Maybe Trump really wants to abolish income taxes and maybe he just says he wants to but I see no way it'll happen with this current legislative mix.

Bad Trump.

If you enjoyed being terrorized by meth heads with 84 month notes on their Hellcats, just wait.

CanyonAg77 said:

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Funky Winkerbean said:

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CanyonAg77 said:

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94chem said:

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I buy used cars, and I pay cash. Not really interested in subsidizing your loan.

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So much this.

If you live in a state with high sales tax, and you're upside down on your car and house, why should I subsidize you?

Reward the people who save and invest, not the people.with debt

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How is it subsidizing a loan?

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If a person with a loan pays less tax than a person with the same income and no loan, that's a subsidy

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Using that logic, would you consider your ag exemption a subsidy?

I suppose there are at least 5 kinds of rich:
1) Retire comfortably and not worry about the bills again rich. 7 figure-ish
2) Eat wherever you want and vacation wherever you want rich. 8 figure
3) FU generational rich. 9 figure
4) Uber-rich - 10 figure (billionaire)
5) GDP rich - 11 figure+

#1 and #2 will be off-limits for Republicans, but #3 - #5 could be in trouble at any time from any regime that has significant dependence on the have-nots for power. What is fascinating about our current dynamic is just how many have-nots voted for Trump.

94chem said:

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I suppose there are at least 5 kinds of rich:
1) Retire comfortably and not worry about the bills again rich. 7 figure-ish
2) Eat wherever you want and vacation wherever you want rich. 8 figure
3) FU generational rich. 9 figure
4) Uber-rich - 10 figure (billionaire)
5) GDP rich - 11 figure+

#1 and #2 will be off-limits for Republicans, but #3 - #5 could be in trouble at any time from any regime that has significant dependence on the have-nots for power. What is fascinating about our current dynamic is just how many have-nots voted for Trump.

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The best way for a have-not to become a have is to vote for the candidate promising to reduce taxes and government red tape.

94chem said:

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I suppose there are at least 5 kinds of rich:
1) Retire comfortably and not worry about the bills again rich. 7 figure-ish
2) Eat wherever you want and vacation wherever you want rich. 8 figure
3) FU generational rich. 9 figure
4) Uber-rich - 10 figure (billionaire)
5) GDP rich - 11 figure+

#1 and #2 will be off-limits for Republicans, but #3 - #5 could be in trouble at any time from any regime that has significant dependence on the have-nots for power. What is fascinating about our current dynamic is just how many have-nots voted for Trump.

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While #3 - #5 could "be in trouble at any time" , there are very few people in that range.
~800 billionaires with a combined net worth of ~6.22 trillion (that's just net worth, not income)

That's why when Dems talk about taxing "millionaires and billionaires" their focus is actually on 0 (not on your list) - middle class folks not made it to 7 figures yet, 1 and 2.

94chem said:

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I suppose there are at least 5 kinds of rich:
1) Retire comfortably and not worry about the bills again rich. 7 figure-ish
2) Eat wherever you want and vacation wherever you want rich. 8 figure
3) FU generational rich. 9 figure
4) Uber-rich - 10 figure (billionaire)
5) GDP rich - 11 figure+

#1 and #2 will be off-limits for Republicans, but #3 - #5 could be in trouble at any time from any regime that has significant dependence on the have-nots for power. What is fascinating about our current dynamic is just how many have-nots voted for Trump.

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They have nots in the bottom 1/5 are squarely on the dem plantation and vote accordingly. They receive the income based entitlements.

That next 2/5 though is largely unaffected by income taxes policies. But they are affected by the economy. Trump has made massive inroads with that group through promises of bringing back industry jobs. Hence his focus on tariffs. They also care about SS and Medicare. Which is why Trump has only targeted Medicaid for removal. He also panders to this group with no taxes on overtime or SS. Tax deductions for car loans and the like. The part of this group that hates wokeness will naturally vote Trump.

The top 2/5 are just screwed. They pay for everything with that skewed largely towards the top 1/5. They are a mixture of dems and republicans.

Funky Winkerbean said:

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CanyonAg77 said:

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Funky Winkerbean said:

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CanyonAg77 said:

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94chem said:

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I buy used cars, and I pay cash. Not really interested in subsidizing your loan.

---

So much this.

If you live in a state with high sales tax, and you're upside down on your car and house, why should I subsidize you?

Reward the people who save and invest, not the people.with debt

---

How is it subsidizing a loan?

---

If a person with a loan pays less tax than a person with the same income and no loan, that's a subsidy

---

Using that logic, would you consider your ag exemption a subsidy?

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Yes. Next question.

Funky Winkerbean said:

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CanyonAg77 said:

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Funky Winkerbean said:

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CanyonAg77 said:

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94chem said:

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I buy used cars, and I pay cash. Not really interested in subsidizing your loan.

---

So much this.

If you live in a state with high sales tax, and you're upside down on your car and house, why should I subsidize you?

Reward the people who save and invest, not the people.with debt

---

How is it subsidizing a loan?

---

If a person with a loan pays less tax than a person with the same income and no loan, that's a subsidy

---

Using that logic, would you consider your ag exemption a subsidy?

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Referring to property tax, I suppose. But a farm puts less pressure on the taxing authority than commercial real estate, so there is a fairness argument.

94chem said:

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El Gallo Blanco said:

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BTKAG97 said:

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It's past time for a flat tax with a single, large exemption (expecting income tax to never be replaced).

Making taxes MORE COMPLICATED by adding more BS carve-outs is not what is needed.

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CONSUMPTION TAX. The most "fair" system...by far.

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Nope. You have to tax consumption, wealth and income. Focusing on one component more than the others will allow some people to skate while others have a heavier burden.

The most unfair tax of all is a tax on wealth that is not owned, otherwise known as property tax.

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No, you absolutely do not.

You also have to understand that no matter what, there will be some percentage of the population that figures out a way to circumvent the system. Always has been that way, always will be that way. Instead of punishing everybody else, you focus enforcement efforts on that subset regardless of whatever demographic they are or how much people whine and moan about being picked on, etc.

CanyonAg77 said:

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94chem said:

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I buy used cars, and I pay cash. Not really interested in subsidizing your loan.

---

So much this.

If you live in a state with high sales tax, and you're upside down on your car and house, why should I subsidize you?

Reward the people who save and invest, not the people.with debt

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That is the antithesis of what the government wants though. They want you in debt, upside down on everything you own, etc. Why? Because its far easier to manipulate and control those that have such burdens versus those that do not.

backintexas2013 said:

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No the most unfair tax right now is income tax. Some pay nothing while others pay way more than their fair share. Everyone should pay the same. Flat tax no deductions

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The achille's heel with a flat tax is that it is only assessed on reported income. And there are a lot of folks out there that work on a cash basis, and with the implementation of a flat tax system that number would grow exponentially.

With a consumption tax, when you buy goods you pay. Regardless of whether you are a W-4, 1099 or cash only type of income. A benefit is that you also get to decide what your tax burden is going to be - the less you spend on items, the less your burden ends up being.

The hole in the consumption system is that the used goods market will be bigger than it is now, and people will naturally hold onto things longer than they currently do because of the consumption tax. But that isn't a bad thing, especially if consumer debt goes down.

All systems have some sort of flaw, it cannot be helped. I prefer one that requires everybody, regardless of income, to pay into the system and has the widest net to ensure that you, me, Juan, Hector, Tyrone and Chin Loo over there pay our fair share instead of just you and me paying your share, my share and their share.

pagerman @ work said:

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Kansas Kid said:

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4 said:

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flashplayer said:

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That sounds like a credit, not a deduction. Unless I just forgot math. Which is possible.

If it's a deduction, a $500 deduction isn't really helping people that much.

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It's $500 more than you were getting before on something you were going to buy anyway

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And where is that $500 coming from? Fellow Americans and in this case, American children since it will add to national debt. Do you also support a $500 deduction for student loans? Maybe we should just forgive all car debt at the same time.

No subsidies for any business.

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Things like this are why Trump will never balance the budget, and any statement he makes about doing so is ludicrous.

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No president will ever balance the budget as long as Congress spends like drunken sailors at a Phillipino house of ill repute while on leave.

Additionally, no president will ever balance the budget if we continue to consider borrowing and spending a few trillion a year more than the tax receipts as part of our budget.

Pinochet said:

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Funky Winkerbean said:

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CanyonAg77 said:

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Funky Winkerbean said:

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CanyonAg77 said:

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94chem said:

---

I buy used cars, and I pay cash. Not really interested in subsidizing your loan.

---

So much this.

If you live in a state with high sales tax, and you're upside down on your car and house, why should I subsidize you?

Reward the people who save and invest, not the people.with debt

---

How is it subsidizing a loan?

---

If a person with a loan pays less tax than a person with the same income and no loan, that's a subsidy

---

Using that logic, would you consider your ag exemption a subsidy?

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Yes. Next question.

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He doesn't like the proposal because in his opinion it subsidizes the person holding the loan, yet he also enjoys tax breaks that others don't.

halfastros81 said:

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Maybe Trump really wants to abolish income taxes and maybe he just says he wants to but I see no way it'll happen with this current legislative mix.

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I never thought we'd have a department like DOGE.