Didn't see this story on Texags. If a thread is already going please delete.

I'm m not catholic, so part of me says meh who cares. However, if this is done at the Vatican what other denominations might be ok with this. Who the hell thought this was a good idea. Is history no longer taught in Europe, have the Europeans forgotten about the battle of Tours? That if it wasnt for one man, Europe might have a different history.

Muslim scholars visiting the Vatican Apostolic Library are being accommodated with prayer spaces, its Vice Prefect has confirmed

Vatican Library grants Muslim scholars a prayer room

I'm not catholic and I genuinely detest Islam on the whole.

That said, I don't think this is a big deal.

I'm Catholic and I don't see a problem with this assuming the pursuits of these 'scholars' are genuine.

This does surprise me at all. The Catholic Church has been in a biblical tailspin for years. Now, it has the second heretical, apostate pope in a row. It invited its own downfall, and many devout people have ditched the church in response. This incident just confirms what many have known for a long while.

If that is all there is to it, this isn't unusual. Vatican is engaged in diplomatic activity and providing suitable worship shrines and quarters for visitors of different faiths is not strange. And it goes back a ways to. Constantinople had a designated mosque for visiting emissaries, but it didn't reflect any general acceptance or embrace of the religion. This may or may not be a "camel nose" in tent thing.

Hold your breath and run to look for the Christian prayer room in Mecca, or Medina. Or anywhere in Saudi Arabia.

Had a relative who worked a while in Saudi Arabia. Believe they did have a Christian chapel they were able to use. Will ask and confirm as now curious if recall correctly.

American Hardwood said:

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I'm Catholic and I don't see a problem with this assuming the pursuits of these 'scholars' are genuine.

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That's a mighty big assumption. I'm sure their "scholarly interests" are as pure as the wind driven snow.

My only question is, if the situation was reversed would Muslim leaders grant the Catholics a small chapel space to pray? I guarantee the answer is 100% no.

If the message is Islam is a religion established by God then iDK what to say other than they are way off course with an anti-Christian message.

As Christ said:
"I am the way, the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father except through me" John 14:6

I didn't read the link, but ayone who thinks the Lord is cool with that... probably ought to read Ezekiel 23. All of Ezekiel, but start there.

Got a story for you Ags... So, Ole Rock loved to travel <whoop>

And one day he was is the Middle East <whoop>.

Well, Ole Rock wanted to meet some local people, so he sought out the Lord's people <whoop> when he stumbled upon 2 daughters of one woman. <whoop>

Well, Ole Rock quickly realized the 1st woman was a ***** <this is where some whoop and some SSSS>.

As he was distancing himself from her, her sister said "If you.thinknshe is a whole, 'hold my beer.""

And that Ags was the 1st recorded "Hold my beer."

And the Lord exiled the two sisters like we're going to do to the t-sips.

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2 "Son of man, there were two women, the daughters of one mother. 3 They played the ***** in Egypt; they played the ***** in their youth; there their breasts were pressed and their virgin bosoms handled. 4 Oholah was the name of the elder and Oholibah the name of her sister. They became mine, and they bore sons and daughters. As for their names, Oholah is Samaria, and Oholibah is Jerusalem.

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You can read from there...

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Muslim scholars visiting the Vatican Apostolic Library ...

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Wht about the Catholic scholars visiting Mecca - what do they get?

Constantinople is now Istanbul. The Hagia Sophia is now a mosque....lol, Erdogon is deporting christians from Turkiye. Urban Ii is rolling over in his grave. Islam is conquering the West, Christianity is on the ropes.

This is probably just one dumb person's decision at one place. The "Vatican" is a vast bureaucratic complex like DC, except the government it runs is ten times older. Hard to hold "the Vatican" responsible for some librarian's policy. It'd be like a librarian in DC having a trans teen book and calling it "US government wants to trans kids." Usually news stories like this are great because really stupid stuff gets killed when light is shone upon it. Hopefully that's what happens here.

titan said:

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Had a relative who worked a while in Saudi Arabia. Believe they did have a Christian chapel they were able to use. Will ask and confirm as now curious if recall correctly.

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Things may have changed but when I was there during the Iran/Iraq War; Desert Shield/Storm and Operation Southern Watch we were not allowed to openly display our Christianity. We had worship tents but it could not have any Christian symbolism. Whether that was approved by the Saudis or more of a "don't ask; don't tell type thing, I don't know.

In other news, the Vatican burned down last night.

Sources suggested it was probably just an electrical fire

Kozmozag said:

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Constantinople is now Istanbul. The Hagia Sophia is now a mosque....lol, Erdogon is deporting christians from Turkiye. Urban Ii is rolling over in his grave. Islam is conquering the West, Christianity is on the ropes.

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Good point. And Muslims believe in conquest and holding territory. They believe once something belongs to Islam, it does forever. You can be sure that some of these Muslims see this as conquering the Vatican and they have fantasies of taking it physically since it now "belongs to Islam."

I know that sounds absurd, but that's how the fundamentalist Muslims see the world. That's why they will fight over something for generations.

God also said - You shall have no other gods before Me.

I understand letting all people come to visit the Vatican. But making a space to help people worship other gods seems like a direct violation of the first commandment.

I'm not Catholic, but it's hard to fathom a Pope would allow this.

The Vatican is a sovereign country, the Vatican Apostolic Library does now have a space for Muslim visitors and scholars to pray. The library has collected documents for all religions so I understand letting scholars from all religions in for that reason.

It's in the second book of the Bible, Exodus 20 (you know the ten commandments part). "You shall have no other gods before me", and is all over other parts of the Bible. If they have scholars from all over the world I understand having places to worship but if I remember correctly there is not a space for Christians to worship now, only Muslims. It is a library, have the same rules for everyone and don't bend a knee to the Muslims.

I attended a few Catholic churches over the years and remember the part in the Nicene Creed about "we believe in one God". Opening up a prayer room for another religion contradicts that belief

I think this type of accommodation is wrong in every way. I am all for being hospitable to guests, even those who are not Christians, but giving them a place to perform Islamic rituals within a Christian institution is sanctioning idolatry. They should have politely but firmly declined this request.

AGROAg88 said:

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Hold your breath and run to look for the Christian prayer room in Mecca, or Medina. Or anywhere in Saudi Arabia.

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Serious question.

I go to church every Sunday. Earlier this year, I converted from Catholic to Methodist. One of the main reasons I did so because Methodists love to quote scripture and repeat turns like "showing each other grace," and "treat others as you would like to be treated." All of that being said, is it not graceful to respect others?

zephyr88 said:

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Muslim scholars visiting the Vatican Apostolic Library ...

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Wht about the Catholic scholars visiting Mecca - what do they get?

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Turned away at best. Deported, arrested, and/or fined should they persist. Goes for Medina as well.

Allowing the practice of a false religion at your church is not "being respectful." I feel certain Jesus would not accommodate non-believers in such a way.

Charpie said:

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AGROAg88 said:

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Hold your breath and run to look for the Christian prayer room in Mecca, or Medina. Or anywhere in Saudi Arabia.

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Serious question.

I go to church every Sunday. Earlier this year, I converted from Catholic to Methodist. One of the main reasons I did so because Methodists love to quote scripture and repeat turns like "showing each other grace," and "treat others as you would like to be treated." All of that being said, is it not graceful to respect others?

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It's graceful to be courteous to others. Respect is something that is earned. Small distinction, but I hate the misuse of the word "respect".

Pope Marx II

And there are still people who want the Pope to rule over the US.

UMC or GMC?

Recall that Jesus flipped over tables in the Temple because people were doing all manner of things other than praying to God. Jesus absolutely would not consider praying to a false God the same as praying to God the Father.

American Hardwood said:

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I'm Catholic and I don't see a problem with this assuming the pursuits of these 'scholars' are genuine.

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The Vatican library is not a sacramental space. The "Vatican" is a very small country not one big church.

Wait till the Catholics start repatriating religious texts to Muslims as they make claims of white supremacy and colonialism.

zephyr88 said:

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Muslim scholars visiting the Vatican Apostolic Library ...

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Wht about the Catholic scholars visiting Mecca - what do they get?

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Why would catholic scholars visit Mecca? It holds no Christian significance.

This reminds me of Duke University allowing muslims to pray in their chapel, except magnified 1000x. Duke was a Methodist school that stopped taking its Christian mission seriously and is now just a liberal, secular institution focused on nothing related to God. Under these two most recent Popes, it looks like the Catholic church is being steered in the same direction.

Jeeper79 said:

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zephyr88 said:

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Muslim scholars visiting the Vatican Apostolic Library ...

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Wht about the Catholic scholars visiting Mecca - what do they get?

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Why would catholic scholars visit Mecca? It holds no Christian significance.

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Exactly. The Vatican library houses some of the world's oldest Qurans and vast Arabic, Islamic, and other religious manuscripts. Mecca holds ZERO significance to Christians.

This is about giving other humans access to historical records. If Mecca has a vast historical library, then we'd be comparing apples to apples.

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Allowing the practice of a false religion at your church is not "being respectful."

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To my understanding, the whole of the Vatican isn't a church. I'm not Catholic, so I can't speak for their priorities. But if one of those priorities is to convince others of their beliefs, it's a lot easier to do that and have those conversations at your place than to have to go to their place to do so. And if the way to get them to your place is to clear out a room for them to pray, seems like a cheap price to pay. It's not like they are performing human sacrifice in there. Worst case, nothing happens. And since you believe there is only one God, the best case is they hear God.

Fishing Fools said:

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UMC or GMC?

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GMC