Loved this show... "Pimp My Ride" hosted by Xzibit.

On the Ram basic truck (or any others for that matter), how much of that price is driven by union labor costs and the multitude of state and national requirements for vehicles from safety standards, emission standards, minimum MPG requirements, etc?

silverado_lover said:

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I bet nobody who has posted on this thread drives a single cab XL trim truck.

You say you want the most basic truck, but it's not what you buy.

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I do, actually. One of the last ones made with a ZF6.

Honestly if this thing could tow 10,000 lbs and had 4 doors with a 6.5' bed, I'd be all over it for $15-20k.

I could easily add a new stereo, backup camera, tint, etc. for cheaper than the dealer add-ons and be super happy with my work/tow vehicle. I just need something to make the occasional Lowe's trip and haul the boat around, while fitting my family of 4 + pup.

TheBonifaceOption said:

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So if its not available in US/Canada markets does that mean we can buy at the border and then drive it up?

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Good question! Anyone know if you can buy these in Mexico and import them?

Yes.

No, you cannot.

TexasRebel said:

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Yes.

No, you cannot.

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I wonder how it would work to buy there, register there, and drive up here? I used to deal with a guy in west TX that had a sweet diesel Ranger with no of our US emissions bs. He keeps it registered back in MX but I'd always see him in it in TX. Maybe I should contact him to see if he can get me one!

Direct Enter Enter said:

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I get the feeling that this thread is pretty much a roll call for anyone who learned to drive with three on the tree.


Here.

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Here.

A YouTube from a few months ago...

CDUB98 said:

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In 2013, I paid around $45k for a nicely equipped F150 FX4. That was after all the discounts.

The MSRP for an equivalent truck is now just a bit over $60k. Even with discounts, it would likely come in around $53k. I don't want to pay that much for a truck.

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$1 in 2013 is worth $1.32 today

So $45k x 1.32 = $59,400 "with discounts"

So that means the new truck at $53k is....






https://www.in2013dollars.com/us/inflation/2013?amount=45000

Yeah, but I still don't want to pay that much for a truck.

I just played with some numbers, and I can get a Taco with the Premium package for just under $46k, and with a manual transmission.

I'd love to make this my fleet vehicle for our company. Would save me so much!

LS swap?

vansprinkle said:

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Honestly if this thing could tow 10,000 lbs and had 4 doors with a 6.5' bed, I'd be all over it for $15-20k.

I could easily add a new stereo, backup camera, tint, etc. for cheaper than the dealer add-ons and be super happy with my work/tow vehicle. I just need something to make the occasional Lowe's trip and haul the boat around, while fitting my family of 4 + pup.

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You can't make a 4-door truck today with a 6'-5" bed that will tow 10,000 lbs for $20k. If if the Big 3 made it they'd lose money on every one they sold.

Even with their "record profits" they're still only making 5-9%.

Also, you can find used vehicles with 80-100k miles on them, still in very good condition for $20k. Why does it have to be new? Trucks routinely exceed 100,000 miles today. It's not the 1970's when 100k was a big deal.

silverado_lover said:

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I bet nobody who has posted on this thread drives a single cab XL trim truck.

You say you want the most basic truck, but it's not what you buy.

---

I think this misses the mark. This truck would be a second vehicle for me to do the truck stuff I need. It isn't an everyday vehicle. The reason trucks are luxury vehicles now is because they are the primary vehicle for many people and I would want some luxury, especially when you consider that a base vehicle trim is going to cost you so much anyway. You might as well pay a couple thousand more for the niceties.

If this truck was available, I would consider trading in my Tundra for a sports car and having this truck for my weekends at the ranch.

Also, it would make a great vehicle for a kid's first car at that price.

I wonder how many thousands more in cost adding a kill switch will be to the average consumer

🚨 The federal government has mandated that all vehicles sold after 2026 must have a kill switch that can disable your vehicle based on your driving performance.

My amendment to defund that unconstitutional mandate failed tonight.

Here is the roll call:https://t.co/YWufj9BuMv

— Thomas Massie (@RepThomasMassie) November 8, 2023

When's the next insurrection?

DrEvazanPhD said:

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We were having that discussion today…

Auto-stop/start
Lane change warnings
Adaptive cruise control
Rear view cameras
GPS

The list goes on and on

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Wait until bunch of folks that the MFG's TV ads are shown clapping their hands and patting their legs while doing 70 down the interstate do it in real life and crash and burn..........GM....get out the checkbook cause the Thomas J Henry's are coming to town ....I guess GM doesn't employ any LP guys that told them that just might be a bad idea advertising such on national TV.

silverado_lover said:

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I bet nobody who has posted on this thread drives a single cab XL trim truck.

You say you want the most basic truck, but it's not what you buy.

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I'm going on year 11 now of using my base model 2013 NIssan Frontier as my daily driver... and there's a reason I haven't even considered replacing it yet, aside from the fact that I've had exactly zero issues with it during that time. You simply can't get anything like it anymore at anywhere close to the same price, even adjusted for inflation.

It's the base model (not even the "S," much less the "SL" or "SV" versions typically found on dealer lots), king cab (2 doors without a regular sized backseat), 2.5L 4 cy engine with 5 speed manual transmission, no power locks, no power windows, no cruise control, no rear-window defroster, a simple AM/FM radio with CD player, no internet or Bluetooth connectivity, no screens or monitors or AI assisted driving features at all.

Nissan discontinued the base model, stopped making them with stick shifts altogether (which is a deal breaker for me), and the cheapest you can now buy any version for is about 40% more expensive than the last one I bought.

Needless to say, I will (sadly) never be buying another Nissan Frontier ever again.

It's not a big market, but there is a market for this. The reason none of the manufacturers are filling this need is because they can't compete with the already existing market. For $15k or probably less, you can take something from the 80's or 90's and make it basically new. That is what those of us that would actually buy something like the Toyota above are doing. The best the big 3 can do is $40k so they don't even try.

Jack Boyett said:

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It's not a big market, but there is a market for this. The reason none of the manufacturers are filling this need is because they can't compete with the already existing market. For $15k or probably less, you can take something from the 80's or 90's and make it basically new. That is what those of us that would actually buy something like the Toyota above are doing. The best the big 3 can do is $40k so they don't even try.

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Low-cost automobiles aren't profitable with the amount of government regulations on any new vehicle. Even this $10K truck is barely profitable for Toyota in that foreign market. Even to sell it here, Toyota would need to build a plant for it or up-charge $2500 to account for the chicken tax plus additional costs for shipping across the ocean.

Combine that with major losses on government-mandated EVs, and the only way for manufacturers to make money is on luxury additions.

As usual, all these laws have the biggest impact on low and middle-class customers. But they don't care when they are pushing mass transit and 15min cities, and this helps then achieve that goal.

Toyota just sold me! Love it

I think there's so much mandatory stuff they just can't pull off that price point. There's no way a carbed engine would pass modern emission and fuel economy standards so you're already at a certain amount of technology and computing. They'd need cats, a bunch of evaporative stuff, dual airbags, TPMS, backup camera with video display, ABS, electronic stability control, and at some point automatic emergency braking.

That's before getting into whatever structural and impact safety requirements there. These trucks are cool, but there's no way the feds and whatever states blindly follow CA would allow them on the road.

The only posters capable of buy this truck are single or the ones that have a wife hoping to get paid out on their life insurance.

American Hardwood said:

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silverado_lover said:

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I bet nobody who has posted on this thread drives a single cab XL trim truck.

You say you want the most basic truck, but it's not what you buy.

---

I think this misses the mark. This truck would be a second vehicle for me to do the truck stuff I need. It isn't an everyday vehicle. The reason trucks are luxury vehicles now is because they are the primary vehicle for many people and I would want some luxury, especially when you consider that a base vehicle trim is going to cost you so much anyway. You might as well pay a couple thousand more for the niceties.

If this truck was available, I would consider trading in my Tundra for a sports car and having this truck for my weekends at the ranch.

Also, it would make a great vehicle for a kid's first car at that price.

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Why not just buy a used truck for $10k? Then sell your Tundra and buy your sports car.

Same goes for a kids first vehicle, buy a used 10k truck.

1836er said:

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It's the base model (not even the "S," much less the "SL" or "SV" versions typically found on dealer lots), king cab (2 doors without a regular sized backseat), 2.5L 4 cy engine with 5 speed manual transmission, no power locks, no power windows, no cruise control, no rear-window defroster, a simple AM/FM radio with CD player, no internet or Bluetooth connectivity, no screens or monitors or AI assisted driving features at all.

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Sounds like you should've bought my 1984 S10. Would've been about the same safety rating as well

silverado_lover said:

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1836er said:

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It's the base model (not even the "S," much less the "SL" or "SV" versions typically found on dealer lots), king cab (2 doors without a regular sized backseat), 2.5L 4 cy engine with 5 speed manual transmission, no power locks, no power windows, no cruise control, no rear-window defroster, a simple AM/FM radio with CD player, no internet or Bluetooth connectivity, no screens or monitors or AI assisted driving features at all.

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Sounds like you should've bought my 1984 S10. Would've been about the same safety rating as well

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Safety rating: Just don't screw up and get into an accident, ok?

DrEvazanPhD said:

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We were having that discussion today…

Auto-stop/start
Lane change warnings
Adaptive cruise control
Rear view cameras
GPS

The list goes on and on

---

I'm not against rear view cameras, they make hooking up a trailer an absolute breeze.

All of the other crap though - hate it. The fact that I have 17 different things to ackowledge or clear from the screen or whatever every single time I start the truck up is beyond annoying. I finally figured out how to turn the lane change and collison warning crap off at least.

Hawk2007 said:

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silverado_lover said:

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I bet nobody who has posted on this thread drives a single cab XL trim truck.

You say you want the most basic truck, but it's not what you buy.

---

You're exactly right. They say they want basic but when push comes to shove, they won't buy it. We should poll former students on game day with season tickets and trucks and how many went basic with a single cab . I doubt most even buy an extended cab. It's the four doors or bust.

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You can't find extended cabs anymore hell, do any manufacturers even make them these days?

Last time I was on a lot the only single cabs were the chassis trucks; every regular truck was a 4 door model.

Kind of hard to buy things that really aren't readily available.

In the late 80s or early 90s my dad had a 6-cylinder F150 truck, two-door, manual transmission, bench seat, crank windows, and plastic floor cover.

I learned to drive a manual shift in that truck

I bet that F150 is still on the road doing work.

Wish I had it now.

silverado_lover said:

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Why not just buy a used truck for $10k? Then sell your Tundra and buy your sports car.

Same goes for a kids first vehicle, buy a used 10k truck.

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That is an option.

But you can't just ignore the trends in the new vehicle market, because it determines what the used vehicle market will be 10 or 20 years from now.

silverado_lover said:

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American Hardwood said:

---

silverado_lover said:

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I bet nobody who has posted on this thread drives a single cab XL trim truck.

You say you want the most basic truck, but it's not what you buy.

---

I think this misses the mark. This truck would be a second vehicle for me to do the truck stuff I need. It isn't an everyday vehicle. The reason trucks are luxury vehicles now is because they are the primary vehicle for many people and I would want some luxury, especially when you consider that a base vehicle trim is going to cost you so much anyway. You might as well pay a couple thousand more for the niceties.

If this truck was available, I would consider trading in my Tundra for a sports car and having this truck for my weekends at the ranch.

Also, it would make a great vehicle for a kid's first car at that price.

---

Why not just buy a used truck for $10k? Then sell your Tundra and buy your sports car.

Same goes for a kids first vehicle, buy a used 10k truck.

---

For $10k, you are generally getting a 15+ year old ragged out truck that probably has 150k+ miles (more likely over 200k) on it. With no warranty and no clue how much you are going to pump into it to keep it reliable.

The market for used vehicles is just as stupid as new. Hell, go try to find an old 80's square body truck - they are running $25-$30k for one in decent shape.

schmellba99 said:

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Hawk2007 said:

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silverado_lover said:

---

I bet nobody who has posted on this thread drives a single cab XL trim truck.

You say you want the most basic truck, but it's not what you buy.

---

You're exactly right. They say they want basic but when push comes to shove, they won't buy it. We should poll former students on game day with season tickets and trucks and how many went basic with a single cab . I doubt most even buy an extended cab. It's the four doors or bust.

---

You can't find extended cabs anymore hell, do any manufacturers even make them these days?

Last time I was on a lot the only single cabs were the chassis trucks; every regular truck was a 4 door model.

Kind of hard to buy things that really aren't readily available.

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You can, you just have to special order it, wait a few months, and get no "discounts"

schmellba99 said:

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silverado_lover said:

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American Hardwood said:

---

silverado_lover said:

---

I bet nobody who has posted on this thread drives a single cab XL trim truck.

You say you want the most basic truck, but it's not what you buy.

---

I think this misses the mark. This truck would be a second vehicle for me to do the truck stuff I need. It isn't an everyday vehicle. The reason trucks are luxury vehicles now is because they are the primary vehicle for many people and I would want some luxury, especially when you consider that a base vehicle trim is going to cost you so much anyway. You might as well pay a couple thousand more for the niceties.

If this truck was available, I would consider trading in my Tundra for a sports car and having this truck for my weekends at the ranch.

Also, it would make a great vehicle for a kid's first car at that price.

---

Why not just buy a used truck for $10k? Then sell your Tundra and buy your sports car.

Same goes for a kids first vehicle, buy a used 10k truck.

---

For $10k, you are generally getting a 15+ year old ragged out truck that probably has 150k+ miles (more likely over 200k) on it. With no warranty and no clue how much you are going to pump into it to keep it reliable.

The market for used vehicles is just as stupid as new. Hell, go try to find an old 80's square body truck - they are running $25-$30k for one in decent shape.

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Well ranch trucks typically are 15+ years old and have the simple technology that's desired. Why worry about warranty if it's cheap and easy to fix vs leaving your truck at the dealership for a month.

Regarding the square body trucks, you're talking about trucks that have turned into collectors items. You're a bit behind the curve as well, go check pricing on GMT400 trucks. The cheapest full size GM trucks are probably the 07-11 GMT900, followed by the GMT800.

schmellba99 said:

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Hawk2007 said:

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silverado_lover said:

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I bet nobody who has posted on this thread drives a single cab XL trim truck.

You say you want the most basic truck, but it's not what you buy.

---

You're exactly right. They say they want basic but when push comes to shove, they won't buy it. We should poll former students on game day with season tickets and trucks and how many went basic with a single cab . I doubt most even buy an extended cab. It's the four doors or bust.

---

You can't find extended cabs anymore hell, do any manufacturers even make them these days?

Last time I was on a lot the only single cabs were the chassis trucks; every regular truck was a 4 door model.

Kind of hard to buy things that really aren't readily available.

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I just found 100x extended cab F150s (2017-current) in a 100 mile radius around Houston. You either aren't looking or aren't paying attention.

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