Phatbob said:

---

aggiehawg said:

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Tucker Carlson on Biden's DOJ arresting the Presidential frontrunner Donald Trump

"Trump became the nominee in August 2022 when the FBI went through his wife's underwear drawer in his house."

"If this is allowed to happen, our system won't continue."

"That's a political… pic.twitter.com/4gdjdMoPyu

— KanekoaTheGreat (@KanekoaTheGreat) December 2, 2023

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Ths is the mindset that will screw us all. We will be allowing the left to decide our candidate instead of picking the right one. We are suckers who allow ourselves to be manipulated when it's obvious what the smart choice is.

---

Lawfare will be used in the future to meddle in elections going forward. DOJ and Soros backed state prosecutors will use their power to bury candidates with whom they disagree.

aggiehawg said:

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Phatbob said:

---

aggiehawg said:

---

Tucker Carlson on Biden's DOJ arresting the Presidential frontrunner Donald Trump

"Trump became the nominee in August 2022 when the FBI went through his wife's underwear drawer in his house."

"If this is allowed to happen, our system won't continue."

"That's a political… pic.twitter.com/4gdjdMoPyu

— KanekoaTheGreat (@KanekoaTheGreat) December 2, 2023

---

Ths is the mindset that will screw us all. We will be allowing the left to decide our candidate instead of picking the right one. We are suckers who allow ourselves to be manipulated when it's obvious what the smart choice is.

---

Lawfare will be used in the future to meddle in elections going forward. DOJ and Soros backed state prosecutors will use their power to bury candidates with whom they disagree.

---

I disagree. If Trump is the nominee, it will prove to be an effective way to prop up mediocre candidates that can be beat in the general election. The way to make sure it doesn't happen again is to act as if it wasn't an issue to begin with and make the more effective conservative choice.

If they really thought these lawsuits were getting rid of Trump, they would have stopped doing them months ago when polls came out that they were bolstering his support in the primary. The more evidence we have that it raises his support in the primary the more they double down. We are being manipulated, and it isn't even subtle.

They have no reason to stop doing it because it has obvious results. A + B = C... If you want it to stop, you have to prove it doesn't affect the results and is a waste of time and resources.

FIFY. Lawfare is being used to meddle in our current election via the Dems inflating Trump's chances by making him the target of lawsuits and therefore riling up his base and others who think they now have to vote for Trump as a way to fight back or get revenge on the Dems.

FL_Ag1998 said:

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FIFY. Lawfare is being used to meddle in our current election via the Dems inflating Trump's chances by making him the target of lawsuits and therefore riling up his base and others who think they now have to vote for Trump as a way to fight back or get revenge on the Dems.

---

Seriously doubt the prosecutors brining these BS charges and claims have that motivation. Letitia James ran on a promise to hrass and jail Trump, not to make sure he was the Republican nominee.

Jack Smith has a history of crafting bogus crimes with contorting statutory constructon such as the McDonnell case. But sure, he really only wants Trump to be the nominee against Biden.

GMAB.

FL_Ag1998 said:

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riling up his base and others who think they now have to vote for Trump as a way to fight back or get revenge on the Dems.

---

Polls in the last 6 months seem to indicate that if that is what they are doing, it is working.

It would not be the first time that many Dems were secretly cheerleading for Trump.

They did not like the way it turned out in 2016. Not sure they will this time, either.

aggiehawg said:

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FL_Ag1998 said:

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FIFY. Lawfare is being used to meddle in our current election via the Dems inflating Trump's chances by making him the target of lawsuits and therefore riling up his base and others who think they now have to vote for Trump as a way to fight back or get revenge on the Dems.

---

Seriously doubt the prosecutors brining these BS charges and claims have that motivation. Letitia James ran on a promise to hrass and jail Trump, not to make sure he was the Republican nominee.

Jack Smith has a history of crafting bogus crimes with contorting statutory constructon such as the McDonnell case. But sure, he really only wants Trump to be the nominee against Biden.

GMAB.

---

Yep, it's just a sheer coincidence that they have timed the indictments and future trials to make them an issue right when Trump needed them and during the primary season. It's because they really want to hurt Trump since those legal issues have made so many Republicans not want to vote for him.

That's your logic hawg but clearly it isn't the case. It's the only issue you seem to defend Trump on as well. You have all but admitted DeSantis is the better candidate and see Trump's flaws yet you keep getting pulled in with the "He's being so mistreated" stuff.

I get it but you are being manipulated. Notice that virtually the only videos you see on Trump are from DeSantis because Trump folks are cringing themselves when they hear him speak now.

Primary reason people vote for Trump is because they feel bad for him. That's the only reason Tucker gave. He gained huge in the polls after the indictments. Again it's all about owning the Libs, that seems to be the most important thing.

aggiehawg said:

---

FL_Ag1998 said:

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FIFY. Lawfare is being used to meddle in our current election via the Dems inflating Trump's chances by making him the target of lawsuits and therefore riling up his base and others who think they now have to vote for Trump as a way to fight back or get revenge on the Dems.

---

Seriously doubt the prosecutors brining these BS charges and claims have that motivation. Letitia James ran on a promise to hrass and jail Trump, not to make sure he was the Republican nominee.

Jack Smith has a history of crafting bogus crimes with contorting statutory constructon such as the McDonnell case. But sure, he really only wants Trump to be the nominee against Biden.

GMAB.

---

No, honestly, you GMAB.

Heck, it was documented in the last election how Dems were supporting the Trump MAGA candidates in the Primary races because they knew those same Trump MAGA candidates were toxic in a General election and would lose to the Dem candidate! And that's what happened! And yet we're supposed to believe they aren't pulling the same basic scam now by trying to get Trump nominated as the Rep candidate? You yourself are posting the evidence of it happening! Tucker Carlson is backing Trump solely because of the Feds investigations even though in all other facets Trump is the worse candidate!!!

Hawg, I'm sorry you can't peel back the top layer of what's happening and you're allowing yourself to be manipulated. But that is what's happening.

aggie93 said:

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aggiehawg said:

---

FL_Ag1998 said:

---

FIFY. Lawfare is being used to meddle in our current election via the Dems inflating Trump's chances by making him the target of lawsuits and therefore riling up his base and others who think they now have to vote for Trump as a way to fight back or get revenge on the Dems.

---

Seriously doubt the prosecutors brining these BS charges and claims have that motivation. Letitia James ran on a promise to hrass and jail Trump, not to make sure he was the Republican nominee.

Jack Smith has a history of crafting bogus crimes with contorting statutory constructon such as the McDonnell case. But sure, he really only wants Trump to be the nominee against Biden.

GMAB.

---

Yep, it's just a sheer coincidence that they have timed the indictments and future trials to make them an issue right when Trump needed them and during the primary season. It's because they really want to hurt Trump since those legal issues have made so many Republicans not want to vote for him.

That's your logic hawg but clearly it isn't the case. It's the only issue you seem to defend Trump on as well. You have all but admitted DeSantis is the better candidate and see Trump's flaws yet you keep getting pulled in with the "He's being so mistreated" stuff.

I get it but you are being manipulated. Notice that virtually the only videos you see on Trump are from DeSantis because Trump folks are cringing themselves when they hear him speak now.

---

I am making the observation that lawfare is not only in this cycle. It will be used from here on out. How many other candidates would have the resources to fight that type of attack? Damn few.

Just because it is being done to a person you hate, doesn't make it right. But it will be a feature going forward. No way to stop it. None.

aggiehawg said:

---

aggie93 said:

---

aggiehawg said:

---

FL_Ag1998 said:

---

FIFY. Lawfare is being used to meddle in our current election via the Dems inflating Trump's chances by making him the target of lawsuits and therefore riling up his base and others who think they now have to vote for Trump as a way to fight back or get revenge on the Dems.

---

Seriously doubt the prosecutors brining these BS charges and claims have that motivation. Letitia James ran on a promise to hrass and jail Trump, not to make sure he was the Republican nominee.

Jack Smith has a history of crafting bogus crimes with contorting statutory constructon such as the McDonnell case. But sure, he really only wants Trump to be the nominee against Biden.

GMAB.

---

Yep, it's just a sheer coincidence that they have timed the indictments and future trials to make them an issue right when Trump needed them and during the primary season. It's because they really want to hurt Trump since those legal issues have made so many Republicans not want to vote for him.

That's your logic hawg but clearly it isn't the case. It's the only issue you seem to defend Trump on as well. You have all but admitted DeSantis is the better candidate and see Trump's flaws yet you keep getting pulled in with the "He's being so mistreated" stuff.

I get it but you are being manipulated. Notice that virtually the only videos you see on Trump are from DeSantis because Trump folks are cringing themselves when they hear him speak now.

---

I am making the observation that lawfare is not only in this cycle. It will be used from here on out. How many other candidates would have the resources to fight that type of attack? Damn few.

Just because it is being done to a person you hate, doesn't make it right. But it will be a feature going forward. No way to stop it. None.

---

He doesn't even "have the resources". He's using campaign monies.

aggiehawg said:

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aggie93 said:

---

aggiehawg said:

---

FL_Ag1998 said:

---

FIFY. Lawfare is being used to meddle in our current election via the Dems inflating Trump's chances by making him the target of lawsuits and therefore riling up his base and others who think they now have to vote for Trump as a way to fight back or get revenge on the Dems.

---

Seriously doubt the prosecutors brining these BS charges and claims have that motivation. Letitia James ran on a promise to hrass and jail Trump, not to make sure he was the Republican nominee.

Jack Smith has a history of crafting bogus crimes with contorting statutory constructon such as the McDonnell case. But sure, he really only wants Trump to be the nominee against Biden.

GMAB.

---

Yep, it's just a sheer coincidence that they have timed the indictments and future trials to make them an issue right when Trump needed them and during the primary season. It's because they really want to hurt Trump since those legal issues have made so many Republicans not want to vote for him.

That's your logic hawg but clearly it isn't the case. It's the only issue you seem to defend Trump on as well. You have all but admitted DeSantis is the better candidate and see Trump's flaws yet you keep getting pulled in with the "He's being so mistreated" stuff.

I get it but you are being manipulated. Notice that virtually the only videos you see on Trump are from DeSantis because Trump folks are cringing themselves when they hear him speak now.

---

I am making the observation that lawfare is not only in this cycle. It will be used from here on out. How many other candidates would have the resources to fight that type of attack? Damn few.

Just because it is being done to a person you hate, doesn't make it right. But it will be a feature going forward. No way to stop it. None.

---

Sorry, don't agree with this at all. The charges against him are wrong but no other candidate says/does as many dumb/undisciplined (and usually pointless) things as he does, which opens the door for the left to abuse the system. There's a reason he's the only one who has faced this volume of issues, and it's not just because he was the front runner.

Take the migrant flights for example - a few officials gave a lot of empty threats but at the end of the day nothing happened because DeSantis was smart and made sure there was absolutely nothing they were doing that could even be presented as illegal.

The answer isn't to reward him for acting like an undisciplined idiot. It's to elect candidates who operate in a way that preemptively blunts any legal attacks that might be coming.

The Democrat party runs top down. If the party wanted the lawsuits to go away, they would go away.

Phatbob said:

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The Democrat party runs top down. If the party wanted the lawsuits to go away, they would go away.

---

I don't think so right now.Why are Dems bringing all of the suits under the 12th Amendment to keep Trump off of the primary ballots? There are different groups employing different strategies. The vote fraud has not been fixed, nor will it be. That's another feature going forward too. Congress even had to amend the Electoral Count Act so no further objections to slates of electors can ever be brought up. Can't sue and get injunctions before election and not enough time to bring full challenges to be heard in court before the Safe Harbor date.

No audits can or will be done that are timely anyway. Zero transparency.

aggiehawg said:

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aggie93 said:

---

aggiehawg said:

---

FL_Ag1998 said:

---

FIFY. Lawfare is being used to meddle in our current election via the Dems inflating Trump's chances by making him the target of lawsuits and therefore riling up his base and others who think they now have to vote for Trump as a way to fight back or get revenge on the Dems.

---

Seriously doubt the prosecutors brining these BS charges and claims have that motivation. Letitia James ran on a promise to hrass and jail Trump, not to make sure he was the Republican nominee.

Jack Smith has a history of crafting bogus crimes with contorting statutory constructon such as the McDonnell case. But sure, he really only wants Trump to be the nominee against Biden.

GMAB.

---

Yep, it's just a sheer coincidence that they have timed the indictments and future trials to make them an issue right when Trump needed them and during the primary season. It's because they really want to hurt Trump since those legal issues have made so many Republicans not want to vote for him.

That's your logic hawg but clearly it isn't the case. It's the only issue you seem to defend Trump on as well. You have all but admitted DeSantis is the better candidate and see Trump's flaws yet you keep getting pulled in with the "He's being so mistreated" stuff.

I get it but you are being manipulated. Notice that virtually the only videos you see on Trump are from DeSantis because Trump folks are cringing themselves when they hear him speak now.

---

I am making the observation that lawfare is not only in this cycle. It will be used from here on out. How many other candidates would have the resources to fight that type of attack? Damn few.

Just because it is being done to a person you hate, doesn't make it right. But it will be a feature going forward. No way to stop it. None.

---

I don't hate Trump, I voted for him not long ago and will vote for him again if I have to.

I agree with you that lawfare has been weaponized and Trump has been treated unfairly but he also damn near begs for problems. If you are going to win you better run a tight ship and know how to play both offense and defense. He likes to get into the fights and they distract from getting his job done.

Your point though was that the charges are NOT being brought in order to mess with the election though and that's just not the case. They did so for that purpose and it is working. Tucker backing Trump over his legal matters illustrates that perfectly.

Quote:

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Your point though was that the charges are NOT being brought in order to mess with the election though and that's just not the case. They did so for that purpose and it is working. Tucker backing Trump over his legal matters illustrates that perfectly.

---

People who have TDS for years now are not trying to help Trump win the nomination. They are trying to wipe out his wealth and jail him, keep him off the primary ballot.

But Dems are A-okay with that because they are not Trump. When Desantis gets criminally charged for some BS reason, you will be completely cool with that too. Because if he gets indicted, he must have done something wrong, is your reasoning. correct?

And that is coming. FEC complaints are coming because of the PAC's actions. Just watch.

aggiehawg said:

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Phatbob said:

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The Democrat party runs top down. If the party wanted the lawsuits to go away, they would go away.

---

I don't think so right now.Why are Dems bringing all of the suits under the 12th Amendment to keep Trump off of the primary ballots? There are different groups employing different strategies. The vote fraud has not been fixed, nor will it be. That's another feature going forward too. Congress even had to amend the Electoral Count Act so no further objections to slates of electors can ever be brought up. Can't sue and get injunctions before election and not enough time to bring full challenges to be heard in court before the Safe Harbor date.

No audits can or will be done that are timely anyway. Zero transparency.

---

Actually the Dem Party is run by a small group of billionaires that fund all the different orgs and pull the strings. The DNC itself has very little money and is really just a shell.

None of the states that want to remove Trump off the ballot are really in play, they are designed as a distraction. Of course we should fight that and should win but simply supporting Trump is exactly what they want. It's about making him more attractive to Republicans and less attractive to everyone else.

I also can't imagine how you think Trump is super organized and legal savvy and will be able to fix any of this. I don't think he could have handled his election challenges worse than he did and he had real ammo there and was still in power.

BTW, outside of the partisans no one cares about this stuff even if they should. They care about the economy and WWIII and their own lives. The more we talk about Trump and how he has been treated badly the less they care about him. His power came from being the guy who stood up for the little guy not from asking the little guy to take a bullet for him.

Trump announced and publicized this event several days ago btw.

Not that long ago the courtesans were trying to convince us the crowd at a UFC fight and a SC football game was there for Trump. Now we see the little crowd Trump really draws.

Remember: Trump is a former POTUS and should be pulling in much larger crowds. All this tells me is… pic.twitter.com/81jhFVhzVp

— Burt Macklin (@BurtMaclin_FBI) December 3, 2023

PREVIEW: Trump to Declare His Campaign 'A Righteous Crusade to Liberate Our Republic'. https://t.co/NqtpTyhB5b

— Jason Miller (@JasonMillerinDC) December 3, 2023

aggie93 said:

---

PREVIEW: Trump to Declare His Campaign 'A Righteous Crusade to Liberate Our Republic'. https://t.co/NqtpTyhB5b

— Jason Miller (@JasonMillerinDC) December 3, 2023

---

Look…Trump is a pompous, narcissistic ass who loves to promote himself…zero disagreement on that…

With that said, I do truly believe that Trump, at his core, is patriotic and pro-America…

His approach has always been brash, and rude, and not what most folks see as being the behavior of someone presidential, but I do believe at his very core, he does love this country and he does want to protect it…

And because of that, though he absolutely opens himself up to all of the stuff that gets piled into him, I do think we have crossed the boundary between politics and weaponization of the law…or lawfare as some refer to it…. I do believe that someone needs to be on a "crusade" (if you will) to defeat this approach to controlling our nation…. hawg is spot on…there's literally no safeguards to protect common citizens from what is being done to Trump…if you have enemies, and those enemies have influence in the justice system, courts can be used against you for any reason, whether an actual crime was committed or not…. What Trump went through is quite literally a non-violent coup to remove him from power…and it started while he was running for president in 2016 most likely because HRC's internals showed the Left that someone that they (and the establishment at large) felt like had zero business running the country as an unknown entity (meaning someone not part of the establishment club) left their vision of America at risk…if not grave risk…. Trump wasn't going to be beholden to anyone but Trump, and the establishment saw this as a threat to their very existence…

So we had the Steele dossier (complete fabrication presented and pushed by media as fact), then quid pro quo (which turns out is exactly what the current administration has been doing to help Ukraine), and then Jan 6 (where it seems we had undercover FBI leading the charge into the capitol, with Capitol Police gladly aiding them)…

You also had a fabricated hate crime that spurred riots and violence in the summer of 2020 (all while burying the toxicology report that showed significant levels of fentanyl in the "victim's" system), and a convenient "pandemic" that the world wasn't prepared for, forced everyone to change their lives because "why would the government lie?", creating an opportunity to swoop in and confiscate an election (and then it turns out that the "vaccine" the government was trying to mandate is essentially worthless as a universal prevention, the mask mandates were proven to be absolutely worthless, and millions of school children basically lost a year of education for no reason)…

All of these things were an effort to remove Trump from office, and now his legal problems (they literally changed laws in NY to charge him with a crime, and they raided his personal residence for something that is standard POTUS protocol) have been created just to invent ways to keep him from returning to power…

How much tax payer money has been spent chasing completely fabricated crimes? It's mind-boggling to think about…

So maybe the left and establishment are using the political capital they've collected to boost him as the R candidate to be destroyed in the election, but I agree with hawg's take…they don't want him on the ballot because they can't keep him out office for a second term using non-violent means otherwise, and that's why they continue to hammer him with lawfare today…

And if that is true, then there is some validity to this being a crusade to take back our country, and whether we like it or not, Trump is the face of that crusade, and folks are migrating back toward him because of it…

aggie93 said:

---

PREVIEW: Trump to Declare His Campaign 'A Righteous Crusade to Liberate Our Republic'. https://t.co/NqtpTyhB5b

— Jason Miller (@JasonMillerinDC) December 3, 2023

---

Nothing but feeding raw meat to MAGA.

The rest of the country shakes their head at the buffoon.

And let me add this...

If they can use lawfare against Trump to keep him out of office...what makes anyone think that the establishment can't use the same tactics against any other non-establishment candidate, including Ron DeSantis?

FireAg said:

---

aggie93 said:

---

PREVIEW: Trump to Declare His Campaign 'A Righteous Crusade to Liberate Our Republic'. https://t.co/NqtpTyhB5b

— Jason Miller (@JasonMillerinDC) December 3, 2023

---

Look…Trump is a pompous, narcissistic ass who loves to promote himself…zero disagreement on that…

With that said, I do truly believe that Trump, at his core, is patriotic and pro-America…

His approach has always been brash, and rude, and not what most folks see as being the behavior of someone presidential, but I do believe at his very core, he does love this country and he does want to protect it…

And because of that, though he absolutely opens himself up to all of the stuff that gets piled into him, I do think we have crossed the boundary between politics and weaponization of the law…or lawfare as some refer to it…. I do believe that someone needs to be on a "crusade" (if you will) to defeat this approach to controlling our nation…. hawg is spot on…there's literally no safeguards to protect common citizens from what is being done to Trump…if you have enemies, and those enemies have influence in the justice system, courts can be used against you for any reason, whether an actual crime was committed or not…. What Trump went through is quite literally a non-violent coup to remove him from power…and it started while he was running for president in 2016 most likely because HRC's internals showed the Left that someone that they (and the establishment at large) felt like had zero business running the country as an unknown entity (meaning someone not part of the establishment club) left their vision of America at risk…if not grave risk…. Trump wasn't going to be beholden to anyone but Trump, and the establishment saw this as a threat to their very existence…

So we had the Steele dossier (complete fabrication presented and pushed by media as fact), then quid pro quo (which turns out is exactly what the current administration has been doing to help Ukraine), and then Jan 6 (where it seems we had undercover FBI leading the charge into the capitol, with Capitol Police gladly aiding them)…

You also had a fabricated hate crime that spurred riots and violence in the summer of 2020 (all while burying the toxicology report that showed significant levels of fentanyl in the "victim's" system), and a convenient "pandemic" that the world wasn't prepared for, forced everyone to change their lives because "why would the government lie?", creating an opportunity to swoop in and confiscate an election (and then it turns out that the "vaccine" the government was trying to mandate is essentially worthless as a universal prevention, the mask mandates were proven to be absolutely worthless, and millions of school children basically lost a year of education for no reason)…

All of these things were an effort to remove Trump from office, and now his legal problems (they literally changed laws in NY to charge him with a crime, and they raided his personal residence for something that is standard POTUS protocol) have been created just to invent ways to keep him from returning to power…

How much tax payer money has been spent chasing completely fabricated crimes? It's mind-boggling to think about…

So maybe the left and establishment are using the political capital they've collected to boost him as the R candidate to be destroyed in the election, but I agree with hawg's take…they don't want him on the ballot because they can't keep him out office for a second term using non-violent means otherwise, and that's why they continue to hammer him with lawfare today…

And if that is true, then there is some validity to this being a crusade to take back our country, and whether we like it or not, Trump is the face of that crusade, and folks are migrating back toward him because of it…

---

Likening it to a "crusade" makes it sound like some kind of mission approved by God.

I know there's a good amount of MAGA that will eat that up, but non-MAGA thinks it's WAY over the top, even for Trump.

FireAg said:

---

And let me add this...

If they can use lawfare against Trump to keep him out of office...what makes anyone think that the establishment can't use the same tactics against any other non-establishment candidate, including Ron DeSantis?

---

They can TRY. And they will.

Is that a reason to vote for Trump?

I think it's hyperbole myself...but I do think there is some underlying truth in it because, if it can be done to Trump, it can be done to anyone...and as hawg points out, there's literally nothing to stop up...

FireAg said:

---

aggie93 said:

---

PREVIEW: Trump to Declare His Campaign 'A Righteous Crusade to Liberate Our Republic'. https://t.co/NqtpTyhB5b

— Jason Miller (@JasonMillerinDC) December 3, 2023

---

Look…Trump is a pompous, narcissistic ass who loves to promote himself…zero disagreement on that…

With that said, I do truly believe that Trump, at his core, is patriotic and pro-America…

His approach has always been brash, and rude, and not what most folks see as being the behavior of someone presidential, but I do believe at his very core, he does love this country and he does want to protect it…

And because of that, though he absolutely opens himself up to all of the stuff that gets piled into him, I do think we have crossed the boundary between politics and weaponization of the law…or lawfare as some refer to it…. I do believe that someone needs to be on a "crusade" (if you will) to defeat this approach to controlling our nation…. hawg is spot on…there's literally no safeguards to protect common citizens from what is being done to Trump…if you have enemies, and those enemies have influence in the justice system, courts can be used against you for any reason, whether an actual crime was committed or not…. What Trump went through is quite literally a non-violent coup to remove him from power…and it started while he was running for president in 2016 most likely because HRC's internals showed the Left that someone that they (and the establishment at large) felt like had zero business running the country as an unknown entity (meaning someone not part of the establishment club) left their vision of America at risk…if not grave risk…. Trump wasn't going to be beholden to anyone but Trump, and the establishment saw this as a threat to their very existence…

So we had the Steele dossier (complete fabrication presented and pushed by media as fact), then quid pro quo (which turns out is exactly what the current administration has been doing to help Ukraine), and then Jan 6 (where it seems we had undercover FBI leading the charge into the capitol, with Capitol Police gladly aiding them)…

You also had a fabricated hate crime that spurred riots and violence in the summer of 2020 (all while burying the toxicology report that showed significant levels of fentanyl in the "victim's" system), and a convenient "pandemic" that the world wasn't prepared for, forced everyone to change their lives because "why would the government lie?", creating an opportunity to swoop in and confiscate an election (and then it turns out that the "vaccine" the government was trying to mandate is essentially worthless as a universal prevention, the mask mandates were proven to be absolutely worthless, and millions of school children basically lost a year of education for no reason)…

All of these things were an effort to remove Trump from office, and now his legal problems (they literally changed laws in NY to charge him with a crime, and they raided his personal residence for something that is standard POTUS protocol) have been created just to invent ways to keep him from returning to power…

How much tax payer money has been spent chasing completely fabricated crimes? It's mind-boggling to think about…

So maybe the left and establishment are using the political capital they've collected to boost him as the R candidate to be destroyed in the election, but I agree with hawg's take…they don't want him on the ballot because they can't keep him out office for a second term using non-violent means otherwise, and that's why they continue to hammer him with lawfare today…

And if that is true, then there is some validity to this being a crusade to take back our country, and whether we like it or not, Trump is the face of that crusade, and folks are migrating back toward him because of it…

---

Yeah, ok. If you actually think that Trump is on a crusade to take back our country and buy into the ridiculousness of that pseudo religious fervor posting I don't know what to tell you. That lunacy was actually put out by his campaign and is deeply insulting considering how Trump conducts himself. Might as well buy a book like this:

Ag with kids said:

---

FireAg said:

---

And let me add this...

If they can use lawfare against Trump to keep him out of office...what makes anyone think that the establishment can't use the same tactics against any other non-establishment candidate, including Ron DeSantis?

---

They can TRY. And they will.

Is that a reason to vote for Trump?

---

You don't seem to get it...there is nothing to stop them from doing it, and nothing to stop them from being successful at it...

Voting for Trump or voting for DeSantis isn't even the argument...if the establishment doesn't want you in office because you are a threat to their vision of this nation (and the global, progressive society at large) there is quite literally nothing to stop it...outside of armed conflict and redoing this thing called 'America' from scratch...

Our laws are being used against us, and the media is absolutley pushing only one side of the narrative (as they did with Steelem, quid pro quo, Jan 6, Floyd, Covid, and the persecution that Trump has specifically endured since being removed from office)... I know hawg hopes it doesn't get to soem sort of civil conflict, but I frankly see no other recourse to stop it...

FireAg said:

---

And let me add this...

If they can use lawfare against Trump to keep him out of office...what makes anyone think that the establishment can't use the same tactics against any other non-establishment candidate, including Ron DeSantis?

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They will try (see the threats around the migrant flights), but the difference is that DeSantis actually puts thought and work into the details of what he does and doesn't give them the opportunity. Trump's complete lack of discipline opens him up to borderline cases like what's been brought against him so far.

You need to peel back the hyperbole and look at what is really going on...you're being triggered by some refence to Trump that pulls at some notion of religious righteousness...you gotta get past that and really look at what is going on...

This is an advertsing schtick...insulting to some while emboldening others...

It doesn't move the needle for me one way or another...

But the underlying issues in this country are what I am truly concerned about, and right now, Trump is the face of the movement trying to reverse it...

DeSantis could also be that face...(he won't be in this cycle, but he could be in the future), and unless we, as the people of this nation, take it upon ourselves to take a stand against this *******ization of the very foundation of this nation, then anyone who comes in as anti-establishment/globalist/progressive will face exactly what Trump faces today...

FireAg said:

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Ag with kids said:

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FireAg said:

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And let me add this...

If they can use lawfare against Trump to keep him out of office...what makes anyone think that the establishment can't use the same tactics against any other non-establishment candidate, including Ron DeSantis?

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They can TRY. And they will.

Is that a reason to vote for Trump?

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You don't seem to get it...there is nothing to stop them from doing it, and nothing to stop them from being successful at it...

Voting for Trump or voting for DeSantis isn't even the argument...if the establishment doesn't want you in office because you are a threat to their vision of this nation (and the global, progressive society at large) there is quite literally nothing to stop it...outside of armed conflict and redoing this thing called 'America' from scratch...

Our laws are being used against us, and the media is absolutley pushing only one side of the narrative (as they did with Steelem, quid pro quo, Jan 6, Floyd, Covid, and the persecution that Trump has specifically endured since being removed from office)... I know hawg hopes it doesn't get to soem sort of civil conflict, but I frankly see no other recourse to stop it...

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Sorry but there is very little in common between Desantis and Trump when it comes to this. DeSantis has repeatedly won against the Establishment. He's removed Soros prosecutors. He's won elections. He's passed bills. He's won his lawsuits. He runs a super tight ship and understands the law.

Trump just scattershoots and has crappy follow up. He surrounds himself with idiots or untrustworthy people He constantly falls into traps and he loves to pick fights with nothing to gain.

Will the Establishment come after both of them? Sure, but we know Trump will lose. The concept that just because Trump sucks at this that everyone else will too is such an eye roll.

It started a conversation.

FireAg said:

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You need to peel back the hyperbole and look at what is really going on...you're being triggered by some refence to Trump that pulls at some notion of religious righteousness...you gotta get past that and really look at what is going on...

This is an advertsing schtick...insulting to some while emboldening others...

It doesn't move the needle for me one way or another...

But the underlying issues in this country are what I am truly concerned about, and right now, Trump is the face of the movement trying to reverse it...

DeSantis could also be that face...(he won't be in this cycle, but he could be in the future), and unless we, as the people of this nation, take it upon ourselves to take a stand against this *******ization of the very foundation of this nation, then anyone who comes in as anti-establishment/globalist/progressive will face exactly what Trump faces today...

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Oh, so you think Trump is putting out crap like this because of a deeper purpose and not to manipulate people to see him as a Messiah?

Of course it is advertising. It's just insulting as hell considering Trump's past behavior. It's also insulting because Trump has consistently tried to cut deals with every Establishment hack he can from McDaniel to Graham to Ryan to Pelosi to Schumer and beyond because it isn't about taking on the Establishment, it's about HIM. Would he like to benefit the American people along with way? Sure, but only because it benefits HIM to do so.

aggie93 said:

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FireAg said:

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Ag with kids said:

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FireAg said:

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And let me add this...

If they can use lawfare against Trump to keep him out of office...what makes anyone think that the establishment can't use the same tactics against any other non-establishment candidate, including Ron DeSantis?

---

They can TRY. And they will.

Is that a reason to vote for Trump?

---

You don't seem to get it...there is nothing to stop them from doing it, and nothing to stop them from being successful at it...

Voting for Trump or voting for DeSantis isn't even the argument...if the establishment doesn't want you in office because you are a threat to their vision of this nation (and the global, progressive society at large) there is quite literally nothing to stop it...outside of armed conflict and redoing this thing called 'America' from scratch...

Our laws are being used against us, and the media is absolutley pushing only one side of the narrative (as they did with Steelem, quid pro quo, Jan 6, Floyd, Covid, and the persecution that Trump has specifically endured since being removed from office)... I know hawg hopes it doesn't get to soem sort of civil conflict, but I frankly see no other recourse to stop it...

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Sorry but there is very little in common between Desantis and Trump when it comes to this. DeSantis has repeatedly won against the Establishment. He's removed Soros prosecutors. He's won elections. He's passed bills. He's won his lawsuits. He runs a super tight ship and understands the law.

Trump just scattershoots and has crappy follow up. He surrounds himself with idiots or untrustworthy people He constantly falls into traps and he loves to pick fights with nothing to gain.

Will the Establishment come after both of them? Sure, but we know Trump will lose. The concept that just because Trump sucks at this that everyone else will too is such an eye roll.

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You are woefully naive if you think they won't put a stop to DeSantis if/when he gets a chance some day to inact his approach on a national scale...

Please understand (as most of your brethern don't seem to get this), I absolutely LOVE what DeSantis has accomplished, and I would love nothing more than to see him try to accomplish it from the Oval Office...I just see no way on earth he avoids a similar fate to Trump... His lack of flambuoyancy certainly makes him a harder target, but if the establishment thinks DeSantis is a threat to their vision of society, they WILL take him down, and they will use the same blueprints against him that they have used against Trump...

DeSantis isn't teflon nor kevlar...he can be gotten to using these same tactics...

FireAg said:

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aggie93 said:

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PREVIEW: Trump to Declare His Campaign 'A Righteous Crusade to Liberate Our Republic'. https://t.co/NqtpTyhB5b

— Jason Miller (@JasonMillerinDC) December 3, 2023

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Look…Trump is a pompous, narcissistic ass who loves to promote himself…zero disagreement on that…

With that said, I do truly believe that Trump, at his core, is patriotic and pro-America…

His approach has always been brash, and rude, and not what most folks see as being the behavior of someone presidential, but I do believe at his very core, he does love this country and he does want to protect it…

And because of that, though he absolutely opens himself up to all of the stuff that gets piled into him, I do think we have crossed the boundary between politics and weaponization of the law…or lawfare as some refer to it…. I do believe that someone needs to be on a "crusade" (if you will) to defeat this approach to controlling our nation…. hawg is spot on…there's literally no safeguards to protect common citizens from what is being done to Trump…if you have enemies, and those enemies have influence in the justice system, courts can be used against you for any reason, whether an actual crime was committed or not…. What Trump went through is quite literally a non-violent coup to remove him from power…and it started while he was running for president in 2016 most likely because HRC's internals showed the Left that someone that they (and the establishment at large) felt like had zero business running the country as an unknown entity (meaning someone not part of the establishment club) left their vision of America at risk…if not grave risk…. Trump wasn't going to be beholden to anyone but Trump, and the establishment saw this as a threat to their very existence…

So we had the Steele dossier (complete fabrication presented and pushed by media as fact), then quid pro quo (which turns out is exactly what the current administration has been doing to help Ukraine), and then Jan 6 (where it seems we had undercover FBI leading the charge into the capitol, with Capitol Police gladly aiding them)…

You also had a fabricated hate crime that spurred riots and violence in the summer of 2020 (all while burying the toxicology report that showed significant levels of fentanyl in the "victim's" system), and a convenient "pandemic" that the world wasn't prepared for, forced everyone to change their lives because "why would the government lie?", creating an opportunity to swoop in and confiscate an election (and then it turns out that the "vaccine" the government was trying to mandate is essentially worthless as a universal prevention, the mask mandates were proven to be absolutely worthless, and millions of school children basically lost a year of education for no reason)…

All of these things were an effort to remove Trump from office, and now his legal problems (they literally changed laws in NY to charge him with a crime, and they raided his personal residence for something that is standard POTUS protocol) have been created just to invent ways to keep him from returning to power…

How much tax payer money has been spent chasing completely fabricated crimes? It's mind-boggling to think about…

So maybe the left and establishment are using the political capital they've collected to boost him as the R candidate to be destroyed in the election, but I agree with hawg's take…they don't want him on the ballot because they can't keep him out office for a second term using non-violent means otherwise, and that's why they continue to hammer him with lawfare today…

And if that is true, then there is some validity to this being a crusade to take back our country, and whether we like it or not, Trump is the face of that crusade, and folks are migrating back toward him because of it…

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Trump is very loose with the facts and with his mouth and he is a bad administrator. That combo is basically in invitation for the left to tie him up in litigation. Notice he is the ONLY one it has been so successful against, and yes, they do try versions of it all the time against other Republicans. That it has been so successful against him is a HORRIBLE reason to support him. It's voting for him because his weakness is so bad that they know how to go after him successfully. It makes no sense.

I'm not going to sit here and argue that Trump is the "best" face for the war against the establishment and lawfare...his approach ABSOLUTELY makes it easier for them to come after him...

But swap him out with DeSantis or ANY OTHER ANTI-ESTABLISHMENT candidate, and you will get the exact same result... Some fo you think DeSantis could beat it...

I agree with hawg in that, if they don't want you to succeed, it doesn't matter who you are...they will throw the kitchen sink at you to protect their vision of America and this globalist society...

FireAg said:

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I think it's hyperbole myself...but I do think there is some underlying truth in it because, if it can be done to Trump, it can be done to anyone...and as hawg points out, there's literally nothing to stop up...

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Well, if our freakin' court system was working like it was designed, there would be a way to stop it. Our court system is too unwieldy, too slow and has too much of a backlog, stemming mainly from the covid crappola.

But I want to add another facet at play in the lawfare being waged against Trump and that is going after the law licenses of anyone who works for him, whether that's by bogus disciplinary complaints to state bars or asking (and getting) monetary sanctions from judges.

Our election laws are a complete mess with courts either too afraid or unable to provide a timely effective remedy when the laws are broken. I started a thread after the 2020 election asking the simple question of how many election laws being broken was too much? Since then, the trajectory has been going mostly downhill, despite the efforts to close the Zuckbuck loopholes, clean up voter rolls, put more stringent controls on mail in ballots and the biggest problem of all, outsourcing elections to private entities with no supervision, oversight nor accountability, nor transparency of what these private entities are really doing.

And that outsourcing will bite DeSantis or any other GOP candidate in the butt just as much as it does Trump. Little of this is actually about Trump, it is about the end of free and fair elections. And that should scare the s*** out of everybody that loves this country.