ABATTBQ11 said:

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We had an unsolicited offer last year for about $10k over our
current appraisal. I was curious about OpenDoor because they kept sending us stuff. I got an online minimum offer for about $20k over our appraisal. Considering we just redid the backyard and have made some other upgrades to the house, I think it would be easily be more. All things considered, as much as the appraisal has increased, it's accurate.

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OpenDoor has much higher closing costs. That's where they get you.

So then invest your money in something else like gold that is only taxed when you sell it. Nothing says you can't live in a shack in the ghetto.

one safe place said:

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ABATTBQ11 said:

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For all the complaints about valuation, how many people see their property valued at prices they know they couldn't sell at? Ours has about doubled since we bought 7 years ago, but it's not like the valuation is out of line with market value. I could sell right now to OpenDoor or Offerpad for more than my current tax valuation. If it's accurate, what's the complaint beyond property tax in general?

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Property tax is a tax on unrealized gain. A tax on something you own. Like the wealth tax they were proposing where tax was going to be assessed on the value of your assets, even though you sold nothing.

With an income tax, you can see where you had income, it is pretty much measurable for most people. With a sales tax, or consumption tax, that too is measurable, you know what you spent and are taxed on that spending. But property tax isn't based on a transaction, like income and consumption taxes are, but on someone's opinion of the value of what you own.

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Yeah, I get all that, but for everyone comparing about the appraisals, if the appraisals are at realistic market values, then what is the complaint? It's one thing to say you don't like property taxes, but I find it disingenuous to complain about appraisals if they're correct

ABATTBQ11 said:

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one safe place said:

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ABATTBQ11 said:

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For all the complaints about valuation, how many people see their property valued at prices they know they couldn't sell at? Ours has about doubled since we bought 7 years ago, but it's not like the valuation is out of line with market value. I could sell right now to OpenDoor or Offerpad for more than my current tax valuation. If it's accurate, what's the complaint beyond property tax in general?

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Property tax is a tax on unrealized gain. A tax on something you own. Like the wealth tax they were proposing where tax was going to be assessed on the value of your assets, even though you sold nothing.

With an income tax, you can see where you had income, it is pretty much measurable for most people. With a sales tax, or consumption tax, that too is measurable, you know what you spent and are taxed on that spending. But property tax isn't based on a transaction, like income and consumption taxes are, but on someone's opinion of the value of what you own.

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Yeah, I get all that, but for everyone comparing about the appraisals, if the appraisals are at realistic market values, then what is the complaint? It's one thing to say you don't like property taxes, but I find it disingenuous to complain about appraisals if they're correct

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Because you haven't realized the increased appraisal because you haven't sold the property. You're paying tax without a corresponding benefit of having sold.

It would be like at the poker table the house taking a percentage of your stack each hand.

samurai_science said:

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ABATTBQ11 said:

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We had an unsolicited offer last year for about $10k over our
current appraisal. I was curious about OpenDoor because they kept sending us stuff. I got an online minimum offer for about $20k over our appraisal. Considering we just redid the backyard and have made some other upgrades to the house, I think it would be easily be more. All things considered, as much as the appraisal has increased, it's accurate.

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OpenDoor offered me 100k less than what Zillow has but I have seen houses on my street go for more than what Zillow has in the last 6 weeks.

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If OpenDoor offered me $100k less than Zillow I would take that and run.

AlaskanAg99 said:

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ABATTBQ11 said:

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one safe place said:

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ABATTBQ11 said:

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For all the complaints about valuation, how many people see their property valued at prices they know they couldn't sell at? Ours has about doubled since we bought 7 years ago, but it's not like the valuation is out of line with market value. I could sell right now to OpenDoor or Offerpad for more than my current tax valuation. If it's accurate, what's the complaint beyond property tax in general?

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Property tax is a tax on unrealized gain. A tax on something you own. Like the wealth tax they were proposing where tax was going to be assessed on the value of your assets, even though you sold nothing.

With an income tax, you can see where you had income, it is pretty much measurable for most people. With a sales tax, or consumption tax, that too is measurable, you know what you spent and are taxed on that spending. But property tax isn't based on a transaction, like income and consumption taxes are, but on someone's opinion of the value of what you own.

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Yeah, I get all that, but for everyone comparing about the appraisals, if the appraisals are at realistic market values, then what is the complaint? It's one thing to say you don't like property taxes, but I find it disingenuous to complain about appraisals if they're correct

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Because you haven't realized the increased appraisal because you haven't sold the property. You're paying tax without a corresponding benefit of having sold.

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You also pay other overhead like insurance and maintenance when you own property. Owning and keeping real estate has never been free.

Even Kings had to employ soldiers to protect their land from being stolen.

AlaskanAg99 said:

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ABATTBQ11 said:

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one safe place said:

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ABATTBQ11 said:

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For all the complaints about valuation, how many people see their property valued at prices they know they couldn't sell at? Ours has about doubled since we bought 7 years ago, but it's not like the valuation is out of line with market value. I could sell right now to OpenDoor or Offerpad for more than my current tax valuation. If it's accurate, what's the complaint beyond property tax in general?

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Property tax is a tax on unrealized gain. A tax on something you own. Like the wealth tax they were proposing where tax was going to be assessed on the value of your assets, even though you sold nothing.

With an income tax, you can see where you had income, it is pretty much measurable for most people. With a sales tax, or consumption tax, that too is measurable, you know what you spent and are taxed on that spending. But property tax isn't based on a transaction, like income and consumption taxes are, but on someone's opinion of the value of what you own.

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Yeah, I get all that, but for everyone comparing about the appraisals, if the appraisals are at realistic market values, then what is the complaint? It's one thing to say you don't like property taxes, but I find it disingenuous to complain about appraisals if they're correct

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Because you haven't realized the increased appraisal because you haven't sold the property. You're paying tax without a corresponding benefit of having sold.

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*Eye roll*

Yeah. I get why people don't like property tax. That's not the question. The question is what exactly are CADs doing wrong when they establish appraisals that appreciate market value. There are lots of complaints here about CADs and how much they keep raising appraisals, but if the appraisals are at or near market value based on selling prices, exactly what are the CADs doing wrong? It's like people are pissed that their property value went up and are blaming the CAD instead of the market.

ABATTBQ11 said:

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AlaskanAg99 said:

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ABATTBQ11 said:

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one safe place said:

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ABATTBQ11 said:

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For all the complaints about valuation, how many people see their property valued at prices they know they couldn't sell at? Ours has about doubled since we bought 7 years ago, but it's not like the valuation is out of line with market value. I could sell right now to OpenDoor or Offerpad for more than my current tax valuation. If it's accurate, what's the complaint beyond property tax in general?

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Property tax is a tax on unrealized gain. A tax on something you own. Like the wealth tax they were proposing where tax was going to be assessed on the value of your assets, even though you sold nothing.

With an income tax, you can see where you had income, it is pretty much measurable for most people. With a sales tax, or consumption tax, that too is measurable, you know what you spent and are taxed on that spending. But property tax isn't based on a transaction, like income and consumption taxes are, but on someone's opinion of the value of what you own.

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Yeah, I get all that, but for everyone comparing about the appraisals, if the appraisals are at realistic market values, then what is the complaint? It's one thing to say you don't like property taxes, but I find it disingenuous to complain about appraisals if they're correct

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Because you haven't realized the increased appraisal because you haven't sold the property. You're paying tax without a corresponding benefit of having sold.

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*Eye roll*

Yeah. I get why people don't like property tax. That's not the question. The question is what exactly are CADs doing wrong when they establish appraisals that appreciate market value. There are lots of complaints here about CADs and how much they keep raising appraisals, but if the appraisals are at or near market value based on selling prices, exactly what are the CADs doing wrong? It's like people are pissed that their property value went up and are blaming the CAD instead of the market.

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I get what you are saying and I don't know the answers to any of this until you completely overhaul the tax system.

Let's say you have two homes next door to one another with similar/same comps both appraised at $250k. One of those homes is then sold for $325k. The new owner now has a home that is worth $325k and I guess we are saying that the other guy that didn't sell should still only pay taxes on a $250k home.

So now you have two homes with same comps and a large disparity in value. From the POV of any other asset, I would say that would be fine because I shouldn't pay tax on an unrealized gain if I'm owner of $250k house just because my neighbor sold his house.

If we are just taxing on realized gains, then you could effectively grandfather yourself into lower taxes by staying put and never moving. That is roughly the California model? That, then, is essentially a progressive tax policy assuming market rates are higher than appraised rates and you move and buy something new. You have now locked yourself into a higher tax bracket by doing this.

However, that's not how the process works and that process funds public schools. So the only way to address it is to have a state-wide, NASTY, very political discourse on how we are going to fund public schools. The CAD is irrelevant until you tackle the source of this issue - funding public schools.

You want to pay lower property taxes and figure out something else for public schools? Then welcome to your new state income tax, or your separate school funding tax.

So we can get mad at them all we want but you are pissing in the wind until/if the tax code changes.

We should just pay sales tax on the price paid when we buy it and eliminate property tax. The system is too complicated, undemocratic, too easily gamed by the counties, and we never truly own our homes.

DrEvazanPhD said:

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I'd really like to know what kind of improvements in city/county/school district services we're getting for paying twice as much

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They get new tahoes

School choice topic. Haven't decided yet if I'm for or agains school choice. What I do know is it is nowhere near as simple as I want my child to go to that school so I pick that school and it is done. Only so may teachers per school, and so only so many the student population can be. Vast majority I am expecting to be waitlisted.

Can anyone speak to the fine print, gotchas, and untold details of school choice?

So does the ESCROW deduct or get reworked?

AGGIEZ99 said:

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YouBet said:

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Looking ahead, you are going to see people just walk away from property. These % increases we are getting every year are unsustainable. I don't care how well off you are at some point the math won't make sense to own.

Edit: or people leave Texas to retire elsewhere. There are several states where it will make more sense to retire from a financial bottom line.

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Which ones? Genuinely curious

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Ran across this today: https://www.bankrate.com/retirement/best-and-worst-states-for-retirement/

This is Bankrate's methodology and there are different views of this out there. I expect some to laugh at this list, but you will probably find this directionally similar to other analysis on this.

Note their primary driver:

Quote:

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The category that we weighed the heaviest was affordability, to reflect the challenges that so many Americans face in today's economy.

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I think you will generally find the bottom 5-10 on this list are usually the same rough list of culprits because you can't skate around the reality of the math at the end of the day.

When they have Mississippi in their top 5, you have to wonder....

tamc93 said:

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When they have Mississippi in their top 5, you have to wonder....

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Cost of living is weighted most heavily. That's why.

It's a financially driven model vs a QOL driven model. And the latter is totally subjective.