I'm in the secondary market for mortgages world.

Cyp0111 said:

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RSU are almost always staggered and vest over a period of time.

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Our RSU's and PSU's vest after 3 years and our SARS vest 1/3, 1/3, 1/3.

2 engineering degrees from A&M - undergrad and grad - graduated 10 years ago

Got an MBA in Boston a few years later.

Take home around $400k now - broke $200k after MBA. Was low to mid $100ks before.

Just kept hustling and networking. Now into entrepreneurship. I attend a lot of conference in my field of clean energy and I try to network with the power players. Never know what deals or opportunities arise.

Keep hustling: never take your foot off the gas. Always keep making new relationships and meeting new people. Doors will open. Attend a lot of conferences in your field.

Also I work a lot but still make time for my health, kids, wife, family etc. But I rarely find time for leisure. Trade offs I suppose?

I have a finance BBA and an MBA with finance emphasis. The education got me in the door, but I've always been in commercial work my entire career and have never been in a "finance" job. That has helped.

I also work for a major if that makes a difference. As far as compensation, I'm out of the $200s completely and am now into the $300s.

RangerRick9211 said:

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AgLA06 said:

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Thunderstruck xx said:

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RangerRick9211 said:

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Bring the hate, but consulting is easy money. You have some dues coming out of B-school, but I've been in coast mode for a few years now. You just have to find the right client, make middle management and never, ever climb the ladder.

PwC is a cohort model and their folks always crowdsource their new comp to reverse engineer the pay structure across ranks/city/tier (performance). It's pretty similar and a good proxy for other firms.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/u/0/d/1p82A0ORFPWb6pHMv0LFKzM4FClvFoDQ8HsNTEZkXtKQ/htmlview#gid=1642874993

For reference, a new MBA grad will enter as a SA2 ($193k) with a sign of $60 and a perf (Tier 1) target of 30%. Total all-in for a fresh hire is $310k for that year. It does go down next year as sign is a one off.

For me, 36, "Manager 2" equivalent in the sheet and it's pretty close. $220 base and a consistent Tier 2 performer (40%). I do nothing beyond my client role with no desire to move up. I have, and will continue to bounce between firms to remain a "Manager."

You won't hire into S&/EYP/Deloitte Strat without MBA on-campus pipeline. But I know plenty of ex-engineers within my firm that do advisory work without an MBA. Their pay is slightly below ours, but it's still great and the ceiling is the same as mine (all comp aligns at Partner across a firm).

Once you know the game, the gig is easy, criminally easy.

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Consulting in which industry? And why do you never want to climb the ladder?

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I hope he comes back to expand more, but I have a close friend that is a partner at a big 4. Planned their entire life / career to get to this point at 40.

They won't admit it, but I think they ultimately regret it. They went from making very good money, slightly above average time commitment, and managing actual meaningful work to ridicules time commitment chasing business and ridiculous money.

At some point it changes from being good at your job executing / managing work to basically being sales focused to bring in money to get your numbers / billable hours as a partner. And all the additional happy hours, business entertainment, travel, and account management that comes with it in addition to the previous responsibilities.

It's not surprising that the divorce rate / substance abuse rate is high among consulting partners.

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Yo, M&A in energy. CIVE > MBA > M&A. I do integration / separation execution. I don't touch diligence or strategy.

Big 4 primer,

• Associates / Staff = Undergrad hires. Life sucks for them.
• Senior = Can be promoted undergrad hire; entry for MBA campus hires (different pay cohort, though). Life generally sucks for them as well. Typical consulting experience: told what, where and how. Minimal voice and delegation.
• Manager = Typically own a single client / workstream and have a team to delegate work. More voice, more maneuverability and more control over type of work. IMPORTANLY, your performance is still governed by utilization, not rev or sales. Expectation is to above-and-beyond sales to justify a promotion, but it's not mandatory. So, I don't do anything beyond client work, because...
• Director/Senior Manger = **** sandwich. Multiple clients, multiple teams = multiple messy humans and needs. PPMDs pass all the internal and client crap to you. Worst hours, most pressure and you slave away for 4-6 years playing the internal politics game to get Partnership. You're judged by sales and managed rev.
• PPMD = Lot's of money (median ~$1m for my practice), terrible hours and A-game everyday. Better hours than Director/SM, though.

Net, I make plenty and have an excellent WLB and minimal work stress. I have a lot outside of work (dad, skiing, MTB / gravel racing) and I'd rather spend my time there. We're nearing FI (4-5 years away hopefully) and I plan to eventually downshift. So career advancement is in my rearview.

Said simply, I'm at the point in my life where I've turned Team's notifications off on my phone. I could not do that as a Senior or a Director. Solid middle-management, ftw.

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Subtle differences from firm to firm, but can confirm that life as an SM/Director is truly awful some weeks (My clients still know my phone is off on weekends, so it isn't that bad)... I have four active clients and am managing relationships across several others to co time to build pipeline and maintain 3-4 active engagements at any one time. But base comp is a hair under 300 with total much higher.

I enjoy the work actually. I spent ~3 years as a CFO of a lower middle-market firm as a break, and some of that so so damn dull. Back in Consulting, finding Managers who own **** independently and don't need to be babysat is critical to success. The fun part is always having a new problem to tackle.

Thankfully I don't do the tech/ERP consulting, same system for 4 years type of thing. Nothing wrong with that but I equate it to building (and then rebuilding) a highway for your entire life. I prefer the custom home/custom commercial type of route (strategy/M&A consulting)

do you require a cpa in your outfit or would an mba fit?

Agsquatch said:

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do you require a cpa in your outfit or would an mba fit?

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Not the person you asked but am an SM.

Consulting is different background from Tax/Audit/Accounting. CPA definitely not required and would honestly be an odd fit in consulting.

I don't have an MBA and only about half of my colleagues do.

That's actually surprising to hear. My wife / all her fam are big4 CPAs so I'm intimately familiar with the audit side.

I don't have MBA but can return emails and commit to what I say I'm gonna do, which is better than 90% of their associates this year.

If you or your team ever has an opening I'd love to talk about it.

We have quite a few "reformed CPAs" as I call them in our group, but mostly just MBA or industry experience. The CPAs we have are typically in our transaction advisory group (FDD, etc.) or are involved in implementing financial systems--I am in neither. You typically need some function/topic where you are considered an "expert" and have a 30 second speech or single paragraph blurb that will jump off the page to a client.

VERY difficult to be successful being hired into the SM/Director level, mostly due to internal politics and networking needed to hit your sales targets. Some direct hires happen into the Manager level, but most non-consulting people direct hire into a staff level where you are an IC or lead a very small team on one part of a project.

As for other openings, it's completely dependent on skillset and experience. We don't have a lot of openings currently. In fact, my group specifically is on a hiring freeze. But other groups are always hiring.

Shoot me a PM.

tamuags08 said:

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Agsquatch said:

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do you require a cpa in your outfit or would an mba fit?

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Not the person you asked but am an SM.

Consulting is different background from Tax/Audit/Accounting. CPA definitely not required and would honestly be an odd fit in consulting.

I don't have an MBA and only about half of my colleagues do.

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It totally depends.

I work with many CPAs (transfer from Audit/Tax to consulting) that do pre-sign financial due-diligence (FDD), deal structuring, equity advisory, deal valuations, regulation analysis, etc. Almost a guaranteed requirement.

My team, M&A execution, we hire undergrads and MBA through fixed pipelines. Very limited hiring outside of those avenues. Other advisory teams hire strictly from industry and have specific credential requirements / or none at all.

I will add entry impacts trajectory. Again, PwC's salary sheet (just Google it) can provide some insight. Just using my anecdote: entry through MBA pipeline is ~$30k higher base and ~20% higher bonus ceiling. That can net to almost a six-figure difference between experience hire vs. MBA entry (not including OCR sign as well) for the same rank. Just my anecdote, but it should proxy for EY vs. EYP, PwC vs. S&, Deloitte vs. D-Strat. You can certainly get hired without anything, but you'll do the same BS for a lot less than others and they will scale quicker (higher starting point).

Or there's other shops for different niche / comp approach. A&M is famous for MBB+ comp with their bonus structure and eat-what-you-kill culture. I still keep my PE license active just in case I need a fall back and FTI recruiters email me every now and them about their forensics teams? No idea, but if something exist in this universe there's a consultant trying to bill hours to make it worse. You just have to find that team.

Buck Compton said:

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VERY difficult to be successful being hired into the SM/Director level, mostly due to internal politics and networking needed to hit your sales targets. Some direct hires happen into the Manager level, but most non-consulting people direct hire into a staff level where you are an IC or lead a very small team on one part of a project.

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Super agree with this. I spent 13 years in industry prior to joining consulting at the manager level. I can't imagine how I'd have succeeded as a direct admit into SM/director.

Sure there's significant leadership experience that can be ported over but there is tons of nuances of how to navigate the firm, pricing strategies, having an internal group of contacts to help with things, etc etc