Quote:

---

Honestly this is one of those situations where there IS no good guy

---

Just keep saying this and maybe it will eventually be true.

Teslag said:

---

Quote:

---

Honestly this is one of those situations where there IS no good guy

---

Just keep saying this and maybe it will eventually be true.

---

It is already true. The ones getting screwed is our middle class and future generations.

Right. All the civilians being blown up in their homes and raped in the street don't have it as bad as our middle class.


Carry on.

Teslag said:

---

Right. All the civilians being blown up in their homes and raped in the street don't have it as bad as our middle class.


Carry on.

---

But...inflation is 4%. That's WAY worse than rape and death.

Ag with kids said:

---

Teslag said:

---

Right. All the civilians being blown up in their homes and raped in the street don't have it as bad as our middle class.


Carry on.

---

But...inflation is 4%. That's WAY worse than rape and death.

---

Not sure if you've addressed it or not, but how upset are you that Elena Baturina is still exempt from the sanctions on Russia/Russians?

Feb. 14, 2014 - Russian businesswoman Elena Baturina wired a $3.5 million payment to Hunter's Rosemont Seneca.

Baturina was married to the late Yuri Luzhkov, who was the mayor of Moscow.

Baturina also sent a series of payments between May 6, 2015, and Dec. 8, 2015, to Rosemont.

— Jeff Carlson (@themarketswork) June 14, 2023

Just curious.

Teslag said:

---

Right. All the civilians being blown up in their homes and raped in the street don't have it as bad as our middle class.


Carry on.

---

Agreed.

nortex97 said:

---

Ag with kids said:

---

Teslag said:

---

Right. All the civilians being blown up in their homes and raped in the street don't have it as bad as our middle class.


Carry on.

---

But...inflation is 4%. That's WAY worse than rape and death.

---

Not sure if you've addressed it or not, but how upset are you that Elena Baturina is still exempt from the sanctions on Russia/Russians?

Feb. 14, 2014 - Russian businesswoman Elena Baturina wired a $3.5 million payment to Hunter's Rosemont Seneca.

Baturina was married to the late Yuri Luzhkov, who was the mayor of Moscow.

Baturina also sent a series of payments between May 6, 2015, and Dec. 8, 2015, to Rosemont.

— Jeff Carlson (@themarketswork) June 14, 2023

Just curious.

---

A) I have no idea who that is
ii) If she's involved in shady shenanigans with the Rooskies, shut her **** down.
3) Biden is a corrupt dbag

That's what I expected, to be fair.

I'm amazed at 'conservatives' and other non-communist Americans' apathy toward our proxy war with Russia being commanded by a guy clearly in bed with…Russians/Chinese. But anyway, back to principles. Everyone who has paid attention to the news the past 24 months knows who she is. Hunter and the Bidens sure do.

Teslag said:

---

Quote:

---

Honestly this is one of those situations where there IS no good guy

---

Just keep saying this and maybe it will eventually be true.

---

Who, praytell, is the good guy then, in your eyes? Are you saying you want to ignore all the bad things that Ukraine did?

Personally, I'm not from Russia or Ukraine, so I plan on just not caring about this conflict and not picking a side.

nortex97 said:

---

That's what I expected, to be fair.

I'm amazed at 'conservatives' and other non-communist Americans' apathy toward our proxy war with Russia being commanded by a guy clearly in bed with…Russians/Chinese. But anyway, back to principles. Everyone who has paid attention to the news the past 24 months knows who she is. Hunter and the Bidens sure do.

---

No they don't.

Steampunk-Kangaroo said:

---

Teslag said:

---

Quote:

---

Honestly this is one of those situations where there IS no good guy

---

Just keep saying this and maybe it will eventually be true.

---

Who, praytell, is the good guy then, in your eyes? Are you saying you want to ignore all the bad things that Ukraine did?

Personally, I'm not from Russia or Ukraine, so I plan on just not caring about this conflict and not picking a side.

---

I'm going to go with the country that's not presently invading another, targeting civilians hundreds of miles from the front, commiting war crimes like in Bucha, and engaging in mass rape.

Your standards may vary and like harumph our tax dollars and ****

Teslag said:

---

Steampunk-Kangaroo said:

---

Teslag said:

---

Quote:

---

Honestly this is one of those situations where there IS no good guy

---

Just keep saying this and maybe it will eventually be true.

---

Who, praytell, is the good guy then, in your eyes? Are you saying you want to ignore all the bad things that Ukraine did?

Personally, I'm not from Russia or Ukraine, so I plan on just not caring about this conflict and not picking a side.

---

I'm going to go with the country that's not presently invading another, targeting civilians hundreds of miles from the front, commiting war crimes like in Bucha, and engaging in mass rape.

Your standards may vary and like harumph our tax dollars and ****

---

Once again, you seem to believe that the map that Google gives you means that those boundaries are immutable. The only way those boundaries have meaning is because there are forces that can defend them.

Just on a lark, tell me where Yugoslavia is.

Teslag said:

---

Steampunk-Kangaroo said:

---

Teslag said:

---

Quote:

---

Honestly this is one of those situations where there IS no good guy

---

Just keep saying this and maybe it will eventually be true.

---

Who, praytell, is the good guy then, in your eyes? Are you saying you want to ignore all the bad things that Ukraine did?

Personally, I'm not from Russia or Ukraine, so I plan on just not caring about this conflict and not picking a side.

---

I'm going to go with the country that's not presently invading another, targeting civilians hundreds of miles from the front, commiting war crimes like in Bucha, and engaging in mass rape.

Your standards may vary and like harumph our tax dollars and ****

---

This guy doesn't Vietnam.

10thYrSr said:

---

Teslag said:

---

Steampunk-Kangaroo said:

---

Teslag said:

---

Quote:

---

Honestly this is one of those situations where there IS no good guy

---

Just keep saying this and maybe it will eventually be true.

---

Who, praytell, is the good guy then, in your eyes? Are you saying you want to ignore all the bad things that Ukraine did?

Personally, I'm not from Russia or Ukraine, so I plan on just not caring about this conflict and not picking a side.

---

I'm going to go with the country that's not presently invading another, targeting civilians hundreds of miles from the front, commiting war crimes like in Bucha, and engaging in mass rape.

Your standards may vary and like harumph our tax dollars and ****

---

This guy doesn't Vietnam.

---

We should have never had boots on the ground in Vietnam

J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

Did anyone say that? I don't see anyone calling people Putin stooges/Ivan etc solely for not supporting the US being involved, but feel free to prove me wrong if someone is doing that.

I'll try and make this as simple as possible:

Being against the US funding Ukraine, for whatever reason (Biden corruption, not wanting to spend our resources, Etc) - not Russian Stooge. Especially if you don't support the US proactively attacking Russia or putting troops on the ground, which I'm pretty sure almost no one does.

Actively supporting Russia destroying it's neighbor, like PlaneCrashGuy is doing for some reason, assuming it's not just a long running troll - Russian stooge (and also just a bad person in general)

Repeating obvious Russian talking points like Ukraine not being a real country, they deserved to be invaded/it's the US's fault, biolabs etc. - somewhere in between but definitely not as bad as someone actively wanting Russia to win.

Will have to agree to disagree on states being able to leave whenever they want to, but not like it really matters because it will never happen here.

---

Weatherman is correct.

the only possible viewpoints for a PATRIOTIC American to have are two:

1) the USA should be isolationist and never really support anyone outside of ourselves. This is a stupid view which based on history has proven to be horrendous and leads to even GREATER American losses.

2) The USA should support the western oriented/NATO applicant against the country WE FOUGHT A COLD WAR WITH FOR FORTY YEARS and is still one of our top three near peer enemies.

it is inconceivable that any Patriotic American would be actually wanting Putin to win- other than Russian bots and trolls.

You are correct that there are two positions for Americans, but you got them wrong. Stateside, your options are:

1) recognize that Russia will win (and sort of already has)

Or 2) you consume more Ukelele propaganda and detach yourself from reality (Teslag)

Quote:

---

1) recognize that Russia will win (and sort of already has)

---

Yes, Russia has already clearly won. Even the most ridiculous Russian propaganda outlets don't even make this claim.

And what are they going to win with? Which rusted buck of old equipment will they use? Or are you going with the super secret back up arsenal of ultra modern weapons? (again, even the most ardent Russian propaganda sites don't make this claim. It's purely Texags russian fan fiction).

Teslag said:

---

Quote:

---

1) recognize that Russia will win (and sort of already has)

---

Yes, Russia has already clearly won.

---

No.

nortex97 said:

---

That's what I expected, to be fair.

I'm amazed at 'conservatives' and other non-communist Americans' apathy toward our proxy war with Russia being commanded by a guy clearly in bed with…Russians/Chinese. But anyway, back to principles. Everyone who has paid attention to the news the past 24 months knows who she is. Hunter and the Bidens sure do.

---

strawman. How does this factor into the US strategic interest???

InfantryAg said:

---

nortex97 said:

---

That's what I expected, to be fair.

I'm amazed at 'conservatives' and other non-communist Americans' apathy toward our proxy war with Russia being commanded by a guy clearly in bed with…Russians/Chinese. But anyway, back to principles. Everyone who has paid attention to the news the past 24 months knows who she is. Hunter and the Bidens sure do.

---

strawman. How does this factor into the US strategic interest???

---

I think the idea of having a demonstrably treasonous and/or senile commander is terrifying in any conflict, let alone one involving multiple nuclear powers.

I imagine even just the poor guys being ordered into mine fields don't have full awareness of the Biden's multi-million dollar history with Russian/Ukrainian billionaires, for instance. But that's…a straw man? Wow.

nortex97 said:

---

InfantryAg said:

---

nortex97 said:

---

That's what I expected, to be fair.

I'm amazed at 'conservatives' and other non-communist Americans' apathy toward our proxy war with Russia being commanded by a guy clearly in bed with…Russians/Chinese. But anyway, back to principles. Everyone who has paid attention to the news the past 24 months knows who she is. Hunter and the Bidens sure do.

---

strawman. How does this factor into the US strategic interest???

---

I think the idea of having a demonstrably treasonous and/or senile commander is terrifying in any conflict, let alone one involving multiple nuclear powers.

I imagine even just the poor guys being ordered into mine fields don't have full awareness of the Biden's multi-million dollar history with Russian/Ukrainian billionaires, for instance. But that's…a straw man? Wow.

---

So if Reagan/ Trump etc was in office right now it would be OK.

The grift is ancillary at best to our strategic interests. No one who supports the continued fighting also supports the corruption. Using the corruption, that no one here supports, to say the war on its face is bad is the definition of a strawman.

InfantryAg said:

---

nortex97 said:

---

InfantryAg said:

---

nortex97 said:

---

That's what I expected, to be fair.

I'm amazed at 'conservatives' and other non-communist Americans' apathy toward our proxy war with Russia being commanded by a guy clearly in bed with…Russians/Chinese. But anyway, back to principles. Everyone who has paid attention to the news the past 24 months knows who she is. Hunter and the Bidens sure do.

---

strawman. How does this factor into the US strategic interest???

---

I think the idea of having a demonstrably treasonous and/or senile commander is terrifying in any conflict, let alone one involving multiple nuclear powers.

I imagine even just the poor guys being ordered into mine fields don't have full awareness of the Biden's multi-million dollar history with Russian/Ukrainian billionaires, for instance. But that's…a straw man? Wow.

---

So if Reagan/ Trump etc was in office right now it would be OK.

The grift is ancillary at best to our strategic interests. No one who supports the continued fighting also supports the corruption. Using the corruption, that no one here supports, to say the war on its face is bad is the definition of a strawman.

---

That's just not true, definitionally. The commander is part of the corruption, who is ordering the continued fighting and helped to ensure it started in the first place.

Secondly, some here have avowed they only care about deaths of soldiers on one side. Therefore, they support corruption if it procures deaths.

Third, if we had a competent/non-senile commander of our foreign policy, yes I expect the outcome wouldn't similarly favor China or Russian oligarchs, but that has nothing to do with Trump or Reagan (RIP). I am not in favor of Trump in the GOP primary, for reference.

Fourth, I never asserted it is just about grift. That's a part, but the bigger part isn't the cost in dollars, let alone money laundering/grift, but the…treason of the leaders involved. Clearly, the Biden familia is part of that, to an extent no former CINC has been. He's uniquely unqualified to lead a nuclear war/conflict with Russia.

I agree in bidens ability to screw this up. The rest of what you wrote has no bearing on the strategic interests of the US. It doesn't matter in 10 or 5 years. The arguments for or against support should be focused on what is the best outcome for the US in 5, 10, 25 and 50 years.

How this affects us, russia, china and our interactions with the rest of the world.

Out of the 6,000 tweets you read today, let this be one of them.

5,999 to go. pic.twitter.com/4yKAeW9nBT

— Elon Musk (Parody) (@ElonMuskAOC) July 1, 2023

When you sent weapons and equipment to Ukraine, and now you need them yourself pic.twitter.com/hmK81fzob0

— Spriter Team (@SpriterTeam) July 1, 2023

It could happen here too, fyi.

Dickering about who should run the Donbas shouldn't be worth the risk of a nuclear conflagration.

With Polish PM showing interest in joining NATO nuclear-sharing program to deliver American nukes (not clear Poland will get such a role), The Drive has informative backgrounder.

Great to see our research used. More info here: https://t.co/FeZ0yjNUBk https://t.co/MHTkBpttlj

— Hans Kristensen (@nukestrat) July 2, 2023