Got my blood boiling this morning....BP is on the rise

Watching the news about the ****show in Newark (EWR) and listening to Chuck Schumer blame Trump and Doge for what's going on makes me want to punch him in the larynx!! F that mother****er.

Then they show Sean Duffy and he blames previous administration. I get it and give him the benefit of the doubt as he's only been on the job for a few months, but quit blaming people and put a damn plan/bill together to get this fixed....NOW! before a tragedy occurs.This is actual gov't spending that makes sense and I don't mind.

We spend TRILLIONS every year on useless ****, and we are running a system that should have been replaced 20 years ago. The damn thing runs on floppy disks and bubble gum. Pisses me off that actual needs never get addressed but BS pet projects and special interests get 99% of politicians attention.

Things are fine

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listening to Chuck Schumer blame Trump and Doge for what's going on makes me want to punch him in the larynx!! F that mother****er.

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Thanks man, that made me laugh.

The Dems absolutely don't give two craps about anything other than moving to full blown Marxism.

Buttgig didn't do a damn thing to address ATC. He was too busy opining about racism in interstates.

samurai_science said:

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Things are fine

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you might think they are fine based on statistics, but when a MAJOR hub loses power, loses all frequency, and radar...that's not fine.

Aggie95 said:

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samurai_science said:

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Things are fine

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you might think they are fine based on statistics, but when a MAJOR hub loses power, loses all frequency, and radar...that's not fine.

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GIve me the data showing its abnormal

samurai_science said:

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Aggie95 said:

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samurai_science said:

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Things are fine

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you might think they are fine based on statistics, but when a MAJOR hub loses power, loses all frequency, and radar...that's not fine.

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GIve me the data showing its abnormal

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admittedly don't have it, but if it's NOT abnormal to lose power, radar, and frequency....that is not a data point in your favor. It SHOULD be very abnormal for that kind of stuff to happen.

When United Airlines says...."find another airport to fly in/out of" you know it's a freaking mess.

Obama started the demise of the ATC program when instead of hiring on merit and skill it was by gender and color of your skin. There is a class action lawsuit about this, and I hope those that were denied get some payment, as most were qualified and would have added value to the system.

United says to avoid the airport?

Just flew from Newark to London this morning and was on the tarmac for 10 minutes. The news is just doing their thing.

Here's a pretty decent data point from the GAO released September of 2024.

https://www.gao.gov/products/gao-24-107001

"The assessment determined that of its 138 systems, 51 (37 percent) were unsustainable and 54 (39 percent) were potentially unsustainable (see figure 1)."

The systems have been bad for decades. Its several administrations fault.

Cowbird said:

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Just flew from Newark to London this morning and was on the tarmac for 10 minutes. The news is just doing their thing.

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Glad to hear your flight went off fine. I'm flying out of EWR to Vegas Sunday and all the news is disconcerting. Just yesterday hundreds of flights were delayed and around 150 cancelled. Plus today is the first day of the Real ID requirement, so I'm expecting more problems from that on top of the previous issues.

Regarding United, I received their text about trying to avoid EWR and to try LaGuardia or Philly with a flight change and in their generosity they are waiving change fees. Philly is a ridiculous suggestion, but I checked LaGuardia and they only have one hops from there via Chicago, Houston or Denver and it's an additional $1800 fare. Total joke.

Logos Stick said:

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United says to avoid the airport?

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https://www.nj.com/news/2025/05/united-airlines-urges-people-to-consider-avoiding-newark-find-a-different-airport.html

80sGeorge said:

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Here's a pretty decent data point from the GAO released September of 2024.

https://www.gao.gov/products/gao-24-107001

"The assessment determined that of its 138 systems, 51 (37 percent) were unsustainable and 54 (39 percent) were potentially unsustainable (see figure 1)."

The systems have been bad for decades. Its several administrations fault.

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I mean isn't everything "potentially unsustainable?"

I think this statement from the GAO report indicates FAA leadership is a mess and has been for a long while

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Lastly, FAA has not consistently provided oversight of ATC modernization investments. Specifically, FAA's acquisition oversight council had not ensured that investments deliver functionality in segments. In addition, while the council held quarterly reviews for investments, it did not consistently monitor high risks. Moreover, for three selected investments, GAO found that the council reviewed some, but not all, required documentation prior to approving investments to proceed to the next lifecycle phase. Lastly, FAA oversight officials did not annually approve the business cases for the three investments, before submitting them to the Office of Management and Budget (OMB) and the federal IT investment transparency website (IT Dashboard). This limits FAA's ability to mitigate cost and schedule overruns, increases the risk of system failures, and reduces informed decision making.

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Logos Stick said:

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United says to avoid the airport?

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Yes. BF was booked on a flight to EWR later this week. He decided to change it to LGA because of this situation. When I logged in, there was a note on the reservation stating you can change at no cost. They are hoping people will change because they've had to cancel something like 35-40 flights per day to EWR.

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quit blaming people and put a damn plan/bill together to get this fixed....NOW!

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Logos Stick said:

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United says to avoid the airport?

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Have a flight to Newark next week and Unites sent a notification yesterday through their app essentially telling us to change airports, at no additional cost. Checked all flights into LGA and they're all booked. I would go from exit row in economy plus to sitting middle seat without my wife in economy. Fk that.

EWR sucks giant donkey balls on its best day.

wow

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Delays and cancellations have been mounting since last week, when United's CEO told customers in a letter that ongoing air traffic control staffing issues are forcing the airline to cancel 35 roundtrip flights per day from its Newark schedule going forward.

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This is only going to get worse with demographic and population issues.

Ducks4brkfast said:

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Logos Stick said:

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United says to avoid the airport?

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Have a flight to Newark next week and Unites sent a notification yesterday through their app essentially telling us to change airports, at no additional cost. Checked all flights into LGA and they're all booked. I would go from exit row in economy plus to sitting middle seat without my wife in economy. Fk that.

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wow

This is years of government processes and red tape. They need to throw lots of money at R&D, implementation, and hiring controllers. You normally get 3 out of 10 controllers that initially apply through the entire process.

Logos Stick said:

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wow

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Delays and cancellations have been mounting since last week, when United's CEO told customers in a letter that ongoing air traffic control staffing issues are forcing the airline to cancel 35 roundtrip flights per day from its Newark schedule going forward.

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This is going to only get worse with demographic and population issues.

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35 flights per day is a huge number of people to try to reorganize. I almost.....almost, feel sorry for all the low level customer service employees who will have to listen to all the Karens screech about the flight cancellations.

samurai_science said:

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Aggie95 said:

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samurai_science said:

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Things are fine

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you might think they are fine based on statistics, but when a MAJOR hub loses power, loses all frequency, and radar...that's not fine.

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GIve me the data showing its abnormal

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Do you want me to forward you the flood of text messages I got from United?

That was definitely abnormal.

NE PA Ag said:

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The news is just doing their thing.Regarding United, I received their text about trying to avoid EWR and to try LaGuardia or Philly with a flight change and in their generosity they are waiving change fees. Philly is a ridiculous suggestion, but I checked LaGuardia and they only have one hops from there via Chicago, Houston or Denver and it's an additional $1800 fare. Total joke.

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PHL might work depending where you're coming from.

My buddy Deepak lives in middle NJ and only flies out of Newark.

But... PHL is only 30 miles further away than EWR.

If it made the difference between getting on a flight or being stranded, it's not a bad one.

On the other side of the coin, if you were coming from Connecticut, BDL or even BOS might be a better suggestion.

When my daughter was attending VMI, United cancelled my flight out of Roanoke, VA but gave me the option to drive 200+ miles to Dulles and get a different flight which I gladly did because my final destination was Sydney, Australia and I needed to fly home that night.

Aggie95 said:

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When United Airlines says...."find another airport to fly in/out of" you know it's a freaking mess.

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Normally that only happens when there's 16+ inches of snow in Denver.

But even then, United is extremely slow to cancel flights. Delay, Delay, Delay, waste your whole day... Cancel.

HollywoodBQ said:

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NE PA Ag said:

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The news is just doing their thing.Regarding United, I received their text about trying to avoid EWR and to try LaGuardia or Philly with a flight change and in their generosity they are waiving change fees. Philly is a ridiculous suggestion, but I checked LaGuardia and they only have one hops from there via Chicago, Houston or Denver and it's an additional $1800 fare. Total joke.

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PHL might work depending where you're coming from.

My buddy Deepak lives in middle NJ and only flies out of Newark.

But... PHL is only 30 miles further away than EWR.

If it made the difference between getting on a flight or being stranded, it's not a bad one.

On the other side of the coin, if you were coming from Connecticut, BDL or even BOS might be a better suggestion.

When my daughter was attending VMI, United cancelled my flight out of Roanoke, VA but gave me the option to drive 200+ miles to Dulles and get a different flight which I gladly did because my final destination was Sydney, Australia and I needed to fly home that night.

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The FAA has been trying to combine the EWR sector with PHL for years. This appears to be a data communication link that is not working. The FAA has combined areas much further than 30 miles for years with little or no impact.

Yeah PHL isn't a bad suggestion. I go to Lakewood, NJ for work once a month. EWR to Lakewood is about 60 miles, PHL is 70-something.

It doesn't help anyone flying from TX, but the Trenton-Mercer airport is super convenient. Frontier has direct flights from ATL and several cities in FL. When I lived in NJ, that's how most everyone from the Jersey burbs and western PA would get down south.

agAngeldad said:

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HollywoodBQ said:

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NE PA Ag said:

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The news is just doing their thing.Regarding United, I received their text about trying to avoid EWR and to try LaGuardia or Philly with a flight change and in their generosity they are waiving change fees. Philly is a ridiculous suggestion, but I checked LaGuardia and they only have one hops from there via Chicago, Houston or Denver and it's an additional $1800 fare. Total joke.

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PHL might work depending where you're coming from.

My buddy Deepak lives in middle NJ and only flies out of Newark.

But... PHL is only 30 miles further away than EWR.

If it made the difference between getting on a flight or being stranded, it's not a bad one.

On the other side of the coin, if you were coming from Connecticut, BDL or even BOS might be a better suggestion.

When my daughter was attending VMI, United cancelled my flight out of Roanoke, VA but gave me the option to drive 200+ miles to Dulles and get a different flight which I gladly did because my final destination was Sydney, Australia and I needed to fly home that night.

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The FAA has been trying to combine the EWR sector with PHL for years. This appears to be a data communication link that is not working. The FAA has combined areas much further than 30 miles for years with little or no impact.

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Somebody "with a variety of interests" probably needs to get paid off in order to make that happen.

All the hype about REAL ID has got to be a joke.

States have been issuing these things for years now. There is almost ZERO way you have a current and valid ID and don't have a REAL ID; at least not in Texas. Plus if you're a somewhat frequent traveler with TSA PreCheck you certainly will not have to deal with the ferals on Spirit or Frontier that haven't renewed their DL in 12 years.


What I don't get about the Newark thing is the news reporting that controllers are taking a week off for "mental health" or some-such to recover following a significant event. Now certainly that situation the other day, with a total loss of power was a complete show, but it's not like you were sitting on your station watching the altitude peel off of a plane that was careening out of the sky. They need a week off to "recover" from their systems going offline?

And yes, as others have alluded to, the FAA is a mess. This is where DOGE needs to go in there and absolutely clean house. Then get a qualified crew in and they could probably modernize the entire ATC system in before the end of Trump's term. Just get systems and code that works and not worry about whether or not the code is somehow racist or how gay the whatever was that typed it.

NATCA is a real road block. 30-35 days was meant for those involved in an aircraft accident however that has morphed into a vacation. Don't underestimate the mental tragedy of losing an aircraft but equipment outages happen all the time.

Kenneth_2003 said:

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All the hype about REAL ID has got to be a joke.

States have been issuing these things for years now. There is almost ZERO way you have a current and valid ID and don't have a REAL ID; at least not in Texas. Plus if you're a somewhat frequent traveler with TSA PreCheck you certainly will not have to deal with the ferals on Spirit or Frontier that haven't renewed their DL in 12 years.


What I don't get about the Newark thing is the news reporting that controllers are taking a week off for "mental health" or some-such to recover following a significant event. Now certainly that situation the other day, with a total loss of power was a complete show, but it's not like you were sitting on your station watching the altitude peel off of a plane that was careening out of the sky. They need a week off to "recover" from their systems going offline?

And yes, as others have alluded to, the FAA is a mess. This is where DOGE needs to go in there and absolutely clean house. Then get a qualified crew in and they could probably modernize the entire ATC system in before the end of Trump's term. Just get systems and code that works and not worry about whether or not the code is somehow racist or how gay the whatever was that typed it.

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I heard this morning that they have in the union contract a 45 day leave process and many are taking the leave in response to the media attention to all the aircraft near misses this year. The leaves are not directly tied to the Newark incidents, but other incidents this year.

I can fully understand needing time off to put your head back together when you lose an aircraft... But yeah they're playing the system.

Maybe they all need to be Regan'd.

Just talked if a flight controller on the real story here. He is mad the real story isn't getting out.

Big power struggle at the FAA. FAA moved the radar group from Newark to Philly. This is the group that watches planes between airports.

This pissed off the whole group do to relocating from NYC area to Philly. Adding to the problem, there is massive problems with the antiquated equipment on the transfer over. Basically radar is dropping constantly and they don't have eyes on planes Nemours times a day.

The air traffic controller contracts state " if there is an event (mid air collision or mid area close call) the controller is allow 45 days off for mental health. 3/4 of the group said I want my 45 days.

Now there is no one to watch the skies and with equipment that doesn't work in a town they don't want to be in.

I grew up in Northwest NJ and we frequently flew out of Allentown PA to avoid EWR.