GigEmADED said:

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This is it "young adults" want to travel the world and they only care about themselves

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Kids who don't want to grow up and take responsibility and want to be kids all their lives.

94chem said:

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TexAgs91 said:

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94chem said:

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We need legal immigrants, and lots of them.

I have 6 kids, including 2 adopted internationally, but I can't carry everyone's water.

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Let's come up with an option that doesn't involve diluting our culture into oblivion.

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Congrats - you managed to be a crybaby, a d-bag, and a fool in the same sentence.

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You just came in and began to insult everyone without adding to the discussion.

Having a bad day at work?

GigEmADED said:

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This is it "young adults" want to travel the world and they only care about themselves

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whats wrong with wanting to travel the world?

Its been a good while since a "bash people that make their own choices and don't live the same life as me" thread. Next up, bash women and the dating scene.

infinity ag said:

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GigEmADED said:

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This is it "young adults" want to travel the world and they only care about themselves

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Kids who don't want to grow up and take responsibility and want to be kids all their lives.

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you can't shame people into having kids. maybe some people have a "forever young" mentality but the cold truth is a lot of millennials/gen z see having kids as not really worth it. I think there are things our society and government can do to remedy this but I surmise you and many others in this thread won't agree with them.

hedge said:

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GigEmADED said:

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This is it "young adults" want to travel the world and they only care about themselves

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whats wrong with wanting to travel the world?

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Nothing. The idea is to have kids at the right age. Traveling can be done before kids and with kids and when kids have left the nest.

How can you travel if you have no money? Not all of us have parents who fund their lifestyles

hedge said:

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GigEmADED said:

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This is it "young adults" want to travel the world and they only care about themselves

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whats wrong with wanting to travel the world?

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absolutely nothing.

When my kids graduate college, I'm going to encourage them to travel as much as they can. Live abroad if possible. Life is way too short to rush into a job, marriage, kids, and suburban life. You have the rest of your life for that.

Tex117 said:

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GigEmADED said:

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. Give it to god and let him decide when the right time is. There will always be an excuse why it won't be the right time.

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So, what does this actually mean?

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It means people very often shut themselves off to the possibility of new life. In practical terms: Get married, have sex. And realize you're not hopelessly incapable of providing for your family. I understand people's tendencies to worry. That's my natural inclination. Luckily for me, my wife has a beautiful faith in God's providence. Or we wouldn't have 6 children.

barbacoa taco said:

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infinity ag said:

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GigEmADED said:

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This is it "young adults" want to travel the world and they only care about themselves

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Kids who don't want to grow up and take responsibility and want to be kids all their lives.

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you can't shame people into having kids. maybe some people have a "forever young" mentality but the cold truth is a lot of millennials/gen z see having kids as not really worth it. I think there are things our society and government can do to remedy this but I surmise you and many others in this thread won't agree with them.

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I see what you mean.
In the old days, there weren't as many means of entertainment and so kids took up a lot of time because people didn't have much else to do. These days due to SM and other many many other things, people feel they have no time for anything else. Hence "too busy to have kids".
This is an issue for the human race if the trend goes on.

Bob Lee said:

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I didn't have an income in mind. We just had sex ...

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congratulations!


having kids is great no matter what age you have them. not many people have regrets about having kids when they have a reasonable relationship with the partner.


the hardest part of this thread, the comment about age, and life is this: anyone that enjoys their kids (at birth ... 10 years old ... 25 years old) you'll always hear "should have had kids earlier in life.

so whereas you may want kids at 32 years old with a 2mm portfolio, half of this board would bet you end up saying "wish i had started earlier"

hedge said:

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How can you travel if you have no money? Not all of us have parents who fund their lifestyles

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Agreed. Make money and then travel.
But that was not the issue discussed earlier. It is no one's responsibility to ensure that you travel around the world.

barbacoa taco said:

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infinity ag said:

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GigEmADED said:

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This is it "young adults" want to travel the world and they only care about themselves

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Kids who don't want to grow up and take responsibility and want to be kids all their lives.

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you can't shame people into having kids. maybe some people have a "forever young" mentality but the cold truth is a lot of millennials/gen z see having kids as not really worth it. I think there are things our society and government can do to remedy this but I surmise you and many others in this thread won't agree with them.

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They are wrong. They will be older before the realize it.

I have done some pretty cool things in my life and played around until my mid 30s, but having smart and well-rounded kids is easily the best and most impressive thing I've done. That legacy will be here long after I am gone.

Get Off My Lawn said:

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Scenario B: trades school, marry at 22, 4 kids at 25-31. Run that forward and you have grandkids at 50, get to be part of their lives, you're attending a grandkid's wedding at 72yo, probably see a great grandkid, big family, tons of love & help, and your children aren't in a care-sandwich.

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As a guy, that's great in theory. But please show everyone the women who have married that young to a trade school graduate in the past few years (not when you got married).

Any desirable woman who would do that is from overseas, or essentially a unicorn.

Demand exceeds supply.

94chem said:

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We need legal immigrants, and lots of them.

I have 6 kids, including 2 adopted internationally, but I can't carry everyone's water.

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If you are doing it to make up for everyone else not having kids you're doing it for the wrong reasons. If you're doing it for the right reason's then you aren't carrying everyone else's water.

Bob Lee said:

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Tex117 said:

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GigEmADED said:

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. Give it to god and let him decide when the right time is. There will always be an excuse why it won't be the right time.

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So, what does this actually mean?

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It means people very often shut themselves off to the possibility of new life. In practical terms: Get married, have sex. And realize you're not hopelessly incapable of providing for your family. I understand people's tendencies to worry. That's my natural inclination. Luckily for me, my wife has a beautiful faith in God's providence. Or we wouldn't have 6 children.

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This is actually a fair response. I was getting all ready to bash your response, but this is honest.

Had my first at 26. Didn't feel ready from a personal point of view and with plans to go back to school 2 years later, we definitely weren't in the greatest financial position. At the same time, waiting until after school would have put me at 32 which isn't a terrible age to have a kid at but we want 3-4 which would put us somewhere around 40 for the last (and damn near 60 before we had them out of the house!). So while it wasn't perfect, we decided that you sometimes have to choose a more difficult life to get the things you want.

Now at 30, I have 2 more years left of school and we added our son into the mix about 7 months ago. I once again didn't feel ready and we weren't in a great spot but we're making it work and it is beyond worth it.

After our daughter was born, an older woman told us a story about them not being ready and her parents asking them if they had leftovers from dinner every night. The answer was yes. Her parents told her that meant they could afford children.

Tom Fox said:

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barbacoa taco said:

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infinity ag said:

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GigEmADED said:

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This is it "young adults" want to travel the world and they only care about themselves

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Kids who don't want to grow up and take responsibility and want to be kids all their lives.

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you can't shame people into having kids. maybe some people have a "forever young" mentality but the cold truth is a lot of millennials/gen z see having kids as not really worth it. I think there are things our society and government can do to remedy this but I surmise you and many others in this thread won't agree with them.

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They are wrong. They will be older before the realize it.

I have done some pretty cool things in my life and played around until my mid 30s, but having smart and well-rounded kids is easily the best and most impressive thing I've done. That legacy will be here long after I am gone.

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One more generation? maybe two? Please man...you are nothing but dirt.

(As we all are...not discrediting your kids or life choices, but from an overall perspective...nothing we do really matters all that much).

hedge said:

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Yea, aren't you the type that complains when people are on welfare with kids. I don't think it's responsible to have a child if you genuinely can't afford it

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I agree with this assessment. Have the kids you can provide for. That definition of "provide" may vary and that's ok too. But if you need government support to support a kid, you shouldn't be having the kid.

My opinion.

Edit: One last thing, if by provide it means you have one and dedicate your resources to that one and have money leftover for good vacations, then that's a decision too.

All the young people at my office are dumbfounded when I talk about childcare prices and how I could afford them.

So I ask, what did you do this weekend? Did you play golf? Go out to eat? Go out to the bar? Go to a workout class? Go shopping for yourself? What did that cost? 300,400,$600?

You don't do that when you have a new born, unless you are also paying for a nanny.

Yea multiple that by 4 ish weekends a month and there is your new born kid cash.

Hoyt Ag said:

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Its been a good while since a "bash people that make their own choices and don't live the same life as me" thread. Next up, bash women and the dating scene.

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Yup.

As its always been. These types of people can't stand people that aren't with the heard.

GigEmADED said:

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I'm 26 and my wife is 25 we have a car payment and house payment along with 100k in student loan debt from my trade school and her master program.

It will never be a right time and it can always be too little too late. Give it to god and let him decide when the right time is. There will always be an excuse why it won't be the right time. Truthfully finances though our situation isn't the best is not even my worst fear. We both do have great jobs that pay us well but it'll be 7 years till the car and student loans are paid off. My worst fear is the society we live in and the prey that children have become to many.

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When we had our 2 sons I never really thought about the world they "might" be living in when they get older. I definitely think about it now and worry for their future in this country. Even though they are both good kids and both will be going to college very soon, I feel it is still going to be very tough for them in the future. Feels like this country is always on the verge of breaking (economically and politically), and the National debt just keeps growing. It's like one day it is all just going to come crashing down.

Tom Fox said:

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barbacoa taco said:

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infinity ag said:

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GigEmADED said:

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This is it "young adults" want to travel the world and they only care about themselves

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Kids who don't want to grow up and take responsibility and want to be kids all their lives.

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you can't shame people into having kids. maybe some people have a "forever young" mentality but the cold truth is a lot of millennials/gen z see having kids as not really worth it. I think there are things our society and government can do to remedy this but I surmise you and many others in this thread won't agree with them.

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They are wrong. They will be older before the realize it.

I have done some pretty cool things in my life and played around until my mid 30s, but having smart and well-rounded kids is easily the best and most impressive thing I've done. That legacy will be here long after I am gone.

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Many people decide against children and don't regret it. It isn't just this generation, so we have proof of that from many who have come and gone. You can't simply say "they are wrong". That isn't reality with many.

GigEmADED said:

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I'm 26 and my wife is 25 we have a car payment and house payment along with 100k in student loan debt from my trade school and her master program.

It will never be a right time and it can always be too little too late. Give it to god and let him decide when the right time is. There will always be an excuse why it won't be the right time. Truthfully finances though our situation isn't the best is not even my worst fear. We both do have great jobs that pay us well but it'll be 7 years till the car and student loans are paid off. My worst fear is the society we live in and the prey that children have become to many.

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Taking on that much debt certainly doesn't help and I hope you did so to go into fields that you make enough to make it worth it. That said it's all choices. In the end the thing you realize after about 45 is that whatever those things were that you thought were important are secondary to family and I say that as someone who never prioritized it and fell into it. Now I know how foolish and lucky I was. My friends without children have really empty lives generally because as you age it is so much more fun to experience things with the next generation than simply trying to find new things to check off the bucket list. Material stuff really loses its flavor. For us we spend our money on experiences not stuff if it isn't investment oriented.

In the end if I didn't have kids I'd be able to easily retire now. Then what? So I could sit around and watch more TV? Go on a few more trips? Buy a nicer car or house? I'd trade all of that in a heartbeat for going to watch my son play football or compete in a robotics competition. Being an active and engaged parent is simply the most rewarding experience imaginable even though it is also stressful and difficult and certainly expensive. So maybe I have to work until I'm 65 or longer, who knows. I really am not concerned because I feel fulfilled in raising 2 great boys and seeing them grow into men, it makes any sacrifice worth it. Certainly I hope to hang around as long as I can but I also know I could get hit by a car or get cancer tomorrow. Life is unpredictable so you have to make the most of your time and try to impact others because that is the most rewarding aspect of life.

So it's hard and I know it's hard. Just make sacrifices and focus on serving your wife and family to provide for them and living with God at the center and your chances of living a happy and fulfilled life are the best they will be. Life isn't fair but in my experience good things usually happen to good people, focus on being a good person.

hedge said:

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Millennials having fewer kids could be a drag on the economy for the next decade, per BI

Millennials not having enough babies could crimp growth by 1-2 percentage points a year.

— unusual_whales (@unusual_whales) July 24, 2024

Hard to argue with this, most of my friend including myself have delayed or opted out of having children due to costs. I think Gen Z is the same, but hat income did you older Millennials feel comfortable having children?

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There's never the 'ideal time'. Having kids means giving up other things that are nice to have but not necessary. Kids are a blessing from God and with faith he will help you provide.

ntxVol said:

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A declining population does affect the markets and their growth projections. Investing in this new world will be different than in the past but it seems most advisors are oblivious. Very frustrating for me personally.

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Demographics and The Debt are both ignored by advisors. Especially the former. And yet both these things are going to have outsized impacts on the immediate future and not in a good way.

Get Off My Lawn said:

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hedge said:

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Why do you say that?

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Scenario A: college, career, marry at 30, 2 kids at 34 & 36. Run that forward and you have your first grandkid at 68 and "fun" grandkids when your body is heavily deteriorating. Now your kid is trying to care for you as you die, while also trying to raise kids whom you barely got to know. A family get-together takes 2 texts and consists of 6 adults drinking by an unused pool.

Scenario B: trades school, marry at 22, 4 kids at 25-31. Run that forward and you have grandkids at 50, get to be part of their lives, you're attending a grandkid's wedding at 72yo, probably see a great grandkid, big family, tons of love & help, and your children aren't in a care-sandwich.

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We were scenario B (except college grads, not trade school). First kid at 24, 4th by 31. Pretty much one income household entire time (wife worked a couple small stints early on but not much).

I'm always amazed at how old some of the other parents are when we go to school functions.

Looking forward to hopefully being young grandparents!

I was broke as tits in my 20s and traveled all over the globe. Of course I never ate out, didn't have cable and budgeted every single penny when I was at home. It was some of the best moments of my life.

The thing I love about having kids, they give you a reason to persevere.

This is where I'm at. I had a great run, now I'm having an even better run with my rugrats.

I made this argument on here a few months ago and I know I am late to the party.

But have kids as early as possible. That is the best advice you will ever get. Waiting to have children is unnatural. If you are done with your education and have met your spouse have kids now. Tonight. Our society would be MUCH better off if were done having kids by 25, not starting at 30. There is nothing to wait for.

agsalaska said:

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I made this argument on here a few months ago and I know I am late to the party.

But have kids as early as possible. That is the best advice you will ever get. Waiting to have children is unnatural. If you are done with your education and have met your spouse have kids now. Tonight. Our society would be MUCH better off if were done having kids by 25, not starting at 30. There is nothing to wait for.

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or. It isn't.

Your "society" can eff right off. Freedom means you can participate in it on your own terms.

Slim Jimbo said:

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I'm always amazed at how old some of the other parents are when we go to school functions.

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I was 5 years older than you when i had my first. All of the young parents were 3-4 years older than me! My wife is 5 years younger than me. Everyone tells her how young she looks to be a mom b/c they think she is their age. good times!

Stonegateag85 said:

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The thing I love about having kids, they give you a reason to persevere.

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Lol. Your perseverance is predicated not from your innate strength, ambition, or self-preservation, but on children. You looked to children for purpose, but not within?

That's just sad. (I know what you meant, but some people do really feel this way)