Ryan34 said:

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Snake Jazz said:

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Ag_07 said:

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Not an Xs and Os expert by any stretch of the imagination but aren't safeties a crucial part to Lovie's Cover 2 defense? Like they run the show and are crucial to the success of the defense.

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My understanding, as well, is that safeties are incredibly important in Tampa 2. They have a lot of ground to cover, so speed could be an issue, but good instincts can make up for that.

I like Sauce Gardner a lot, but since corners do less man coverage than in other schemes, I don't know that he is the best value at 3.

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I'd argue that Tampa 2 one of the friendliest schemes to safeties. Rangy LBs and CBs are more important. Tampa 2 often has a LB covering the deep middle.

Regardless, the safeties should be interchangeable. Hamilton is much more of a box safety than the typical Tampa 2. I really don't see him as a fit regardless, unless he's going to be lining up at LB on passing downs.

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This is correct. That's why Derrick Brooks was so important to Tampa in those days - they do a lot of coverage between the hashes deep. Brooks was an undersized but fast MLB before most everyone went to speedier LBs.

Again, history shows a lack of safeties taken in the top 5 living up to being picked that high. Will the Texans be the breakthrough team? Yeah, right. And since I doubt Lovie is here for the next 10 years I'd rather spend the top picks on guys that can play a more traditional style.

I think Nicks goal for this years draft in to add at least 2
First or early second round picks in 2023 by trading down from 3 and possibly 13. Ideally Carolina, Atlanta or Pittsburgh is willing to trade up to pick 3 to
Get their qb. Carolina would only be a drop to pick 6 and they don't have picks in rounds 2 or 3 this year so a 1 next year would be the best they can offer. I could see ruhle wanting probably Pickett to trade to stay employed.

If we end up with a mid to late first in a trade down I could see Kenyon Green being a starting guard to really help the run game. Texans need at least 1 RB and 1 WR in the first 3 rounds. Otherwise build the OL and DL as much as possible

John Mclain to retire, or has that been in the works?

LincolnBorglum79 said:

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I think Nicks goal for this years draft in to add at least 2
First or early second round picks in 2023 by trading down from 3 and possibly 13. Ideally Carolina, Atlanta or Pittsburgh is willing to trade up to pick 3 to
Get their qb. Carolina would only be a drop to pick 6 and they don't have picks in rounds 2 or 3 this year so a 1 next year would be the best they can offer. I could see ruhle wanting probably Pickett to trade to stay employed.

If we end up with a mid to late first in a trade down I could see Kenyon Green being a starting guard to really help the run game. Texans need at least 1 RB and 1 WR in the first 3 rounds. Otherwise build the OL and DL as much as possible

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Trading down from 3 looks unlikely to me right now. The only position teams are going to be that desperate for is QB and I just don't see this draft class as the one that teams are going to go all in for one of them. I do think Carolina takes a QB, but right now I don't know that anyone is high enough on any prospects to get in front of them, and if they do I still think they're talking to the Jets before they talk to Houston. I could see Carolina taking Pickett or Willis at 6. I think Atlanta goes full tank this season with Mariota, Seattle might do the same. Atlanta needs a WR so badly I think they have to go WR so they have more than just Pitts catching passes next season.

If we trade back I still think 13 will be where it happens. There's going to be a lot of good prospects on the board right there and the cost to move up isn't nearly as severe as it is to get a top 3 pick.

Teams with extra picks in the first couple rounds that I could see Houston trying to work something out with:
Green Bay 22, 28, 53 & 59
Kansas City 29, 30, 50 & 62
Philadelphia 15, 16, 19, 51

Max Power said:

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LincolnBorglum79 said:

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I think Nicks goal for this years draft in to add at least 2
First or early second round picks in 2023 by trading down from 3 and possibly 13. Ideally Carolina, Atlanta or Pittsburgh is willing to trade up to pick 3 to
Get their qb. Carolina would only be a drop to pick 6 and they don't have picks in rounds 2 or 3 this year so a 1 next year would be the best they can offer. I could see ruhle wanting probably Pickett to trade to stay employed.

If we end up with a mid to late first in a trade down I could see Kenyon Green being a starting guard to really help the run game. Texans need at least 1 RB and 1 WR in the first 3 rounds. Otherwise build the OL and DL as much as possible

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Trading down from 3 looks unlikely to me right now. The only position teams are going to be that desperate for is QB and I just don't see this draft class as the one that teams are going to go all in for one of them. I do think Carolina takes a QB, but right now I don't know that anyone is high enough on any prospects to get in front of them, and if they do I still think they're talking to the Jets before they talk to Houston. I could see Carolina taking Pickett or Willis at 6. I think Atlanta goes full tank this season with Mariota, Seattle might do the same. Atlanta needs a WR so badly I think they have to go WR so they have more than just Pitts catching passes next season.

If we trade back I still think 13 will be where it happens. There's going to be a lot of good prospects on the board right there and the cost to move up isn't nearly as severe as it is to get a top 3 pick.

Teams with extra picks in the first couple rounds that I could see Houston trying to work something out with:
Green Bay 22, 28, 53 & 59
Kansas City 29, 30, 50 & 62
Philadelphia 15, 16, 19, 51

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I agree about probably not being able to trade back with the #3 pick. This is similar to the year we had the #1 and took Clowney. Trading down was not an option because no other teams had a desire for any o the prospects at the top of the draft. Really helps if there are some outstanding QB prospects.

it's Texans tradition...or Texans bad luck.

have a top 5 pick in bad draft years

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/04/01/marlon-mack-signing-with-texans/

Max Power said:

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https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/04/01/marlon-mack-signing-with-texans/

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I think that's a great signing, he's only 26. I wonder what kind of contact he got.

Also a lot more flexibility around targeting RBs in the draft. I was thinking we needed two, now we can grab one and groom him for the future.

W said:

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it's Texans tradition...or Texans bad luck.

have a top 5 pick in bad draft years

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Actually it's a bad year to have the top pick like us in 2014. But i would take something like the browns and bills trade from that year

After a 2-year sabbatical on watching the Texans drain my life force every Sunday, I'm going to try and get excited and follow them this year with BoB and DW gone. They are still owned by morons, but maybe the braintrust can get around that, although Jack is still in the building.

I want two giant linemen who can start for 10 years, offense or defense, doesn't matter which. Don't see the point in drafting a skill player right now with our high picks, they'll just be wasted for a couple of years.

Nice guys finish last?

Lol NE at 24 with a murderer on the team. That stat just shows be sure you have a one in a lifetime qb or you teammates get arrested after they win a sb

Thinice said:

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And here we all thought that the #Cowboys had the most players arrested, but there’s actually 18 teams with more players arrested since 2000.

(via profootballstuff/IG) pic.twitter.com/0i5MN3b0I2

— JPA Football  (@jpafootball) April 3, 2022

I think I've found our problem……

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The Raiders are not top 10? The world has truly gone mad!

Need to trade down pick 3 and get Malik.

So since we're in basically a dead period I keep fixating on the draft trying to figure out what makes the most sense. Here are the composite rankings for offense and defense in 2021.

Offense:
-Rushing: 32nd
-Passing: 28th
-Scoring: 30th
-Total offense: 32nd

Defense:
-Rushing: 31st
-Passing: 23rd
-Scoring: 27th
-Total: 31st

Surprise, we were bad at everything. The good news is it makes drafting easier, if you need help everywhere then very few players at the top of this draft would be a mistake, they should all be able to help. While I like the defensive prospects the most I think that Caserio is going to spend capital in this draft to build around Mills and see what he can do and if Mills fails then these guys will have a year experience under their belt for whoever they draft next year.

The safe bet at 3 will be the best o-lineman in the draft, Evan Neal or Ikem Ekwonu. My guess is he takes Ekwonu since he seems to be more versatile. At 13 he takes the best defender available. WR in the 2nd round and RB in the 3rd.

I agree that there is a lot of flexibility since we need everything in this draft outside of QB for the immediate future.

Assuming no trades, in the first round I would be good with either o-line or d-line with the first pic and then BPA at pick 13.

2nd round is going to be tougher, as if we go WR we'll be reaching since there are so many WR needy teams at the back half of round one. There is a legitimate chance up to 7 WRs go in round 1 which means other positions will drop into round 2. I wouldn't mind them grabbing another o-line with our 2nd round pick if someone with a 1st round grade drops to us. Other than that, I would go BPA on the board again

3rd round, again this is interesting with the signing of Mack. If a RB we really like is sitting there in the top pick of the 3rd, them grab him, if not move on to a TE, LBer, or DB. Someone who has a chance to make an impact their rookie year starting, situationally, or on special teams. We just need impact players everywhere.

This draft is going to be so tough getting a WR because the grades are going to be shifted with the run that is setting up in the 1st round. I thought maybe we could steal Sky Moore or Christian Watson in the 3rd round originally, then maybe the 2nd, but now I see them in the 1st round of some mock drafts.

I won't be surprised if we go WR at 13. I also think there's going to be a run on WRs in the first round. And if that happens there will be some surprises at the top of the second. I mainly think he goes defense at 13 because I could see that WR run starting early and someone sitting there at 13 that wasn't anticipated.

In other news earlier today the Saints and Eagles completed a trade. The Saints now have picks 16 and 19, Eagles have 15 and 18, and picked up a 1st in 2023 amongst other assets. I'm curious if the Saints are trying to work their way up even higher from 16.

Oh wow, that is a pretty big trade.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/33670901/philadelphia-eagles-new-orleans-saints-shake-first-round-2022-nfl-draft-multi-pick-trade

I would agree with WR for the 13th pick, but we might be able to move the pick if that run on them happens

I'll guess DL first pick and either CB or WR with the second. I'd be surprised if one of the two isn't a DL though.

This is a deep WR draft and unless one falls that was expected to go higher, I don't expect them to take a WR until at least the second or third round, unless they trade Cooks.

Interesting, so was listening to the Texans All Access podcast and John Harris had his latest mock. As part of it he has us trading down with the Falcons to #8. Falcons would get #3 to get Willis and Houston would get #8, Atlanta's top 2nd rounder (#43) and their lower 3rd round (#82) and Atlanta's 3rd round next year. I would take that trade.

I would still disagree on his Mock picks for Houston though:

Houston at 8: Kyle Hamilton
Houston at 13: Kayvon Thibodeaux

IrishAg said:

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Interesting, so was listening to the Texans All Access podcast and John Harris had his latest mock. As part of it he has us trading down with the Falcons to #8. Falcons would get #3 to get Willis and Houston would get #8, Atlanta's top 2nd rounder (#43) and their lower 3rd round (#82) and Atlanta's 3rd round next year. I would take that trade.

I would still disagree on his Mock picks for Houston though:

Houston at 8: Kyle Hamilton
Houston at 13: Kayvon Thibodeaux

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No way I trade down to 8 unless I'm getting a first next year.

MelvinUdall said:

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This is a deep WR draft and unless one falls that was expected to go higher, I don't expect them to take a WR until at least the second or third round, unless they trade Cooks.

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It's a tough toss up, if we want a WR that isn't going to be a complete project, we have to pick one at 13. With the run shaping up you're probably going to be taking a full round above everyone's round grade by the 2nd round at the position. So it just comes down to priorities.

While we don't have a top tier guy at QB, if you look around the league having top their playmakers at WR can completely change an offense these days.

That said, ironically I'm not sold on getting one at 13, but there are so many variables on who might be available at 13.


Also, top 15 will probably be shuffled around in Mocks with Derek Stingley's pro day today. If he goes crazy look for him to jump back into the top 5.

IrishAg said:

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superaggie73 said:

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IrishAg said:

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Interesting, so was listening to the Texans All Access podcast and John Harris had his latest mock. As part of it he has us trading down with the Falcons to #8. Falcons would get #3 to get Willis and Houston would get #8, Atlanta's top 2nd rounder (#43) and their lower 3rd round (#82) and Atlanta's 3rd round next year. I would take that trade.

I would still disagree on his Mock picks for Houston though:

Houston at 8: Kyle Hamilton
Houston at 13: Kayvon Thibodeaux

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No way I trade down to 8 unless I'm getting a first next year.

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I'm pretty sure 3 to 8 won't get you an extra 1st on the value chart. But the thing is, if you're looking at picking from the same potential group of players you would have gotten at 3 then I would do it. In this scenario Atlanta is trading for a QB and the Panthers would be drafting a QB, so that is only 6 teams picking ahead of us for the same players, and with no clear cut top 3, I think it would be a good trade.

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Not sure I like his picks but I would do the trade as well. You only drop 5 spots and the end result is 2 #1s, 2 #2s and 3 #3s in this draft. If you draft well that should land you 7 guys that should be at worst rotational guys and possibly starters this season.

Excuse me if this is obvious but I haven't kept up with NFL draft prospects...

What's the deal with Thibodeaux?

Wasn't he one of the consensus top 3-5 guys? Why the drop?

Ag_07 said:

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Excuse me if this is obvious but I haven't kept up with NFL draft prospects...

What's the deal with Thibodeaux?

Wasn't he one of the consensus top 3-5 guys? Why the drop?

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Attitude, he's probably one of the top guys in talent, but apparently he has an attitude that seems to go past being confident and more just constantly bragging. Mix that in with a guy that seemed to only give effort when he wanted to (which usually wasn't very often) and you have someone who has a very high ceiling but a very low floor which is dangerous to use on a top 10 pick.

The most telling thing I've heard so far is that on one of the NFL Network podcasts they were discussing their top 10 prospects and they go and talk to coaches in the conferences that played against the prospects to get their input. Apparently, no coach felt they needed to account for Thibodeaux at all when game planning against the Ducks. This is the pac 12, which doesn't have the best o-lines, and no coach felt they needed to worry about him, instead just told their guys watch for the initial burst but after that he would give up. That is very scary for a GM drafting a guy that their career might rely on.

chjoak said:

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IrishAg said:

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superaggie73 said:

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IrishAg said:

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Interesting, so was listening to the Texans All Access podcast and John Harris had his latest mock. As part of it he has us trading down with the Falcons to #8. Falcons would get #3 to get Willis and Houston would get #8, Atlanta's top 2nd rounder (#43) and their lower 3rd round (#82) and Atlanta's 3rd round next year. I would take that trade.

I would still disagree on his Mock picks for Houston though:

Houston at 8: Kyle Hamilton
Houston at 13: Kayvon Thibodeaux

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No way I trade down to 8 unless I'm getting a first next year.

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I'm pretty sure 3 to 8 won't get you an extra 1st on the value chart. But the thing is, if you're looking at picking from the same potential group of players you would have gotten at 3 then I would do it. In this scenario Atlanta is trading for a QB and the Panthers would be drafting a QB, so that is only 6 teams picking ahead of us for the same players, and with no clear cut top 3, I think it would be a good trade.

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Not sure I like his picks but I would do the trade as well. You only drop 5 spots and the end result is 2 #1s, 2 #2s and 3 #3s in this draft. If you draft well that should land you 7 guys that should be at worst rotational guys and possibly starters this season.

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Same here, I would be against it if there were a clear difference between the top 3 or top 5 from the rest of the pack. But this year is one of those weird ones where there are probably 10-15 players who are sitting at the top of the draft board of every team. I've seen mocks with Neal, Walker, and Hutchinson in the top spot and I've seen other mocks that have scenarios where any of those guys can fall to the 5-10 range. So we would have an actual realistic shot to get the same guy at 8 as we would at 3. So value wise I think an extra 2nd and 3rd with a player in the 5-10 range outweighs someone in the 1-3 range this year.

Ag_07 said:

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Excuse me if this is obvious but I haven't kept up with NFL draft prospects...

What's the deal with Thibodeaux?

Wasn't he one of the consensus top 3-5 guys? Why the drop?

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The concerns that I'm aware of mainly have stemmed from his interviews and statements to the media. The narrative about taking plays off isn't one I'd pay attention to, this argument comes up for every single defensive lineman, it's really easy to cherry pick that argument.

He seems rather full of himself to put it mildly, granted these are division 1 athletes about to go pro, most will be. But the perception is he might be such a "me first" guy that he actually doesn't care about the team itself. He's been open that he wants to be drafted to a place like Texas or Florida because of the no state income tax. He made the statement that he went to Oregon/Pac 12 due to the comparative academics of the SEC, which Greg McElroy took issue with. He went to Oregon, not Stanford. He's called himself the best player in the draft. He's called himself Jadeveon Clowney 2.0 as well. This is a guy who was the number one hs recruit of his class, so I'm sure he's been hearing about how great he is for as long as he can remember, and he believes every bit of it. Might sound crazy, but he could legitimately be there at 13 even though he was in the discussion for the number 1 pick.

My gut feeling is he's not going to be a guy that Caserio and Lovie Smith want on the team, at least not at 3. But also keep in mind that teams don't tell anyone who they want, and are more than happy to say things to talk down guys they are interested in. I haven't heard anything coming out of the organization about who they like, I read yesterday they are bringing in Sauce Gardner for an in person meeting, I think Trayvon Walker is as well.

He reminds me of the statement from Tywin Lannister "Any man who must say 'I am the king' is no true king."

IrishAg said:

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chjoak said:

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IrishAg said:

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superaggie73 said:

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IrishAg said:

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Interesting, so was listening to the Texans All Access podcast and John Harris had his latest mock. As part of it he has us trading down with the Falcons to #8. Falcons would get #3 to get Willis and Houston would get #8, Atlanta's top 2nd rounder (#43) and their lower 3rd round (#82) and Atlanta's 3rd round next year. I would take that trade.

I would still disagree on his Mock picks for Houston though:

Houston at 8: Kyle Hamilton
Houston at 13: Kayvon Thibodeaux

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No way I trade down to 8 unless I'm getting a first next year.

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I'm pretty sure 3 to 8 won't get you an extra 1st on the value chart. But the thing is, if you're looking at picking from the same potential group of players you would have gotten at 3 then I would do it. In this scenario Atlanta is trading for a QB and the Panthers would be drafting a QB, so that is only 6 teams picking ahead of us for the same players, and with no clear cut top 3, I think it would be a good trade.

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Not sure I like his picks but I would do the trade as well. You only drop 5 spots and the end result is 2 #1s, 2 #2s and 3 #3s in this draft. If you draft well that should land you 7 guys that should be at worst rotational guys and possibly starters this season.

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Same here, I would be against it if there were a clear difference between the top 3 or top 5 from the rest of the pack. But this year is one of those weird ones where there are probably 10-15 players who are sitting at the top of the draft board of every team. I've seen mocks with Neal, Walker, and Hutchinson in the top spot and I've seen other mocks that have scenarios where any of those guys can fall to the 5-10 range. So we would have an actual realistic shot to get the same guy at 8 as we would at 3. So value wise I think an extra 2nd and 3rd with a player in the 5-10 range outweighs someone in the 1-3 range this year.

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That and we are in a build/re-build mode. We have a QB (for now) so there isn't really any 1 player/position that we absolutely have to have in the 1st. Would make sense to address OL & DL but those don't have to be the picks because we aren't likely to be a playoff team next season so just go grab the best players you can get and start building up the entire roster. A trade down from #3, whether it's this or a similar deal, gets us more high end guys that can help shorten the re-build process.

chjoak said:

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IrishAg said:

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chjoak said:

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IrishAg said:

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superaggie73 said:

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IrishAg said:

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Interesting, so was listening to the Texans All Access podcast and John Harris had his latest mock. As part of it he has us trading down with the Falcons to #8. Falcons would get #3 to get Willis and Houston would get #8, Atlanta's top 2nd rounder (#43) and their lower 3rd round (#82) and Atlanta's 3rd round next year. I would take that trade.

I would still disagree on his Mock picks for Houston though:

Houston at 8: Kyle Hamilton
Houston at 13: Kayvon Thibodeaux

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No way I trade down to 8 unless I'm getting a first next year.

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I'm pretty sure 3 to 8 won't get you an extra 1st on the value chart. But the thing is, if you're looking at picking from the same potential group of players you would have gotten at 3 then I would do it. In this scenario Atlanta is trading for a QB and the Panthers would be drafting a QB, so that is only 6 teams picking ahead of us for the same players, and with no clear cut top 3, I think it would be a good trade.

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Not sure I like his picks but I would do the trade as well. You only drop 5 spots and the end result is 2 #1s, 2 #2s and 3 #3s in this draft. If you draft well that should land you 7 guys that should be at worst rotational guys and possibly starters this season.

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Same here, I would be against it if there were a clear difference between the top 3 or top 5 from the rest of the pack. But this year is one of those weird ones where there are probably 10-15 players who are sitting at the top of the draft board of every team. I've seen mocks with Neal, Walker, and Hutchinson in the top spot and I've seen other mocks that have scenarios where any of those guys can fall to the 5-10 range. So we would have an actual realistic shot to get the same guy at 8 as we would at 3. So value wise I think an extra 2nd and 3rd with a player in the 5-10 range outweighs someone in the 1-3 range this year.

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That and we are in a build/re-build mode. We have a QB (for now) so there isn't really any 1 player/position that we absolutely have to have in the 1st. Would make sense to address OL & DL but those don't have to be the picks because we aren't likely to be a playoff team next season so just go grab the best players you can get and start building up the entire roster. A trade down from #3, whether it's this or a similar deal, gets us more high end guys that can help shorten the re-build process.

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Yup, in addition I think the 2nd round this year will be very talent rich with the potential huge WR run that is building. If 7 receivers go in the first round (which there is potential), that means there will be probably a few 1st round grade players available in the 2nd. So with 2 1st's 2 2nd's we could bring in potential 3 first round talents and a 2nd to help build this team. Hell with 3 3's I would be good with us packaging a couple to move into the 2nd round again if there is someone else we want at that point.