AGC said:

---

halfastros81 said:

---

Had the system been set up right to begin with so that the allegedly "earmarked" money couldn't be used for other purposes then SS would be and would remain solvent imo. That is the fundamental issue with it .

It's essentially a forced contract with really bad terms . Had it not been forced then I would have opted out and I'd be a lot better off for it so yes , now that I contributed to it at gunpoint for almost 50 yrs I do expect my relative pittance of a return and I'm not remotely going to feel bad about it.

---

This is the problem: you know it's insolvent, you simply don't care. That's what's repeated in this thread, time after time.

That's why the revolution is coming (which is not a threat btw, it's a mathematical fact). It's alarming that y'all have changed selfishness (I'm gonna get mine) into some sort of virtue (I did my part [in the Ponzi scheme, even though I knew it wouldn't work]).

---

it's hard to even have a political disagreement with people who can't understand basic logic and REALITY.

it is not "selfishness" when you go to your bank and withdraw your own money.

IT IS YOUR MONEY THAT YOU GAVE TO THE BANK

LMCane said:

---

AGC said:

---

halfastros81 said:

---

Had the system been set up right to begin with so that the allegedly "earmarked" money couldn't be used for other purposes then SS would be and would remain solvent imo. That is the fundamental issue with it .

It's essentially a forced contract with really bad terms . Had it not been forced then I would have opted out and I'd be a lot better off for it so yes , now that I contributed to it at gunpoint for almost 50 yrs I do expect my relative pittance of a return and I'm not remotely going to feel bad about it.

---

This is the problem: you know it's insolvent, you simply don't care. That's what's repeated in this thread, time after time.

That's why the revolution is coming (which is not a threat btw, it's a mathematical fact). It's alarming that y'all have changed selfishness (I'm gonna get mine) into some sort of virtue (I did my part [in the Ponzi scheme, even though I knew it wouldn't work]).

---

it's hard to even have a political disagreement with people who can't understand basic logic and REALITY.

it is not "selfishness" when you go to your bank and withdraw your own money.

IT IS YOUR MONEY THAT YOU GAVE TO THE BANK

---

That's not how it works and hasn't been for decades. This is self-deceit, at best.

Whatever you thought it was has changed, and you saw it change, but you haven't adapted your mindset to the new reality (irony, right?).

Do the math! It doesn't work, no matter what you think you're owed. There simply aren't the same number of people paying in to cash you out. Forcing them into debt for it is slavery, no matter what you want to call it.

AGC said:

---

halfastros81 said:

---

Had the system been set up right to begin with so that the allegedly "earmarked" money couldn't be used for other purposes then SS would be and would remain solvent imo. That is the fundamental issue with it .

It's essentially a forced contract with really bad terms . Had it not been forced then I would have opted out and I'd be a lot better off for it so yes , now that I contributed to it at gunpoint for almost 50 yrs I do expect my relative pittance of a return and I'm not remotely going to feel bad about it.

---

This is the problem: you know it's insolvent, you simply don't care. That's what's repeated in this thread, time after time.

---

What do you want people to do?

What is a solution some 70-year-old can implement today that would make a difference?

Shred his $3,000 check each month? What will that do?

Vote for politicians who wouldn't dare touch SS? What does that do?

How can we show we care? What symbol of caring would be enough?

EclipseAg said:

---

AGC said:

---

halfastros81 said:

---

Had the system been set up right to begin with so that the allegedly "earmarked" money couldn't be used for other purposes then SS would be and would remain solvent imo. That is the fundamental issue with it .

It's essentially a forced contract with really bad terms . Had it not been forced then I would have opted out and I'd be a lot better off for it so yes , now that I contributed to it at gunpoint for almost 50 yrs I do expect my relative pittance of a return and I'm not remotely going to feel bad about it.

---

This is the problem: you know it's insolvent, you simply don't care. That's what's repeated in this thread, time after time.

---

What do you want people to do?

What is a solution some 70-year-old can implement today that would make a difference?

Shred his $3,000 check each month? What will that do?

Vote for politicians who wouldn't dare touch SS? What does that do?

How can we show we care? What symbol of caring would be enough?

---

Accept a modest benefit cut now in order to fund the system in the future.

EclipseAg said:

---

AGC said:

---

halfastros81 said:

---

Had the system been set up right to begin with so that the allegedly "earmarked" money couldn't be used for other purposes then SS would be and would remain solvent imo. That is the fundamental issue with it .

It's essentially a forced contract with really bad terms . Had it not been forced then I would have opted out and I'd be a lot better off for it so yes , now that I contributed to it at gunpoint for almost 50 yrs I do expect my relative pittance of a return and I'm not remotely going to feel bad about it.

---

This is the problem: you know it's insolvent, you simply don't care. That's what's repeated in this thread, time after time.

---

What do you want people to do?

What is a solution some 70-year-old can implement today that would make a difference?

Shred his $3,000 check each month? What will that do?

Vote for politicians who wouldn't dare touch SS? What does that do?

How can we show we care? What symbol of caring would be enough?

---

Thanks for the engagement. Don't shred your check, send it back.

https://www.pay.gov/public/form/start/23779454

Second, yes, vote for politicians willing to wind down SS and engage with budget issues. Beyond that, there are other things you can do (return to multigenerational housing, for instance), and it won't take much creativity to figure it out.

BonfireNerd04 said:

---

EclipseAg said:

---

AGC said:

---

halfastros81 said:

---

Had the system been set up right to begin with so that the allegedly "earmarked" money couldn't be used for other purposes then SS would be and would remain solvent imo. That is the fundamental issue with it .

It's essentially a forced contract with really bad terms . Had it not been forced then I would have opted out and I'd be a lot better off for it so yes , now that I contributed to it at gunpoint for almost 50 yrs I do expect my relative pittance of a return and I'm not remotely going to feel bad about it.

---

This is the problem: you know it's insolvent, you simply don't care. That's what's repeated in this thread, time after time.

---

What do you want people to do?

What is a solution some 70-year-old can implement today that would make a difference?

Shred his $3,000 check each month? What will that do?

Vote for politicians who wouldn't dare touch SS? What does that do?

How can we show we care? What symbol of caring would be enough?

---

Accept a modest benefit cut now in order to fund the system in the future.

---

Again, even if some people were willing to do this (and I don't doubt there are), what politician is going to push this through?

It can't be an ad hoc, voluntary thing. You're going to have to codify it to get big enough numbers to make a difference.

And there will be lots of people (and special interest groups) that go into full-on fight mode. Congress will back down in a heartbeat even if someone is brave enough to introduce it.

AGC said:

---

Thanks for the engagement. Don't shred your check, send it back.

https://www.pay.gov/public/form/start/23779454

Second, yes, vote for politicians willing to wind down SS and engage with budget issues. Beyond that, there are other things you can do (return to multigenerational housing, for instance), and it won't take much creativity to figure it out.

---

So the solution to fixing Social Security is to have some old people voluntarily send back their checks and then move in with their kids while voting for non-existent politicians who are running on dismantling the program?

I had no say in any of it , that's the part you seem to ignore. I wouldn't have ever supported it if I had a chance to have a say and had it been optional I wouldn't have opted for it. It was implemented 20 yrs-ish before I was born and was basically institutionalized well before I ever worked for pay. I didn't make the rules but if you're going to admonish me for living by them then so be it . What I really don't care about is your opinion on this particular subject. if you don't like the system then dedicate yourself to changing it and good luck with that.

EclipseAg said:

---

BonfireNerd04 said:

---

EclipseAg said:

---

AGC said:

---

halfastros81 said:

---

Had the system been set up right to begin with so that the allegedly "earmarked" money couldn't be used for other purposes then SS would be and would remain solvent imo. That is the fundamental issue with it .

It's essentially a forced contract with really bad terms . Had it not been forced then I would have opted out and I'd be a lot better off for it so yes , now that I contributed to it at gunpoint for almost 50 yrs I do expect my relative pittance of a return and I'm not remotely going to feel bad about it.

---

This is the problem: you know it's insolvent, you simply don't care. That's what's repeated in this thread, time after time.

---

What do you want people to do?

What is a solution some 70-year-old can implement today that would make a difference?

Shred his $3,000 check each month? What will that do?

Vote for politicians who wouldn't dare touch SS? What does that do?

How can we show we care? What symbol of caring would be enough?

---

Accept a modest benefit cut now in order to fund the system in the future.

---

Again, even if some people were willing to do this (and I don't doubt there are), what politician is going to push this through?

It can't be an ad hoc, voluntary thing. You're going to have to codify it to get big enough numbers to make a difference.

And there will be lots of people (and special interest groups) that go into full-on fight mode. Congress will back down in a heartbeat even if someone is brave enough to introduce it.

---

Are you saying this for yourself, or for us? We younger generations know it will be a fight. It's going to collapse no matter what, though. When something's inevitable, you accept it. It's the boomer generation that hasn't come to terms with the math.

halfastros81 said:

---

I had no say in any of it , that's the part you seem to ignore. I wouldn't have ever supported it if I had a chance to have a say and had it been optional I wouldn't have opted for it. It was implemented 20 yrs-ish before I was born and was basically institutionalized well before I ever worked for pay. I didn't make the rules but if you're going to admonish me for living by them then so be it . What I really don't care about is your opinion on this particular subject. if you don't like the system then dedicate yourself to changing it and good luck with that.

---

I mean, I'm sorry? If I say, "you're right, you didn't", does the math change? That's the problem, the math never changes. You're content screwing everyone after you but think you're the victim here (and I do agree, by the way, you are a victim, but you're acting like you're entitled to hurt others as a result).

tysker said:

---

Science Denier said:

---

tysker said:

---

Logos Stick said:

---

MemphisAg1 said:

---

Yukon Cornelius said:

---

Politicians will campaign on ending SS. Boomers won't have the votes.

---

Lol, show me a Democrat who will campaign on ending SS.

Boomers don't need the votes. They'll be gone. The next generation on the cusp of receiving SS will magically shift from "I never planned on it" to "I want what's mine and what I've paid into"... it happens with every generation.

The sun will stop shining before SS ends.

---

I don't understand why the bold is so hard to comprehend. The SS train can't be stopped.

---

Sometime during the 2030s both SS and Medicare will become insolvent. There will be less money coming in than going out. What happens next is anyone's guess. But if nothing happens, we'll have to accept that SS and Medicare benefits are being passed on to current and future taxpayers

---

LOL. SS won't be insolvent. It's a government program.

That's like saying the Military will become insolvent. Or Congress will become insolvent.

---

The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money - Margaret Thatcher

---

1. You buy something
2. You pay for something
3. You get what you pay for.

That is nowhere close to socialism.

1. You buy something
2. You pay for something
3. Government takes it from you because "you are rich and can afford it.

That is exactly socialism.

Just thought I'd clear that up for you.

Go outside and yell at clouds already…crappy SS system ain't changing by a few Ags returning their monthly benefits

AGC said:

---

halfastros81 said:

---

I had no say in any of it , that's the part you seem to ignore. I wouldn't have ever supported it if I had a chance to have a say and had it been optional I wouldn't have opted for it. It was implemented 20 yrs-ish before I was born and was basically institutionalized well before I ever worked for pay. I didn't make the rules but if you're going to admonish me for living by them then so be it . What I really don't care about is your opinion on this particular subject. if you don't like the system then dedicate yourself to changing it and good luck with that.

---

I mean, I'm sorry? If I say, "you're right, you didn't", does the math change? That's the problem, the math never changes. You're content screwing everyone after you but think you're the victim here (and I do agree, by the way, you are a victim, but you're acting like you're entitled to hurt others as a result).

---

I'm going to collect the SS benefits that I have earned and don't feel one bit bad about it. In fact, knowing that the younger generation is trying to guilt me into not accepting it just makes me more determined to collect every last dime. You don't change the rules after the game has been played and retirees put all of that money into the system over decades.

You need to put less effort into telling me not to collect it, and more effort into your health and long term earnings capability. We're counting on you.

EclipseAg said:

---

AGC said:

---

Thanks for the engagement. Don't shred your check, send it back.

https://www.pay.gov/public/form/start/23779454

Second, yes, vote for politicians willing to wind down SS and engage with budget issues. Beyond that, there are other things you can do (return to multigenerational housing, for instance), and it won't take much creativity to figure it out.

---

So the solution to fixing Social Security is to have some old people voluntarily send back their checks and then move in with their kids while voting for non-existent politicians who are running on dismantling the program?

---

You asked what you, personally, could do. You're not powerless in this, you have agency. You're also not responsible for the choices of others. It's tough to do the right thing when you see so many being selfish. The question isn't, 'what are they gonna do?' It's, 'what are you going to do?'

I'll bet you taught your kids this same lesson. The question now is, do you believe it?

MemphisAg1 said:

---

AGC said:

---

halfastros81 said:

---

I had no say in any of it , that's the part you seem to ignore. I wouldn't have ever supported it if I had a chance to have a say and had it been optional I wouldn't have opted for it. It was implemented 20 yrs-ish before I was born and was basically institutionalized well before I ever worked for pay. I didn't make the rules but if you're going to admonish me for living by them then so be it . What I really don't care about is your opinion on this particular subject. if you don't like the system then dedicate yourself to changing it and good luck with that.

---

I mean, I'm sorry? If I say, "you're right, you didn't", does the math change? That's the problem, the math never changes. You're content screwing everyone after you but think you're the victim here (and I do agree, by the way, you are a victim, but you're acting like you're entitled to hurt others as a result).

---

I'm going to collect the SS benefits that I have earned and don't feel one bit bad about it. In fact, knowing that the younger generation is trying to guilt me into not accepting it just makes me more determined to collect every last dime. You don't change the rules after the game has been played and retirees put all of that money into the system over decades.

You need to put less effort into telling me not to collect it, and more effort into your health and long term earnings capability. We're counting on you.

---

Do. The. Math.

AGC said:

---

Do. The. Math.

---

Keep. Sending. The. Check.

MemphisAg1 said:

---

AGC said:

---

Do. The. Math.

---

Keep. Sending. The. Check.

---

It's easier to vote for AOC than sympathize with you. Enjoy it while it lasts, it won't be there for long.

AGC said:

---

EclipseAg said:

---

AGC said:

---

Thanks for the engagement. Don't shred your check, send it back.

https://www.pay.gov/public/form/start/23779454

Second, yes, vote for politicians willing to wind down SS and engage with budget issues. Beyond that, there are other things you can do (return to multigenerational housing, for instance), and it won't take much creativity to figure it out.

---

So the solution to fixing Social Security is to have some old people voluntarily send back their checks and then move in with their kids while voting for non-existent politicians who are running on dismantling the program?

---

You asked what you, personally, could do. You're not powerless in this, you have agency. You're also not responsible for the choices of others. It's tough to do the right thing when you see so many being selfish. The question isn't, 'what are they gonna do?' It's, 'what are you going to do?'

I'll bet you taught your kids this same lesson. The question now is, do you believe it?

---

But see, that's the thing, we like being selfish. We like driving our fancy cars and taking trips to Italy while you work and complain. I mean, honestly, you complaining is the primary reason we do it.

AGC said:

---

MemphisAg1 said:

---

AGC said:

---

Do. The. Math.

---

Keep. Sending. The. Check.

---

It's easier to vote for AOC than sympathize with you. Enjoy it while it lasts, it won't be there for long.

---

I don't need sympathy. Just keep sending the check per the terms of the agreement.

Change the rules going forward if you want, but you don't renege on current/near retirees.

Even AOC knows that.

My dad and his dad (my grandfather) passed when they turned 60.

Aside from some survivor benefits that went to my mother and grandmother... dad and grandfather collected nothing. NOTHING.

I hit 60 this year... I expect to live many years beyond retirement in 2030 (will be 65).

I will be buying a C8 Corvette or a 911 in 2030... and that monthly SS check will help pay for it plus a lot of fuel.

#truth

AGC said:

---

MemphisAg1 said:

---

AGC said:

---

Do. The. Math.

---

Keep. Sending. The. Check.

---

It's easier to vote for AOC than sympathize with you. Enjoy it while it lasts, it won't be there for long.

---

AOC would vote to send SS recipients twice as much money.

As is lumping all 60s/70 year olds into a Boomer category and blaming them for your own failures in life.

Owlagdad said:

---

AJ02 said:

---

What if we just raise the retirement age to 80. Folks are living much longer now than back when SS was rolled out.

Work until you die, then SS is no longer a problem.

---

I'm still at it at 73! Gotta work to pay taxes on SS!

---

Impossible! We were told earlier that people over 65 don't pay any income taxes.

MemphisAg1 said:

---

I'm not disagreeing on the challenges young people face today. All those points you make are spot on.

That portion of the younger crowd that works hard, delays gratification, and stays out of trouble, will do just fine. There are data points in the media showing that wealth accumulation for Millenials is occurring at a faster pace than their parents and grandparents due to more robust 401ks, IRAs, HSAs -- coupled with a long term bull market. They will not only do fine, they will succeed and build wealth over their life.

The other portion of young people who won't work, or live in the moment to spend now, or can't stay away from trouble, will absolutely suffer. Mindset is important also. You typically see a will to overcome in the first portion, and a victim's mentality in the second... they are absolutely looking for someone to blame.

What you'll see is a dichotomy in the younger crowd. Some who will vote very much like their parents and grandparents, and others who vote for radical change. Lumping all young people into one voting class is off the mark.

---

Not hard to figure how they got that way. They learned it from their parents blaming boomers for everything bad under the sun. This thread is prima facie evidence of such

EclipseAg said:

---

AGC said:

---

halfastros81 said:

---

Had the system been set up right to begin with so that the allegedly "earmarked" money couldn't be used for other purposes then SS would be and would remain solvent imo. That is the fundamental issue with it .

It's essentially a forced contract with really bad terms . Had it not been forced then I would have opted out and I'd be a lot better off for it so yes , now that I contributed to it at gunpoint for almost 50 yrs I do expect my relative pittance of a return and I'm not remotely going to feel bad about it.

---

This is the problem: you know it's insolvent, you simply don't care. That's what's repeated in this thread, time after time.

---

What do you want people to do?

What is a solution some 70-year-old can implement today that would make a difference?

Shred his $3,000 check each month? What will that do?

Vote for politicians who wouldn't dare touch SS? What does that do?

How can we show we care? What symbol of caring would be enough?

---

Repeatedly tell the AARP (and encourage others) to support even a modest move towards solvency (e.g. means testing):

https://help.aarp.org/s/article/what-is-the-aarp-statement-on-funding-social-security-and-medicare

Or just watch the entire thing circle the drain while you get yours. Your choice

tysker said:

---

Quote:

---

There is already less money coming in - FICA - than going out for SS. We are simply cashing bonds to pay for the excess now. The money for those bonds comes from general tax revenue. It's nothing but ledger entries.

---

That is my basis for arguing that SS is essentially welfare. Same thing with Medicare.
But there is no cost borne by the recipient; the working class and the taxpayer carry the costs. The recipient no longer has skin in the game.

Thus, maybe we should consider that recipients of these benefits lose their privilege to vote in federal elections.

---

There was a cost borne by this recipient and his employers for 40 plus years.
Let's say you contributed to a company retirement plan for 40 years and the company matched it. All of a sudden your employer ditches the plan, keeps the money and says sorry pal you're just SOL. What's your response going to be?

AJ02 said:

---

What if we just raise the retirement age to 80. Folks are living much longer now than back when SS was rolled out.

Work until you die, then SS is no longer a problem.

---

Grandma Rattler was born in 1890. She died in 1983 at 93. Grandma Rattler would have thrown a monkey wrench into your plan.

Rattler12 said:

---

MemphisAg1 said:

---

I'm not disagreeing on the challenges young people face today. All those points you make are spot on.

That portion of the younger crowd that works hard, delays gratification, and stays out of trouble, will do just fine. There are data points in the media showing that wealth accumulation for Millenials is occurring at a faster pace than their parents and grandparents due to more robust 401ks, IRAs, HSAs -- coupled with a long term bull market. They will not only do fine, they will succeed and build wealth over their life.

The other portion of young people who won't work, or live in the moment to spend now, or can't stay away from trouble, will absolutely suffer. Mindset is important also. You typically see a will to overcome in the first portion, and a victim's mentality in the second... they are absolutely looking for someone to blame.

What you'll see is a dichotomy in the younger crowd. Some who will vote very much like their parents and grandparents, and others who vote for radical change. Lumping all young people into one voting class is off the mark.

---

Not hard to figure how they got that way. They learned it from their parents blaming boomers for everything bad under the sun. This thread is prima facie evidence of such

---

What should give you pause is that I'm one of those millennials who will be fine. My Montecarlo simulation says I won't have a care in the world or need SS when I'm older.

That's before I inherit (I'm currently taking care of a parent who has dementia and I've been growing their assets despite depleting them at a higher rate for care).

If I, as a responsible and capable younger person, recognize that the money isn't there, and that a major change is coming, why don't y'all? Why isn't this a team effort? Why isn't this everyone being less selfish?

Side note: If I'm playing the victim card and learned it from my parents, that means I learned it from boomers. How ironic is that?

halfastros81 said:

---

Had the system been set up right to begin with so that the allegedly "earmarked" money couldn't be used for other purposes then SS would be and would remain solvent imo. That is the fundamental issue with it .

It's essentially a forced contract with really bad terms . Had it not been forced then I would have opted out and I'd be a lot better off for it so yes , now that I contributed to it at gunpoint for almost 50 yrs I do expect my relative pittance of a return and I'm not remotely going to feel bad about it.

---

It was set up that way originally......until 1969

No Spin Ag said:

---

AJ02 said:

---

What if we just raise the retirement age to 80. Folks are living much longer now than back when SS was rolled out.

Work until you die, then SS is no longer a problem.

---

Time to see how much better the Boomers really are than everyone who came after them.

---

Agreed. Everyone who has been in the job market for 5 years should already have the same level of wealth and lifestyle that someone that's been in it for 45 has. That's only fair....

AGC said:

---

LMCane said:

---

AGC said:

---

halfastros81 said:

---

Had the system been set up right to begin with so that the allegedly "earmarked" money couldn't be used for other purposes then SS would be and would remain solvent imo. That is the fundamental issue with it .

It's essentially a forced contract with really bad terms . Had it not been forced then I would have opted out and I'd be a lot better off for it so yes , now that I contributed to it at gunpoint for almost 50 yrs I do expect my relative pittance of a return and I'm not remotely going to feel bad about it.

---

This is the problem: you know it's insolvent, you simply don't care. That's what's repeated in this thread, time after time.

That's why the revolution is coming (which is not a threat btw, it's a mathematical fact). It's alarming that y'all have changed selfishness (I'm gonna get mine) into some sort of virtue (I did my part [in the Ponzi scheme, even though I knew it wouldn't work]).

---

it's hard to even have a political disagreement with people who can't understand basic logic and REALITY.

it is not "selfishness" when you go to your bank and withdraw your own money.

IT IS YOUR MONEY THAT YOU GAVE TO THE BANK

---

That's not how it works and hasn't been for decades. This is self-deceit, at best.

Whatever you thought it was has changed, and you saw it change, but you haven't adapted your mindset to the new reality (irony, right?).

Do the math! It doesn't work, no matter what you think you're owed. There simply aren't the same number of people paying in to cash you out. Forcing them into debt for it is slavery, no matter what you want to call it.

---

So you are saying that the US population is shrinking?

Hey Don Quixote.....why you tilting at windmills? (and trying to virtue signal in the process?)

The math starts to work if you:

-Means test to a level where above that people get 0.

-Do away with the spousal benefits calculations/windfall and extend it to people that have were married for 20 years or longer before they divorced.

-Do away with the upper limit of yearly salary where SS/FICA tax stops and is no longer taken out.

-Raise the employee and employer percentage slightly.

Math isn't that hard.

Rattler12 said:

---

AGC said:

---

LMCane said:

---

AGC said:

---

halfastros81 said:

---

Had the system been set up right to begin with so that the allegedly "earmarked" money couldn't be used for other purposes then SS would be and would remain solvent imo. That is the fundamental issue with it .

It's essentially a forced contract with really bad terms . Had it not been forced then I would have opted out and I'd be a lot better off for it so yes , now that I contributed to it at gunpoint for almost 50 yrs I do expect my relative pittance of a return and I'm not remotely going to feel bad about it.

---

This is the problem: you know it's insolvent, you simply don't care. That's what's repeated in this thread, time after time.

That's why the revolution is coming (which is not a threat btw, it's a mathematical fact). It's alarming that y'all have changed selfishness (I'm gonna get mine) into some sort of virtue (I did my part [in the Ponzi scheme, even though I knew it wouldn't work]).

---

it's hard to even have a political disagreement with people who can't understand basic logic and REALITY.

it is not "selfishness" when you go to your bank and withdraw your own money.

IT IS YOUR MONEY THAT YOU GAVE TO THE BANK

---

That's not how it works and hasn't been for decades. This is self-deceit, at best.

Whatever you thought it was has changed, and you saw it change, but you haven't adapted your mindset to the new reality (irony, right?).

Do the math! It doesn't work, no matter what you think you're owed. There simply aren't the same number of people paying in to cash you out. Forcing them into debt for it is slavery, no matter what you want to call it.

---

So you are saying that the US population is shrinking?

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Do you know how the system works?

Rattler12 said:

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tysker said:

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Quote:

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There is already less money coming in - FICA - than going out for SS. We are simply cashing bonds to pay for the excess now. The money for those bonds comes from general tax revenue. It's nothing but ledger entries.

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That is my basis for arguing that SS is essentially welfare. Same thing with Medicare.
But there is no cost borne by the recipient; the working class and the taxpayer carry the costs. The recipient no longer has skin in the game.

Thus, maybe we should consider that recipients of these benefits lose their privilege to vote in federal elections.

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There was a cost borne by this recipient and his employers for 40 plus years.
Let's say you contributed to a company retirement plan for 40 years and the company matched it. All of a sudden your employer ditches the plan, keeps the money and says sorry pal you're just SOL. What's your response going to be?

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Like a pension? There are legal avenues to recoup some of that money, no?

We're talking about the federal govt here. Apples to oranges.

Lone Stranger said:

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Hey Don Quixote.....why you tilting at windmills? (and trying to virtue signal in the process?)

The math starts to work if you:

-Means test to a level where above that people get 0.

-Do away with the spousal benefits calculations/windfall and extend it to people that have were married for 20 years or longer before they divorced.

-Do away with the upper limit of yearly salary where SS/FICA tax stops and is no longer taken out.

-Raise the employee and employer percentage slightly.

Math isn't that hard.

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Please note it took nine pages for something where everyone gives instead of 'I'm gettin mine.' I have no problem with these suggestions.

I don't need to virtue signal. I'm going to live the reality of less.