Cars have gotten too expensive, holding middle class down

16,497 Views | 249 Replies | Last: 9 days ago by 94chem
beerad12man
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CampSkunk said:

Overblown and misleading. My kids have an old Sequoia that they bought for $3,000, 4-year-old Forrester that they bought for $27K, a four-year-old Honda Odyssey for about $25K. The only one of them who bought new picked up a Ford Maverick for less than $30K. I on the other hand do buy the expensive SUV's and pickups, because I can afford it. Guess what? When I was younger and couldn't afford it, I bought old and used. If you don't want to high car payment you can avoid it and still have reliable transportation.
Posts like these always miss the point. NO ONE is saying you absolutely cannot afford any kind of car at all. But......

Wages simply have not kept up. To get the same thing today takes a higher percent of income. Even if you take the cheapest thing you can get. It's simple math, and some of you continue to scoff over that in everyone of these threads from vehicles to housing to groceries. Some always say you can find cheaper options. Yes. True. But again, those cheaper options on average still take up more of a percent of income today than they did 5 and 10 years ago.

So basically, you make the same sacrifice, but you still tie up more of your money than you would have 10 years ago. For the average wage. Maybe for you, your wages have outpaced it. If so, consider yourself lucky. But that certainly isn't he case for, well, the AVERAGE person.

For example upon a QUICK search: A used honda civic that is 10 years old (2014) and has 75k miles on lists typically around $14-17k. The CHEAPEST options for anything under 100k miles is about $12k. Doing a search for a 2004 Honda civic with that many miles back in 2014 (the equivalent timeline of the first search 10 years later) would have cost around $4-5k on average. That means a 275-300% price increase. Have wages gone up 300% in the last 10 years?

So again, you can buy that cheaper civic. To the average person, it still hurts their monthly balance much more now than it did in 2014.
Teslag
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aggiehawg said:

Quote:

Considering I typically keep cars for 10-15 years, if I could get 96 months at 0%, I'd do it in a heartbeat and you'd see me rolling a Denali.
Ditto. Since 1989, I have had three vehicles in total. 1989 Mercedes. 2003 Trailblazer, 2017 Traverse. And the only reason I bought the Trailblazer was because we had recently purchased a lake house, that was off a dirt and gravel road and needed to haul stuff (including my Mom and her stuff) back and forth. My Mercedes was just too small. Needed the cargo room of the SUV.

I love, love, loved my Mercedes and didn't sell it quickly after I got the Trailblazer. But after several weeks of driving the Traiblazer, I had occasion to drive the Mercedes and suddenly it felt so low to the ground and so small. Finally sold it to my Mom's neighbor who had always liked it.

I'm the complete opposite. I average a new car every 3 years or so. I replaced a 2021 Chevy 1500 with 2023 Chevy 2500 diesel in April of this year. Just replaced it with a 2024 Colorado a few weeks ago.
GE
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As long as they keep pumping out new cars faster than we pump out new drivers, prices will eventually go down. It's a now problem but I'd be surprised if this topic is as relevant in 10 years.
CDUB98
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I am keeping a closer eye on prices and incentives as December approaches. A deal may very well be out there lurking.

Still not sure I want a payment again though.
beerad12man
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And to add to what I said above, it's the government regulations and subsidies in large part causing this. Why some of you always go straight to telling others to "make more sacrifices. Live below your means" line rather than your first inclination being that the government should be making your blood boil is beyond me.
beerad12man
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GE said:

As long as they keep pumping out new cars faster than we pump out new drivers, prices will eventually go down. It's a now problem but I'd be surprised if this topic is as relevant in 10 years.
I sure hope so. For me, I'm in a fortunate spot that I should be able to drive my truck into the ground for a good 6-8 more years. By then, maybe the average car, or in my case truck, will be far less of a percentage of my income than it is today.

But just because I'm in a fortunate spot doesn't mean I don't feel for my fellow Americans.
DannyDuberstein
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Too many mandates driving increased cost and skewing supply to where it doesn't match consumer preferences
sam callahan
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The cost of buying a couple years old and driving it for 150,000 miles or more has skyrocketed, too.

Still cheaper but good grief repairs and maintenance costs have gotten unreal.
Kyle Field Shade Chaser
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Except a used naturally aspirated Toyota is over $30K now for a used car with 115K miles on it
Phatbob
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sam callahan said:

The cost of buying a couple years old and driving it for 150,000 miles or more has skyrocketed, too.

Still cheaper but good grief repairs and maintenance costs have gotten unreal.
Maintenance on my 3 Hondas was somewhere around $1300 total last year, with 2 of them being almost 15 years old each and those 2 requiring replacement parts. It can be done cheaply with the right vehicles.
AgRN16
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AggieDruggist89 said:

Used Toyota for the win.


My 5th gen 4runner is so awesome. Our whole family loves her. Got her new in 2019 and now at 108k miles. FANTASTIC vehicle.
swimmerbabe11
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CDUB98 said:

My truck is a 2013 with 161k miles. I wish I could buy a new one, but I'm too fearful of the future economic situation.

Same, but Jeep Grand Cherokee. Bought it new for ~23k. When I loked, it would cost 50k for the same vehicle with similar specs according to the website. I know its been 10 years, but doubling in price is a pretty huge leap.

I'm hoping to drive it until it literally can't go anymore.
ChipFTAC01
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swimmerbabe11 said:

CDUB98 said:

My truck is a 2013 with 161k miles. I wish I could buy a new one, but I'm too fearful of the future economic situation.

Same, but Jeep Grand Cherokee. Bought it new for ~23k. When I loked, it would cost 50k for the same vehicle with similar specs according to the website. I know its been 10 years, but doubling in price is a pretty huge leap.

I'm hoping to drive it until it literally can't go anymore.


I bought a 2000 gc in 03 with 40k miles for about $13k. I drove it until 2015 and about 220k miles when it literally died on the side of the road on the way to the dealer. I think I traded it in for $500. Bought a 2015 for about $35k that I'll hopefully drive for another 5-6 years. God forbid I buy another GC in 2030. What a boring existence.
DCAggie13y
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Sims said:

Cars also used to get you from point a to point b.

Now the car drives itself while you watch a movie with 7.1 surround and your heated massaging seat melts your cares away.

Maybe they need a lower end vehicle that accomplishes a task in a pragmatic way.


This is so true. I just bought a 2025 vehicle after driving my 2010 car around for 15 years. Holy hell batman, my new car practically drives itself. The technology leap is insane.
pacecar02
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I bought an 01 7.3 Excursion with 93k in March


I friggin love it
BenFiasco14
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philiah06 said:

People keep saying this, but we just bought a new Honda Pilot (old model January 2023) for 40k. My wife told me the price and I was like write the check, pay that thing off.


40k for a Honda pilot is insane.
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frenchtoast
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PascalsWager said:

I understand that its not possible for everyone. But the greatest decision we've made for our family was traded the 2nd car (and admittedly house space) for walkability.

Its a LIFE changing; in all aspects. Its cheaper, better for your health, better for your mental health and day to day morale. Kids can and do walk much further than I thought they could/would and there's no battle to get into car.

Same here, minus the kids. I totaled my car in 2019 and chose not to replace it. Since then, we've moved several times over the past five years but always make a point to live in walkable neighborhoods so we can rely less on our one remaining car. The thought of taking on the cost of a second car, especially with today's prices, is hard to imagine.

I'm a big advocate for giving people more transportation options. I would love to see improved public transit, better bike infrastructure, and more walkable communities so that those who choose not to own a car aren't forced into it just to meet their daily needs.
AggieDruggist89
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Kyle Field Shade Chaser said:

Except a used naturally aspirated Toyota is over $30K now for a used car with 115K miles on it


Forerunner and LC???

Bruh...
Kansas Kid
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DCAggie13y said:

Sims said:

Cars also used to get you from point a to point b.

Now the car drives itself while you watch a movie with 7.1 surround and your heated massaging seat melts your cares away.

Maybe they need a lower end vehicle that accomplishes a task in a pragmatic way.


This is so true. I just bought a 2025 vehicle after driving my 2010 car around for 15 years. Holy hell batman, my new car practically drives itself. The technology leap is insane.

And that is a large part of why your new car is more expensive. Luxury used to be cruise control, A/C and electric windows. Now it is a 7 speaker sound system, dynamic cruise, lane following, back up cameras, proximity sensors, high end nav systems, ability to connect with your vehicle online, heated and vented seats and steering wheels, etc.
swimmerbabe11
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ChipFTAC01 said:

swimmerbabe11 said:

CDUB98 said:

My truck is a 2013 with 161k miles. I wish I could buy a new one, but I'm too fearful of the future economic situation.

Same, but Jeep Grand Cherokee. Bought it new for ~23k. When I loked, it would cost 50k for the same vehicle with similar specs according to the website. I know its been 10 years, but doubling in price is a pretty huge leap.

I'm hoping to drive it until it literally can't go anymore.


I bought a 2000 gc in 03 with 40k miles for about $13k. I drove it until 2015 and about 220k miles when it literally died on the side of the road on the way to the dealer. I think I traded it in for $500. Bought a 2015 for about $35k that I'll hopefully drive for another 5-6 years. God forbid I buy another GC in 2030. What a boring existence.

I guess maybe that's something I'm fine with.. being boring. I like my car.
CampSkunk
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No, I didn't miss the point. Somehow the wages of my children have kept up, as have mine. Inflation has hurt across the board, and it isn't limited to vehicles. But it's not insurmountable.
IIIHorn
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ibtIBoughtATeslaWithBitcoin


( ...voice punctuated with a clap of distant thunder... )
CDUB98
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Quote:

dynamic cruise, lane following, back up cameras, proximity sensors, ability to connect with your vehicle online,
I don't want any of these things, but to get the others, like the nice stereo, heated/ventilated seats, and navigation, I don't have a choice.
EMY92
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javajaws said:

AggieDruggist89 said:

I struggle to comprehend people buying $90,000+ American Made SUVs.
When you add the insurance cost to that it would end up costing more than my mortgage. The pricing is totally out of whack.

Government efficiency regulations need to be loosened
The EV push needs to stop (let it be market driven not policy driven)
Manufacturers need to stop bloating every vehicle they make (in size AND features)
Insurance industry needs....something. The costs are outrageous. I don't know what the fix here might be other than cheaper vehicles to start with.

Why do you want manufacturers to provide things people don't want? I see that Mitsubishi is killing their little econo box that is the only new vehicle with a sticker price under $20,000 because no one is buying them.

In the US people want big vehicles, that's why everyone is making SUVs.
BluHorseShu
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Funky Winkerbean said:

Government allowing 8 year terms is part of the problem.
Agreed. Though the dealers need them to allow it or they wouldn't sell any vehicles, especially at these prices.
aggiehawg
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Quote:

I'm the complete opposite. I average a new car every 3 years or so. I replaced a 2021 Chevy 1500 with 2023 Chevy 2500 diesel in April of this year. Just replaced it with a 2024 Colorado a few weeks ago.
You pay cash?
TxAgPreacher
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S
I wish I could afford a truck.
Catag94
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Just like the push for emissions reductions on diesel powered car and equipment has driven up prices, now the push for electrification is doing the same.
No Spin Ag
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BusterAg said:

No Spin Ag said:

techno-ag said:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets/cars-were-once-a-financial-engine-of-america-s-middle-class-now-they-re-a-wealth-killer/ar-AA1tXWhC

Good article. Interview with people over at Dave Ramsey's podcast series. Average new car prices approaching $50k, many payments over $1k/mo. Used car averages close to $30k. Sucking up more and more income, now a trap more so than it ever was.

Government regs don't help of course, nor does the push for electrification.


Will tarrifs have any effect on auto prices?
Only if you are dead-set on a BMW or Mercedes.

Japan and South Korea have low or no tariffs on US sedans, so I don't see Trump jacking up tariffs on Hondas, Toyotas, Kias, or Hyundais.

Is it really important to you to own a European car?


Not at all. I was just asking to see what the market may look like in six months to a year when I'm looking for something new.
There are in fact two things, science and opinion; the former begets knowledge, the later ignorance. Hippocrates
rwv2055
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Hagen95 said:

Tea Party said:

Sims said:

Cars also used to get you from point a to point b.

Now the car drives itself while you watch a movie with 7.1 surround and your heated massaging seat melts your cares away.

Maybe they need a lower end vehicle that accomplishes a task in a pragmatic way.
Bring back carbs and the only electronics in a vehicle is the AM radio.

I'm only somewhat joking as I would seriously entertain a bare bones vehicle that could survive an EMP .
Horses are cheap these days.
LOL, no they are not!!
Teslag
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aggiehawg said:

Quote:

I'm the complete opposite. I average a new car every 3 years or so. I replaced a 2021 Chevy 1500 with 2023 Chevy 2500 diesel in April of this year. Just replaced it with a 2024 Colorado a few weeks ago.
You pay cash?

Depends on interest rate. If it's low I'll pay 50% down with cash/trade. If it's high I'll pay cash. I paid for $43k for the truck I just bought. But my trade was paid off and I got $50k for it. So I walked away with a new truck and a cashiers check for the difference.
2023NCAggies
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It sucks,I should have pulled the trigger back in 2020 before Trump got beat. Found a Trial boss on sale for 37k

It will never get that low again. Car manufacturers changed how they produce, before covid, they would over produce to get good pricing on materials, the more you buy the better the price.....

That is where you would get the sales on the previous years model, Texas truck month yada yada. Not anymore, which is major BS. Push mass quantities out you bast*ards, no one want to pay 47k for a Fing Trial boss
BenFiasco14
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I've never driven a new car.

I have never driven a used one either. In fact, I have never driven a vehicle with an internal combustion engine.

My parents instilled in me that my lifestyle should be the same as theirs when they were kids.

Which, oddly enough, was the same as my great great great grandparents.

I'm Amish.
CNN is an enemy of the state and should be treated as such.
infinity ag
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Well that is demand and supply. I thought we were all free market capitalists here.
DCAggie13y
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Kansas Kid said:

DCAggie13y said:

Sims said:

Cars also used to get you from point a to point b.

Now the car drives itself while you watch a movie with 7.1 surround and your heated massaging seat melts your cares away.

Maybe they need a lower end vehicle that accomplishes a task in a pragmatic way.


This is so true. I just bought a 2025 vehicle after driving my 2010 car around for 15 years. Holy hell batman, my new car practically drives itself. The technology leap is insane.

And that is a large part of why your new car is more expensive. Luxury used to be cruise control, A/C and electric windows. Now it is a 7 speaker sound system, dynamic cruise, lane following, back up cameras, proximity sensors, high end nav systems, ability to connect with your vehicle online, heated and vented seats and steering wheels, etc.


I'm not complaining about the price at all. I can also control my car with an app.
 
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