Are you cold applying only?

500,000ags said:

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Are you cold applying only?

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A mix. Of course im networking with people I know, but still not getting traction. I've tried to look up Aggies within companies and message them through the HireAggies connection but have a 0% response rate through that approach. About to be on month 4 of unemployment and about ready to just give up.

swimmerbabe11 said:

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Made up applications as in.. a completely fake person/resume?

not a real person with an AI made resume with a bot that spams out their resume to many many applications, but a total catfish?

What is the goal?

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There are people in India who do this all day everyday. Their goal is to get hired at a company remotely and then have someone else step in and pretend to work. One guy will even do all of the technical assessment interviews, and then a different guy shows up on the first day of onboarding remotely.

<deleted>

Appreciate it. Im a Houston native, but live up in Georgetown these days.

Tech?

500,000ags said:

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Tech?

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PhD Analytical Chemist by formal training.
18 years experience, mostly chemical industry (gas sweetening, ethoxylated products, analytical sciences), but have also worked in pharma and refinery product testing while in Houston. Up in Georgetown I worked for a startup designing field instrumentation for narcotics and explosives detection. Roughly 75% of career spent as a people leader, but comfortable being an individual contributor.

Haven't been on this board in a while. I do have a secondhand bad interview story! I conducted several interviews in my previous job both by phone and in person. I wasn't on it, but my team did a phone interview with a candidate who abruptly hung up in the middle of the interview. When my boss called the interviewee back, apparently he said something along the lines of "oh I didn't think it was going well so I decided to end it." Needless to say, he did not get the position!

Cromagnum said:

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I'm so sick of applying to jobs where I checked 100% of required and 100% of preferred skills and still get the "we went with candidates who were a better fit" emails.

Absolute bull***** Just tell me you were going to give the role to an internal candidate and picked the 3-4 people least likely to out interview them.

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I had about 45 candidates that checked all the required and preferred skills to the job I'm doing interviews for right now. It's a tough job market out there. 12 got phone screens, 5 or 6 will get interviews.

Agador Spartacus said:

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Cromagnum said:

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I'm so sick of applying to jobs where I checked 100% of required and 100% of preferred skills and still get the "we went with candidates who were a better fit" emails.

Absolute bull***** Just tell me you were going to give the role to an internal candidate and picked the 3-4 people least likely to out interview them.

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I had about 45 candidates that checked all the required and preferred skills to the job I'm doing interviews for right now. It's a tough job market out there. 12 got phone screens, 5 or 6 will get interviews.

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For things im applying for, I doubt there are 50 other candidates that have a similar background as me, or even close to the same experience.

I would tend to agree. Are there recruiters that specifically place hard sciences or R&D roles?

500,000ags said:

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I would tend to agree. Are there recruiters that specifically place hard sciences or R&D roles?

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I'm sure there must be, but if there are, I haven't found one that will answer any introductory message I've attempted. People only care about you in the moment.

I had a recruiter for Entegris reach out to me 2-3 years ago while I still worked at Dow about a role up here and I wasn't ready to make that move yet and told her so much. I reached out to the same recruiter now about the same exact job opportunity which is open again by re-forwarding her original message. Crickets.

I hear ya. But at the original time she asked, things were going well and I had no reason to even look at the time. Next year I got a new boss who sucked, and Dow started losing a lot of steam so I started looking harder. The year after that I had two offers. One to work near Charlotte, NC which I now regret not taking, and the opportunity in Austin that I did take, but got laid off 15 months in. And now im on month 4 of unemployment in this **** ass market.

Cromagnum said:

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I'm so sick of applying to jobs where I checked 100% of required and 100% of preferred skills and still get the "we went with candidates who were a better fit" emails.

Absolute bull***** Just tell me you were going to give the role to an internal candidate and picked the 3-4 people least likely to out interview them.

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I was the Director of Operations for a large pipeline company 6 years ago and had that role for a decade. I recently applied for that role at another major and was told I lacked experience. I literally did this exact job (with larger budget, territory, team size) for ten years at another company and was told that I didnt make that cut after 4 interviews. I take it as God talking to me and saying not to go through that door.

infinity ag said:

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Cromagnum said:

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I had a recruiter for Entegris reach out to me 2-3 years ago while I still worked at Dow about a role up here and I wasn't ready to make that move yet and told her so much. I reached out to the same recruiter now about the same exact job opportunity which is open again by re-forwarding her original message. Crickets.

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I've made this same mistake so many times in my career, I've lost count.
There were times when my job was going great, I'd just have launched some new products, making revenue, and one time an Exec VP came over and told me that I'm due for a promotion and he will keep in mind for next time. At that time, a different company reaches out with a higher level job that I'd wanted in my own company and I say NO. Because I was sure it would happen where I was.

Then what happened?
I got laid off... along with 1/3 of the company. Eventually my boss, her boss and the Exec VP (3 levels up) also got booted out and soon the CEO also. The company then got sold off. But what good did it do to my career?

Key learning: When opportunity arrives, don't be a dumbass and say no. Grab it with both hands and see where it goes. That is how I look at things now though it is a bit late for me.

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On the flip side, Ive had situations where I was working for a good company and they treated me well, but another company reaches out to me about a new exciting role, I ended up leaving for more money and instantly regretted it because the new company was a mess. Switching jobs is a coin flip, sometimes it works out and sometimes it doesnt.

Leaving a good company for a new position isnt always the answer, as Ive found out many times in my career. Sometimes you just gotta stay put. I was always antsy to job hop for more money early in my career, now I value stability more.

Texag5324 said:

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infinity ag said:

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Cromagnum said:

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I had a recruiter for Entegris reach out to me 2-3 years ago while I still worked at Dow about a role up here and I wasn't ready to make that move yet and told her so much. I reached out to the same recruiter now about the same exact job opportunity which is open again by re-forwarding her original message. Crickets.

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I've made this same mistake so many times in my career, I've lost count.
There were times when my job was going great, I'd just have launched some new products, making revenue, and one time an Exec VP came over and told me that I'm due for a promotion and he will keep in mind for next time. At that time, a different company reaches out with a higher level job that I'd wanted in my own company and I say NO. Because I was sure it would happen where I was.

Then what happened?
I got laid off... along with 1/3 of the company. Eventually my boss, her boss and the Exec VP (3 levels up) also got booted out and soon the CEO also. The company then got sold off. But what good did it do to my career?

Key learning: When opportunity arrives, don't be a dumbass and say no. Grab it with both hands and see where it goes. That is how I look at things now though it is a bit late for me.

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On the flip side, Ive had situations where I was working for a good company and they treated me well, but another company reaches out to me about a new exciting role, I ended up leaving for more money and instantly regretted it because the new company was a mess. Switching jobs is a coin flip, sometimes it works out and sometimes it doesnt.

Leaving a good company for a new position isnt always the answer, as Ive found out many times in my career. Sometimes you just gotta stay put. I was always antsy to job hop for more money early in my career, now I value stability more.

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I value stability too. When I seriously started looking to leave big chemical where I had been for over 10 years, was when I was told I was never getting a promotion again by my ****ty boss. Meanwhile Dow was going hyper woke and promoting the hell out of DEI so the culture was going to pot. The same year I got out, they laid off 1600 people, then turned around and announced 4500 more a year later. I feel like I got out at the perfect time but need to work on sticking my landing.

For now, I was forced to start up my own LLC and do consulting work. I have a former Dow buddy who now works for Ecolab trying to get me connected with folks in their quality group. Networking in person at Pittcon tomorrow to see what rocks I can kick over for other opportunities as well.

Texag5324 said:

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infinity ag said:

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Cromagnum said:

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I had a recruiter for Entegris reach out to me 2-3 years ago while I still worked at Dow about a role up here and I wasn't ready to make that move yet and told her so much. I reached out to the same recruiter now about the same exact job opportunity which is open again by re-forwarding her original message. Crickets.

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I've made this same mistake so many times in my career, I've lost count.
There were times when my job was going great, I'd just have launched some new products, making revenue, and one time an Exec VP came over and told me that I'm due for a promotion and he will keep in mind for next time. At that time, a different company reaches out with a higher level job that I'd wanted in my own company and I say NO. Because I was sure it would happen where I was.

Then what happened?
I got laid off... along with 1/3 of the company. Eventually my boss, her boss and the Exec VP (3 levels up) also got booted out and soon the CEO also. The company then got sold off. But what good did it do to my career?

Key learning: When opportunity arrives, don't be a dumbass and say no. Grab it with both hands and see where it goes. That is how I look at things now though it is a bit late for me.

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On the flip side, Ive had situations where I was working for a good company and they treated me well, but another company reaches out to me about a new exciting role, I ended up leaving for more money and instantly regretted it because the new company was a mess. Switching jobs is a coin flip, sometimes it works out and sometimes it doesnt.

Leaving a good company for a new position isnt always the answer, as Ive found out many times in my career. Sometimes you just gotta stay put. I was always antsy to job hop for more money early in my career, now I value stability more.

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You are right, and that is why I didn't leave.. things were going so amazingly well for me with work and the Exec VP telling me himself that I am next for a promo. Then KABOOM. Nothing is guaranteed. However, I should have taken the job (at least interviewed and tried my luck) and if I got the job, used that to negotiate my next career jump. There is always some risk one has to take and I failed to do so and paid the price for my stupidity.

It is a mistake today to assume that you can join a company and "grow" by working hard. That was 1990s. Now you make your own path by switching jobs and going up else the corporate structure will pull you down.

Ultimately my fault was I like stability. That was my comfort zone. I should have learned to like or at least tolerate some instability and some discomfort.

infinity ag said:

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Texag5324 said:

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infinity ag said:

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Cromagnum said:

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I had a recruiter for Entegris reach out to me 2-3 years ago while I still worked at Dow about a role up here and I wasn't ready to make that move yet and told her so much. I reached out to the same recruiter now about the same exact job opportunity which is open again by re-forwarding her original message. Crickets.

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I've made this same mistake so many times in my career, I've lost count.
There were times when my job was going great, I'd just have launched some new products, making revenue, and one time an Exec VP came over and told me that I'm due for a promotion and he will keep in mind for next time. At that time, a different company reaches out with a higher level job that I'd wanted in my own company and I say NO. Because I was sure it would happen where I was.

Then what happened?
I got laid off... along with 1/3 of the company. Eventually my boss, her boss and the Exec VP (3 levels up) also got booted out and soon the CEO also. The company then got sold off. But what good did it do to my career?

Key learning: When opportunity arrives, don't be a dumbass and say no. Grab it with both hands and see where it goes. That is how I look at things now though it is a bit late for me.

---

On the flip side, Ive had situations where I was working for a good company and they treated me well, but another company reaches out to me about a new exciting role, I ended up leaving for more money and instantly regretted it because the new company was a mess. Switching jobs is a coin flip, sometimes it works out and sometimes it doesnt.

Leaving a good company for a new position isnt always the answer, as Ive found out many times in my career. Sometimes you just gotta stay put. I was always antsy to job hop for more money early in my career, now I value stability more.

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You are right, and that is why I didn't leave.. things were going so amazingly well for me with work and the Exec VP telling me himself that I am next for a promo. Then KABOOM. Nothing is guaranteed. However, I should have taken the job (at least interviewed and tried my luck) and if I got the job, used that to negotiate my next career jump. There is always some risk one has to take and I failed to do so and paid the price for my stupidity.

It is a mistake today to assume that you can join a company and "grow" by working hard. That was 1990s. Now you make your own path by switching jobs and going up else the corporate structure will pull you down.

Ultimately my fault was I like stability. That was my comfort zone. I should have learned to like or at least tolerate some instability and some discomfort.

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I learned in the late 80's that companies didn't care about their employees loyalty. It was all about profit. One could argue that this should be the way, but this overlooks who makes those profits.

At that point I would have been like:

"WHY are you trying to fill this role?"

"WHY is your turnover so high?"

"WHY do employees think you are an *******?"

maybe he knew?

Gotta love companies that you apply to because you check every single requirement, and every single nice to have, only to have them auto-reject you, and then repost the job a few weeks later. I doubt its a fake job because its Eli Lilly, so I suspect they are unicorn hunting.

Cromagnum said:

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Gotta love companies that you apply to because you check every single requirement, and every single nice to have, only to have them auto-reject you, and then repost the job a few weeks later. I doubt its a fake job because its Eli Lilly, so I suspect they are unicorn hunting.

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Happen to me with them but I actually interviewed.

This was about a time when I was the interviewer, not an interviewee.

I was at a large tech company which was a giant and pioneer in its time but since fallen into hard times. I was part of interviewing an engineer from Johns Hopkins. My job was to take him out to lunch with another guy. This interviewee was totally the party boy at the lunch, trying to flirt with the waitress, calling them "hot" and making weird noises like "oooohhhhh woweeee... did you see her? maaaaan!" when one of them walked by. Totally inappropriate interview behavior.

I was new to the workforce and this behavior shocked me at that time.

that was 25+ years ago. With that behavior, I won't be surprised if he is now CEO somewhere....

Cromagnum said:

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Gotta love companies that you apply to because you check every single requirement, and every single nice to have, only to have them auto-reject you, and then repost the job a few weeks later. I doubt its a fake job because its Eli Lilly, so I suspect they are unicorn hunting.

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What makes you think EL won't post fake jobs? They ALL do. I applied to Relativity and thought I'd give it a try so I even adjusted my resume to match EXACTLY what they were looking. I actually spent the time to do so.

Not even a call. Rejected right away. I can't think of someone having a better match than I put forth for that job. I was okay not getting the job but I wanted to see if I could get a call.


All companies put out fake jobs.

infinity ag said:

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Cromagnum said:

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Gotta love companies that you apply to because you check every single requirement, and every single nice to have, only to have them auto-reject you, and then repost the job a few weeks later. I doubt its a fake job because its Eli Lilly, so I suspect they are unicorn hunting.

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What makes you think EL won't post fake jobs? They ALL do. I applied to Relativity and thought I'd give it a try so I even adjusted my resume to match EXACTLY what they were looking. I actually spent the time to do so.

Not even a call. Rejected right away. I can't think of someone having a better match than I put forth for that job. I was okay not getting the job but I wanted to see if I could get a call.


All companies put out fake jobs.

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Why though? The only thing it accomplishes is making a lot of people hate that company. I will likely never apply to Lilly again.

infinity ag said:

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Cepe said:

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I've been on the job hunt since October.

The first job I applied to I went through a series of interviews - 7 in total over a 6 week period. I prepared like taking an exam because I hadn't interviewed in years. The questions were read straight out of the behavior question packets. The interviewers were either disinterested because they were filler interviews or like talking to a wall. They told me I made it to the final decision point and went with someone else. Then, 3 months later I see the job is reposted so I contact the recruiter to let them know I'm still interested and he tells me I'm not allowed to reapply because I wouldn't be considered since I was declined the first time.

Second interview with the same company for a different role - hiring manager stops midway to answer texts and the proceeds to say "I'm not really supposed to ask this - but when are you going to retire?" Believe me, age discrimination is a real thing.

I went through 3 rounds with Google, which was interesting, but I'm not Google-y enough I guess.

Most recently, I finished 5 rounds with a company looking to go public. Interviews with the leadership team members went great and everyone was optimistic. Final was with the CEO and he was a total ass from start to finish - lasted 20 minutes. The next morning I see they've reposted the job on LinkedIn with the same responsibilities at a lower grade title. I never heard back from them at all after that. I was pretty honest during the interviews what I saw that needed to be done at this point in their plan rather than overly sugar coating it. As Lou Brown says in Major League "I'm too old to go diving into showers." I think the LT appreciated it because they see it too but the CEO just wants his pay day.

It's been interesting for sure. It's amazing that some of the interviewers act like HOA board members because they know they hold your future in their hands. But, I'll keep plugging away.

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You were probably just someone they had to checkmark as a US citizen before they went overseas and hired an H1B.
Happened to me several times.

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Bringing this back up because my first 2 stories were Lilly. I'd add that the 7 interviews were 2 phone screens and then 5 interviews on 5 straight days - one each day. Took up a full week. I'm not sure how someone with a job could actually even go through that.

They're building a big facility out by Bush airport so anyone interviewing with them should go into it with open eyes I think.

Cromagnum said:

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infinity ag said:

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Cromagnum said:

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Gotta love companies that you apply to because you check every single requirement, and every single nice to have, only to have them auto-reject you, and then repost the job a few weeks later. I doubt its a fake job because its Eli Lilly, so I suspect they are unicorn hunting.

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What makes you think EL won't post fake jobs? They ALL do. I applied to Relativity and thought I'd give it a try so I even adjusted my resume to match EXACTLY what they were looking. I actually spent the time to do so.

Not even a call. Rejected right away. I can't think of someone having a better match than I put forth for that job. I was okay not getting the job but I wanted to see if I could get a call.


All companies put out fake jobs.

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Why though? The only thing it accomplishes is making a lot of people hate that company. I will likely never apply to Lilly again.

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Everything today is investor/Wall Street based. That is why I keep advising people to invest, not just work in a corporate job.

Reasons?

1. If you are an investor and looking to invest in Eli Lilly, would you be happy if you poked around their website and saw zero jobs? No. If you saw 100s of jobs in all countries that would make you feel good about investing in EL.

2. For H1B purposes. What many people don't know is that a company can hire an H1B only if the company can "prove" that a US citizen was not available with those skills. How can this be shown? It is very wishy-washy. USDOL just wants the company to interview a few (3?) US citizens. So they do it, they call you and I and waste our time and promptly reject us and the next thing they do is file for a H1B.

3. Fake jobs cost them almost nothing. They just have to put it on their website, and many are regurgitated jobs with different titles and job numbers. I have seen this myself where the top title is different from the title in the description. They just need to farm it out to Linkedin, Ziprecruiter and other outlets so they need subscriptions for those but that is about it. There is no legal requirement of needing to interview even one person.

4. Build a database for the future. When they put out jobs when the jobs don't exist, people apply. Lots of good qualified people. They all get rejections. But the resume remains with EL and when things turn, they have a ready database for a particular skill and the recruiter can contact them directly asking if they are available.

I am sure there are other reasons too. And they don't care if you hate them. They have an unending supply of labor because they paid the politicians to allow H1B and offshoring. They don't need you or I. Corporations have manipulated things so that everything works in their favor and we have to play along. If they fail, we bail them out. Good deal for them.

And you will apply to EL even you hate them. I did. During COVID time I was with a large heavy equipment company. I hated them, they treated me poorly and I left. In Jan I saw a very good job that fit me and I applied. I got a call, I interviewed with the hiring manager and I think it went well. He told me that he is interviewing other candidates also so to be patient, it could take 2 weeks. I spoke to him on 10 Mar and I should get a reject or be moved to the next round next week. Their portal still says "In Process". I started a new job this past week so i am not desperate. However my current job is very low in salary but promises to be good work.


This is what EL's current job site looks like. Impressive. Things are happening there! (or so it seems)
164 jobs in R&D! But don't count on getting a call back. If they call you, you are likely to get a reject even if the interview goes well.
https://careers.lilly.com/us/en/

AustinAg2K said:

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infinity ag said:

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I recently interviewed with a large credit card company for a product position. They gave me 3 products of theirs to research on and do a case interview. They would pick any one on interview day. I spend 10 days preparing, used ChatGPT to be my interviewer etc etc. The interview actually went well overall. But I got a reject. Then I see the job renewed in LinkedIn.
Surely they are up to something. I don't even know if the interviewer passed me but someone above him could have rejected me. He did take notes on my product ideas.
What's in your wallet?

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That position doesn't exist. I interviewed with the same "What's in your wallet?" company a few months ago. I applied for a lead engineer position, and I went through five rounds of interviews. After the last interview, the recruiter told me, "Good news! You've passed all of our interviews! We'll let you know when we have an opening." WTF? You don't have an opening? What did I apply for? The job keeps getting closed and reopened on their career site. I don't know why they do it, but they are perpetually interviewing for positions that don't really exist. I assume they do it, so they will already have a list of names they can call quickly if a position does open, but that's just a guess on my part. All I know is that they wasted a lot of my time (and I'm sure other people's, too).

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Just saw this which tells the story!
I applied in Jan, they called me, set me up for a "case interview", I prepped for 2 weeks, interviewer was 15 years younger, interview went well, then.... reject! No reason given. My 25 years of experience and last 7 years of shipping AI/ML products and graduate engg degree (A&M) and a top 5 MBA does not matter to them. Now they repost the same job today!

Forget hiring me, they couldn't find anyone in America to do the job in the 2+ months they've spent looking?

Now this will soon go into the H1B bin with "no skills in America, we need to get a genius from India!".



These corporations need to be investigated.

I must add that the recruiter lady called me up a week after the rejection to tell me not to worry, my skills are a good match, and to apply again in 6 months. Hmm. She likely knows that right now they are just screwing around.

Use AI to help you get started and outline slides. Also, to the question below, AI can probably help you drill into the details that would make you plan relevant. It sucks to have to put on the work with no guaranteed return, but that's business. The company is making a big bet on the hire, and if someone has already outlined exactly how they'll deliver results, can you blame the company for wanting to see the same from another candidate?

I feel you though, just did the exact same thing over the he Christmas holiday while I was in PTO with family in Colorado. I can say this though, the work paid off.

Used the heck out of AI.