Astroag said:
ea1060 said:
Astroag said:
ea1060 said:
Milwaukees Best Light said:
Don't play games with them. They ask what you are looking for, you say I was making X at my last job and would like to be in that neighborhood. Tell them you understand conditions have changed recently any you understand that it might affect the salary.
No sense jerking each other around. If the job is really two notches below where you should be, you really will leave asap. Don't be a jerk and just be real. Most of them will appreciate you being frank and up front. You aren't going to out coy a half decent pro at this.
This is the best advice on this thread. All of the playing coy advice and not giving them a number first is bad advice, it will just make them think you're hiding something. Just be upfront with them and say I'm looking for something in this Range, or I was making x at my last company. You don't have much leverage since you're unemployed at the moment.
I was in this same situation recently. I was upfront and told them I was making X at my last company and I am looking for something in that range, but I am negotiable and salary isn't everything. If you want to Have more leverage then get multiple offers from other companies, then you will be in a position to negotiate better.
Disagree 1000% percent. They should tell you what they are willing to pay. What I made at my last roles is in no way relevant to this role. It assumes the roles and companies are the same as well as my circumstances when I was at the previous company. If you give them a range expect to see a number at or near the bottom of the range.
I work in HR and have worked for some of the biggest companies in the world. I've probably hired over 1000 people in my career. But hey what do I know right lol!
Your advice of making the company say a number first might work for a gainfully employed and well paid individual, but for the OP who is unemployed it might not make as much sense. I've dealt with candidates who refused to tell me what salary they were looking for and trust me it's a huge turnoff to everyone involved in the hiring process.
1. Telling them what you think a particular role should be compensated at and what you made at your last role are two completely different things.
2. HR is supposed to be the SME in the space, why wouldn't you tell the applicant what the market says the role is worth?
3. Your implication that its fine to pay someone less than the market because they are unemployed is pretty disappointing
4. I think the fact that its a turnoff when someone expects a hiring/comp SME to lead a conversation on hiring/comp speaks more about HR than it does about the applicant
Just my .02
HR is never gonna be able to quantify and value all of your experience properly because of how bespoke it is. And I'll say it again: nobody pays for the role that you do... they pay for the experience and skills that you bring to the table. Case in point: a Fortune 500 company would never hire an undergrad to the c-suite to save a dime.
End of the day, managers (not HR) are nearly always incentivized for their own deliverables and priorities. As a hiring manager, I don't get bonuses or accolades if somebody comes and works for my team for 20k lower than average or whatever. And I'm disincentivized to bring anybody in lower than market because I'll just lose the resource if they are worth a damn pretty quickly.
So... think about that. If I select you and you've given me no numbers to shoot for and are just asking me to guess, you are right... I'm probably just asking HR to run comps and send you an offer. Knowing that they are highly likely to not fully value your bespoke skillset, you are just setting yourself up for a crappy offer. Now, the other side of this is if you tell me a range or number (hell make the low end the floor of what would make you move assuming your same benefits), you've given me as a manager something actionable to get a deal done... I can either get you what your are asking or not... but at least you've got somebody who is personally incentivized and vested in your hire actioning your asks vs. HR who almost for sure commodicizes your skillset a hell of a lot more.
That's why not telling a company what you want upfront is really not great negotiating.