aTm2004 said:

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ChemEAg08 said:

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aTm2004 said:

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ChemEAg08 said:

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aTm2004 said:

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ChemEAg08 said:

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aTm2004 said:

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ChemEAg08 said:

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Teslag said:

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TAMU1990 said:

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I have a 2007 Sequoia and we just bought a used car last week. We are keeping the Sequoia and I just wanted a newer vehicle to drive out of town. All three kids in college have cars and we wanted two cars again.

2019 Highlander certified, $29k, 30,000 miles. Clean carfax. The prices for used Highlanders have been dropping - I think Toyota is coming out with a new body style soon. That car was $39-42k last year.

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Great purchase. Another issue I see is when many morons buy a Surbaban/Tahoe/Expedition etc instead of a minivan which is better for all aspects instead of towing. And men buy these for their wives purely out of insecurity because "they don't want to be seen driving a minivan". Tons of wasted dollars there for personal insecurity.

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What about hauling significant amount of cargo (people, luggage, etc) long distances and off-road (mud, rocks, etc). Is that a stupid investment asks the suburban owner or should I have bought a minivan or a Tesla for that kind of driving?

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You're an exception and you know it. Rhonda, in her $85k Escalade, isn't hauling travel trailers or going off road (intentionally). She's hauling kids and their stuff to and from school/practice/doctors, etc. For majority of SUV owners, a minivan would be a better fit, but pride won't allow it.

My cousin is a great example of this. Pregnant with #6, and drives an Expedition XL. She's one of the "will never own a minivan" camp, no matter how cramped the kids are. It's sole purpose is a kid hauler and family vehicle. Her husbands truck is the tow/haul vehicle.

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So if Rhonda (and presumably her spouse) make $500k/year she shouldn't be allowed to pick something other than a minivan to drive her kids around? Sounds like socialism to me. "You don't need that excess even if you can afford it, you only need what we deem you need."

Agree that people that can't afford certain vehicles shouldn't get them, but if they can afford it, why should I give a damn if they get it? Do millionaires need Bugatti's that go 250 mph when a Corolla will go the maximum speed on any US road legally?

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Nowhere in what me or the other poster posted was about being able to afford the vehicle. It was about the better vehicle for it's primary use. I mean, you could hunt whitetail with a .50 cal, but there are better calibers for the job.

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So millionaires should get Corollas because they aren't legally allowed to drive 80+ mph on the road instead of a Bugatti because the primary purpose is to get them around, not drive at maximum speeds. Got it.

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Continue to move the goalposts.

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But to get millionaires around, a Corolla would be much better as a primary vehicle than a Bugatti, kind of like a minivan would be much better to get a family with kids to get around than a suburban/Tahoe. So I guess that's moving goalposts.

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Nice rebuttal. I'll concede your point since you've eloquently made a point that you know better than others about what vehicles they must drive.

Mind also telling me what type of government I should endorse? Since I'm stupid and don't know how I should be governed? I mean I can't take care of myself so should I have a communist or socialist government take care of me?

That wasn't my point at all. But you know that.

Lots of business folks use accelerated depreciation, let the government pay for 40% of their ride, and drive whatever they want (assuming it qualifies).... lots and lots of guys in suburbans and pickups doing just that.

aTm2004 said:

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That wasn't my point at all. But you know that.

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When you say people are stupid for picking a certain car, that may be if they can't afford it, but to say they shouldn't because they don't need it is very socialist. You don't need it so you shouldn't get it.

"Better fit" is subjective.

One of the things i hate about minivans, aside from their very existence, is the fact that they are front wheel drive, lack decent power and doing any type of maintenance on them absolutely sucks because of their design lackof access and needing to jack the damn thing up just to change oil.

So they are absolutely not a better it for me for that fact alone.

I dont like how low they sit (same thing applies to a Chevy or GMC 1500 2wd or 4wd that isnt an AT4 or Texas Edition package) and every one i have been in (granted, not much) is not comfortable to be in for one or multiple reasons - whether ergos or something as simple as the view because of the front wnd design. So again, not a better fit.

Will they haul kids and groceries and soccer balls the same as something else? Sure they will. And if that is the only criteria, then most other things are a "better fit" as well.

Tom Doniphon said:

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Lots of business folks use accelerated depreciation, let the government pay for 40% of their ride, and drive whatever they want (assuming it qualifies).... lots and lots of guys in suburbans and pickups doing just that.

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I have a suburban and a pick up so that must be me. Dang, I should trade them in for a minivan and a Corolla.

ChemEAg08 said:

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aTm2004 said:

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That wasn't my point at all. But you know that.

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When you say people are stupid for picking a certain car, that may be if they can't afford it, but to say they shouldn't because they don't need it is very socialist. You don't need it so you shouldn't get it.

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I never said anything about someone being stupid. I think you have me confused with another poster.

It's nearly everyone thats understands economics and taxation. (Pending their financial station in life)... it's why there's so much fail in blanket statements about what vehicles folks should use.

aTm2004 said:

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ChemEAg08 said:

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aTm2004 said:

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That wasn't my point at all. But you know that.

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When you say people are stupid for picking a certain car, that may be if they can't afford it, but to say they shouldn't because they don't need it is very socialist. You don't need it so you shouldn't get it.

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I never said anything about someone being stupid. I think you have me confused with another poster.

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https://texags.com/forums/16/topics/3358754/replies/64189648

Sure seems like you think Rhonda and your cousin are stupid.

Quote:

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You're an exception and you know it. Rhonda, in her $85k Escalade, isn't hauling travel trailers or going off road (intentionally). She's hauling kids and their stuff to and from school/practice/doctors, etc. For majority of SUV owners, a minivan would be a better fit, but pride won't allow it.

My cousin is a great example of this. Pregnant with #6, and drives an Expedition XL. She's one of the "will never own a minivan" camp, no matter how cramped the kids are. It's sole purpose is a kid hauler and family vehicle. Her husbands truck is the tow/haul vehicle.

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ChemEAg08 said:

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aTm2004 said:

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ChemEAg08 said:

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aTm2004 said:

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That wasn't my point at all. But you know that.

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When you say people are stupid for picking a certain car, that may be if they can't afford it, but to say they shouldn't because they don't need it is very socialist. You don't need it so you shouldn't get it.

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I never said anything about someone being stupid. I think you have me confused with another poster.

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https://texags.com/forums/16/topics/3358754/replies/64189648

Sure seems like you think Rhonda and your cousin are stupid.

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You're an exception and you know it. Rhonda, in her $85k Escalade, isn't hauling travel trailers or going off road (intentionally). She's hauling kids and their stuff to and from school/practice/doctors, etc. For majority of SUV owners, a minivan would be a better fit, but pride won't allow it.

My cousin is a great example of this. Pregnant with #6, and drives an Expedition XL. She's one of the "will never own a minivan" camp, no matter how cramped the kids are. It's sole purpose is a kid hauler and family vehicle. Her husbands truck is the tow/haul vehicle.

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I mean hell, Rhonda should get a minivan instead of wasting all that money because of her pride and your cousin shouldn't force her kids to be cramped in an expedition XL when should could have them nice and cozy in a minivan. Right? So dumb….

Funky Winkerbean said:

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Burdizzo said:

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Funky Winkerbean said:

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Allowing 7 year terms spurred the price expansion.

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A seven-year-old car today would be a 2016 model with roughly 100k miles on it depending on a lot of factors. In 1980, a 1973 model with 100k miles had one two wheels headed for the scrapyard. I think seven year financing is ridiculous too, but cars are built a lot better these days than they used to be.

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I don't disagree, but it begs the question of who still drives a car that's paid off?

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Me. My wife.

Oh, wait. Never mind. Me before I traded for a pickup last year. So middle/end of this year, it will be me. At some point, I'm going to pick up a 10-ish year old Lexus sedan to have one of those to drive on a road trip (or cross county) and keep the miles on the pickup low. We'll probably finance it, depending on the rates, but pay it off within a year or so.

Manhattan said:

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Tom Doniphon said:

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Manhattan said:

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Run off I'm still here… How many people have you told you aren't making money on a car when you are?

If a manufacturer is paying you to sell X number of cars that counts.

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You should reread what I wrote, Einstein.... and I never said that I don't make money - I accurately stated that prior to the Covid madness consumers were paying less than dealers were paying the manufacturers. Don't change my words or tell me what "counts."

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Nobody cares how much you pay for the car when you get holdback, dealer cash and other kickbacks…. Kickback isn't always a negative denotation…

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Sounds like you've got it all nailed down... you should take this secret info to your banker and get him to help you buy a dealership! You'll be a billionaire in no time with your knowledge of kick backs, dealer cash, and hold back!

ChemEAg08 said:

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aTm2004 said:

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ChemEAg08 said:

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aTm2004 said:

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That wasn't my point at all. But you know that.

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When you say people are stupid for picking a certain car, that may be if they can't afford it, but to say they shouldn't because they don't need it is very socialist. You don't need it so you shouldn't get it.

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I never said anything about someone being stupid. I think you have me confused with another poster.

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https://texags.com/forums/16/topics/3358754/replies/64189648

Sure seems like you think Rhonda and your cousin are stupid.

Quote:

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You're an exception and you know it. Rhonda, in her $85k Escalade, isn't hauling travel trailers or going off road (intentionally). She's hauling kids and their stuff to and from school/practice/doctors, etc. For majority of SUV owners, a minivan would be a better fit, but pride won't allow it.

My cousin is a great example of this. Pregnant with #6, and drives an Expedition XL. She's one of the "will never own a minivan" camp, no matter how cramped the kids are. It's sole purpose is a kid hauler and family vehicle. Her husbands truck is the tow/haul vehicle.

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Never in there did I say either were stupid.

aTm2004 said:

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ChemEAg08 said:

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aTm2004 said:

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ChemEAg08 said:

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aTm2004 said:

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That wasn't my point at all. But you know that.

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When you say people are stupid for picking a certain car, that may be if they can't afford it, but to say they shouldn't because they don't need it is very socialist. You don't need it so you shouldn't get it.

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I never said anything about someone being stupid. I think you have me confused with another poster.

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https://texags.com/forums/16/topics/3358754/replies/64189648

Sure seems like you think Rhonda and your cousin are stupid.

Quote:

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You're an exception and you know it. Rhonda, in her $85k Escalade, isn't hauling travel trailers or going off road (intentionally). She's hauling kids and their stuff to and from school/practice/doctors, etc. For majority of SUV owners, a minivan would be a better fit, but pride won't allow it.

My cousin is a great example of this. Pregnant with #6, and drives an Expedition XL. She's one of the "will never own a minivan" camp, no matter how cramped the kids are. It's sole purpose is a kid hauler and family vehicle. Her husbands truck is the tow/haul vehicle.

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Never in there did I say either were stupid.

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Ok then what did you imply by the statements above? Because it sure as hell sounds like you implied it, but go ahead and interpret for the class.

ChemEAg08 said:

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Teslag said:

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aTm2004 said:

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ChemEAg08 said:

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Teslag said:

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TAMU1990 said:

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I have a 2007 Sequoia and we just bought a used car last week. We are keeping the Sequoia and I just wanted a newer vehicle to drive out of town. All three kids in college have cars and we wanted two cars again.

2019 Highlander certified, $29k, 30,000 miles. Clean carfax. The prices for used Highlanders have been dropping - I think Toyota is coming out with a new body style soon. That car was $39-42k last year.

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Great purchase. Another issue I see is when many morons buy a Surbaban/Tahoe/Expedition etc instead of a minivan which is better for all aspects instead of towing. And men buy these for their wives purely out of insecurity because "they don't want to be seen driving a minivan". Tons of wasted dollars there for personal insecurity.

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What about hauling significant amount of cargo (people, luggage, etc) long distances and off-road (mud, rocks, etc). Is that a stupid investment asks the suburban owner or should I have bought a minivan or a Tesla for that kind of driving?

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You're an exception and you know it. Rhonda, in her $85k Escalade, isn't hauling travel trailers or going off road (intentionally). She's hauling kids and their stuff to and from school/practice/doctors, etc. For majority of SUV owners, a minivan would be a better fit, but pride won't allow it.

My cousin is a great example of this. Pregnant with #6, and drives an Expedition XL. She's one of the "will never own a minivan" camp, no matter how cramped the kids are. Its sole purpose is a kid hauler and family vehicle. Her husbands truck is the tow/haul vehicle.

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And why do you need a $60-80k electric vehicle when a Corolla will get gas mileage that by cost per mile is equivalent to what you are getting charging your vehicle by the use of natural gas that powers your home? That's excess but your pride says you have to have a Tesla since it's better than sliced bread.

Salute the shot.

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Because a Corolla doesn't have near the performance, tech, or drive experience that the Y Performance does. They aren't comparable cars.

Teslag said:

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ChemEAg08 said:

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Teslag said:

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aTm2004 said:

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ChemEAg08 said:

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Teslag said:

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TAMU1990 said:

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I have a 2007 Sequoia and we just bought a used car last week. We are keeping the Sequoia and I just wanted a newer vehicle to drive out of town. All three kids in college have cars and we wanted two cars again.

2019 Highlander certified, $29k, 30,000 miles. Clean carfax. The prices for used Highlanders have been dropping - I think Toyota is coming out with a new body style soon. That car was $39-42k last year.

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Great purchase. Another issue I see is when many morons buy a Surbaban/Tahoe/Expedition etc instead of a minivan which is better for all aspects instead of towing. And men buy these for their wives purely out of insecurity because "they don't want to be seen driving a minivan". Tons of wasted dollars there for personal insecurity.

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What about hauling significant amount of cargo (people, luggage, etc) long distances and off-road (mud, rocks, etc). Is that a stupid investment asks the suburban owner or should I have bought a minivan or a Tesla for that kind of driving?

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You're an exception and you know it. Rhonda, in her $85k Escalade, isn't hauling travel trailers or going off road (intentionally). She's hauling kids and their stuff to and from school/practice/doctors, etc. For majority of SUV owners, a minivan would be a better fit, but pride won't allow it.

My cousin is a great example of this. Pregnant with #6, and drives an Expedition XL. She's one of the "will never own a minivan" camp, no matter how cramped the kids are. Its sole purpose is a kid hauler and family vehicle. Her husbands truck is the tow/haul vehicle.

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And why do you need a $60-80k electric vehicle when a Corolla will get gas mileage that by cost per mile is equivalent to what you are getting charging your vehicle by the use of natural gas that powers your home? That's excess but your pride says you have to have a Tesla since it's better than sliced bread.

Salute the shot.

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Because a Corolla doesn't have near the performance, tech, or drive experience that the Y Performance does. They aren't comparable cars.

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Do they both drive over pavement, allow their driver to go the speed limit and are very affordable from a mileage/energy cost to go? Sounds comparable to me!

By your standard a fiat and a Ferrari are also the same. Brilliant take.

Teslag said:

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By your standard a fiat and a Ferrari are also the same. Brilliant take.

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Yes, because a minivan and Suburban are comparable as well per this thread.

ChemEAg08 said:

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Teslag said:

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By your standard a fiat and a Ferrari are also the same. Brilliant take.

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Yes, because a minivan and Suburban are comparable as well per this thread.

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One is functional for hauling kids and families around and the other isn't as good at that but can satisfy an insecurity or superficial need or accommodate towing/rough roads. There's nothing inherently wrong with that though.

As Biggie Smalls used to say, "condo paid for, no car payment…" These are Words of Wisdom.

At my arraignment, note for the plaintiff…

ChemEAg08 said:

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Manhattan said:

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Don't have all day to get to 80.

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So it takes 2+ hrs to get to 80 mph in a Corolla?

Also, you know you're defending Elon who hates the woke liberalism cancer you espouse on this website, right?

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FYI, the 2023 Corolla has updated to a 169 HP engine across all lines (except the hybrid), shaving about 2 seconds off the 0-60 time compared to the previous 139 HP engine. Not great but not horrible either.

Uh oh, simp'n for Tesla has begun

The market will adjust as it always does. Interest rates being held so low for so long has been the number one factor leading the inflationary prices of cars, boats and housing. Add longer note terms, lower down payments and lower credit qualification and you get the current situation. Those days are gone or going away.

With that being said, the positive of higher interest rates is a benefit of actually saving money. A benefit that the newest generation has never experienced. Look at the history of interest rates, and 3% borrowing only occurred around the time of the Great Depression.

Incentivized saving is the backbone to financial responsibility, but at 0.25% there was no incentive to save only to borrow. Will will see how long the Fed will allow interest rates to remain this high. They have to pay interest as well.

Funky Winkerbean said:

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Burdizzo said:

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Funky Winkerbean said:

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Allowing 7 year terms spurred the price expansion.

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A seven-year-old car today would be a 2016 model with roughly 100k miles on it depending on a lot of factors. In 1980, a 1973 model with 100k miles had one two wheels headed for the scrapyard. I think seven year financing is ridiculous too, but cars are built a lot better these days than they used to be.

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I don't disagree, but it begs the question of who still drives a car that's paid off?

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we have 4 vehicles, all paid off.

I dislike paying interest (paying eextra) on depreciating non revenue generating assets.

Same, which is why I wouldn't finance in the current market. But back when rates were sub 2% it would have been irresponsible to pay cash.

Lot to unpack here, but there's a few things causing this rise:

1. Extension of loans out to72, 84 and 96 months

2. Low interest rates during the COVID years (and no payments for 6 months on some)

3. Extreme rise in used vehicle prices. While you're paying for an expensive vehicle, they are holding their value better than ever.

4. Ride sharing apps

I know, 2022 and earlier my car is half the time 0-60. For $2,000 it's half the 2023.

ChemEAg08 said:

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aTm2004 said:

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ChemEAg08 said:

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aTm2004 said:

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ChemEAg08 said:

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aTm2004 said:

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That wasn't my point at all. But you know that.

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When you say people are stupid for picking a certain car, that may be if they can't afford it, but to say they shouldn't because they don't need it is very socialist. You don't need it so you shouldn't get it.

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I never said anything about someone being stupid. I think you have me confused with another poster.

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https://texags.com/forums/16/topics/3358754/replies/64189648

Sure seems like you think Rhonda and your cousin are stupid.

Quote:

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You're an exception and you know it. Rhonda, in her $85k Escalade, isn't hauling travel trailers or going off road (intentionally). She's hauling kids and their stuff to and from school/practice/doctors, etc. For majority of SUV owners, a minivan would be a better fit, but pride won't allow it.

My cousin is a great example of this. Pregnant with #6, and drives an Expedition XL. She's one of the "will never own a minivan" camp, no matter how cramped the kids are. It's sole purpose is a kid hauler and family vehicle. Her husbands truck is the tow/haul vehicle.

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Never in there did I say either were stupid.

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Ok then what did you imply by the statements above? Because it sure as hell sounds like you implied it, but go ahead and interpret for the class.

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I think I was pretty clear when I said this:

"For majority of SUV owners, a minivan would be a better fit, but pride won't allow it."

They're prideful. That doesn't mean they're stupid.

Exactly. There's nothing particularly wrong with making a superficial decision to buy a car. We do it with a lot of things in life. I spent extra on weightlifting plates that were flecked in color instead of black because I liked the look. Didn't affect function. For some reason, most people that buy large SUV's they can't admit their true reason. Of course there's exceptions like towing, terrain, and the guy on this thread whose wife and him played center for the Knicks. But those are outliers.

Quote:

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"For majority of SUV owners, a minivan would be a better fit, but pride won't allow it."

They're prideful. That doesn't mean they're stupid.

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As soon as I am inside a minivan, I love it. I just won't ever own one because I would have to look at the outside, too.

I totally get it. We have a minivan, and my wife and I are both honest about it...we don't want it, but it's awesome with 3 kids. The sliding doors have kept my BP down as well because I'm not fearing a door ding on my car in the garage, or someone's in the parking lot. My wife's family has a farm up in Iowa that we go to once or twice a year, and the minivan is awesome the road trip. We load it down with clothes, guns, toys, etc for all of us, and still have the 3rd row up and I have nothing blocking my view out of the back window. Oh, and we get 30+ mpg on the trip. We can make it from Houston to OKC before needing to fill up, and we top off in KC to go the rest of the way.

Once they're older and she's ready for a new vehicle, we'll go with a SUV.

I have enjoyed this thread.

Nothing really to add other than I bought an F150 in 2007 and still have it. It only has 77k miles on it because I had a work vehicle for a long time. My son is about to start driving so I will start him out on the F150 and if he crashes it no big deal.

aggiebrad94 said:

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Quote:

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"For majority of SUV owners, a minivan would be a better fit, but pride won't allow it."

They're prideful. That doesn't mean they're stupid.

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As soon as I am inside a minivan, I love it. I just won't ever own one because I would have to look at the outside, too.

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That's how I've felt about the Panamera for a long time too.