interesting article and idea:

Quote:

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In order to determine whether more fawns could be produced by keeping coyotes away, a large fence was erected at a research facility in Georgia. This 10-year study involved the construction of a fence around a 98-acre area that provided good fawning habitat for whitetails. The fence was four feet tall and buried deep within the ground, preventing coyotes from going over or under it. GPS collars on subject deer showed that does quickly learned to go into this coyote exclusion area to avoid predation and have their fawns.

This study showed two predictable results over 10 years. First, the number of fawns that made it to reproductive age significantly increased. Second, hunting success also increased in and near the exclusion area.

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link to article: https://www.outdoorhub.com/stories/2015/10/30/controlling-coyotes-to-protect-deer-hunting-part-1/

Quote:

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Another article and different method of laying fence to prevent coyotes from entering/exiting a property:
Quote:
"Coyotes are omnivores, which means they will eat almost anything. One research project in Texas showed that predators, primarily coyotes were responsible for 60 percent of all fawn deaths in one year."

Without question, deer losses such as this represent a significant financial setback and huge damage in a wildlife management program.

There are several ways to control these predators.

The use of predator wire can help greatly in this matter. Quality ranch fence materials will come in a 26-inch-wide net wire that can be laid on the ground and attached to the bottom of the 8-foot fence with hog-proof fence rings.

Turf staples can be used to secure the wire to the ground if the soil is not rocky. This is 99% effective to keep coyotes from digging under the fence. It also keeps the coyotes inside the high fence from getting out. Usually an intense coyote hunting needs to take place by someone that is qualified after the wire is installed.

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link to article: http://tejasranchfence.com/protect-deer-population-predators/[url=http://tejasranchfence.com/protect-deer-population-predators/][/url]


My question is a coyote couldn't just jump a 4 foot fence if he wanted to?

Be curious how expensive that would be to dig a fence deeper vs. going higher? I'd assume in parts of the hill country and in rockier areas, that would be a tremendous undertaking?

Paging ursus (i think?)...What adverse effects to not having coyotes on your land create?

For one, you have to do their job once you remove them. You have to hunt the property and since a large part of a coyotes diet is small animals such as rodents, you will have an abundance of them.

and an abundance of rodents probably means you'll have an abundance of snakes. I'd rather coyotes than a bunch of rattlesnakes.

I think you can also lay down a 5' wide fence on the ground and put the vertical fence perpendicular to it and achieve the same effect if you can't dig deep enough.

24in on the ground is enough if the ground isn't to Sandy. We would roll the dirt out of the way with a dozer, attach the wire, then roll the dirt back.

barnag said:

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interesting article and idea:

Quote:

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In order to determine whether more fawns could be produced by keeping coyotes away, a large fence was erected at a research facility in Georgia. This 10-year study involved the construction of a fence around a 98-acre area that provided good fawning habitat for whitetails. The fence was four feet tall and buried deep within the ground, preventing coyotes from going over or under it. GPS collars on subject deer showed that does quickly learned to go into this coyote exclusion area to avoid predation and have their fawns.

This study showed two predictable results over 10 years. First, the number of fawns that made it to reproductive age significantly increased. Second, hunting success also increased in and near the exclusion area.

---

link to article: https://www.outdoorhub.com/stories/2015/10/30/controlling-coyotes-to-protect-deer-hunting-part-1/

Quote:

---

Another article and different method of laying fence to prevent coyotes from entering/exiting a property:
Quote:
"Coyotes are omnivores, which means they will eat almost anything. One research project in Texas showed that predators, primarily coyotes were responsible for 60 percent of all fawn deaths in one year."

Without question, deer losses such as this represent a significant financial setback and huge damage in a wildlife management program.

There are several ways to control these predators.

The use of predator wire can help greatly in this matter. Quality ranch fence materials will come in a 26-inch-wide net wire that can be laid on the ground and attached to the bottom of the 8-foot fence with hog-proof fence rings.

Turf staples can be used to secure the wire to the ground if the soil is not rocky. This is 99% effective to keep coyotes from digging under the fence. It also keeps the coyotes inside the high fence from getting out. Usually an intense coyote hunting needs to take place by someone that is qualified after the wire is installed.

---

link to article: http://tejasranchfence.com/protect-deer-population-predators/[url=http://tejasranchfence.com/protect-deer-population-predators/][/url]


My question is a coyote couldn't just jump a 4 foot fence if he wanted to?

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I would think one could, but maybe not.
I have a 4' fence around my place to keep pigs out and horses in, but I can attest that 2-3 does each year fawn in the yaupon brush. They appear to like the protection around here too.

TwoMarksHand said:

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Paging ursus (i think?)...What adverse effects to not having coyotes on your land create?

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Everything is a give and take that must be balanced.

I ran hunts on a place near Snook for a few years. The land owner leased a portion of the land to a farmer who grew watermelons. The farmer mentioned coyotes causing crop destruction to watermelon plants as they bring plant pathogens into the field on their fur. The landowner declared war and started shooting every coyote he could. A few years later, I started noticing an abundance of field mice. That year the farmer said he had over $1M in crop damage from mice. They would pick melons and find a small hole where a mouse ate it's way in to get the inside.

How big is your enclosure?

Clicked on this thread because it seemed so unlikely that you could fence coyotes off a fawn crop. Kind of interesting research though, thanks for sharing.

Be curious how effective high game fences are on predator control? Most seem robust and well anchored. Guess you could dig under them like any other fence, but that seems excessive. I've seen some game ranches with two fences - and old and a new, with a space between wide enough for trucks/vehicles to patrol (and act as a fire break). So you have a double fence line - have to be one determined coyote to get in there.

They'll go right under it

Both?

I don't see why not. I know they go under high fences. What's the point of a double fence?

How correct you are sir. I grew up on a ranch and have owned my own for going on 25 years now. Live in the western hill country and old-timers out here kill anything and everything that they think get their lambs. So consequently all the natural predators....bobcats, foxes, coyotes, cougars are hunted and trapped very heavily. Just about eliminating any predator that might actually catch a baby hog, etc. Now we are seeing a proliferation of rabbits and mice...... and guess what is going after them?....many more rattlesnakes. We are in the pasture all the time every year and use to kill 8-10 rattlesnakes on average a year. Now we kill 18-20+ and see field mice everywhere. We use to see bobcats and foxes and a few coyotes on game cameras and when we did our spotlight deer surveys. I have not seen a bobcat in 5 years and have seen only one coyote this year and just a few foxes as well. But now we see lots of rabbits and lots of mice and snakes. And of course run over with hogs..............
Mother nature put predators in the field for a purpose........everything needs to be in balance.

barnag said:

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How big is your enclosure?

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It's cross fenced, the brushy part they like is only about an acre. The horse rarely goes over there because the good grass, barn, and hay is elsewhere.

Good question? I always assumed it was a combination of not wanting to tear the old one down, creating a fire break, and the assumption that on rare occasions deer have been known to clear a high fence, no way they are clearing two spaced a matter of feet apart.

Sounds expensive!

I'm in the western hill country as well (Llano, Mason, & San Saba Counties). When I was a kid (70s & 80s) there weren't many coyotes. We ran lots of angora goats back then. In the late 80s coyotes started moving in. We hired trappers, shot them from helicopters, tried every kind of sheep dog you can imagine & ultimately ended up with donkeys. In the end we got out of the goat business and the coyotes remained.

I remember back then we seemed to have more coons, ringtails, possums, cottontails, etc. LOTS more jackrabbits then. Haven't noticed much of a change one way or the other regarding mice & snakes.

Gunny where in the western hill country are you? Having fought them unsuccessfully for so long I'm always interested in stories where there was success.

Yeah, I remember when Angoras were as thick as broom weed. My g-parents coordinated with aerial coyote hunting with other land owners who ran them when I was younger. Then the goats disappeared. I always attributed this to changing markets (mohair, fashion, etc.).

Then there was the brief Ostrich/Emu craze. Giant, mean birds that can kill you. What could go wrong....

Guy in town over the summer bought some old Spanish goats to clear out a small strip of land. Resulted in some fat, happy coyotes...only with the recent rains and subsequent cover have we seen more rabbits/varmints/quail.

Little off topic but this thread made me think of good times killing jack rabbits near Brady back in the 80's. Rancher wanted them gone.
Hunted with .357's and spot light. Easily shoot 60-70 in a night with 3 guys. Big fun.
I don't see rabbits like that anymore.

Buddy has goats. He runs a single female llama with them and hasn't lost a billy since

All you need is a mean jack or Jenny or Llama or a Great Pyr and the coyotes will bother someone else.

MouthBQ98 said:

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All you need is a mean jack or Jenny or Llama or a Great Pyr and the coyotes will bother someone else.

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Starts new thread. "Where do I buy a donkey?"

Coyotes can easily jump a 4' fence

Too many things to play with, but to answer the origin question.......a coyote can go over a privacy fence it the want, so a 4' isn't much of a deterrent.

As far as impact goes, you typically see an increase I rodents, coons and foxes (foxes can act as a really good indicator of how active coyotes are in the area). Subsequently, you may also see a decrease in nesting success of ground next birds.

barnag said:

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MouthBQ98 said:

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All you need is a mean jack or Jenny or Llama or a Great Pyr and the coyotes will bother someone else.

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Starts new thread. "Where do I buy a donkey?"

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For sex? Or not for sex?

I'd posit that the 60% fawn death is not directly related to coyote kills, but I'd agree to 60% of dead fawns being scavenged by coyotes.

So coyotes can parkour?

I call BS.

There are too many dynamics in play. Coyotes are opportunistic and lazy. There may be other food sources available during the study that are easier for a coyote to procur.

A 4 foot fence is a joke to a hungry coyote. I know someone who caught and raised a coyote pup. When it was grown, it preferred to stay in the attic above the garage.. It got up there by jumping 8' 3 1/2".

A coyote is on the prowl for food. It will catch and eat whatever is available. There are probably many more rabbits that there are deer. Yes, I know and have seen coyotes decimate a fawn crop. I have also seen red foxes do the same thing.

Does become very smart and aggressive against coyotes. The study is BS.

Username checks out.

Gunny456 said:

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How correct you are sir. I grew up on a ranch and have owned my own for going on 25 years now. Live in the western hill country and old-timers out here kill anything and everything that they think get their lambs. So consequently all the natural predators....bobcats, foxes, coyotes, cougars are hunted and trapped very heavily. Just about eliminating any predator that might actually catch a baby hog, etc. Now we are seeing a proliferation of rabbits and mice...... and guess what is going after them?....many more rattlesnakes. We are in the pasture all the time every year and use to kill 8-10 rattlesnakes on average a year. Now we kill 18-20+ and see field mice everywhere. We use to see bobcats and foxes and a few coyotes on game cameras and when we did our spotlight deer surveys. I have not seen a bobcat in 5 years and have seen only one coyote this year and just a few foxes as well. But now we see lots of rabbits and lots of mice and snakes. And of course run over with hogs..............
Mother nature put predators in the field for a purpose........everything needs to be in balance.

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Our place in Mills county is the same way. Many small ranches means lots of people hunting predators over the past 20+ years. Now we are overrun with jackrabbits and hogs which pick off our kid goats and lambs easily. Not to worry, Shawn has set us up with thermal and we are waging war.

MouthBQ98 said:

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All you need is a mean jack or Jenny or Llama or a Great Pyr and the coyotes will bother someone else.

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Our Llama didn't do ***** We named him Barack and relocated him.

In our experience, the guard dogs work best in pairs or threes. Make sure your neighbors aren't trying to poison or snare coyotes though.