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WASHINGTON The U.S. Army announced the award of a 10-year firm-fixed-price follow-on production contract to Sig Sauer, Inc for the manufacture and delivery of two Next Generation Squad Weapon variations (the XM5 Rifle and the XM250 Automatic Rifle) and the 6.8 Common Cartridge Family of Ammunition.

This award was made following a rigorous 27-month prototyping and evaluation effort that included numerous technical tests and Soldier touch points of three competing prototype systems.

The value of the initial delivery order on the contract is $20.4 million for weapons and ammunition that will undergo testing. The contract includes accessories, spares and contractor support. It also provides the other Department of Defense services and, potentially, Foreign Military Sales countries the opportunity to purchase the NGSW weapons.

The XM5 Rifle will replace the M4/M4A1 carbine within the close combat force, and the XM250 Automatic Rifle is the planned replacement for the M249 Squad Automatic Weapon

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https://www.army.mil/article/255827/army_awards_next_generation_squad_weapon_contract

Finally going to be upgrading from the .223/5.56 to something with a little more punch. Guess at least one lesson was learned and adopted from the 20 years in the desert.

Made in New Hampshire?

Going from the 5.56 to a 6.8?

There was a thread on here a couple days ago about the army building out ammo production capacity. I'm pretty sure this is why. They need to produce something on the order of a billion rounds of ammo for this just to get into circulation.

Additionally, the civilan version is label the 277 Fury

This will be the M5 and replace the M4.

Almost like the Army rediscovers full power cartridges. Great, but they will keep Eugene Stoner's AR design around for years to come: it's light weight, compactness and cost make it too handy to relinquish.

6.8 isn't bad. 6.5 kicks ass.

Somebody got paid.

flakrat said:

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Going from the 5.56 to a 6.8?

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Yes, but not the 6.8SPC that is already on the market.

This one will be 6.8x51mm.

https://www.tactical-life.com/gear/ammo/277-sig-fury-hybrid-case-design/

Is the 6.8mm going to be the new NATO standard? Hopefully, otherwise, WTF!

flakrat said:

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Going from the 5.56 to a 6.8?

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I think you posted the wrong 6.8 - the one you pictured looks like the 6.8 spc ii (6.8x43 i think). The new cartridge is a 6.8x51.

UTExan said:

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...but they will keep Eugene Stoner's AR design around for years to come: it's light weight, compactness and cost make it too handy to relinquish.

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Probably why the SCAR didn't get selected again.

But I still love mine.

Reciprocating barrel on the squad weapon is interesting. Also interesting that they went with the steel/brass case instead of the plastic of the competition

Trigger06 said:

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flakrat said:

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Going from the 5.56 to a 6.8?

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I think you posted the wrong 6.8 - the one you pictured looks like the 6.8 spc ii (6.8x43 i think). The new cartridge is a 6.8x51.

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Additionally, it is a hybrid two material cartridge.

Can't get the forum code working in mobile, but this is cool
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The round's 80,000 psi pressure can push a 135-grain bullet to velocities of 3,000 feet per second. Hunters and long-range aficionados using magnum ammo won't find that velocity number inconceivable, but it's a lot more impressive when you consider that it's coming from a 16-inch barrel and the cartridges fit into a standard AR-10 magazine. Plus, the ammunition weighs less than .308 Winchester rounds, allowing soldiers to carry more of it than they could if they were using a traditional magnum rifle.

On top of that, there's the new XM157 self-adjusting optic the Army chose to go with the XM5 rifles. The Vortex product can send and receive data both with a soldier's augmented reality (IVAS) system and with other soldiers's gear and even military aircraft. But, why is the military going for such a big upgrade now?
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https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/https-defensereview-com-spikes-tactical-5-45mm-russian-ar-carbine-the-greatest-training-gun-everif-you-have-to-buy-your-own-ammunition-that-is/

Darn. I really liked the general dynamics offering

Over 1 million rounds already delivered by SIG
https://soldiersystems.net/2021/01/27/sig-ammunition-produced-rounds-of-6-8x51mm/

Here's the new SIG 6.8 x 51 hybrid round next to the current 5.56, 23% weight reduction

Manufactured in Arkansas.

flakrat said:

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Over 1 million tons already delivered by SIG
https://soldiersystems.net/2021/01/27/sig-ammunition-produced-rounds-of-6-8x51mm/

Here's the new SIG 6.8 x 51 hybrid round next to the current 5.56, 23% weight reduction

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How is this better than the mosin nagant 7.62x54 round? I don't think it is.

10thYrSr said:

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flakrat said:

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Over 1 million tons already delivered by SIG
https://soldiersystems.net/2021/01/27/sig-ammunition-produced-rounds-of-6-8x51mm/

Here's the new SIG 6.8 x 51 hybrid round next to the current 5.56, 23% weight reduction

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How is this better than the mosin nagant 7.62x54 round? I don't think it is.

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That's what the 7.62x51 is for. We will still have plenty of weapons which use that and .50BMG.

The Russians use 5.45x39 in their standard military rifles. It was their answer to the 5.56 of the M-16.

UTExan said:

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Almost like the Army rediscovers full power cartridges. Great, but they will keep Eugene Stoner's AR design around for years to come: it's light weight, compactness and cost make it too handy to relinquish.

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Years ago I was told that the reason for the smaller bullet was that when you kill an enemy soldier he is dead. When you maim an enemy soldier it takes resources tend to him afterward. I don't know if that was true, but someone told me that.

Can't wait for the Marine Corps to have all the Army leftovers in 3 years!

Burdizzo said:

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UTExan said:

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Almost like the Army rediscovers full power cartridges. Great, but they will keep Eugene Stoner's AR design around for years to come: it's light weight, compactness and cost make it too handy to relinquish.

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Years ago I was told that the reason for the smaller bullet was that when you kill an enemy soldier he is dead. When you maim an enemy soldier it takes resources tend to him afterward. I don't know if that was true, but someone told me that.

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It's 100% true and they still explicitly mentioned that in basic training in 2009.

I have heard that several times over the years as well, though I don't remember it from basic training in 1992. The thing is, I am not sure if it is really a myth or not.

In fact, the Remington 223...5.56 etc. history don't seem to have had that as an objective, and it never made sense to me as...certainly within a few hundred yards, if hitting center mass it is plenty lethal.

Ranges for infantry combat in Vietnam were, ultimately I guess, well within 300 yards, but I guess after Afghanistan etc., with modern body armor/optics/opponents (like the Chinese) in mind, more lethality out further is important today.

I was never instructed to shoot to injure, and am unaware of any actual manuals/doctrine as such, either. If there are 10 bad guys shooting at x-number of good guys, do we really want troops engaging with an idea to 'let's just injure a couple so they have to haul them away?' It just doesn't make sense, imho.

Without doubt, the 6.8 decision (which the army made in advance of the contractors making/putting up their designs competitively), has greater lethality at range as a criteria/key factor.

That optic is $10,800 in quantities of a quarter million. There won't be any affordable consumer variants available for a long time.

The rifle is available though. Only $8K plus tax stamp.

The L3/Leupold bid...looked a lot smaller/simpler, to me.



As usual, the Army did not seek my input.

I can believe they don't instruct to shoot to maim. That is as dumb as Biden's "shootn'em in the knee" remark. In the fog of combat, you rarely have the time to think about that anyway. That said, I am guessing there is some statistical evidence someone used to rationalize the caliber policy.

So badass.

It's the round. Not the aim.

Not looking for minute of angle.

Looking for minute of man.

10thYrSr said:

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flakrat said:

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Over 1 million tons already delivered by SIG
https://soldiersystems.net/2021/01/27/sig-ammunition-produced-rounds-of-6-8x51mm/

Here's the new SIG 6.8 x 51 hybrid round next to the current 5.56, 23% weight reduction

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How is this better than the mosin nagant 7.62x54 round? I don't think it is.

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It has to do with hybrid cartridge. The highly increased chamber pressures give it over 3,000fps muzzle velocity on a 16" barrel. Throw in that it has lower drag and the new round has almost half the drop of the 7.62 at 1,000 yards.