ABATTBQ11 said:

---

deddog said:

---

Quote:

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As of September, Amazon, Meta and Microsoft were the three largest sponsors of H-1B workers

---

This is the real problem.
Instead of going after individuals, Trump needs to get after the companies doing this.

Sucks for people stuck, with family back in the US.

---

Base rate fallacy. Those are also some of the largest companies in the world and focused primarily on software and technology, so it would make sense they'd have really high counts. What you should really be looking for is percentage of workforce.

---

As someone that was in IT for approaching 20 yrs, no, it doesn't make sense.

There are plenty of us Americans that can do those jobs. And, again, having the experience I did, I know that these foreigners (in general) aren't the best and brightest in the first place. They're lackluster, at best.

Here's an idea, while you Indians are back home why don't you get involved and fix your country where you can earn a living over there.

Problem solved for everyone.

Here's a 2026 update.
Amazon (the biggest H1B scammer) hates Americans so much that it is okay with paying Indians to do nothing than pay an American a fair wage! Time for a big raid on Amazon and haul their execs to jail.


'H-1Bs sit on payroll while waiting…': US investor says Amazon's remote work policy 'doesn't actually let Indians do their jobs'
https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/world/us/h-1bs-sit-on-payroll-while-waiting-us-investor-says-amazons-remote-work-policy-doesnt-actually-let-indians-work/articleshow/126296137.cms
TOI World Desk / TIMESOFINDIA.COM / Updated: Jan 02, 2026, 07:43 IST

Quote:

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'H-1Bs sit on payroll while waiting…': US investor says Amazon's remote work policy 'doesn't actually let Indians do their jobs'

Amazon has introduced a temporary remote work policy for employees stranded in India due to H-1B visa delays, but the company's latest memo makes clear that these workers cannot actually perform most of their job functions. US investor and Ed-Tech chairman Hany Girgis weighed in on the situation on X, saying Amazon "found a workaround for H-1B visa delays. But he claimed that the idea doesn't actually let people work.

The memo outlines strict restrictions: employees cannot code, test, troubleshoot, make strategic decisions, interact with customers, negotiate contracts, or access Amazon buildings.

U.S. Rewrites H-1B Rules, Setback To Indian Workers; Check Who Is Eligible & Changes | WATCH
All final approvals and decisions must take place outside India. In short, employees can remain on payroll but cannot perform the work itself because the job must legally stay in the United States.


The memo was posted on Amazon's internal HR portal on December 17, and it allows affected employees in India as of December 13, 2025, to work remotely until March 2, 2026. Normally, Amazon requires employees to work five days a week in the office, but this is a temporary exception. The policy comes amid other bigger challenges of H-1B visa delays, which have been worsened by additional screening requirements, including social media, digital footprint checks made compulsory under the Trump administration.

Many consulates and embassies have postponed appointments by several months, leaving some employees unable to enter US. Companies including Google, Apple, and Microsoft have issued travel warnings to prevent employees from getting stranded abroad. For employees in technical roles, the restrictions severely limit their work, as most of their tasks involve coding, testing and deploying according to the Business Insider. Amazon is among the largest users of H-1B visas, with nearly 14,800 certified applications in the 2024 fiscal year, including 23 for Whole Foods.Girgis even asked why is US not still going 'America First' by hiring native Americans: "If the work must stay here, why doesn't the hiring?"

His comments come as MAGA bigwigs have urged the GOP government to permanently ban H1-Bs as they claim the programme unfairly steals jobs and opportunities from domestic American workers and gives them to foreign employees.

---

Amazon found a workaround for H-1B visa delays. It doesn’t actually let people work.

Amazon is letting visa workers stranded in India “work remotely” … but they’re not allowed to actually do the job.

Per the internal memo:
• No coding
• No testing or troubleshooting
• No… pic.twitter.com/pRWpDHtf8m

— Hany Girgis (@SanDiegoKnight) January 1, 2026

Malibu said:

---

I can feel sympathy for the plight of these folks as individuals. They made a life here, followed the process, and got screwed. There should have been more humanity in a process that ended this cleanly and not stranding people with no agency into a nightmare. That doesn't mean backfilling foreign labor for high skilled US jobs is a good policy. We could have both ended the policy and fairly allowed for people to make responsible plans for their future knowing it would sunset rather than marooning them away from their family and property.

---

The ones that are getting stranded are the ones who were living dangerously. For instance the guy who went back to India for a wedding. If you are on H-1 you know you better not leave the country without having your visa secured. I know folks who had the same thing happen prior to Trump, he has just made it even less lenient. They are giving people and companies time to adjust now and the writing is on the wall, those who choose to want to pretend things will be the same as they were Pre Trump are rolling the dice. If you are on H-1 or were planning to ride the F-1 to OPT to H-1 to Green Card path that so many have over the last couple decades you better really have your stuff together. You are going to see a lot of folks moving back to India or maybe Canada.

If they want to blame someone blame the thousands that abused the system.

Good Trump. The whole program needs to be shut down for a few years at minimum.

ts5641 said:

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Good Trump. The whole program needs to be shut down for a few years at minimum.

---

Well, hold your horses. The problem still exists. It may be looking positive right now and I hope aggie93 is correct. He is in recruiting so I trust his analysis.

The ideal thing would be to completely kill H1B and replace with another fool-proof program to get top talent. But maybe this is not possible legally. So Trump is squeezing H1B.

I just heard from a friend in Seattle who has contacts in Microsoft that they have asked their H1Bs to move to Canada or to India or they will get fired. It is possible Trump put in a phone call to Nadella and read him the riot-act. The biggest crooks are Amazon's Bezos and Jassy.

ABATTBQ11 said:

---

deddog said:

---

Quote:

---

As of September, Amazon, Meta and Microsoft were the three largest sponsors of H-1B workers

---

This is the real problem.
Instead of going after individuals, Trump needs to get after the companies doing this.

Sucks for people stuck, with family back in the US.

---

Base rate fallacy. Those are also some of the largest companies in the world and focused primarily on software and technology, so it would make sense they'd have really high counts. What you should really be looking for is percentage of workforce.

---

It does not make sense. They could hire Americans who already know how to do the job,.....tons of out of work Americans

samurai_science said:

---

ABATTBQ11 said:

---

deddog said:

---

Quote:

---

As of September, Amazon, Meta and Microsoft were the three largest sponsors of H-1B workers

---

This is the real problem.
Instead of going after individuals, Trump needs to get after the companies doing this.

Sucks for people stuck, with family back in the US.

---

Base rate fallacy. Those are also some of the largest companies in the world and focused primarily on software and technology, so it would make sense they'd have really high counts. What you should really be looking for is percentage of workforce.

---

It does not make sense. They could hire Americans who already know how to do the job,.....tons of out of work Americans

---

Yep

In my 20 yrs in IT, I rarely ran into an Indian/H1B that was worth the hassle versus hiring a US worker.

Hell, even US citizens, they had to hire 4 people in Tulsa to replace me in Iowa when they finally laid me off in 2016. Some of us 'Mericans ain't too shabby at that ciphering and **** . ;-)

samurai_science said:

---

ABATTBQ11 said:

---

deddog said:

---

Quote:

---

As of September, Amazon, Meta and Microsoft were the three largest sponsors of H-1B workers

---

This is the real problem.
Instead of going after individuals, Trump needs to get after the companies doing this.

Sucks for people stuck, with family back in the US.

---

Base rate fallacy. Those are also some of the largest companies in the world and focused primarily on software and technology, so it would make sense they'd have really high counts. What you should really be looking for is percentage of workforce.

---

It does not make sense. They could hire Americans who already know how to do the job,.....tons of out of work Americans

---

They could. But they don't.

Why not?
Because Indian H1Bs are cheap.

Are they cheap but better?
No.

Then why do companies hire them if their quality is not better?
Because they are subservient slave labor who do not ask questions.
They are cheaper so the C suite gets higher bonuses before the company goes to hell.

infinity ag said:

---

samurai_science said:

---

ABATTBQ11 said:

---

deddog said:

---

Quote:

---

As of September, Amazon, Meta and Microsoft were the three largest sponsors of H-1B workers

---

This is the real problem.
Instead of going after individuals, Trump needs to get after the companies doing this.

Sucks for people stuck, with family back in the US.

---

Base rate fallacy. Those are also some of the largest companies in the world and focused primarily on software and technology, so it would make sense they'd have really high counts. What you should really be looking for is percentage of workforce.

---

It does not make sense. They could hire Americans who already know how to do the job,.....tons of out of work Americans

---

Then why do companies hire them if their quality is not better?
Because they are subservient slave labor who do not ask questions.
They are cheaper so the C suite gets higher bonuses before the company goes to hell.

---

This part especially, they are true NPCs

I don't know what the cop is saying but looking at other sites, I understand that in some places in India they sell degrees, even PhD certificates for $350 and companies hire them and ship to America where gullible foolish Americans give them jobs and call them geniuses while replacing Americans with these people.

Imagine dropping 150K for a degree while companies around U are hiring international students who got theirs for $350.

Welcome to North America. 🇺🇸🇨🇦

pic.twitter.com/fndZ9kkHHm

— EconomicWoes 🤖 (@ManyBeenRinsed) January 2, 2026

infinity ag said:

---

samurai_science said:

---

ABATTBQ11 said:

---

deddog said:

---

Quote:

---

As of September, Amazon, Meta and Microsoft were the three largest sponsors of H-1B workers

---

This is the real problem.
Instead of going after individuals, Trump needs to get after the companies doing this.

Sucks for people stuck, with family back in the US.

---

Base rate fallacy. Those are also some of the largest companies in the world and focused primarily on software and technology, so it would make sense they'd have really high counts. What you should really be looking for is percentage of workforce.

---

It does not make sense. They could hire Americans who already know how to do the job,.....tons of out of work Americans

---

They could. But they don't.

Why not?
Because Indian H1Bs are cheap.

Are they cheap but better?
No.

Then why do companies hire them if their quality is not better?
Because they are subservient slave labor who do not ask questions.
They are cheaper so the C suite gets higher bonuses before the company goes to hell.

---

A lot of you don't understand one of the biggest reasons to have onshore resources vs offshore in tech. There is a giant tax credit for most of the work and accelerated deductions for the rest if the work is done onshore, even if it's by an H-1B. You can get the same resource doing the work in India vs doing it in California and you get a much bigger tax benefit in the US scenario. Most states also give a tax benefit (including Texas) for having that work done here.

The work can very easily be done by the Indian company in India, but the companies know it's better to do it here. So they look for the cheapest resource here. With H-1Bs, that can be the foreigner. Fix the incentives and you fix the problem. The cost of the application is just one piece.

Pinochet said:

---

infinity ag said:

---

samurai_science said:

---

ABATTBQ11 said:

---

deddog said:

---

Quote:

---

As of September, Amazon, Meta and Microsoft were the three largest sponsors of H-1B workers

---

This is the real problem.
Instead of going after individuals, Trump needs to get after the companies doing this.

Sucks for people stuck, with family back in the US.

---

Base rate fallacy. Those are also some of the largest companies in the world and focused primarily on software and technology, so it would make sense they'd have really high counts. What you should really be looking for is percentage of workforce.

---

It does not make sense. They could hire Americans who already know how to do the job,.....tons of out of work Americans

---

They could. But they don't.

Why not?
Because Indian H1Bs are cheap.

Are they cheap but better?
No.

Then why do companies hire them if their quality is not better?
Because they are subservient slave labor who do not ask questions.
They are cheaper so the C suite gets higher bonuses before the company goes to hell.

---

A lot of you don't understand one of the biggest reasons to have onshore resources vs offshore in tech. There is a giant tax credit for most of the work and accelerated deductions for the rest if the work is done onshore, even if it's by an H-1B. You can get the same resource doing the work in India vs doing it in California and you get a much bigger tax benefit in the US scenario. Most states also give a tax benefit (including Texas) for having that work done here.

The work can very easily be done by the Indian company in India, but the companies know it's better to do it here. So they look for the cheapest resource here. With H-1Bs, that can be the foreigner. Fix the incentives and you fix the problem. The cost of the application is just one piece.

---

I asked ChatGPT and according to it, while the incentives do exist to do work onshore, they are not "giant" in nature.

I agree that incentives need to be changed. That is what Trump did with tariffs and his 100k fee. He will do more to get the result he wants.

infinity ag said:

---

I don't know what the cop is saying but looking at other sites, I understand that in some places in India they sell degrees, even PhD certificates for $350 and companies hire them and ship to America where gullible foolish Americans give them jobs and call them geniuses while replacing Americans with these people.

---

That explains the one Indian maintenance tech my company hired as a tech3 (usually YEARS of experience) that turned out to not even understand things that would garner a tech1 spot.

This MENSA candidate came for a work order on one of my machines for the status lights being out, so he wiped the exterior cover. Lo and behold, the lights still didn't work. Called in another WO, and he did the same thing. Finally had to reach out to the maintenance mgr and explain that wiping the cover probably wasn't going to magically repair the filament in the bulb.

The thing that I puzzle over the most is would it really bankrupt a company so badly to hire American? You would think with American talent, the company would actually achieve more and win more business. The Indian drones just run the company into the ground and the csuite runs off with their winnings.

How do we promote the capitalistic side of the argument to hire Americans? Trump can only do so much on the legal side.

Did you reboot the machine? Ctrl-Alt-Delete is usually next level tech support. If that doesn't work, they will suggest you reformat the hard drive then call back.

flown-the-coop said:

---

Did you reboot the machine? Ctrl-Alt-Delete is usually next level tech support. If that doesn't work, they will suggest you reformat the hard drive then call back.

---

This was a Toyoda CNC machine. The light tower (red/yellow/green) on top of it was out. Turns out, they were out and needed replaced with .....****gasp**** new bulbs.

The guy is very nice, but not the sharpest bulb in the crayon box.

Madagascar said:

---

The thing that I puzzle over the most is would it really bankrupt a company so badly to hire American? You would think with American talent, the company would actually achieve more and win more business. The Indian drones just run the company into the ground and the csuite runs off with their winnings.

How do we promote the capitalistic side of the argument to hire Americans? Trump can only do so much on the legal side.

---

1) Gut the corporate hierarchy to where people "higher up" actually had to work.
2) What little hierarchy is left should be hired from within, hopefully ensuring the employment of people that actually understand the business. Protip, from experience: People with MBAs are usually less capable, from an intrinsic value aspect, if hired from outside with no industry experience.

3) Work to convince the BoDs to actual care about the long term health of the company, not just pumping it for a quick profit for their own pockets. <--- no idea how to do this

infinity ag said:

---

Pinochet said:

---

infinity ag said:

---

samurai_science said:

---

ABATTBQ11 said:

---

deddog said:

---

Quote:

---

As of September, Amazon, Meta and Microsoft were the three largest sponsors of H-1B workers

---

This is the real problem.
Instead of going after individuals, Trump needs to get after the companies doing this.

Sucks for people stuck, with family back in the US.

---

Base rate fallacy. Those are also some of the largest companies in the world and focused primarily on software and technology, so it would make sense they'd have really high counts. What you should really be looking for is percentage of workforce.

---

It does not make sense. They could hire Americans who already know how to do the job,.....tons of out of work Americans

---

They could. But they don't.

Why not?
Because Indian H1Bs are cheap.

Are they cheap but better?
No.

Then why do companies hire them if their quality is not better?
Because they are subservient slave labor who do not ask questions.
They are cheaper so the C suite gets higher bonuses before the company goes to hell.

---

A lot of you don't understand one of the biggest reasons to have onshore resources vs offshore in tech. There is a giant tax credit for most of the work and accelerated deductions for the rest if the work is done onshore, even if it's by an H-1B. You can get the same resource doing the work in India vs doing it in California and you get a much bigger tax benefit in the US scenario. Most states also give a tax benefit (including Texas) for having that work done here.

The work can very easily be done by the Indian company in India, but the companies know it's better to do it here. So they look for the cheapest resource here. With H-1Bs, that can be the foreigner. Fix the incentives and you fix the problem. The cost of the application is just one piece.

---

I asked ChatGPT and according to it, while the incentives do exist to do work onshore, they are not "giant" in nature.

I agree that incentives need to be changed. That is what Trump did with tariffs and his 100k fee. He will do more to get the result he wants.

---

They are giant. If you do the work offshore, you don't deduct the cost in the current year but have to amortize it over 10 years. The R&D tax credit is giant. It reduces the ETR of a lot of my client tech companies by half or more. That credit isn't available for expenditures made offshore. At no point did I say the $100k fee was a bad thing. I'm saying we need to fix the other issues. Maybe reduce QRE by H-1B salaries. Maybe amortize instead of immediately deduct H-1B salaries. Companies care about even temporary book tax differences when it impacts cash flow. PE cares almost exclusively about cash flow, so you have even bigger incentives there.

But hey, I'm glad you asked ChatGPT. The system that sucks at math and is trained on surface level internet things instead of actual experience that isn't published in articles probably knows best.

Pinochet said:

---

infinity ag said:

---

Pinochet said:

---

infinity ag said:

---

samurai_science said:

---

ABATTBQ11 said:

---

deddog said:

---

Quote:

---

As of September, Amazon, Meta and Microsoft were the three largest sponsors of H-1B workers

---

This is the real problem.
Instead of going after individuals, Trump needs to get after the companies doing this.

Sucks for people stuck, with family back in the US.

---

Base rate fallacy. Those are also some of the largest companies in the world and focused primarily on software and technology, so it would make sense they'd have really high counts. What you should really be looking for is percentage of workforce.

---

It does not make sense. They could hire Americans who already know how to do the job,.....tons of out of work Americans

---

They could. But they don't.

Why not?
Because Indian H1Bs are cheap.

Are they cheap but better?
No.

Then why do companies hire them if their quality is not better?
Because they are subservient slave labor who do not ask questions.
They are cheaper so the C suite gets higher bonuses before the company goes to hell.

---

A lot of you don't understand one of the biggest reasons to have onshore resources vs offshore in tech. There is a giant tax credit for most of the work and accelerated deductions for the rest if the work is done onshore, even if it's by an H-1B. You can get the same resource doing the work in India vs doing it in California and you get a much bigger tax benefit in the US scenario. Most states also give a tax benefit (including Texas) for having that work done here.

The work can very easily be done by the Indian company in India, but the companies know it's better to do it here. So they look for the cheapest resource here. With H-1Bs, that can be the foreigner. Fix the incentives and you fix the problem. The cost of the application is just one piece.

---

I asked ChatGPT and according to it, while the incentives do exist to do work onshore, they are not "giant" in nature.

I agree that incentives need to be changed. That is what Trump did with tariffs and his 100k fee. He will do more to get the result he wants.

---

They are giant. If you do the work offshore, you don't deduct the cost in the current year but have to amortize it over 10 years. The R&D tax credit is giant. It reduces the ETR of a lot of my client tech companies by half or more. That credit isn't available for expenditures made offshore. At no point did I say the $100k fee was a bad thing. I'm saying we need to fix the other issues. Maybe reduce QRE by H-1B salaries. Maybe amortize instead of immediately deduct H-1B salaries. Companies care about even temporary book tax differences when it impacts cash flow. PE cares almost exclusively about cash flow, so you have even bigger incentives there.

But hey, I'm glad you asked ChatGPT. The system that sucks at math and is trained on surface level internet things instead of actual experience that isn't published in articles probably knows best.

---

Dude, you need to calm down a bit.
I have a Masters degree in Engineering and an MBA in Finance. I can do math.
But if silly slights are your way of getting off, then go for it. I won't stand in your way.

ChatGPT is good for data collection from various places on the internet. You merely saying "giant" won't convince me. You need to show me numbers. I don't claim to know tax law so ChatGPT is a good source of information. I believe it more than I believe you anyway.

BigRobSA said:

---

Madagascar said:

---

The thing that I puzzle over the most is would it really bankrupt a company so badly to hire American? You would think with American talent, the company would actually achieve more and win more business. The Indian drones just run the company into the ground and the csuite runs off with their winnings.

How do we promote the capitalistic side of the argument to hire Americans? Trump can only do so much on the legal side.

---

1) Gut the corporate hierarchy to where people "higher up" actually had to work.
2) What little hierarchy is left should be hired from within, hopefully ensuring the employment of people that actually understand the business. Protip, from experience: People with MBAs are usually less capable, from an intrinsic value aspect, if hired from outside with no industry experience.

3) Work to convince the BoDs to actual care about the long term health of the company, not just pumping it for a quick profit for their own pockets. <--- no idea how to do this

---

What you say may work, but why would they change anything when they can make money and scoot? Nothing will change by itself. They are actually incentivized to keep things this way.

Only way to change is if laws change that disincentivize or criminalize this behavior. The fear of spending hours counting bars on a cold hard floor does wonders.

Only Trump can affect change. He already has them squealing with his law changes and 100k fee. He has to do more.

infinity ag said:

---

BigRobSA said:

---

Madagascar said:

---

The thing that I puzzle over the most is would it really bankrupt a company so badly to hire American? You would think with American talent, the company would actually achieve more and win more business. The Indian drones just run the company into the ground and the csuite runs off with their winnings.

How do we promote the capitalistic side of the argument to hire Americans? Trump can only do so much on the legal side.

---

1) Gut the corporate hierarchy to where people "higher up" actually had to work.
2) What little hierarchy is left should be hired from within, hopefully ensuring the employment of people that actually understand the business. Protip, from experience: People with MBAs are usually less capable, from an intrinsic value aspect, if hired from outside with no industry experience.

3) Work to convince the BoDs to actual care about the long term health of the company, not just pumping it for a quick profit for their own pockets. <--- no idea how to do this

---

What you say may work, but why would they change anything when they can make money and scoot? Nothing will change by itself. They are actually incentivized to keep things this way.

Only way to change is if laws change that disincentivize or criminalize this behavior. The fear of spending hours counting bars on a cold hard floor does wonders.

Only Trump can affect change. He already has them squealing with his law changes and 100k fee. He has to do more.

---

If investors were smarter, they would band together and make the changes via their votes in shareholder meetings. But too many of them are just as stupid and for-the-now as the c-suite morons and aren't for the long term health of the company, either. But, you're right, the c-suite/BoD idiots won't make the needed changes themselves, I'm just against govt interference as it is always worse than you'd ever dream it could be. Always.

Wow. Visa scam explained.
Shut down this exploitative slave-program.

BigRobSA said:

---

infinity ag said:

---

BigRobSA said:

---

Madagascar said:

---

The thing that I puzzle over the most is would it really bankrupt a company so badly to hire American? You would think with American talent, the company would actually achieve more and win more business. The Indian drones just run the company into the ground and the csuite runs off with their winnings.

How do we promote the capitalistic side of the argument to hire Americans? Trump can only do so much on the legal side.

---

1) Gut the corporate hierarchy to where people "higher up" actually had to work.
2) What little hierarchy is left should be hired from within, hopefully ensuring the employment of people that actually understand the business. Protip, from experience: People with MBAs are usually less capable, from an intrinsic value aspect, if hired from outside with no industry experience.

3) Work to convince the BoDs to actual care about the long term health of the company, not just pumping it for a quick profit for their own pockets. <--- no idea how to do this

---

What you say may work, but why would they change anything when they can make money and scoot? Nothing will change by itself. They are actually incentivized to keep things this way.

Only way to change is if laws change that disincentivize or criminalize this behavior. The fear of spending hours counting bars on a cold hard floor does wonders.

Only Trump can affect change. He already has them squealing with his law changes and 100k fee. He has to do more.

---

If investors were smarter, they would band together and make the changes via their votes in shareholder meetings. But too many of them are just as stupid and for-the-now as the c-suite morons and aren't for the long term health of the company, either. But, you're right, the c-suite/BoD idiots won't make the needed changes themselves, I'm just against govt interference as it is always worse than you'd ever dream it could be. Always.

---

I am sorry but this is just dogma. Govt interference is frequently bad but many times it is needed and the ONLY way to make an improvement. You cannot rely on "free market" (no one seems to know what that is, everyone makes up their own definition).

If govt does not interfere, then the powerful will get more and more powerful in an exponential way. This hurts the country as a whole. The only power who can fix this is the government.

If you don't agree, tell me what else can possibly change things. Don't say "CEO" or "Board" because they are all corrupt and looking for a cash grab. There has to be something/someone who pushed things against the interest of the C level.

BigRobSA said:

---

3) Work to convince the BoDs to actual care about the long term health of the company, not just pumping it for a quick profit for their own pockets. <--- no idea how to do this

---

Adjust the rates and terms of long term capital gains taxes? Maybe there's a tipping point where shareholders and c Suite would be incentivized to hold longer.

infinity ag said:

---

BigRobSA said:

---

infinity ag said:

---

BigRobSA said:

---

Madagascar said:

---

The thing that I puzzle over the most is would it really bankrupt a company so badly to hire American? You would think with American talent, the company would actually achieve more and win more business. The Indian drones just run the company into the ground and the csuite runs off with their winnings.

How do we promote the capitalistic side of the argument to hire Americans? Trump can only do so much on the legal side.

---

1) Gut the corporate hierarchy to where people "higher up" actually had to work.
2) What little hierarchy is left should be hired from within, hopefully ensuring the employment of people that actually understand the business. Protip, from experience: People with MBAs are usually less capable, from an intrinsic value aspect, if hired from outside with no industry experience.

3) Work to convince the BoDs to actual care about the long term health of the company, not just pumping it for a quick profit for their own pockets. <--- no idea how to do this

---

What you say may work, but why would they change anything when they can make money and scoot? Nothing will change by itself. They are actually incentivized to keep things this way.

Only way to change is if laws change that disincentivize or criminalize this behavior. The fear of spending hours counting bars on a cold hard floor does wonders.

Only Trump can affect change. He already has them squealing with his law changes and 100k fee. He has to do more.

---

If investors were smarter, they would band together and make the changes via their votes in shareholder meetings. But too many of them are just as stupid and for-the-now as the c-suite morons and aren't for the long term health of the company, either. But, you're right, the c-suite/BoD idiots won't make the needed changes themselves, I'm just against govt interference as it is always worse than you'd ever dream it could be. Always.

---

I am sorry but this is just dogma. Govt interference is frequently bad but many times it is needed and the ONLY way to make an improvement. You cannot rely on "free market" (no one seems to know what that is, everyone makes up their own definition).

If govt does not interfere, then the powerful will get more and more powerful in an exponential way. This hurts the country as a whole. The only power who can fix this is the government.

If you don't agree, tell me what else can possibly change things. Don't say "CEO" or "Board" because they are all corrupt and looking for a cash grab. There has to be something/someone who pushed things against the interest of the C level.

---

Govt is NEVER the answer.

Name the one thing they've done that has bettered the situation. Every time they get involved, it worsens things. Often, not just the thing they're trying to fix.

I don't know the answer, other than "Not government involvement.". I think McNasty's idea above may help, using the already instituted interference:

Quote:

---

Adjust the rates and terms of long term capital gains taxes? Maybe there's a tipping point where shareholders and c Suite would be incentivized to hold longer.

---

We need less govt, not more.

BigRobSA said:

---

infinity ag said:

---

BigRobSA said:

---

infinity ag said:

---

BigRobSA said:

---

Madagascar said:

---

The thing that I puzzle over the most is would it really bankrupt a company so badly to hire American? You would think with American talent, the company would actually achieve more and win more business. The Indian drones just run the company into the ground and the csuite runs off with their winnings.

How do we promote the capitalistic side of the argument to hire Americans? Trump can only do so much on the legal side.

---

1) Gut the corporate hierarchy to where people "higher up" actually had to work.
2) What little hierarchy is left should be hired from within, hopefully ensuring the employment of people that actually understand the business. Protip, from experience: People with MBAs are usually less capable, from an intrinsic value aspect, if hired from outside with no industry experience.

3) Work to convince the BoDs to actual care about the long term health of the company, not just pumping it for a quick profit for their own pockets. <--- no idea how to do this

---

What you say may work, but why would they change anything when they can make money and scoot? Nothing will change by itself. They are actually incentivized to keep things this way.

Only way to change is if laws change that disincentivize or criminalize this behavior. The fear of spending hours counting bars on a cold hard floor does wonders.

Only Trump can affect change. He already has them squealing with his law changes and 100k fee. He has to do more.

---

If investors were smarter, they would band together and make the changes via their votes in shareholder meetings. But too many of them are just as stupid and for-the-now as the c-suite morons and aren't for the long term health of the company, either. But, you're right, the c-suite/BoD idiots won't make the needed changes themselves, I'm just against govt interference as it is always worse than you'd ever dream it could be. Always.

---

I am sorry but this is just dogma. Govt interference is frequently bad but many times it is needed and the ONLY way to make an improvement. You cannot rely on "free market" (no one seems to know what that is, everyone makes up their own definition).

If govt does not interfere, then the powerful will get more and more powerful in an exponential way. This hurts the country as a whole. The only power who can fix this is the government.

If you don't agree, tell me what else can possibly change things. Don't say "CEO" or "Board" because they are all corrupt and looking for a cash grab. There has to be something/someone who pushed things against the interest of the C level.

---

Govt is NEVER the answer.

Name the one thing they've done that has bettered the situation. Every time they get involved, it worsens things. Often, not just the thing they're trying to fix.

I don't know the answer, other than "Not government involvement.". I think McNasty's idea above may help, using the already instituted interference:

Quote:

---

Adjust the rates and terms of long term capital gains taxes? Maybe there's a tipping point where shareholders and c Suite would be incentivized to hold longer.

---

We need less govt, not more.

---

Good conservative slogan but does not work in practice.

You just say "Govt is never the answer" but don't tell me if there is anything better.
This is just conservative propaganda that no one has thought through completely. Which is why we are where we are. We thought "free markets" will get us through but we ended up selling out our manufacturing, and then our tech.

You cannot let a tiger be in charge of a chicken coop.
If you remove the government then no one will pay any taxes. You need the government to determine and enforce.

jeremy said:

---

BusterAg said:

---

I had a friend in graduate school that popped porches during the dotcom boom when he was in undergrad. He was making 10% to 20% of the value of the car on repossessing them.

Wonder if this problem is bad enough to look into that again.......

---

I dont know what you said. Sounds cool or lame. I'm not sure.

---

Glad I'm not the only one who has never heard the term "popping porches"

infinity ag said:

---

BigRobSA said:

---

infinity ag said:

---

BigRobSA said:

---

infinity ag said:

---

BigRobSA said:

---

Madagascar said:

---

The thing that I puzzle over the most is would it really bankrupt a company so badly to hire American? You would think with American talent, the company would actually achieve more and win more business. The Indian drones just run the company into the ground and the csuite runs off with their winnings.

How do we promote the capitalistic side of the argument to hire Americans? Trump can only do so much on the legal side.

---

1) Gut the corporate hierarchy to where people "higher up" actually had to work.
2) What little hierarchy is left should be hired from within, hopefully ensuring the employment of people that actually understand the business. Protip, from experience: People with MBAs are usually less capable, from an intrinsic value aspect, if hired from outside with no industry experience.

3) Work to convince the BoDs to actual care about the long term health of the company, not just pumping it for a quick profit for their own pockets. <--- no idea how to do this

---

What you say may work, but why would they change anything when they can make money and scoot? Nothing will change by itself. They are actually incentivized to keep things this way.

Only way to change is if laws change that disincentivize or criminalize this behavior. The fear of spending hours counting bars on a cold hard floor does wonders.

Only Trump can affect change. He already has them squealing with his law changes and 100k fee. He has to do more.

---

If investors were smarter, they would band together and make the changes via their votes in shareholder meetings. But too many of them are just as stupid and for-the-now as the c-suite morons and aren't for the long term health of the company, either. But, you're right, the c-suite/BoD idiots won't make the needed changes themselves, I'm just against govt interference as it is always worse than you'd ever dream it could be. Always.

---

I am sorry but this is just dogma. Govt interference is frequently bad but many times it is needed and the ONLY way to make an improvement. You cannot rely on "free market" (no one seems to know what that is, everyone makes up their own definition).

If govt does not interfere, then the powerful will get more and more powerful in an exponential way. This hurts the country as a whole. The only power who can fix this is the government.

If you don't agree, tell me what else can possibly change things. Don't say "CEO" or "Board" because they are all corrupt and looking for a cash grab. There has to be something/someone who pushed things against the interest of the C level.

---

Govt is NEVER the answer.

Name the one thing they've done that has bettered the situation. Every time they get involved, it worsens things. Often, not just the thing they're trying to fix.

I don't know the answer, other than "Not government involvement.". I think McNasty's idea above may help, using the already instituted interference:

Quote:

---

Adjust the rates and terms of long term capital gains taxes? Maybe there's a tipping point where shareholders and c Suite would be incentivized to hold longer.

---

We need less govt, not more.

---

Good conservative slogan but does not work in practice.

You just say "Govt is never the answer" but don't tell me if there is anything better.
This is just conservative propaganda that no one has thought through completely. Which is why we are where we are. We thought "free markets" will get us through but we ended up selling out our manufacturing, and then our tech.

You cannot let a tiger be in charge of a chicken coop.
If you remove the government then no one will pay any taxes. You need the government to determine and enforce.

---

We don't have a free market, since the govt interferes in all markets. And here we are, with liberals wanting MORE govt. Because that's worked so well to date.

:-/

BigRobSA said:

---

infinity ag said:

---

BigRobSA said:

---

infinity ag said:

---

BigRobSA said:

---

infinity ag said:

---

BigRobSA said:

---

Madagascar said:

---

The thing that I puzzle over the most is would it really bankrupt a company so badly to hire American? You would think with American talent, the company would actually achieve more and win more business. The Indian drones just run the company into the ground and the csuite runs off with their winnings.

How do we promote the capitalistic side of the argument to hire Americans? Trump can only do so much on the legal side.

---

1) Gut the corporate hierarchy to where people "higher up" actually had to work.
2) What little hierarchy is left should be hired from within, hopefully ensuring the employment of people that actually understand the business. Protip, from experience: People with MBAs are usually less capable, from an intrinsic value aspect, if hired from outside with no industry experience.

3) Work to convince the BoDs to actual care about the long term health of the company, not just pumping it for a quick profit for their own pockets. <--- no idea how to do this

---

What you say may work, but why would they change anything when they can make money and scoot? Nothing will change by itself. They are actually incentivized to keep things this way.

Only way to change is if laws change that disincentivize or criminalize this behavior. The fear of spending hours counting bars on a cold hard floor does wonders.

Only Trump can affect change. He already has them squealing with his law changes and 100k fee. He has to do more.

---

If investors were smarter, they would band together and make the changes via their votes in shareholder meetings. But too many of them are just as stupid and for-the-now as the c-suite morons and aren't for the long term health of the company, either. But, you're right, the c-suite/BoD idiots won't make the needed changes themselves, I'm just against govt interference as it is always worse than you'd ever dream it could be. Always.

---

I am sorry but this is just dogma. Govt interference is frequently bad but many times it is needed and the ONLY way to make an improvement. You cannot rely on "free market" (no one seems to know what that is, everyone makes up their own definition).

If govt does not interfere, then the powerful will get more and more powerful in an exponential way. This hurts the country as a whole. The only power who can fix this is the government.

If you don't agree, tell me what else can possibly change things. Don't say "CEO" or "Board" because they are all corrupt and looking for a cash grab. There has to be something/someone who pushed things against the interest of the C level.

---

Govt is NEVER the answer.

Name the one thing they've done that has bettered the situation. Every time they get involved, it worsens things. Often, not just the thing they're trying to fix.

I don't know the answer, other than "Not government involvement.". I think McNasty's idea above may help, using the already instituted interference:

Quote:

---

Adjust the rates and terms of long term capital gains taxes? Maybe there's a tipping point where shareholders and c Suite would be incentivized to hold longer.

---

We need less govt, not more.

---

Good conservative slogan but does not work in practice.

You just say "Govt is never the answer" but don't tell me if there is anything better.
This is just conservative propaganda that no one has thought through completely. Which is why we are where we are. We thought "free markets" will get us through but we ended up selling out our manufacturing, and then our tech.

You cannot let a tiger be in charge of a chicken coop.
If you remove the government then no one will pay any taxes. You need the government to determine and enforce.

---

We don't have a free market, since the govt interferes in all markets. And here we are, with liberals wanting MORE govt. Because that's worked so well to date.

:-/

---

I agree. We have never had sustained free markets and definitely not during my career of almost 30 years. I don't really care about more/less govt. I only care about results. If less govt can get me the result I want, then I will support that as it also means less cost. But I don't think that will get the result because it is foolish to expect anyone to be moral and "do the right thing for the country". They will only do the right thing for themselves (not even their employer). It is the job of the govt to do the right thing for the country.

I don't trust any CEO. Not too many politicians. As of now, I still trust Trump.

More likely the jobs will be offshored or manpower reduced in favor of AI. Not my hope obviously, but a very real likelihood

infinity ag said:

---

BigRobSA said:

---

infinity ag said:

---

BigRobSA said:

---

infinity ag said:

---

BigRobSA said:

---

infinity ag said:

---

BigRobSA said:

---

Madagascar said:

---

The thing that I puzzle over the most is would it really bankrupt a company so badly to hire American? You would think with American talent, the company would actually achieve more and win more business. The Indian drones just run the company into the ground and the csuite runs off with their winnings.

How do we promote the capitalistic side of the argument to hire Americans? Trump can only do so much on the legal side.

---

1) Gut the corporate hierarchy to where people "higher up" actually had to work.
2) What little hierarchy is left should be hired from within, hopefully ensuring the employment of people that actually understand the business. Protip, from experience: People with MBAs are usually less capable, from an intrinsic value aspect, if hired from outside with no industry experience.

3) Work to convince the BoDs to actual care about the long term health of the company, not just pumping it for a quick profit for their own pockets. <--- no idea how to do this

---

What you say may work, but why would they change anything when they can make money and scoot? Nothing will change by itself. They are actually incentivized to keep things this way.

Only way to change is if laws change that disincentivize or criminalize this behavior. The fear of spending hours counting bars on a cold hard floor does wonders.

Only Trump can affect change. He already has them squealing with his law changes and 100k fee. He has to do more.

---

If investors were smarter, they would band together and make the changes via their votes in shareholder meetings. But too many of them are just as stupid and for-the-now as the c-suite morons and aren't for the long term health of the company, either. But, you're right, the c-suite/BoD idiots won't make the needed changes themselves, I'm just against govt interference as it is always worse than you'd ever dream it could be. Always.

---

I am sorry but this is just dogma. Govt interference is frequently bad but many times it is needed and the ONLY way to make an improvement. You cannot rely on "free market" (no one seems to know what that is, everyone makes up their own definition).

If govt does not interfere, then the powerful will get more and more powerful in an exponential way. This hurts the country as a whole. The only power who can fix this is the government.

If you don't agree, tell me what else can possibly change things. Don't say "CEO" or "Board" because they are all corrupt and looking for a cash grab. There has to be something/someone who pushed things against the interest of the C level.

---

Govt is NEVER the answer.

Name the one thing they've done that has bettered the situation. Every time they get involved, it worsens things. Often, not just the thing they're trying to fix.

I don't know the answer, other than "Not government involvement.". I think McNasty's idea above may help, using the already instituted interference:

Quote:

---

Adjust the rates and terms of long term capital gains taxes? Maybe there's a tipping point where shareholders and c Suite would be incentivized to hold longer.

---

We need less govt, not more.

---

Good conservative slogan but does not work in practice.

You just say "Govt is never the answer" but don't tell me if there is anything better.
This is just conservative propaganda that no one has thought through completely. Which is why we are where we are. We thought "free markets" will get us through but we ended up selling out our manufacturing, and then our tech.

You cannot let a tiger be in charge of a chicken coop.
If you remove the government then no one will pay any taxes. You need the government to determine and enforce.

---

We don't have a free market, since the govt interferes in all markets. And here we are, with liberals wanting MORE govt. Because that's worked so well to date.

:-/

---

I agree. We have never had sustained free markets and definitely not during my career of almost 30 years. I don't really care about more/less govt. I only care about results. If less govt can get me the result I want, then I will support that as it also means less cost. But I don't think that will get the result because it is foolish to expect anyone to be moral and "do the right thing for the country". They will only do the right thing for themselves (not even their employer). It is the job of the govt to do the right thing for the country.

I don't trust any CEO. Not too many politicians. As of now, I still trust Trump.

---

Govt, even under Trump, won't net positive results.

Liberalism, aka "Big Govt", never does. Not even this time.

Ag_of_08 said:

---

More likely the jobs will be offshored or manpower reduced in favor of AI. Not my hope obviously, but a very real likelihood

---

AI is overrated. It will improve some things and cut some jobs but it won't be the avalanche people think it will be. Already experts are souring at the future of LLMs.

BigRobSA said:

---

infinity ag said:

---

BigRobSA said:

---

infinity ag said:

---

BigRobSA said:

---

infinity ag said:

---

BigRobSA said:

---

infinity ag said:

---

BigRobSA said:

---

Madagascar said:

---

The thing that I puzzle over the most is would it really bankrupt a company so badly to hire American? You would think with American talent, the company would actually achieve more and win more business. The Indian drones just run the company into the ground and the csuite runs off with their winnings.

How do we promote the capitalistic side of the argument to hire Americans? Trump can only do so much on the legal side.

---

1) Gut the corporate hierarchy to where people "higher up" actually had to work.
2) What little hierarchy is left should be hired from within, hopefully ensuring the employment of people that actually understand the business. Protip, from experience: People with MBAs are usually less capable, from an intrinsic value aspect, if hired from outside with no industry experience.

3) Work to convince the BoDs to actual care about the long term health of the company, not just pumping it for a quick profit for their own pockets. <--- no idea how to do this

---

What you say may work, but why would they change anything when they can make money and scoot? Nothing will change by itself. They are actually incentivized to keep things this way.

Only way to change is if laws change that disincentivize or criminalize this behavior. The fear of spending hours counting bars on a cold hard floor does wonders.

Only Trump can affect change. He already has them squealing with his law changes and 100k fee. He has to do more.

---

If investors were smarter, they would band together and make the changes via their votes in shareholder meetings. But too many of them are just as stupid and for-the-now as the c-suite morons and aren't for the long term health of the company, either. But, you're right, the c-suite/BoD idiots won't make the needed changes themselves, I'm just against govt interference as it is always worse than you'd ever dream it could be. Always.

---

I am sorry but this is just dogma. Govt interference is frequently bad but many times it is needed and the ONLY way to make an improvement. You cannot rely on "free market" (no one seems to know what that is, everyone makes up their own definition).

If govt does not interfere, then the powerful will get more and more powerful in an exponential way. This hurts the country as a whole. The only power who can fix this is the government.

If you don't agree, tell me what else can possibly change things. Don't say "CEO" or "Board" because they are all corrupt and looking for a cash grab. There has to be something/someone who pushed things against the interest of the C level.

---

Govt is NEVER the answer.

Name the one thing they've done that has bettered the situation. Every time they get involved, it worsens things. Often, not just the thing they're trying to fix.

I don't know the answer, other than "Not government involvement.". I think McNasty's idea above may help, using the already instituted interference:

Quote:

---

Adjust the rates and terms of long term capital gains taxes? Maybe there's a tipping point where shareholders and c Suite would be incentivized to hold longer.

---

We need less govt, not more.

---

Good conservative slogan but does not work in practice.

You just say "Govt is never the answer" but don't tell me if there is anything better.
This is just conservative propaganda that no one has thought through completely. Which is why we are where we are. We thought "free markets" will get us through but we ended up selling out our manufacturing, and then our tech.

You cannot let a tiger be in charge of a chicken coop.
If you remove the government then no one will pay any taxes. You need the government to determine and enforce.

---

We don't have a free market, since the govt interferes in all markets. And here we are, with liberals wanting MORE govt. Because that's worked so well to date.

:-/

---

I agree. We have never had sustained free markets and definitely not during my career of almost 30 years. I don't really care about more/less govt. I only care about results. If less govt can get me the result I want, then I will support that as it also means less cost. But I don't think that will get the result because it is foolish to expect anyone to be moral and "do the right thing for the country". They will only do the right thing for themselves (not even their employer). It is the job of the govt to do the right thing for the country.

I don't trust any CEO. Not too many politicians. As of now, I still trust Trump.

---

Govt, even under Trump, won't net positive results.

Liberalism, aka "Big Govt", never does. Not even this time.

---

Well, he is our only and last hope. Everyone seems to be intent on selling out this nation for a fistful of dollars.