jja79 said:
Since no one suffered a financial loss to whom is this paid?
Quote:
A New York appeal bond serves a very special purposeto pause the execution of a judgment while the defendant appeals the court's ruling and the award of damages to the plaintiff. Defendants who have lost a case in a New York court cannot appeal that decision until they have purchased an appeal bond to show the court that they are not merely trying to delay paying a judgment, but have reasonable grounds for a successful appeal.
A New York appeal bond also serves as the defendant's guarantee to make good on the judgment if the appeal turns out to be unsuccessful. In New York, appeal bonds must be in an amount that will cover the judgment. Most sureties require these bonds to be fully collateralized to provide funds for immediate payment to the plaintiff if the appellate court rules against the defendant and upholds the judgment.
Letter of credit? Like from a lender? LOL.Quote:
Anyone appealing a New York court's ruling in a civil matter is required to purchase an appeal bond in an amount that is equal toor in some cases more thanthe amount of the judgment under appeal. Be aware that only court-ordered judgments, not negotiated settlements, can be appealed.
The defendant will be unable to complete the process of filing an appeal until the necessary New York appeal bond has been purchased and submitted to the Clerk of the Court in which the case was originally decided. The bond must be fully collateralized, typically in the form of a cashier's check or irrevocable letter of credit.
LINKQuote:
Collateralization of a New York appeal bond means that the defendant's personal credit history is not a big factor in the surety bond's determination of the premium rate the defendant will pay for the bond. In most cases, that premium rate will be 2% or less on a fully collateralized basis. For bonds that are able to be obtained with partial or no collateral, the premium may range from 1.5% to 3%.
It would be funny if Trump got a bond company that valued that property higher and closer to Trump's valuation than the judge's...dirkjones said:
I'm told that in NY in order to appeal, he will have to post a bond that is equal to the judgement. I would assume he would have to use some of his property at collateral.
I have even posted Jonathan Turley explaining that it is irrelevant, and this guy continues to raise that issue.fc2112 said:Irrelevantjja79 said:
Since no one suffered a financial loss to whom is this paid?
Antoninus said:I have even posted Jonathan Turley explaining that it is irrelevant, and this guy continues to raise that issue.fc2112 said:Irrelevantjja79 said:
Since no one suffered a financial loss to whom is this paid?
He begins to remind me of Rain Man.
it would be funny to limit the bond to just Mar-a-lagoaggiehawg said:Quote:
A New York appeal bond serves a very special purposeto pause the execution of a judgment while the defendant appeals the court's ruling and the award of damages to the plaintiff. Defendants who have lost a case in a New York court cannot appeal that decision until they have purchased an appeal bond to show the court that they are not merely trying to delay paying a judgment, but have reasonable grounds for a successful appeal.
A New York appeal bond also serves as the defendant's guarantee to make good on the judgment if the appeal turns out to be unsuccessful. In New York, appeal bonds must be in an amount that will cover the judgment. Most sureties require these bonds to be fully collateralized to provide funds for immediate payment to the plaintiff if the appellate court rules against the defendant and upholds the judgment.Letter of credit? Like from a lender? LOL.Quote:
Anyone appealing a New York court's ruling in a civil matter is required to purchase an appeal bond in an amount that is equal toor in some cases more thanthe amount of the judgment under appeal. Be aware that only court-ordered judgments, not negotiated settlements, can be appealed.
The defendant will be unable to complete the process of filing an appeal until the necessary New York appeal bond has been purchased and submitted to the Clerk of the Court in which the case was originally decided. The bond must be fully collateralized, typically in the form of a cashier's check or irrevocable letter of credit.LINKQuote:
Collateralization of a New York appeal bond means that the defendant's personal credit history is not a big factor in the surety bond's determination of the premium rate the defendant will pay for the bond. In most cases, that premium rate will be 2% or less on a fully collateralized basis. For bonds that are able to be obtained with partial or no collateral, the premium may range from 1.5% to 3%.
Depends what you mean by "deadline." (Bill Clinton reference)fc2112 said:
When does Trump have to pay $355 MM?
There has to be a deadline, eight? If appealing, he still has to put up?
Does he have $355 MM liquid? How do the finances work on this?
I think this poster saying that Trump need not pay the amount of the Judgment to the State of New York (as successful Plaintiff) until all appeals have been exhausted. That is technically correct, but it overlooks the bond element.Bryanisbest said:
30 days after the judgment is final which could be as late as 30 days after the USSC issues a mandate following its decision.
When you start crying…fc2112 said:
There has to be a deadline, eight? If appealing, he still has to put up?
Does he have $355 MM liquid? How do the finances work on this?
Timberwolf said:
That's a difficult deadline to meet. I doubt he has that much liquidity, right? Then what?
Does Trump own anything worth $500mm that is not already collateral on other obligations? I doubt it, and I doubt that any potential surety will be willing to accept a second lien on such a property as collateral for a bond.fc2112 said:
Thank you. But if he offers a $500 MM property as collateral on a $350 MM bond, someone will do that, won't they?
Thanks.Antoninus said:Depends what you mean by "deadline." (Bill Clinton reference)fc2112 said:
When does Trump have to pay $355 MM?
There has to be a deadline, eight? If appealing, he still has to put up?
Does he have $355 MM liquid? How do the finances work on this?
I've not researched New York law, but as a general rule the successful plaintiff cannot commence efforts to COLLECT a judgment until the appellate deadline has passed. In most places, that is 30 days. So, Trump and his stuff are safe for that long, anyway.
If Trump decides to appeal and wants to protect his assets in the process, he must post a bond. In New York, that can be a cash bond (approx. $400mm paid into the court registry) or a surety bond (some reputable financial institution guaranteeing that they will pay the judgment if Trump loses on appeal and then fails to pay the judgment). The chances of any financial institution providing him with a surety bond of this magnitude are IMO ... slim, at best. So he will need to deposit a cash bond.
If he appeals but fails to submit a bond, the successful Plaintiff (here, the state of New York) can proceed with collection efforts ... seizing assets and such.
I THINK that addresses all potential aspects of your question.
I don't hate the country, but do consider extremists of any persuasion to be cancer cells.El Gallo Blanco said:
I hate this country. Leftists are cancer cells.
Generally, "no," because a bonding agent generally does NOT pay cash out-of-pocket to the court system. They simply provide a promise that they will stand-good for the defendant, if the defendant loses on appeal and fails/refuses to pay the judgment. As such, the bonding agent usually is paid a flat fee for providing the "promise to pay." The amount of that fee varies based upon a dozen variables, but generally ranges from about 2% of the Judgment to about 10% of the Judgment.eric76 said:
In the case of a bond, does the bonding company collect interest? I imagine that would really affect the willingness of a bonding company.
Sort of. See above.Quote:
Suppose that he puts up real estate as collateral. If he loses the appeal and defaults on his obligations as he seems to do far too often, it could take a long time and probably some legal battles to sell the property. If the bonding company could not collect interest, they could easily lose a lot of money on the deal. I wouldn't anyone to be willing to do that.
Am I wrong there?
Which will happen if this doesn't get reversed or dramatically reduced on appeal.Quote:
Having campaigned on bagging Trump on any basis, James turned the law into a virtual license to hunt him down along with his family and his associates.
Engoron proved the perfect judge for the case. The opinion itself seems almost cathartic for the jurist who struggled with Trump inside and outside of court. In the judgment, Engoron fulfilled Oscar Wilde's rule that the only way to be rid of temptation is to yield to it. He ordered everything short of throwing Trump into a wood chipper.
The size of the damages is grotesque and should shock the conscience of any judge on appeal. Even if the Democrat-appointed judges on the New York Court of Appeals were to ignore the obvious inequity and unfairness, the United States Supreme Court could intervene.
State courts tend to get a significant amount of deference in the interpretation of their own laws. After all, if New York wants to turn Wall Street into a remake of "The Hunger Games," it has only itself to blame as other businesses flee the state.
Quote:
The one hope for New York businesses may be the U.S. Supreme Court. Despite the deference afforded to the states and their courts, the court has occasionally intervened to block excessive damage awards.
With no discernible basis for this damage award, easily could meet the "arbitrary" issue, in my view.Quote:
An Alabama jury awarded $4,000 in compensatory damages for the loss of value in having a factory paint job, but then added $4 million in punitive damages. Even when the Alabama Supreme Court reduced that to $2 million, the U.S. Supreme Court still found it excessive. Even liberals on the Court such as John Paul Stevens and Stephen Breyer agreed that such "grossly excessive" awards raise a "basic unfairness of depriving citizens of life, liberty, or property, through the application of arbitrary coercion."
Tongue planted firmly in cheek on the "tad excessive" remark.Quote:
The court may find almost half a billion dollars in damages without a single lost dollar from a victim to be a tad excessive.
Judge having and expressing his personal animus towards Trump was not only unseemly for a judge but Turley is making the equal protection argument there.Quote:
But you do not have to feel sorry or even sympathetic for Trump to see this award as obscene. The appeal will test the New York legal system to see if other judges can do what Judge Engoron found so difficult: set aside their feelings about Trump.
LINKQuote:
New York is one of our oldest and most distinguished bars. It has long resisted those who sought to use the law to pursue political opponents and unpopular figures. It will now be tested to see if those values transcend even Trump.
El Gallo Blanco said:
I hate this country.
Turley has always had a talent for sarcastic understatement.aggiehawg said:Tongue planted firmly in cheek on the "tad excessive" remark.Quote:
The court may find almost half a billion dollars in damages without a single lost dollar from a victim to be a tad excessive.
