Happy Independence Day!

We are blessed to have a country founded on principles of freedom, and it is our duty to preserve and defend the sacred fire of liberty as these principles are constantly under attack.

We do not run from this responsibility; we welcome it. We will hold… pic.twitter.com/OgpatZEJM1

— Ron DeSantis (@RonDeSantis) July 4, 2023

This is why DeSantis will win the general election.

Great CNN segment featuring @vlal42, @JenniferSey, and @hamill_law, all liberal moms who became disaffected with Democrats and open to a different political path thanks to Ron DeSantis' COVID policies.

h/t @justin_hart pic.twitter.com/kwbdHHeBwl

— Scott Morefield (@SKMorefield) July 4, 2023

FireAg said:

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J. Walter Weatherman said:

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Funky Winkerbean said:

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Rapier108 said:

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AggieVictor10 said:

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Not sure desantis fans have any room to call trumpers "cult45" when their zealotry for meatball Ron puts trumper loyalty to shame.

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Says the guy who is really just as leftist who makes comments to stir the pot 24/7.

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Deflect, deflect! You guys have been the most condescending group on the board, and you can't tell that all your doing is hurting conservatism.

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Nobody is hurting conservatism more than fake-conservative con artist trump. He's single-handedly setting back the movement back by a decade.

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Absolute and total hyperbole with no way to quantify such a statement to back it up…

You're making an emotional argument devoid of actual, quantifiable metrics…

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Let's see now.

2018, Republicans/conservatives lost the House, but got lucky with the Senate because Democrats had to defend too many seats in Republican states. Republicans still lost two Senate seats they should not have lost, Arizona and Nevada.

2020, Republicans/conservatives, and Trump lost again, losing the White House and almost it all save for two Democrats in the Senate not willing to go nuclear. Then Trump goes extra stupid and sabotages the Georgia Senate runoffs.

2022, Republicans/conservatives barely won the House, lost the Senate completely.

What is the one ever present factor in all three elections? Oh yeah, Trump.

The majority of this country cannot stand Trump, pure and simple. Nothing will change it at this point.

Now of course you'll blame everyone and everything else for those three election loses, because nothing could ever possibly be Trump's fault. He is a faultless god king who is so perfect he has never made a mistake. (Last sentence is sarcasm.)

And if Trump is the nominee, Republicans/conservatives will get their ass kicked a 4th time in a row (likely giving the Democrats complete control forever in the process), you still won't blame Trump. You'll blame voter fraud again (even though it won't even be close enough that fraud was needed), and then begin preparing for Trump 2028.

You have a real problem with absolutes…

It's like you have convinced yourself that you have it all figured out…

We still have a loooong way to go, and you're already setting the stage for excuses if DeSantis doesn't win the primary…

What are you going to cry about if he does win the primary?

I don't think we know what is going to unfold just yet…

Phatbob said:

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AggieVictor10 said:

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Phatbob said:

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AggieVictor10 said:

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Not sure desantis fans have any room to call trumpers "cult45" when their zealotry for meatball Ron puts trumper loyalty to shame.

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Nice try. Most just have a healthy skepticism of any politician. Even if they like them. Unfortunately the Trumpers have lost their skepticism when it comes from one man in particular. Please come back from the ledge...our country depends on it.

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I have yet to see any skepticism on Ron DeSantis, except from those that support trump which does tend to draw condescension from desantis supporters.

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I'll give you that, but so far his weaknesses do not seem to be idealogical. I could be wrong, but if there is evidence to the contrary, lay it out there, and I will listen. The only downsides I have heard either were from the left (he's too conservative) or they are straight up political theater bs.

But so you know, I am also skeptical of the stuff coming out about Trump. I know there is bull **** coming out about both of them. What CANNOT be denied is what comes directly from Trump himself and the consequences of his own actions. I have been a Trump voter, because he was the only option in the last election. That does not mean he is a good option. I can defend him in what is happening to him, but not who he is or what he stands for without making excuses and I am sick of doing that, because we can't afford to keep doing it.

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this should go over really well with centrists in Arizona, Georgia, Wisconsin and Pennsylvania:

"The report also discussed a "coup memo" authored by Eastman which proposed avenues Pence could use to assist Trump in reversing his election loss, including unilaterally throwing out certain state electoral college votes.

At House panel hearings, Pence's then counsel Greg Jacob testified that Eastman acknowledged to him that his push with Trump to get Pence to reject Biden's winning electoral college count would violate the Electoral Count Act, and that Trump too was informed that if Pence tried to block Biden's certification it would be illegal."

Guardian Newspaper reporting more charges coming

Trumpers conveniently forget that as much as Trump is hated now by 56% of the American population- the left HAS NOT EVEN STARTED TO RUN ATTACK ADS AGAINST HIM.

wonder if this will make it into the billion dollars worth of negative ads the left is gleefully preparing:

"If she were to win, it would create an unprecedented Constitutional crisis that would cripple the operations of our government," he said.

"She is likely to be under investigation for many years, and also it will probably end up in my opinion in a criminal trial. I mean, you take a look. Who knows? But it certainly looks that way."

"She has no right to be running, you know that," Trump said. "No right."

Trump added at a November 5, 2016, rally in Denver that as "the prime suspect in a far-reaching criminal investigation," Clinton's controversies would make it "virtually impossible for her to govern."

The comments aren't the only ones from Trump's past campaigns that could have aged poorly with his legal troubles.

In another comment, made when running for reelection, Trump acknowledged only the sitting president could reveal classified information."

His own Words that will come back to Haunt Donald Trump

FireAg said:

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J. Walter Weatherman said:

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Funky Winkerbean said:

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Rapier108 said:

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AggieVictor10 said:

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Not sure desantis fans have any room to call trumpers "cult45" when their zealotry for meatball Ron puts trumper loyalty to shame.

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Says the guy who is really just as leftist who makes comments to stir the pot 24/7.

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Deflect, deflect! You guys have been the most condescending group on the board, and you can't tell that all your doing is hurting conservatism.

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Nobody is hurting conservatism more than fake-conservative con artist trump. He's single-handedly setting back the movement back by a decade.

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Absolute and total hyperbole with no way to quantify such a statement to back it up…

You're making an emotional argument devoid of actual, quantifiable metrics…

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you love to make this weird claim that every argument you disagree with is "emotional"

how is it "emotional" to ACCURATELY NOTE that

Trump lost the House in 2018 and lost Senate seats

lost the White House in 2020

Lost the House in 2020

lost the Senate in 2020

lost the Senate in 2021

lost the Senate in 2022

that's 3 straight national elections he has lost.

he is at 56% disapproval right now.

how are these facts "emotional"!?!?

Then DeSantis needs to pick it up because the national average for the R primary doesn't look good right now...

It appears he's currently splitting votes with Pence...



And on a national average, both Trump and DeSantis, for the most part, lead Biden...


And this is for a man who is having more criminal cases thrown at him than Al Capone...

FireAg said:

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Then DeSantis needs to pick it up because the national average for the R primary doesn't look good right now...

It appears he's currently splitting votes with Pence...



And on a national average, both Trump and DeSantis, for the most part, lead Biden...


And this is for a man who is having more criminal cases thrown at him than Al Capone...

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Yes, we know. Thankfully we have the debates (assuming trump shows) so that everyone who isn't paying attention will see how much of a joke trump has become.

Either way, his post shows my point perfectly. No one has done more damage to the conservative movement than Trump. And if the primary voters are dumb enough to nominate him in '24 then that damage will conclude with 4 more years of Biden/Newsome while Trump finally (thankfully) goes away for good.

LMCane said:

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FireAg said:

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J. Walter Weatherman said:

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Funky Winkerbean said:

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Rapier108 said:

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AggieVictor10 said:

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Not sure desantis fans have any room to call trumpers "cult45" when their zealotry for meatball Ron puts trumper loyalty to shame.

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Says the guy who is really just as leftist who makes comments to stir the pot 24/7.

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Deflect, deflect! You guys have been the most condescending group on the board, and you can't tell that all your doing is hurting conservatism.

---

Nobody is hurting conservatism more than fake-conservative con artist trump. He's single-handedly setting back the movement back by a decade.

---

Absolute and total hyperbole with no way to quantify such a statement to back it up…

You're making an emotional argument devoid of actual, quantifiable metrics…

---

you love to make this weird claim that every argument you disagree with is "emotional"

how is it "emotional" to ACCURATELY NOTE that

Trump lost the House in 2018 and lost Senate seats

lost the White House in 2020

Lost the House in 2020

lost the Senate in 2020

lost the Senate in 2021

lost the Senate in 2022

that's 3 straight national elections he has lost.

he is at 56% disapproval right now.

how are these facts "emotional"!?!?

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That's definitely the opposite of "SO MUCH WINNING!!"

a picture says a thousand words

Has this Ad been discussed?

Yes. There was an entire thread on it.

It goes to show that the only person who can make people who at one time claimed to be conservative starting using the term "homophobia" and coming out in support of LGBTQABCDEFG, is Trump. Like everything else, Trump and his followers attack DeSantis from the left, every single time.

While Trump is doing lord knows what in Mar A Lago

DeSantis was walking in the rain in New Hampshire. of course the Trumptards on Twitter made fun of someone walking in the rain without using an umbrella.

LMCane said:

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While Trump is doing lord knows what in Mar A Lago

DeSantis was walking in the rain in New Hampshire. of course the Trumptards on Twitter made fun of someone walking in the rain without using an umbrella.

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Because there's no way Trump could last walking throughout a whole parade. He'd collapse. He's no different than 2019/2020 Biden, limiting appearances because he's AN OLD, OLD MAN.

FireAg said:

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Then DeSantis needs to pick it up because the national average for the R primary doesn't look good right now...

It appears he's currently splitting votes with Pence...



And on a national average, both Trump and DeSantis, for the most part, lead Biden...


And this is for a man who is having more criminal cases thrown at him than Al Capone...

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You keep posting these polling averages as if they are the most important thing when they simply aren't, especially when you are looking at them in that level of detail. So few voters are engaged at this point. Keep on keeping on I guess but this race isn't even close to the serious part yet and won't be for many months.

J. Walter Weatherman said:

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Funky Winkerbean said:

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Rapier108 said:

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AggieVictor10 said:

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Not sure desantis fans have any room to call trumpers "cult45" when their zealotry for meatball Ron puts trumper loyalty to shame.

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Says the guy who is really just as leftist who makes comments to stir the pot 24/7.

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Deflect, deflect! You guys have been the most condescending group on the board, and you can't tell that all your doing is hurting conservatism.

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Nobody is hurting conservatism more than fake-conservative con artist trump. He's single-handedly setting back the movement back by a decade.

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DC insiders are the ones feeling the effect of Trump. They are now expected to be a voice instead of cowering in the corner. Their grift of losing on purpose and profiting as the minority party is over.

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DC insiders are the ones feeling the effect of Trump.

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Which insiders? Wray that he hired / appointed? Fauci that he couldn't remove / fire? Feinstein that he agreed with on trashing the 2A? Lindsay Graham? Which insiders are "feeling the effect?"

Trump had a predominately good presidency.... let's don't embellish his accomplishments.

Old May Banker said:

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DC insiders are the ones feeling the effect of Trump.

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Which insiders? Wray that he hired / appointed? Fauci that he couldn't remove / fire? Feinstein that he agreed with on trashing the 2A? Lindsay Graham? Which insiders are "feeling the effect?"

Trump had a predominately good presidency.... let's don't embellish his accomplishments.

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A small sample of an incredibly large population would include Liz Chaney and Paul Ryan. Here is an article in 2021 about it.

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/congressional-republicans-left-office-in-droves-under-trump-just-how-conservative-are-their-replacements/amp/

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Of the 293 Republicans who were serving in the Senate or House on Jan. 20, 2017 the day of Trump's inauguration a full 132 (45 percent) are no longer in Congress or have announced their retirement or resignation.

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So in a position with an average tenure of just over 8 years, less of half of them being gone in 4 years is your gotcha moment? Congrats, I think... although I'm not sure math is your friend here.

Again, Trump had a good enough presidency to stand on its own without exaggerating his accomplishments or trying to gloss over his failures. Not sure why that's impossible for you to admit.

Old May Banker said:

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So in a position with an average tenure of just over 8 years, less of half of them being gone in 4 years is your gotcha moment? Congrats, I think... although I'm not sure math is your friend here.

Again, Trump had a good enough presidency to stand on its own without exaggerating his accomplishments or trying to gloss over his failures. Not sure why that's impossible for you to admit.

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Gotcha? Lol.

Trump redefined Republican establishment. He showed that voters support candidates that don't lose on purpose. Many of those, like Ryan and Chaney intended on much longer terms.

And yes. When half of a group gets 4 years or less when the average is 8, that's significant.

Many of those were long timers. Not just one and done.

LMCane said:

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a picture says a thousand words

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what verifiable truths do you have supporting the claims in the picture?

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When half of a group gets 4 years or less when the average is 8, that's significant.

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Not particularly... unless you know their tenure prior to his election.

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Many of those were long timers

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Which again, doesn't bode well for your math...

His accomplishments don't require you being his fluffer. Let his words and actions stand on their own... unless he has some shortcomings you're trying to cover for with your cry / laugh?

Old May Banker said:

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Quote:

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When half of a group gets 4 years or less when the average is 8, that's significant.

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Not particularly... unless you know their tenure prior to his election.

Quote:

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Many of those were long timers

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Which again, doesn't bode well for your math...

His accomplishments don't require you being his fluffer. Let his words and actions stand on their own... unless he has some shortcomings you're trying to cover for with your cry / laugh?

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Lol. Trump cleared out half of the RINOS in 4 short years. I provided a link and the day and you provided the math. He knew the establishment would not help him pass his agenda because they didn't want to win. And so he went after them.

If your logic thinks that's not an accomplishment, then I can't provide you with logic.

Laugh/cry added just for you.

AgBandsman said:

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LMCane said:

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a picture says a thousand words

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what verifiable truths do you have supporting the claims in the picture?

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They don't deal in truths. Their greatest joy comes from calling people that align with them politically, stupid. And they just can't seem to grasp why DeSantis is struggling to catch Trump in the polls.

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They don't deal in truths.

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Which "truths" would that be? That Trump won't be 78 years old this time next year? That he advocated to skip due process for the 2A? That he couldn't advance legislation and relied on EOs? That he appointed Wray? That he's slammed his very own hand picked people when they say things he doesn't agree with? That he couldn't fire fauci?

Which selective "truths" is it you think conservatives should accept without seeking out a better candidate?

I've been asking for 6 months what Trump is going to do different if elected again. No one can answer.

I also asked for the names of 2 competent people that will join Trump's administration. crickets.

Lastly, I haven't seen one Trump supporter address the fact that he will be 78 years old. I want to know honestly if you think hes going to get anything done at that age.

Zarathustra said:

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I've been asking for 6 months what Trump is going to do different if elected again. No one can answer.

I also asked for the names of 2 competent people that will join Trump's administration. crickets.

Lastly, I haven't seen one Trump supporter address the fact that he will be 78 years old. I want to know honestly if you think hes going to get anything done at that age.

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Don't expect any kind of answer.

At most you'll get is a laugh/cry emoji and a bunch of words about how great Trump is.

Zarathustra said:

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I've been asking for 6 months what Trump is going to do different if elected again. No one can answer.

I also asked for the names of 2 competent people that will join Trump's administration. crickets.

Lastly, I haven't seen one Trump supporter address the fact that he will be 78 years old. I want to know honestly if you think hes going to get anything done at that age.

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1. Nothing. Libs had to cheat to win and they had Biden hidden. That dude is totally exposed and won't get near the votes he got last time, even after Dominion changed all those votes. Trumps base is squarely on his side. I'd he gets the labor vote again,he's there.

2. I have no idea who he's going to get.

3. He's as fit as ever. He was able to go toe to toe with a hostile media for hours and hours in his press conferences. He's able to go to event after event after event. He's probably in better shape than over half of this board.

Have a nice day.

Zarathustra said:

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I've been asking for 6 months what Trump is going to do different if elected again. No one can answer.

I also asked for the names of 2 competent people that will join Trump's administration. crickets.

Lastly, I haven't seen one Trump supporter address the fact that he will be 78 years old. I want to know honestly if you think hes going to get anything done at that age.

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Why not ask for next weeks winning lotto numbers? You are asking unanswerable questions.

Yes, I think he can't further expose the corruption in our government. They can't help themselves because they hate him that much. Doesn't the level of hate give you pause? Why do they hate him that much? Because he's an outsider to them, and he's not scared of them. Who else would go through what he's gone through (his own government breaking our laws to get him) and still be standing up asking for his job back? That's pretty impressive in my book. Plus, now he knows where the bodies are buried, so to speak.

Funky Winkerbean said:

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AgBandsman said:

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LMCane said:

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a picture says a thousand words

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what verifiable truths do you have supporting the claims in the picture?

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They don't deal in truths. Their greatest joy comes from calling people that align with them politically, stupid. And they just can't seem to grasp why DeSantis is struggling to catch Trump in the polls.

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Honestly, I can't figure out why he's off to a sputtering start myself…and I'd happily vote for him…he just hasn't gained much traction yet…still has time obviously…but I still think he needs to grab a headline or two…the spotlight continues to avoid him for now…and I don't honestly know why…

"Someone who is in our country illegally and has violated our laws should not possess a government-issued ID which allows them access to state-funded services and other privileges afforded to lawful residents." - @RonDeSantis https://t.co/TXpn0prUqi

— Gloria Taylor (@Glo_Tay) July 5, 2023