So far no mention of the Cohen embezzlement/theft from Trump but I'm sure its coming at some point.

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Defense attorney Todd Blanche moved to another instance where Michael Cohen allegedly lied to Melania Trump.
"There was another time he lied to you," Blanche says. "Text from the president's wife. Please call the president."
Blanche noted that phone records indicate there are no calls from any of Cohen's phones to Trump that day.
Prosecutor Joshua Steinglass objected to Blanche as he pulled up Cohen's phone records about a text message from Melania Trump asking Cohen to call Trump.
The lawyers approached the bench briefly, and Trump stayed turned in his chair, facing the jury, with his arm over the back.

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Trump attorney Todd Blanche says Michel Cohen didn't take the oath he took promising to tell the truth seriously.
"He's repeatedly lied under oath. He's lied to his family. He lied to his wife about the home equity line of credit ... he lied to his banker," Blanche says.
"He's literally like an MVP of liars," Blanche adds.

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Trump attorney Todd Blanche is now giving 10 reasons why the jury should have reasonable doubt.
"Each one of these reasons makes a not guilty verdict a very easy path and a very quick path," Blanche says.
The first reason he lists is that Cohen created the invoices.

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The whole thing about Merchan not allowing Smith to be called because Trump wasn't charged with and election violations is sorta comical because to this point no one knows what the underlying crime or intent to commit a crime actually is. Merchan allowed the prosecution to infer that Trump committed fraud to try and cover up an election violation and to influence the election, something Trump has never been charged with or prosecuted for. But the allowed inference wasn't allowed to be rebutted by Smith pointing out there was no violation of election laws. Merchan's hubris stating he didn't need to be lectured on election law is laughable, evidence to the contrary. Election laws are so confusing and conflated it takes and expert to explain it to even skilled attorneys that don't regularly deal with it much less layman jurists. So prosecutors got to reference it but to specifically point to a specific issue.


My question is can the underlying crime be simply conspiracy to do something not named? This circular mess is a farce

4stringAg said:

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So far no mention of the Cohen embezzlement/theft from Trump but I'm sure its coming at some point.

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No he did mention it. But will come back to it now that he is wrapping up.

I wasn't sure how the defense was going to phrase the larceny and embezzlement. I sort of thought they may go along the lines of "a crime was concealed here, Michael Cohen's larceny and embezzlement, and he lied to you repeatedly to try and hide it".

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My question is can the underlying crime be simply conspiracy to do something not named? This circular mess is a farce

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They have to PROVE Trump intended on committing a crime and altering the books to cover it up.

Many are diverting attention that no proof is required of don't a specific crime.

But they have to prove he intended on committing a crime and covering it up.

That has not happened.

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Trump attorney Todd Blanche is now replaying two clips from Michael Cohen's "Mea Culpa" podcast where he talked about Trump being indicted and praised Manhattan District Attorney Alvin Bragg.
In one clip, Cohen is heard saying that picturing Trump being booked "fills me with delight" and in another one Cohen says "I want to thank the Manhattan DA's office and their fearless leader Alvin Bragg."
One of the jurors looked over at Bragg in court while this was played.
Blanche reminds the jury Cohen lied in the podcast clip when he said he met with Bragg all the time. They've never actually met.
Blanche is also showing Cohen's tweet selling the t-shirt showing Trump in an orange jumpsuit behind bars.
"But you know that the lying is simply to benefit and protect Michael Cohen and nobody else period," Blanche says

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In other Trump court news on Tuesday, federal Judge Aileen Cannon rejected special counsel Jack Smith's request for a gag order against Donald Trump in the classified documents case, saying prosecutors' efforts to work with defense lawyers was "wholly lacking in substance and professional courtesy."
In a brief order, Cannon slammed prosecutors for not following the court's rules by failing to confer with Trump's defense lawyers in a meaningful way about a potential gag order.
"Because the filing of the Special Counsel's Motion did not adhere to these basic requirements, it is due to be denied without prejudice," Cannon wrote, adding that "it should go without saying that meaningful conferral is not a perfunctory exercise."
Prosecutors can ask for a gag order again, Cannon said, once they give "sufficient time" to Trump's defense team to read the motion and discuss it with prosecutors.
"Failure to comply with these requirements may result in sanctions," Cannon wrote.
While Cannon quickly ruled on this matter, she has yet to rule on nearly a dozen fully briefed motions in this case. The judge's decision on the gag order also highlights how the cumbersome filing process in her court has repeatedly plagued the case as it slowly inches towards trial.

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Trump attorney Todd Blanche is presenting the jury with 10 reasons they should have reasonable doubt.
Here's the full list, according to Blanche:
[ol]

Michael Cohen created the invoices.

There's no evidence Trump knew the invoices were sent.

There was "absolutely" no evidence of any intent to defraud.

There was no attempt to commit or conceal another crime.

There was "absolutely" no agreement to influence the 2016 election.

AMI would have run the doorman's story no matter what if it was true.

Karen McDougal did not want her story published.

Stormy Daniels' story was already public in 2011.

There was manipulation of evidence.

Michael Cohen. "He's the human embodiment of reasonable doubt."

[/ol]

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Science Denier said:

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My question is can the underlying crime be simply conspiracy to do something not named? This circular mess is a farce

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They have to PROVE Trump intended on committing a crime and altering the books to cover it up.

Many are diverting attention that no proof is required of don't a specific crime.

But they have to prove he intended on committing a crime and covering it up.

That has not happened.

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In a normal court with a normal judge and a normal jury, yes, they would have to prove it.

In this court with this judge, they don't have to prove a damn thing.

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Trump attorney Todd Blanche is now ticking through the times Micheal Cohen lied to Congress, to the Justice Department, to judges and to his family.
"He lied to you repeatedly. He lied many, many times before you even met him," Blanche says. "He is biased and motivated to tell you a story that is not true."
"He's literally the greatest liar of all time," Blanche adds, calling Cohen "the GLOAT."

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The court is taking a lunch break until 2 p.m. ET.

Joshua Steinglass is expected to deliver the prosecution's closing argument when the court returns.

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Donald Trump's attorney Todd Blanche reached the key point of planting a seed of doubt about Michael Cohen's version of events, CNN chief legal correspondent Paula Reid said.

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"It's their key point. This is the most thing they need to get across to jurors to doubt the version of events that Michael Cohen conveyed on the stand," Reid said.

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She noted that, in hindsight, the defense might have realized a mistake of taking too long to get to this key point, but it's something the Trump team has said throughout the trial.
"It is supported by a mountain of evidence that Michael Cohen is liar" and he continued that pattern of lying even during the course of this trial, Reid added.
Ultimately, all the defense needs is to get at least one juror to doubt Cohen's account, that's really all they need here, she said.

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Trump attorney Todd Blanche began to wrap his closing by zeroing in on the defense's argument that the jury cannot believe Michael Cohen's testimony.
"His words cannot be trusted and I'm going to end this summation the same way I told you a few minutes ago that you know you cannot rely on him," Blanche says.

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"Cohen lies to family, when it matters, when it doesn't," Blanche added. "Then he came in here he raised his right hand and he lied to each of you repeatedly. You cannot send someone to prison you cannot convict somebody based upon the words of Michael Cohen."

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Prosecutor Joshua Steinglass objected to Blanche's prison remark, which was sustained by Judge Juan Merchan.

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As he wrapped up his closing argument, Trump attorney Todd Blanche told the jury this isn't a referendum on Donald Trump.

"This isn't a referendum on your views on President Trump. This is not a referendum on the ballot box," Blanche says.

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MVP! MVP! MVP! MVP! MVP! MVP! MVP! MVP!

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Trump attorney Todd Blanche wrapped up his closing argument, focusing on the story of former adult film star Stormy Daniels and trying to discredit former Trump attorney Michael Cohen's testimony.
Here are the highlights:
More on Stormy Daniels: Blanche detailed some aspects of Daniels' agreement and story. Here are some of his key points:

• The Daniels situation started out as "an extortion," Blanche said. "At the end of the day, what really happened is that somebody offered more money to Ms. Daniels. Somebody offered to pay her legal fees if she got out of the NDA she signed with Mr. Cohen."
• He said Daniels and her then-publicist Gina Rodriguez "seized an opportunity" after the "Access Hollywood" tape came out in October 2016. He added National Enquirer editor Dylan Howard told Rodriguez in text messages that he believed David Pecker would pay for Daniels' story.
• Trump never thought Daniels' story would cost him the 2016 presidential campaign, Blanche argued.
• Blanche argued prosecutors called Daniels to the witness stand "to try to inflame your emotions, they did it to try to embarrass President Trump."
• Blanche outlined why he thought it made sense for Cohen to make the $130,000 hush money payment, as he was angling for a job with Trump, whether it was inside or outside the White House.
• He said Trump never signed the Stormy Daniels agreement and told the jury what Trump knew about it came from one source: Cohen.

Discrediting Cohen: Blanche zeroed in on the cross-examination moment involving Cohen's testimony about the October 24, 2016, phone call to Trump's former bodyguard Keith Schiller's phone. He said the call was not about the Daniels situation it was about a teenager who had been harassing Cohen for days. He also said prosecutors left out key context between Cohen and Schiller when they showed the phone records to the jury

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"We put them into evidence and now you know what happened," Blanche says.
"Is there the same absolute proof of lies for every single thing that man told you? No, no there's not. For that, we have what's called an oath," Blanche says.

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Cohen lied: Blanche said Cohen "repeatedly lied under oath" and lied to the people in his life, including his wife and his banker.
"He's literally like an MVP of liars," Blanche said.
Reasonable doubt: Blanche presented the jury with 10 reasons they should have reasonable doubt.

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aggiehawg said:

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Trump attorney Todd Blanche says when prosecutors "conveniently" showed the jury the phone records during Michael Cohen's testimony on direct examination about the October 24, 2016, call record, they left out the texts between Cohen and Trump's bodyguard Keith Schiller that Blanche says gives the appropriate context.
"We put them into evidence and now you know what happened," Blanche says.
"Is there the same absolute proof of lies for every single thing that man told you? No, no there's not. For that, we have what's called an oath," Blanche says.

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Glad I'm not playing a drinking game with the number of times Blance says the word "lie" or a variation thereof.

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Glad I'm not playing a drinking game with the number of times Cohen lied.

It's tough to really tell if it was a good closing from just reading what essentially amounts to tweets about the closing, but I think it was just Ok. It seems like it was pretty long (although the prosecution will likely be longer). I think it could have been tightened up by dropping all the stuff about McDougal and Stormy, and essentially just saying, "It doesn't matter if you think Trump and Stormy/McDougal had sex or not. That is immaterial to this case. The only reason the prosecution brought in Daniels was to smear Trump. What matters is that she tried to extort money from Trump through Cohen." The parts where he focused on Cohen being a liar seemed to be effective, but it does seem like the defense got side tracked on things that aren't really that important.

SwigAg11 said:

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I wasn't sure how the defense was going to phrase the larceny and embezzlement. I sort of thought they may go along the lines of "a crime was concealed here, Michael Cohen's larceny and embezzlement, and he lied to you repeatedly to try and hide it".

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How about Cohen said Trump is meticulous and knows every detail of every transaction of every check he signs - yet he signed checks allowing Cohen to steal $60,000 from him?

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Judge Juan Merchan said he'd give a curative instruction as to defense attorney Todd Blanche's remarks about sending Trump to prison.
During his closing arguments, Blanche talked about Cohen's credibility and told the jury: "Then he came in here, he raised his right hand and he lied to each of you repeatedly. You cannot send someone to prison you cannot convict somebody based upon the words of Michael Cohen."

Merchan said Blanche's comment was "outrageous."

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"You know that making a comment like that is highly inappropriate. It simply not allowed. Period. It's hard for me to imagine that was accidental in any way," the judge said, referencing Blanche's experienced career as a prosecutor and a defense attorney.

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Prosecutor Joshua Steinglass had raised the issue and asked for curative instruction for the "ridiculous comment."

"That was a blatant and wholly inappropriate" effort to get sympathy for Trump, Steinglass told Merchan.

Steinglass also said Merchan should reconsider a curative instruction about retainer agreements because he said Blanche "doubled down that it's perfectly plausibly to have no retainer agreement when that is not the law in New York State." This was debated at the charge conference last week and Merchan said he'd look into the law.

Merchan did not make any comments about a potential curative instruction on the retainer issue.

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The judge's decision on the gag order also highlights how the cumbersome filing process in her court has repeatedly plagued the case as it slowly inches towards trial.

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This is editorializing. The writer is making it seem that Cannon is the problem.

Never mind that the whole point was to delay prosecution and then spring it on Trump simultaneously with several other cases meant to interfere with his ability to campaign and prevent him defending himself, rushing for conviction before the election.

Ellis Wyatt said:

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The judge's decision on the gag order also highlights how the cumbersome filing process in her court has repeatedly plagued the case as it slowly inches towards trial.

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This is editorializing. The writer is making it seem that Cannon is the problem.

Never mind that the whole point was to delay prosecution and then spring it on Trump simultaneously with several other cases meant to interfere with his ability to campaign and prevent him defending himself, rushing for conviction before the election.

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It is always a plodding case under CIPA. Classified Information Procedure Act. That's how that law works.

aggiehawg said:

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Blanche "doubled down that it's perfectly plausibly to have no retainer agreement when that is not the law in New York State." This was debated at the charge conference last week and Merchan said he'd look into the law.

Merchan did not make any comments about a potential curative instruction on the retainer issue.

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Feel certain that Merchan will leave the jury with the impression that it was illegal and that Trump is the party responsible for it.

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Feel certain that Merchan will leave the jury with the impression that it was illegal and that Trump is the party responsible for it.

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The two lawyers on the jury will likely know better. It is always best practices for attorneys to have clear fee agreements whether or not that includes a retainer. But Cohen was so lackadaisical in his billings and documentation, they probably would explain it is the lawyer's responsibility to reduce those arrangements to writing, not the client's duty to request one.

Cohen had been working as a salaried employee for a decade or so before. No agreement necessary there. But when he left the Trump Org. and became Personal Attorney to POTUS and took on other "consulting clients" it was up to Cohen to put pen to paper to formalize those fee agreements.

Agreed. The idea of requiring a written agreement is to protect the attorney as the client can incorrectly assume that there is an attorney client relationship. The burden is not on the client to require a written contract.

aggiehawg said:

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Cohen had been working as a salaried employee for a decade or so before. No agreement necessary there. But when he left the Trump Org. and became Personal Attorney to POTUS and took on other "consulting cliets" it was up to Cohen to put pen to paper to formalize those fee agreements.

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Plus, Trump wasn't running the business at the time. He wasn't the one managing the day-to-day operations.

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The prosecution is up next to give its closing statement in the hush money trial against former President Donald Trump and they should keep it short, a former Trump lawyer says.

Prosecutor Joshua Steinglass estimated earlier that his closing argument would take between four and four and a half hours, but Tim Parlatore, a former Trump attorney, said that is too long.

"If I were sitting there and I could grab Steinglass in the hallway and say what to do: shorten it significantly," Parlatore said.

He said the prosecutor should take the defense's list of reasons for why they argued the jury should have reasonable doubt and "nail that right off the top" and then keep the rest of the closing argument brief.

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Don't think the prosecution has the discipline to keep this short and sweet.

They are going to put on the full smoke and mirror show and claim that, somewhere in the smoke, there is proof of a crime.

I don't think it matters.

And if somehow the jury were to acquit, Merchan would object and rule Trump guilty himself.

Maybe. This is starting to feel like the OJ trial with politics and not race as the filter by which the trial is viewed.

Each side is convinced that they are winning.

Troy91 said:

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Don't think the prosecution has the discipline to keep this short and sweet.

They are going to put on the full smoke and mirror show and claim that, somewhere in the smoke, there is proof of a crime.

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Agree. I expect a lot of Stormy's salacious testimony, Trump's PJs and boxer shorts.

Troy91 said:

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Maybe. This is starting to feel like the OJ trial with politics and not race as the filter by which the trial is viewed.

Each side is convinced that they are winning.

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Maybe. Sure seems most non-leftists believe Trump will be found guilty. Nothing about this trial has been reasonable or fair.

aggiehawg said:

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Judge Juan Merchan said he'd give a curative instruction as to defense attorney Todd Blanche's remarks about sending Trump to prison.
During his closing arguments, Blanche talked about Cohen's credibility and told the jury: "Then he came in here, he raised his right hand and he lied to each of you repeatedly. You cannot send someone to prison you cannot convict somebody based upon the words of Michael Cohen."

Merchan said Blanche's comment was "outrageous."

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"You know that making a comment like that is highly inappropriate. It simply not allowed. Period. It's hard for me to imagine that was accidental in any way," the judge said, referencing Blanche's experienced career as a prosecutor and a defense attorney.

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Prosecutor Joshua Steinglass had raised the issue and asked for curative instruction for the "ridiculous comment."

"That was a blatant and wholly inappropriate" effort to get sympathy for Trump, Steinglass told Merchan.

Steinglass also said Merchan should reconsider a curative instruction about retainer agreements because he said Blanche "doubled down that it's perfectly plausibly to have no retainer agreement when that is not the law in New York State." This was debated at the charge conference last week and Merchan said he'd look into the law.

Merchan did not make any comments about a potential curative instruction on the retainer issue.

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Steinglass is all hung up about it being the law in NY State. Who is responsible for abiding by that law, the client or the attorney? Is it illegal for a client to pay an attorney without a retainer agreement in place? Or is it illegal for an attorney to perform legal services without an agreement in place?