Southern Arizona is full of illegals walking through just as harsh an environment.

1981 Monte Carlo said:

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Ducks4brkfast said:

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lb3 said:

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Did nobody read the link? It's talking about a 'smart wall'. Which means a mix of roads, surveillance technology, floating obstacles, bollards, etc.

Until they release the actual plan, there is nothing to get riled up about. All they did is redesignate Big Bend from a technology only zone to a 'smart wall' zone.

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Correct, and the "smart wall" literally incorporates their bollard wall, that looks like this.

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Would pretty much ruin one of my favorite golf courses.



Par'd the above hole btw.

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"Bogie at 12 O'Clock!"

Senator Blutarski said:

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I can sort of understand some form of wall in the desert of NM, AZ, and CA.

But along a river, it can't be built in the flood plain, so you end up with a DMZ where someone can still cross over and give birth, ask for asylum, commit a crime, etc. Meanwhile, the wall cuts Americans off from the river, cuts wildlife from the river, creates a flood hazard (either from the Rio Grande or the many small streams that feed into it).

The wall, along with 150 feet on each side of it for maintenance, patrol, and security zone, plus lights, cameras, and vehicles running up and down, absolutely tramples on private property rights. The border patrol has always had the right to enter land within 25 miles of the river. And as much of a nuisance as that could be, at least it was your land. The wall is taking that land from families that have owned it for generations. This won't be done with a normal eminent domain process, which is bad enough. The feds are setting up to use the Declaration of Taking so that they just have to put their estimate of value aside and then they can take your land and start construction immediately - all they need is a federal judge to sign the order.

Most illegal immigration stems from people overstaying their visas. Most drugs come across via a bridge. Trump's policies in the last year have clearly demonstrated that enforcing our current laws is more effective than spending billions on a wall. The physical wall in Texas is nothing more than political theatre.

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What you've described is the federal land acquisition process that they do all the time. It's not unusual as far as the feds are concerned. It is very different than what the state does.

torrid said:

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And quite frankly, this is textbook Trump trolling designed to get people worked up.

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I've seen a list of ranches that would be impacted by this, and people are gearing up for the acquisition work, so it's highly likely we're way past trolling at this point.

I've hiked the Bend since the late 70's and I can assure you crossings occur there frequently. They have only increased since other parts of the border have been closed judging from the quantity of trash printed in Spanish that I find in the north/south draws, especially on the east side of the park. That said, there are exactly two paved roads into and out of the park with checkpoints that were not full-time manned during the last administration. That changed under this administration. While I think those should be enough, I don't KNOW that they are. Those that DO know are hopefully part of this decision making process.

Correct, we are past "trolling" and moving into the eye-wateringly expensive, political theatre, boondogle phase. Perhaps the federal government does things this way - now in my best "A Time To Kill" voice, close your eyes and imagine it's happening in your own back yard, for something that is of very questionable effectiveness and necessity.

Title is fake news. A map proposing the idea has been updated to include a wall. And it's not in the ideal tourist spots like Santa Elena canyon.

HTownAg98 said:

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Explain how putting a wall here would be useful. Juan isn't jumping across that river.

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. I literally swam across that very point 3 years ago on Spring Break.

Who is building it? Texas or Feds?

Jbob04 said:

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So we only want a wall in some places but not the pretty ones? Y'all need to be more consistent

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Okay, how about

Quote:

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We only want a wall in places with high illegal traffic, and that will be effective in slowing that traffic.

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I'm pretty consistent on that.

1981 Monte Carlo said:

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ETFan said:

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Having hiked across the entire desert of Big Bend.... this is ****ing insanity.

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A wall is stupid, still not as insane as many of the things your party believes and supports, but dumb nonetheless. I personally think Big Bend would be a GREAT place to smuggle drugs in though. That's why they have these down there I presume. For this region, we should be relying on technology and gadgets, not wasteful spending on wall.

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When my brother and I got picked up by Border Patrol back in May 2024, they said that spotted us with a balloon 1 hour before they stopped us.

They said that could see where we were going and knew there was only one way out. So... they had time to get a cup of coffee and wait for us.

ETFan said:

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Ol_Ag_02 said:

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Sid Farkas said:

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Tea Party said:

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Sid Farkas said:

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Ol_Ag_02 said:

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Sid Farkas said:

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KerrAg76 said:

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I've walked across that border and back a couple times. I've seen plenty of border crossers there.

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Watch it...Users with TDS will drive by on the way to the ICE riots and tell you you're embarrassing yourself.

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When was the last time you went to Big Bend and made it down to the Rio Grande?

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The price of tea in China bro.

The cost of security isn't 'free'.

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"Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."

-Benjamin Franklin

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Yes, but have you gone to Big Bend and made it down the Rio Grande? because that humblebrag trumps all logic.

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Illegal border crossings and drug smuggling occasionally occur in Big Bend National Park, but the area historically has the fewest crossings of any U.S. Border Patrol sector due to its remote, rugged terrain and lack of water.

That's a quote from the NPS.

You must be exhausted from that giant hole you're digging.

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To this point; the park Rangers made me sign my 8 day back country permit as "Against ranger advice", explicitly because of the water situation out there.

They only let me go because I had paper maps with every single spring in the park mapped with a legend of "likely to have water"

It's inhospitable out there. Anyone who crosses there is welcome, as far as I'm concerned.

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When I was out there in December 2023, we encountered some cyclists south of the Black Gap trail who had no idea what they had gotten into.

They were very grateful for the water I gave them because they were 10 miles from the nearest road and had been out of water for a while.

Just because you survive a difficult border crossing doesn't make you welcome. Unless you mean welcome to go back wherever you came from.

MouthBQ98 said:

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Have you been there? I've been there and driven the river road and interior roads.

There is NO WAY a major smuggling or crossing operation can be conducted.


There is no bridge. There is one crossing to an extremely isolated tiny border town, by burro or a little boat. No vehicle crossing at all. I mean it might be 500 people there in Boquillas. The park roads along the river are all jeep trails except at 2 locations: the rio grange village campground, and near the Castolon center. The paved roads are very few and there is only 2 ways in or out of the park: long isolated 2 lane blacktops that would be extremely easy to monitor. There are a a couple of extremely rough offroad jeep trails on the east side of the park but very inefficient for transport.

On the south side of the river is virtually nothing but open rough desert and mountain country. No major roads, nothing.

It's literally the worse possible route to take to disguise any volume of unlawful traffic. Anything substantial would immediately stick out with just a few cameras placed at the right locations.

It's a really dumb and wasteful idea to fence it unless substantial overland traffic is detected somehow.


Over in presidio, maybe I could see it, but the entire area is very rough terrain and very inhospitable and any buildup of infrastructure to facilitate illegal activity would stick out right away.

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I wouldn't underestimate the Cartels, they will try anything to make money. In the late 90s/ early 2000s they had a drug traffic Route all the way from the border to Phoenix, all dirt/ rugged trails the whole way. Some really rough country..They used a ramp truck to drive All Terrain vehicles over the border wall...It stuck out like a sore thumb and they got caught, but only after officials here had investigated them for years and let them traffic drugs for years so they could figure out who all was involved on this side of the border.

MouthBQ98 said:

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Stupid, wasteful, and useless there. There simply are not illegal crossings in big bend due to the extreme isolation. This is really really dumb and someone needs to tell the administration this bluntly

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This is false. I've seen the evidence in person with my own eyes. Piles and piles of garbage strewn through some of the most inhospitable (and formerly pristine) land on this planet. Eroded river banks and thousands of dried, muddy footprints.

Love it or hate it, claiming there's no illegal crossing in the park is simply not true.

Ol_Ag_02 said:

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Sid Farkas said:

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HTownAg98 said:

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Explain how putting a wall here would be useful. Juan isn't jumping across that river.

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Feel free to side with Mother Jones and AOC on the issue based on a headline.

I'll stick with the Trump admin until further notice.

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I'm always amazed when people are confronted with evidence that proves their point of view is wrong and instead of thinking thoughtfully about their beliefs they just stick their fingers in their ears and makes loud noises.

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Are people aware that a lot of Big Bend and the Rio Grande is open/relatively flat ground, not deep canyons? Pulling one picture from the internet to represent the entire region, then claiming everyone else is ignorant is, well, ignorant.

HollywoodBQ said:

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1981 Monte Carlo said:

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ETFan said:

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Having hiked across the entire desert of Big Bend.... this is ****ing insanity.

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A wall is stupid, still not as insane as many of the things your party believes and supports, but dumb nonetheless. I personally think Big Bend would be a GREAT place to smuggle drugs in though. That's why they have these down there I presume. For this region, we should be relying on technology and gadgets, not wasteful spending on wall.

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When my brother and I got picked up by Border Patrol back in May 2024, they said that spotted us with a balloon 1 hour before they stopped us.

They said that could see where we were going and knew there was only one way out. So... they had time to get a cup of coffee and wait for us.

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Ha yep, those things are incredible

P.H. Dexippus said:

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Ol_Ag_02 said:

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Sid Farkas said:

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HTownAg98 said:

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Explain how putting a wall here would be useful. Juan isn't jumping across that river.

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Feel free to side with Mother Jones and AOC on the issue based on a headline.

I'll stick with the Trump admin until further notice.

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I'm always amazed when people are confronted with evidence that proves their point of view is wrong and instead of thinking thoughtfully about their beliefs they just stick their fingers in their ears and makes loud noises.

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Are people aware that a lot of Big Bend and the Rio Grande is open/relatively flat ground, not deep canyons? Pulling one picture from the internet to represent the entire region, then claiming everyone else is ignorant is, well, ignorant.

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Yes. We're very aware that it's not all canyons. Just 100 miles of desert going north filled with rattlesnakes, cactus, no water, heavily armed ranchers, and only two roads going that are manned by BP.

As I posted earlier. The Big Bend sector is the least trafficked sector on the border. If they want to throw up some digital border protection then I'm all for it. But anything like bollards is unneeded and a hard pass.

As many times as I've bee there in the backcountry I've never seen one illegal or even evidence of one. Are there some going through the park, of course, but it's literally the most unsafe place in the US Border to try and make a crossing.

The only place I've seen Mexicans in the park is on the boquillas side where they'll ride their horses across the river to retrieve their livestock or the ones that come daily to set up blankets to sell trinkets. And the BP and NPS all seemed to know and interact with them. Hell theres probably families from Boquillas that have been doing that for fifty years.

Extremely bad trump. Not only would this be a collosal waste of money, but also would ruin one of the most isolated places in the our country that is fairly accessible to texans. Major thumbs down.

Also, If a illegal somehow manages to survive that trek on foot they must have some sort of aptitude and might be a plus to the state. It would take a Herculean, bear gryllas effort to get through that area with limited supplies.

This. If Pedro is tough and resilient enough to hike across Big Bend and survive I say that is the kind of hardworking amigo we should welcome. Instant citizenship.

Sure there might be a few drugs smuggled over once in a while, but building a wall anywhere in Big Bend country is like squashing a single sugar ant in your kitchen while your entire lawn is infested with fire ants.

Stupid Trump.

I agree its the last place in TX that needs a vertical barrier wall and thats coming from someone who has conducted multiple operations with BP out there. One in particular 3 of us hiked 6ea 700 amp car batteries, solar cells, Stano gear, weapons, etc almost 3 miles from infil. Spent 10 days in hell going through a vicious cycle of hide from the sun while praying for night, until night came and the mosquitoes got us until, it froze then, we prayed for sun. In 10 days saw only fainting goats and coyotes. Not one ROW or smuggler. Most miserable operation I have ever been on.

That said good chance we will be doing the design build bridges on that project, like it or not, I will earn that GOV money, which will be hell in the making compared to the taking in minnesota by terrorists.

I'll be happy when the wall runs from Tijuana to Matamoros. Until then we don't really have a border with Mexico because Mexico will not enforce their border and the US doesn't have the ability to police over 1900 miles in its current state. There is a compromise I would be willing to consider instead of a wall, armed man towers placed with line of sight to the next tower, and manned with snipers 24/7/365, with USA beneficial rules of engagement.

The nimby ITT is strong

According to CPB, border crossing are down 74% over the past two years(3100 last year)

Is a wall really needed here ?

https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/local-media-release/illegal-border-crossings-big-bend-sector-fall-significantly-fy-2025

nai06 said:

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According to CPB, border crossing are down 74% over the past two years(3100 last year)

Is a wall really needed here ?

https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/local-media-release/illegal-border-crossings-big-bend-sector-fall-significantly-fy-2025

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So in past years apprehensions were roughly the size of the population of Bastrop or Fredericksberg and now they have fallen to roughly the population of Schulenburg or San Saba and we should be good with that because that doesn't indicate there is still a huge a problem?

How much are you willing to spend to get those last few? It would be cheaper to just fly the ones we do catch to Venezuela so they don't retry.

It has been estimated to cost $50-70 billion to complete the entire wall. I am ok with that since we increased SNAP spending by about $60-70 billion per year after 2019.

MouthBQ98 said:

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Stupid, wasteful, and useless there. There simply are not illegal crossings in big bend due to the extreme isolation. This is really really dumb and someone needs to tell the administration this bluntly

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It's plenty easy to cross in BB. Build that wall!

lb3 said:

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Did nobody read the link? It's talking about a 'smart wall'. Which means a mix of roads, surveillance technology, floating obstacles, bollards, etc.

Until they release the actual plan, there is nothing to get riled up about. All they did is redesignate Big Bend from a technology only zone to a 'smart wall' zone.

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Thank you for the clarification, much appreciated.

lb3 said:

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Ducks4brkfast said:

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lb3 said:

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Did nobody read the link? It's talking about a 'smart wall'. Which means a mix of roads, surveillance technology, floating obstacles, bollards, etc.

Until they release the actual plan, there is nothing to get riled up about. All they did is redesignate Big Bend from a technology only zone to a 'smart wall' zone.

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Correct, and the "smart wall" literally incorporates their bollard wall, that looks like this.

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It can incorporate a bollard wall like that. It can also be roads or technology.

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Some people haven't read the article and are making assumptions.
auote from the article

• On its website, CBP describes the Smart Wall as "comprised of a steel bollard wall or waterborne barrier, along with roads, detection technology, cameras and lighting and in some cases a secondary wall creating an enforcement zone."

Again thanks for the clarification.

Why don't we just cut to the chase here and just effing invade Mexico and return her to the actual good people in that country?

We're treating symptom after symptom yet the disease is only growing. Time to cut it out.

HollywoodBQ said:

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ETFan said:

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Ol_Ag_02 said:

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Sid Farkas said:

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Tea Party said:

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Sid Farkas said:

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Ol_Ag_02 said:

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Sid Farkas said:

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KerrAg76 said:

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I've walked across that border and back a couple times. I've seen plenty of border crossers there.

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Watch it...Users with TDS will drive by on the way to the ICE riots and tell you you're embarrassing yourself.

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When was the last time you went to Big Bend and made it down to the Rio Grande?

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The price of tea in China bro.

The cost of security isn't 'free'.

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"Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."

-Benjamin Franklin

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Yes, but have you gone to Big Bend and made it down the Rio Grande? because that humblebrag trumps all logic.

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Illegal border crossings and drug smuggling occasionally occur in Big Bend National Park, but the area historically has the fewest crossings of any U.S. Border Patrol sector due to its remote, rugged terrain and lack of water.

That's a quote from the NPS.

You must be exhausted from that giant hole you're digging.

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To this point; the park Rangers made me sign my 8 day back country permit as "Against ranger advice", explicitly because of the water situation out there.

They only let me go because I had paper maps with every single spring in the park mapped with a legend of "likely to have water"

It's inhospitable out there. Anyone who crosses there is welcome, as far as I'm concerned.

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When I was out there in December 2023, we encountered some cyclists south of the Black Gap trail who had no idea what they had gotten into.

They were very grateful for the water I gave them because they were 10 miles from the nearest road and had been out of water for a while.

Just because you survive a difficult border crossing doesn't make you welcome. Unless you mean welcome to go back wherever you came from.

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Similar story time, maybe you can appreciate since you'll know the spots. I was there in Jan/Feb of 2022 when that huge snow storm hit Texas doing a solo trek across the park.

I had gone from Sotol to the ranch house, partway around the loop, then a 3 day diagonal cut from there to Talley (2 days in the desert), down at the rio (drank some cancer water) then up the mariscal rim trail. Camped on top of mariscal. Followed the entire ridge back north. Then NW to catch back up to the outter loop.

Story starts, I meet a guy doing the loop, clockwise. We chat, he seems green but other than that, all good. I go on my way and get the news on my Garmin that night that weather has deteriorated. My 3 remaining days are now becoming "I need to leave". I camp at the base of Juniper and plan to go up and over, counter clockwise so I can see the rim and get back to my vehicle at Sotol.

It ends up being 18mi, 5k ft up, 5k ft down. Complete ass kicking. Get to the bear box at the ranch and I meet that guy again, he's contemplating finishing the loop. Brother. No. We talk and I end up giving him a ride back to the basin. Then drive through blowing snow until I have to stop in Midland and get a hotel for 2 days .. Fun times! Definitely some type 2 fun out there.

From on top of Mariscal:
https://imgur.com/a/kd41MWt

I'm not in favor of this but the article clearly says the wall would not be across Santa Elena canyon

Kozmozag said:

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Build the wall on mexicos side. No reason to build it on our side of the river.

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Trump only has 4 years, they should really concentrate on building as much border wall as they can in high traffic border crossing areas and fortifying existing walls in those areas...

Bottleneck situations like Big Bend where they may only have limited routes to travel across the border should be low priority and looked at last on the list..

Ramdiesel said:

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Trump only has 4 years, they should really concentrate on building as much border wall as they can in high traffic border crossing areas and fortifying existing walls in those areas...

Bottleneck situations like Big Bend where they may only have limited routes to travel across the border should be low priority and looked at last on the list..

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I am about to be involved in a couple if not more. There is wall slated to go up in Big Bend but to your point all the RFPs I have seen require Vertical Barrier to be complete by 1-1-28, other supporting work 8-1-28. In case idiots take over again.