State Park and Historical Site
• Only benefits the foreign operator partnered with foreign investors to take advantage of U.S. subsidies

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So in other words, a bunch of people in the area don't want a private landowner to do what they want and put windmills on their property because they think they are ugly. Got it.

It's a tough pill to swallow, but these guys are correct. Nothing to be done.

Just ask the landowners in Comal county who are about to lose a fight with Vulcan Quarry. It was never a fight. Too much money that sealed the deal long ago.

I agree with every one on the private property issue and would fight for the right to do what I want with my land. The lands in question were purchased from individuals and families under completely different auspices .The original purchasers did a lot of fibbing to the sellers, as to the stewardship the land would receive. The State of Texas now owns 2 natural areas that they paid exorbitant amounts for under the guise of keeping the river the most pristine in the State, Soon. when these locations (near football field size) start getting tropical type rains or just even large thunder storms , every bit of the caliche is heading to the river and the most pristine river will look like the Rio Grande . Val Verde County has refused tax abatements as have the school and Hospital but it appears the Chinese could care less . One question no one seems to be able to answer is who is going to take the mills down when they become obsolete?

Any chance these east Texas guys have the initials L.G. or D.F.?

A lot of people have no problem talking about how bad big oil is and we as a leading nation should set the bar with renewable energy. Well, here you go. Oh, you meant somewhere else, right!

Welcome to politics in the last decade. Where liberal ideas and theory are great until the people advocating for them actually have to sacrifice as well. Karma.

I'm from an area of west Texas that has had large wind farms for decades now and I don't see that it's detrimental to the area. I know the taxes it created was a real shot in the arm to some small school districts.

That said I can appreciate a land owner, especially a multi-generational one wanting to keep things as they have always know it. If it does happen I don't think it will be the disaster it is being made out to be.

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when these locations (near football field size) start getting tropical type rains or just even large thunder storms , every bit of the caliche is heading to the river

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What locations? Once the windmills are in, the only things that might be caliche are the access roads. And isn't caliche used, in part, because it doesn't run off?

Quote:

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Creates airspace hazards for Air Force pilots in training

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Best I can tell, the wind farm is planned for the "Carta Vally" area, which already shows a wind farm in operation.

It's about 25 miles north of Laughlin AFB, so it should not interfere with takeoffs and landings.

It is just inside the SE boundary of the Laughlin 1 MOA (Military Operating Area), one of the places they train. The base of the MOA is 9000'msl, the ground in that area is under 3000'msl, so as long as the towers are less than a mile high, I don't see the conflict.

Online sectional if you want to see it. Drag the map to Del Rio.

http://vfrmap.com/

Would you rather it be a wind farm, with about 85% of the land undisturbed or chopped up and sold as 10 acre ranchettes?

That would be an impact to the watershed.

The county probably requires a decommissioning bond. Plus, the demo value on a turbine is quit a bit. The landowner could make money on the scrap.

I could go with this if it were Texans doing what they want with their property. Foreign entities, imo, are a different ball of wax.

Most wind farms just lease the land needed for their infrastructure. This company purchased the land ?

PFG said:

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It's a tough pill to swallow, but these guys are correct. Nothing to be done.

Just ask the landowners in Comal county who are about to lose a fight with Vulcan Quarry. It was never a fight. Too much money that sealed the deal long ago.

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where do the people of comal county think the concrete for thei McMansion comes from? What about the rock facade?

Wind farms

Tree huggers

I don't understand the wind farm hate. I live in the Panhandle and we have several of them. Personally, I don't know that I would put one on my place, but I've got no problems with neighbors doing it. I've heard in some cases, the lease for the wind farms puts the landowners in a position to maintain ownership when weather conditions could have potentially put the land at risk.

I would love to not have to deal with

• wind farms
• oil derricks
• highlines
• interstates
• radio/TV antennae
• skyscrapers
• train tracks
• idiot neighbors with bright outside lights at night
• etc
• etc

But it's a modern world, and they all have to be somewhere

It's ugle to a lot of people. It ruins the visual landscape. My kids will never know what the panhandle looked like without windfarms in partial operation. Is that a big deal? Maybe. The ecological impact to wildlife is much more than originally thought.

I'm not personally against it as I'm all for diversification of resources. However, it's pretty much the ultimate alteration of the earth by man. You can require them to be removed, but that's easier said than done when companies go bankrupt. Especially when the government is involved. Which is going to happen without large scale government subsidies.

Man it makes me sick to my stomach thinking about what they are doing out there. We've been north on 277 for the past 35+ years and I was working out of state last year and didn't get a chance to make it to the ranch until December. I was pulling across lake Amistead at night and saw all the flashing red lights and my stomach dropped. I thought our neighbor had sold out. Luckily a couple minutes later I pulled up to the gate and our landscape covers the windmills - turned out it was someone further down the road.

I've always been in love with that land. You pull in the gate out there and it's like entering your own world that hasn't ever been touched and completely isolated from the rest of the world. There's something enchanting about being able to fall back in time and off the face of the planet by being out there. That charm of the land out there has now been ruined for our neighbors and its truly disheartening that it's likely going to ruin the enchantment of the land I've come to know and love throughout my life.

Not to mention the results of these liberal "green" initiatives actually having ultimately negative ecological impacts. https://climatechangedispatch.com/wind-turbines-destroy-habitats/amp/

Our place is up 377 towards Rocksprings and this group approached my grandpa about buying his place. He's not interested in selling so he named a crazy price. They hung around and tried to negotiate him down for about 8-10 months before giving up. They were VERY persistent though. Shady folks on the east Texas side...

I'm an old aggie that just found this addition to TEX Ags. I'm pretty slow on the computer and an even worse typist. The farthest I had ever scrolled down on the forums page before was Old Rivalries and found this Outdoor Forum really by mistakE. My wife and I thought it would be a good way to let some AGS know about a great place on the Devils River for deer ,Aoudads and fly fishing.My thoughts are
pretty much changed now.
All I asked was for some sportsmen to look at a web site and make a decision , read the info on the web site, sign the petition ,decline ,donate, or forget.
MY first thought goes to AgT Dub- THANK YOU! You know the country and had absolutely no smart remarks. The initials you alluded too could possibly be right but I don't know the Chinese form of the letters L,G or D,F but you are probably spot on!. Also you obviously know the country and can help me with the run-off question. We like to say that on the Devils we live on the short end of a very big funnel. A good three inch rain in a small amount of time can raise the river significantly. Solid rock straight down with very little vegetation is common and dangerous. Caliche is basically inert dirt and will be a product of the wind mill locations and the prominent material on the roads to each windmill. A little at a time or a lot at a time ,the result is still the same
To Paloma Pachanga- THANK YOU! you obviously know the country and are appreciative of the land ,the vistas, the wildlife ,and the Heritage. please sign the petition and encourage your friends
Canyon AG 77- AS A Land owner you also know the laws governing private property but when a neighbor in tentionaly takes a neighbor property value down by 30%(how about a pig farm ) you have to fight. that's all I'm asking . Sign or forget. My wife is from Dalhart.
Water Turkey- they own and took a 320 acre agreement I had with the previous owner . They couldn't have gotten their Federal Govt .subsidies with out ownership.
Dead zip01. I grew up in Iraan .Wind farms started on University Lands in West TX. you need to re visit the tax abatement issues our little schools gave them and see where they are now. Most of the windmills do not even produce any more .The Feds will have to bail them out again if they are to repair and start producing again
The HILL Country stopped Wind Mills and The other pristine areas of Texas could do the same if people just get involved .
For all the LAWYERSPEAK ON THE FORUM, Private Property is sacred in our Country. When did China get ANNEXED! Interested parties do your homework ! look at the petition ,decide ,sign, not donate,not do something1

I know I hate the way the Kenedy Ranch looks while fishing in the Land Cut. Oh well, the Catholic Church needs its money.

....I don't have a problem with it if (like if I buy land in Vietnam ) that after 40 years aftervthebourchsdecthe land goes back to the state.

Or how about we just don't have any wind farms and utilize other energy sources? The whole wind mill thing is supposed to be good for the environment but it's been proven to show the opposite effect.

I'm as nostalgic as anyone about the "ways things use to be", but it is pretty ironic that it is Devil's river folks that are wanting sympathy from fellow Texans considering the reputation many of them have regarding their attitude towards others using the river over the years.

96ags, The river is the way it is because of the stewardship of the land owners, 95% of the paddlers using the river don't have any problems with the land owners.me included. The 5% ,unpermitted, cause a lot of anguish to land owners. Most of the paddlers we see are from the Austin area . Lets assume you own a nice home in Austin and one morning you wake up and you have a tent set up in your back yard .litter all around .and a guy crapping in your flower bed. You immediately call the police the guys given a trespassing ticket and is ushered off the land. your still the one to clean the poop and litter. The guy gets a small fine but decided he liked your yard and fine was no deterrent so a week later he comes back and repeats his actions, Devils River landowners are some time cranky because that same scenario is played out on our lands more than you would want to know about ,We try to walk our banks on a regular basis ;Instead of enjoying our property we have trash bags surgical gloves and kitchen tongs. we find crappy toilet paper used condoms and every thing else you can imagine.

Ags all I asked for was help on a petition to stop a Chinese Company spoiling one of the most magical places in our State. I'm really sorry I started the thread.There may be nothing we can do but we are going to try.

Ragoo said:

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PFG said:

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It's a tough pill to swallow, but these guys are correct. Nothing to be done.

Just ask the landowners in Comal county who are about to lose a fight with Vulcan Quarry. It was never a fight. Too much money that sealed the deal long ago.

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where do the people of comal county think the concrete for thei McMansion comes from? What about the rock facade?

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Home Depot! Duh

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Only benefits the foreign operator partnered with foreign investors to take advantage of U.S. subsidies

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Does someone want to help me with this one? I thought that the subsidies were gone. The mandates are still there that companies derive at least X% of their energy from "renewables", but most passed that number long ago

Xcel, the company in this area, is building wind, way beyond the mandate. They say it now makes economic sense.