It's unjust and unfair, what is happening to Trump.

The election part of that battle is lost. The dems have won by maliciousness and it is disgusting, but swing state independents are not going to vote for Trump.

The only hope is that biden can still lose the election, because Trump can't win it.

That is the objective reality.

aggiehawg said:

---

Old May Banker said:

---

Quote:

---

You're really going to allow the democrats Laura Loomer to tell you which candidate you can vote for?

---

See how silly that game is?

---

Silly? Wrecking our electoral process and trashing the Constitution is silly to you?

---

Being told that I'm supporting DeSantis because a f'ing Democrat said to is every f'ing bit that silly. Yes.

Ags4DaWin said:

---

Yes.

Let's give in to the leftist's Banana republic tactics by cratering and abandoning their political opponents who they victimize.

Enabling them while they run roughshod over the constitution just like they did in the 2020 election is sure to discourage such behavior in the future.

What could go wrong?

---

Defending Trump from the weaponization of the judicial system has nothing with him getting to be President again. He isn't owed anything, certainly not the Oval Office. He already had his chance for re-election and lost.

We need to run someone that isn't a widely despised geriatric.

TexAgs91 said:

---

I keep asking this question and no one has responded yet...

Democrats hate Trump so they will cheat to keep him from winning.
DeSantis would also be a great president and a big threat to democrats. So they would also cheat to keep DeSantis from winning. It worked against Trump, there were no repercussions, so why wouldn't they?

So in terms of electability, the same reason you wouldn't vote for Trump could be applied to DeSantis as well.

The question is: Which republican candidate is enough of a RINO that democrats would let a fair election happen?

---

Of course they will try to cheat, the question is what do you do about it? What you do is ballot harvest and have a strong ground game to go with strong legal teams in place to contest everything. Also you need a candidate that appeals to get more Swing voters who are primarily Suburban voters that have shifted from Red to Blue under Trump candidates but are staying Red with others. Examples include DeSantis, Youngkin, Reynolds, and Kemp.

Trump has burned the bridges and then pissed on them in Georgia and AZ and those are absolute must win states.

I was pretty fired up about the cheating stuff until I really looked into it more. It's there but it's fundamentally not why Trump and his candidates have lost. The real moment for me was listening to the Charlie Kirk recap show after 2022 and he talked about how they had gone to all of these GOP stronghold areas to get people to verify votes and so many folks just said they didn't vote Lake. There is a solid 5 plus percent of folks that are permanently done with Trump and his candidates. I'm not one of them but they absolutely exist.

No Spin Ag said:

---

aggiehawg said:

---

Quote:

---

Do you happen to know if that was more in the red states where McCain would win anyway, so it didn't do anything, or in the purple states where it cost him?

---

In 2012, Karl Rove was openly wondering if Mitt Romney could bring those voters back in mostly swing states and vital ones for Republicans such as Ohio and Iowa that went Obama in 2008.

---

Romney was the worst candidate the GOP put up since Dole. He was more a sacrificial lamb than Kerry was for the left.

---

McCain was worse. He literally ran an ad during Obama's DNC Acceptance speech congratulating him for being the first Black Presidential nominee. He was the definition of "Controlled Opposition".

It's way simpler....

I am not voting for Trump because I'm not a lib. Same reason I wouldn't vote for Vivek (on top of his inexperience), Christie, and others.

No overly complicated bull***** Just....I don't vote for liberals.

BigRobSA said:

---

It's way simpler....

I am not voting for Trump because I'm not a lib. Same reason I wouldn't vote for Vivek (on top of his inexperience), Christie, and others.

No overly complicated bull***** Just....I don't vote for liberals.

---

By your own definitions, DeSantis is a liberal. He has said he would use tariff's, right?

Funky Winkerbean said:

---

BigRobSA said:

---

It's way simpler....

I am not voting for Trump because I'm not a lib. Same reason I wouldn't vote for Vivek (on top of his inexperience), Christie, and others.

No overly complicated bull***** Just....I don't vote for liberals.

---

By your own definitions, DeSantis is a liberal. He has said he would use tariff's, right?

---

He said "everything is on the table".

Tariffs would be saddening, yes. Liberal policy.

aggiehawg said:

---

No Spin Ag said:

---

aggiehawg said:

---

Quote:

---

Do you happen to know if that was more in the red states where McCain would win anyway, so it didn't do anything, or in the purple states where it cost him?

---

In 2012, Karl Rove was openly wondering if Mitt Romney could bring those voters back in mostly swing states and vital ones for Republicans such as Ohio and Iowa that went Obama in 2008.

---

Romney was the worst candidate the GOP put up since Dole. He was more a sacrificial lamb than Kerry was for the left.

---

And Obama was popular after Obama care? Tea Party? Romney needed to make it his mantra that he had tried ObamaCare in MA and it didn't work. But he refused to admit he made a big mistake when he was Governor. So that alone tamped down the any-one-but-Obama vote.

Saying both he and McCain were lousy candidates (which they were) is not the only reason Republicans stayed home.

---

Old May Banker said:

---

aggiehawg said:

---

Old May Banker said:

---

Quote:

---

You're really going to allow the democrats Laura Loomer to tell you which candidate you can vote for?

---

See how silly that game is?

---

Silly? Wrecking our electoral process and trashing the Constitution is silly to you?

---

Being told that I'm supporting DeSantis because a f'ing Democrat said to is every f'ing bit that silly. Yes.

---

So you are claiming that the Special Counsel and Fani Willis are Republicans, then? Because taking the 30,000 foot view, Lawfare is lawfare and should be repugnant to all Americans. I wish Trump had not run in the first place. OTOH using malicious prosecution to keep him isn't right. It is despicable and a perversion of our electoral process. That's principle not what we have now which is partisanship and election interference.

And if they can do it to Trump with impunity, they will do it to any GOP candidate. They have already tried it with DeSantis through the Disney lawsuit, which ludicrously claims they corporate first amendment rights were violated by the legislation dissolving special improvement districts, and not just Reedy Creek. An for some reason, that federal case has not been dismissed yet. (That move by Disney has had disastrous blowback, BTW.) But the point is they have tried it, just to hurt DeSantis.

DeSantis making hay on the crooked swamp's selective prosecution.
but he's a good man. and trustworthy.

aggiehawg said:

---

Old May Banker said:

---

aggiehawg said:

---

Old May Banker said:

---

Quote:

---

You're really going to allow the democrats Laura Loomer to tell you which candidate you can vote for?

---

See how silly that game is?

---

Silly? Wrecking our electoral process and trashing the Constitution is silly to you?

---

Being told that I'm supporting DeSantis because a f'ing Democrat said to is every f'ing bit that silly. Yes.

---

So you are claiming that the Special Counsel and Fani Willis are Republicans, then? Because taking the 30,000 foot view, Lawfare is lawfare and should be repugnant to all Americans. I wish Trump had not run in the first place. OTOH using malicious prosecution to keep him isn't right. It is despicable and a perversion of our electoral process. That's principle not what we have now which is partisanship and election interference.

And if they can do it to Trump with impunity, they will do it to any GOP candidate. They have already tried it with DeSantis through the Disney lawsuit, which ludicrously claims they corporate first amendment rights were violated by the legislation dissolving special improvement districts, and not just Reedy Creek. An for some reason, that federal case has not been dismissed yet. (That move by Disney has had disastrous blowback, BTW.) But the point is they have tried it, just to hurt DeSantis.

---

Of course they have, and will, try things with Desantis, as has been pointed out ad nauseum. Literally nobody thinks otherwise. Difference being RD is extremely intelligent and articulate who actually hires "top men", unlike Trump, and thusly doesn't do/say things that add fuel to the fire. It also helps not being a womanizing man-whoor who loudly proclaims he can do whatever he wants because he is rich.

TexAgs91 said:

---

You're really going to allow the democrats to tell you which candidate you can vote for?

Which candidate do you think they will be ok with you voting for?

---

Yep. That's the level of fight the OP and many of the RDS people have. They pretend they are orthodox conservatives, but at the end the day they fail to understand the sitz en leben of our political system.. They pretend it 2004 and think the Dems are going to allow RDS to a fair election and even if he miraculously wins, he won't be given numerous indictments, impeachment, and 24/7 hatred.

They are fools to the highest magnitude

You're trying to hard.

A poster claimed that Desantis voters were doing so because of democrats.

I am not a f'ing Democrat. I have the full ability to believe that the assaults on Trump are bull**** AND STILL BELIEVE that he isn't the best candidate. I thought Cruz was the best candidate in 16... I think DeSantis is in 24.

Doesn't have **** to do with whatever made up "the democrats choice" bull**** anyone chooses to espouse. My point was, claiming I'm supporting RD in the primaries because of Democrats is the equivalent of claiming all Trump voters do what Laura loomer tells them.

You're smart enough to understand that.

It's wild to think that you people really believe "not wanting Trump to get his butt kicked in the general election again" equals "okay with lawfare against him".

What's happening is banana republic level ***** I hope he wrecks shop and spends his remaining years vindicated at Mar a Lago playing golf. But he isn't owed the Presidency and he will lose bigly again if he wins the primary.

Old May Banker said:

---

You're trying to hard.

A poster claimed that Desantis voters were doing so because of democrats.

I am not a f'ing Democrat. I have the full ability to believe that the assaults on Trump are bull**** AND STILL BELIEVE that he isn't the best candidate. I thought Cruz was the best candidate in 16... I think DeSantis is in 24.

Doesn't have **** to do with whatever made up "the democrats choice" bull**** anyone chooses to espouse. My point was, claiming I'm supporting RD in the primaries because of Democrats is the equivalent of claiming all Trump voters do what Laura loomer tells them.

You're smart enough to understand that.

---

No, no. You don't really believe this, you've just been tricked into believing it because you're actually a secret lib troll that fell for all the media lies.

Are the Rs still holding primaries in the spring? Cause I see an awful lot of RonneD enthusiasts saying he is the better candidate and thats why he should win and Trump should lose.

If I recall from my understanding of the primaries held by Republicans (the other side has a (d)ifferent selection process), the R candidates campaign, may choose to debate other candidates, then state by state we hold primary elections and that shows who the "best" candidate is.

Trump haterz always devolve to a) Dems want it to be Trump cause he will lose to Biden so supporting Trump is doing what the Ds tell you; b) RonnieD is the bestest and our only chance to beat Biden and Trump needs to step aside; or c) Trump will be in prison and do you really want the Country run from Fulton County jail?

Just let the process play out. Then in the general, vote Trump to deliver this Country from the wicked.

TheBonifaceOption said:

---

TexAgs91 said:

---

You're really going to allow the democrats to tell you which candidate you can vote for?

Which candidate do you think they will be ok with you voting for?

---

Yep. That's the level of fight the OP and many of the RDS people have. They pretend they are orthodox conservatives, but at the end the day they fail to understand the sitz en leben of our political system.. They pretend it 2004 and think the Dems are going to allow RDS to a fair election and even if he miraculously wins, he won't be given numerous indictments, impeachment, and 24/7 hatred.

They are fools to the highest magnitude

---

I actually see this as a lesser reason not to vote for him. I'd put age and the fact he has no path because of GA and AZ as tops on the list then get into policy failures and then stuff like this somewhere down there. Revenge is not going to propel Trump to victory in the General, it may in the Primary but it's a loser in the General.

Look around. People are concerned with the economy on a downward spiral, inflation eating up their savings and making it harder and harder to buy a house or a car, and the overall direction of where we are headed. Trump getting screwed over in 2020 and his legal stuff means little to nothing to people in the middle who for right or wrong see Trump as old, tired, and corrupt and just want to move on. They don't really care if he goes to jail or not and you are going to have a very hard time convincing them to care. They just want him to go away.

You know what else I have noticed? I don't see Trump stuff hardly anywhere anymore. Trump flags and MAGA hats are rare. I sometimes see a bumper sticker or maybe a flag out in the country but that's about it. The energy behind him is a fraction of what it was and it could get a lot worse.

Trump isn't talking about the future he's talking about the past or himself, that's not a winning message.

Quote:

---

We don't want to vote for Trump because he's going to lose the general election, again.

---

To be clear, the "we" in your statement is actually less than 20% of the Republican Party.

Taking out Trump ensures a democrat victory. Forcing the Party to pick between any candidate that has less than 20% actual support of the party is suicide.

You can scream the TDS REEEEEEEE TRUMP CANT WIN THE GENERAL, even though Biden is way weaker than he was the last election. But he's the only candidate that actually has a chance.

14 months in politics is a lifetime. No one knows how all these contingencies will sway the voters. It's possible the 4 dubious and sloppy indictments won't even get to trial by election day. The economy may tank. The flood of migrants by election time may be so intolerable that Independents & even Moderate Democrats will have had enough. Ukraine might be crushed into a Rump State with all our taxpayers money wasted. And then there is Cornell West and the No Labels Party !! It's silly to make serious predictions now.

ts5641 said:

---

This guy crystalizes my thoughts exactly on why we have to move away from Trump. We're being played.

The odds that Donald Trump will be saddled with at least one FELONY conviction out of the dozens he is currently charged with is exceedingly high. This time next year, he could either be in prison or on house arrest.

Make no mistake. They are removing Trump from the board.… pic.twitter.com/wBjIqOlri5

— Scott Morefield (@SKMorefield) September 3, 2023

---

And if enough people begin to think as you do, that the people should just accept and acquiesce to fascist acts, our country is lost and civil war is just around the corner.

Do you really think President Trump is not being railroaded?

geoag58 said:

---

ts5641 said:

---

This guy crystalizes my thoughts exactly on why we have to move away from Trump. We're being played.

The odds that Donald Trump will be saddled with at least one FELONY conviction out of the dozens he is currently charged with is exceedingly high. This time next year, he could either be in prison or on house arrest.

Make no mistake. They are removing Trump from the board.… pic.twitter.com/wBjIqOlri5

— Scott Morefield (@SKMorefield) September 3, 2023

---

And if enough people begin to think as you do, that the people should just accept and acquiesce to fascist acts, our country is lost and civil war is just around the corner.

Do you really think President Trump is not being railroaded?

---

These people actually claim the left is doing this to Trump to HELP HIM WIN.

Science Denier said:

---

Quote:

---

We don't want to vote for Trump because he's going to lose the general election, again.

---

Taking out Trump ensures a democrat victory. Forcing the Party to pick between any candidate that has less than 20% actual support ifnthr party is suicide.

You can scream the TDS REEEEEEEE TRUMP CANT WIN THR GENERAL, even though Biden is way weaker thst he was the last election. But he's the only candidate that actually has a chance.

---

Nominating Trump ensures a Dem victory in AZ, GA, NH, NV, WI, PA, and MI. The downballot fallout will be horrible.

In 2020, Trump's margins were lower in 27 out of 30 states he won in 2016:

2016 v 2020

Alabama: -2.8 pts
Alaska: -5.1 pts
Arizona: -4.4 pts
Arkansas: + 1.0 pts
Florida: +2.0 pts
Georgia: -5.9 pts
Idaho: - 1.0 pts
Indiana: -3.2 pts
Iowa: -1.0 pts
Kansas: -6.4 pts
Kentucky: -3.9…

— Joe Rhode (@JoeRhode) September 2, 2023

Since the tweet cuts out:

Quote:

---

In 2020, Trump's margins were lower in 27 out of 30 states he won in 2016:

2016 v 2020

Alabama: -2.8 pts
Alaska: -5.1 pts
Arizona: -4.4 pts
Arkansas: + 1.0 pts
Florida: +2.0 pts
Georgia: -5.9 pts
Idaho: - 1.0 pts
Indiana: -3.2 pts
Iowa: -1.0 pts
Kansas: -6.4 pts
Kentucky: -3.9 pts
Louisiana: -1.1 pts
Michigan: - 2.5 pts
Mississippi: -2.1 pts
Missouri: -3.7 pts
Montana: -4.2 pts
Nebraska: -7.2 pts
North Carolina: -2.4 pts
North Dakota: -3.7 pts
Ohio: -0.6 pts
Oklahoma: -3.3 pts
Pennsylvania: -2.4 pts
South Carolina: -2.4 pts
South Dakota: -3.6 pts
Tennessee: -3.0 pts
Texas: -3.6 pts
Utah: +2.4
West Virginia: -3.3 pts
Wisconsin: -1.7 pts
Wyoming: -3.9 pts

---

That settles it. Cancel the primaries and let's pass out DeSantis-Kemp shirts cause that will show those pesky libs who the Rs really are!

How does Trump turn around his negative trend everywhere? How will he win those potential swing states?

TRM said:

---

Science Denier said:

---

Quote:

---

We don't want to vote for Trump because he's going to lose the general election, again.

---

Taking out Trump ensures a democrat victory. Forcing the Party to pick between any candidate that has less than 20% actual support ifnthr party is suicide.

You can scream the TDS REEEEEEEE TRUMP CANT WIN THR GENERAL, even though Biden is way weaker thst he was the last election. But he's the only candidate that actually has a chance.

---

Nominating Trump ensures a Dem victory in AZ, GA, NH, NV, WI, PA, and MI. The downballot fallout will be horrible.

In 2020, Trump's margins were lower in 27 out of 30 states he won in 2016:

2016 v 2020

Alabama: -2.8 pts
Alaska: -5.1 pts
Arizona: -4.4 pts
Arkansas: + 1.0 pts
Florida: +2.0 pts
Georgia: -5.9 pts
Idaho: - 1.0 pts
Indiana: -3.2 pts
Iowa: -1.0 pts
Kansas: -6.4 pts
Kentucky: -3.9…

— Joe Rhode (@JoeRhode) September 2, 2023

Since the tweet cuts out:

Quote:

---

In 2020, Trump's margins were lower in 27 out of 30 states he won in 2016:

2016 v 2020

Alabama: -2.8 pts
Alaska: -5.1 pts
Arizona: -4.4 pts
Arkansas: + 1.0 pts
Florida: +2.0 pts
Georgia: -5.9 pts
Idaho: - 1.0 pts
Indiana: -3.2 pts
Iowa: -1.0 pts
Kansas: -6.4 pts
Kentucky: -3.9 pts
Louisiana: -1.1 pts
Michigan: - 2.5 pts
Mississippi: -2.1 pts
Missouri: -3.7 pts
Montana: -4.2 pts
Nebraska: -7.2 pts
North Carolina: -2.4 pts
North Dakota: -3.7 pts
Ohio: -0.6 pts
Oklahoma: -3.3 pts
Pennsylvania: -2.4 pts
South Carolina: -2.4 pts
South Dakota: -3.6 pts
Tennessee: -3.0 pts
Texas: -3.6 pts
Utah: +2.4
West Virginia: -3.3 pts
Wisconsin: -1.7 pts
Wyoming: -3.9 pts

---

---

That was with a Biden hidden in a closet being promoted as a moderate.

Crime way up
Grooming children
Parents on FBI watch lists
Gas prices thru the roof
Inflation
Should I keep going?

Do you really think any candidate that has less than 20% of the Republican Party support at this stage of the primary process will win a general election? That's just crazy.

TRM said:

---

How does Trump turn around his negative trend everywhere? How will he win those potential swing states?

---

In 2020, Trump got more votes than any Republican in history. And that's after dominion changed votes. It took massive cheating to beat him.

I get it that you don't believe that, but that's the way it is.

Science Denier said:

---

TRM said:

---

How does Trump turn around his negative trend everywhere? How will he win those potential swing states?

---

In 2020, Trump got more votes than any Republican in history. And that's after dominion changed votes. It took massive cheating to beat him.

I get it that you don't believe that, but that's the way it is.

---

The RNC is awful. Their attention is fully on the ass kicking that the party will get in the General afa President is concerned
They should be focused on down ballots. 2022 was an awful result for the Senate and House. I'm of the opinion that Trump as the GOP ensures both Sen and House end up Democrat. I'm hopeful that DeSantis could at least stave off losing the House. I don't think the Senate can be won back with any Republican candidate, though

If Trump is the nominee, will the focus be on Biden's incompetence or Trump's legal problems? Moderates aren't interested in voting for convicted felons. You'd have a third party run by Manchin/Hogan to contend with as well and they'd probably win the independent vote, but ultimately there's generally more Dems than Republicans.

txaggieacct85 said:

---

Actually the best reason to vote for DeSantis is that he is the better candidate in every category

---

Science Denier said:

---

geoag58 said:

---

ts5641 said:

---

This guy crystalizes my thoughts exactly on why we have to move away from Trump. We're being played.

The odds that Donald Trump will be saddled with at least one FELONY conviction out of the dozens he is currently charged with is exceedingly high. This time next year, he could either be in prison or on house arrest.

Make no mistake. They are removing Trump from the board.… pic.twitter.com/wBjIqOlri5

— Scott Morefield (@SKMorefield) September 3, 2023

---

And if enough people begin to think as you do, that the people should just accept and acquiesce to fascist acts, our country is lost and civil war is just around the corner.

Do you really think President Trump is not being railroaded?

---

These people actually claim the left is doing this to Trump to HELP HIM WIN.

---

Young and wet behind the ears can't be an excuse forever. The things the commies, formerly known as dimtards, are doing go way beyond the usual election year antics. This is an attempt to overthrow our system and institute one party rule. Hopefully they wake up.

TRM said:

---

If Trump is the nominee, will the focus be on Biden's incompetence or Trump's legal problems? Moderates aren't interested in voting for convicted felons. You'd have a third party run by Manchin/Hogan to contend with as well and they'd probably win the independent vote, but ultimately there's generally more Dems than Republicans.

---

Most of Trump supporters are Trump supporters. Labor is not going with Manchin. That dude won't run as a 3rd party as it would take way too many votes from Biden. Mike's could t Cary enough harvested votes to come close to overcoming thst. They are better off just throwing some stupid number at him to go away.

Science Denier said:

---

TRM said:

---

How does Trump turn around his negative trend everywhere? How will he win those potential swing states?

---

In 2020, Trump got more votes than any Republican in history. And that's after dominion changed votes. It took massive cheating to beat him.

I get it that you don't believe that, but that's the way it is.

---

Good enough for second place.

aggiehawg said:

---

Quote:

---

That way, Maga will have to give their votes to someone else, and they want to be that someone else.

---

Not the way it works. They will just not show up, like what happened with McCain and to a lesser degree, Romney. Also arguably to Hillar in 2016 as Bernie Bros believed she had rigged the primary.

And yes, I know Obama was going to win in 2008. The point is Republican turnout was down by 3 million votes.

---

That knife cuts both ways. If Trump is the nominee I'll be staying home. Love his policies (well, except for his lack of aversion to debt). Just tired of the juvenile behavior.