MaxPower said:

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I'd say the older EV market is just immature. There are very few EVs that are 8+ years old. If I were purchasing a used vehicle in that age or price range I'd go ICE. That said, I wouldn't worry much about purchasing new now because of resale market in 8 or 10 years. There will be millions of older EVs by then. The after market will mature and companies like Tesla will see increasing value in providing refurbishment or cheaper battery replacements as time moves on. I could also see them simply gobbling up older EVs to essentially recycle them once they hit a certain price point. The raw materials in an EV are more valuable than in an ICE.

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Agreed if they figure out a way to recycle the batteries economically it will help sustain the used EV market. Otherwise if those millions of used EVs can't be sustained, the used market will crash bigly.

China taking advantage of EU "green agenda" and Ukraine war (energy inflation) with EV onslaught:

Quote:

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Major EU ports are almost full to capacity with Chinese electric vehicles(EVs) that no one wants to buy. A slump in sales across Europe has caused parking lots at the Belgian ports of Antwerp and Zeebrugge to fill up with the Chinese imports.

The parking lots are each able to accommodate about 130,000 vehicles and are crammed full of MGs, BYDs, Nios, XPengs, Lynk & Cos, Omodas and Hongqis, among others.

Chinese EV companies have aggressively targeted European markets as they look to take advantage of the EU's green agenda.

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Again, China is precisely what makes EV's a political issue, wittingly or not for many.

nortex97 said:

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China taking advantage of EU "green agenda" and Ukraine war (energy inflation) with EV onslaught:

Quote:

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Major EU ports are almost full to capacity with Chinese electric vehicles(EVs) that no one wants to buy. A slump in sales across Europe has caused parking lots at the Belgian ports of Antwerp and Zeebrugge to fill up with the Chinese imports.

The parking lots are each able to accommodate about 130,000 vehicles and are crammed full of MGs, BYDs, Nios, XPengs, Lynk & Cos, Omodas and Hongqis, among others.

Chinese EV companies have aggressively targeted European markets as they look to take advantage of the EU's green agenda.

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Again, China is precisely what makes EV's a political issue, wittingly or not for many.

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How different is this from Americans who knowingly do business directly with China?

Like joe Biden and fam with cefc? Not very different.

Wow. Can't wait for these "luxury" Chinese EV to reach our shores.
Europe is so woke and forked.

https://gwmora.co.uk/models/ora-03/

nortex97 said:

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Like joe Biden and fam with cefc? Not very different.

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As well as any American, correct?

No Spin Ag said:

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nortex97 said:

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China taking advantage of EU "green agenda" and Ukraine war (energy inflation) with EV onslaught:

Quote:

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Major EU ports are almost full to capacity with Chinese electric vehicles(EVs) that no one wants to buy. A slump in sales across Europe has caused parking lots at the Belgian ports of Antwerp and Zeebrugge to fill up with the Chinese imports.

The parking lots are each able to accommodate about 130,000 vehicles and are crammed full of MGs, BYDs, Nios, XPengs, Lynk & Cos, Omodas and Hongqis, among others.

Chinese EV companies have aggressively targeted European markets as they look to take advantage of the EU's green agenda.

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Again, China is precisely what makes EV's a political issue, wittingly or not for many.

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How different is this from Americans who knowingly do business directly with China?

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Every single American, except maybe the Amish, have their hand in the Chinese cookie jar. That ship has sailed for anyone to use talking point.

No Spin Ag said:

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nortex97 said:

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Like joe Biden and fam with cefc? Not very different.

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As well as any American, correct?

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Nortex has said he's an Audi owner. Which is ironic given Audi's propensity to get their hand slapped for using forced Chinese labor…

https://www.foxbusiness.com/markets/imported-luxury-cars-audi-held-by-us-over-banned-part-linked-forced-labor-china.amp

Everyone has their hand in the Chinese cookie jar.

techno-ag said:

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MaxPower said:

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I'd say the older EV market is just immature. There are very few EVs that are 8+ years old. If I were purchasing a used vehicle in that age or price range I'd go ICE. That said, I wouldn't worry much about purchasing new now because of resale market in 8 or 10 years. There will be millions of older EVs by then. The after market will mature and companies like Tesla will see increasing value in providing refurbishment or cheaper battery replacements as time moves on. I could also see them simply gobbling up older EVs to essentially recycle them once they hit a certain price point. The raw materials in an EV are more valuable than in an ICE.

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Agreed if they figure out a way to recycle the batteries economically it will help sustain the used EV market. Otherwise if those millions of used EVs can't be sustained, the used market will crash bigly.

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I don't get why you guys keep claiming EV batteries can't be recycled. It isn't hard and has been done with hybrid batteries for years. Are a lot recycled in China today, yes, but they can be done in many other locations and almost certainly will given the cost to ship the batteries. There are a number of US startups getting into the business.

https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a44022888/electric-car-battery-recycling/

"EV batteries are simply too valuable to toss out, and a new industry of recyclers is busy snatching them all up."

"Though still in its infancy, EV recycling is already profitable and capable of recovering more than 95% of the key minerals. "

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-04-24/battery-recycling-shatters-the-myth-of-ev-battery-waste

bobbranco said:

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Wow. Can't wait for these "luxury" Chinese EV to reach our shores.
Europe is so woke and forked.

https://gwmora.co.uk/models/ora-03/

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Domestic pricing starts at $14,600. Not sure that qualifies as "luxury" in the U.S or China.

hph6203 said:

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bobbranco said:

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Wow. Can't wait for these "luxury" Chinese EV to reach our shores.
Europe is so woke and forked.

https://gwmora.co.uk/models/ora-03/

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Domestic pricing starts at $14,600. Not sure that qualifies as "luxury" in the U.S.

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It's very easy to spend more than that on a Club Car.

No Spin Ag said:

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nortex97 said:

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Like joe Biden and fam with cefc? Not very different.

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As well as any American, correct?

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No, because outside of a middle school level of thinking most of us understand there are different degrees of involvement. It's like comparing the amount of CCP-refined/sourced precious metals in an iphone battery vs. a cybertruck. Sure, they are both using them, but one is using many thousands of times more.

And the CCP didn't pay me millions of dollars to look out for their interests/work as their agent.

It's sort of amazing such 'nuance' has to even be explained.

Good thread with some links/articles on Chinese EV's.

Having Chinese automakers set up plants in the US could be a smart solution that would allow US consumers to have cheaper, innovative Chinese EVs while keeping jobs in the US. This is what happened with Japanese automakers.

But there’s one thorny problem: auto parts.
1/ 🧵 pic.twitter.com/sJtsxw7Weg

— Kyle Chan (@kyleichan) May 18, 2024

It will be interesting to see how/when the Chinese do directly attack the US market…

U.S. had banned Xiaomi to protect Apple, but ban motivated Xiaomi to crush both Apple AND Tesla. This stunning Xiaomi EV costs $30,000, shames Teslas costing 2X. That bump on roof is Lidar, which Musk shunned but which many savvy Chinese car buyers prefer.pic.twitter.com/7wWqez3OlV

— Facts Chaser 🌎 🤦🏻‍♂️ (@Factschaser) May 18, 2024

And yes I own an older Audi. I have no idea how to get outside of your head, have no intent of living in it. My wife's paid-for supercharged V6 suv somehow being relevant to this thread about not owning EV's I am sure is bothering you. Please don't feel compelled to explain your point, I really don't care what it is.

Just ordered a Tesla. Pretty excited about it.

Which model?

Model 3 Performance. Was going to get the LR which was already quick enough but what the hell. I love my Lexus GS-F but this thing is a lot faster. Looking forward to July and won't miss gas stations.

Did the same with the Y. The LR fit our needs but the Peformance was just just so much more fun. Just go easy at first or youll need new tires in year like I did.

GAC06 said:

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Just ordered a Tesla. Pretty excited about it.

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The best days of being a Tesla owner are the day you buy it and the day you sell it.

3 Year Model Y ownership, over 100K miles. This is by far the best and most convenient car I have owned. I can't think of anything an ICE car would be better other than the occasional Supercharging 20 min vs Gas 5 minute stops. But even then, doing 3 supercharging stops a year beats 100 stops a year at a gas station.

No, the guy that's never owned one says it sucks

techno-ag said:

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GAC06 said:

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Just ordered a Tesla. Pretty excited about it.

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The best days of being a Tesla owner are the day you buy it and the day you sell it.

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And exactly how would you know? Have you owned one?

Remember essentially everyone who owns one has also had an ICE so they can do a direct comparison and shockingly, consumer satisfaction is high versus people that trash them based on a few rides (if that) in one and what they read online in many cases from biased sources like most online sources these days.

Kansas Kid said:

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techno-ag said:

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GAC06 said:

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Just ordered a Tesla. Pretty excited about it.

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The best days of being a Tesla owner are the day you buy it and the day you sell it.

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And exactly how would you know? Have you owned one?

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Nope. It's a play on the old saying about boats.

Medaggie said:

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3 Year Model Y ownership, over 100K miles. This is by far the best and most convenient car I have owned. I can't think of anything an ICE car would be better other than the occasional Supercharging 20 min vs Gas 5 minute stops. But even then, doing 3 supercharging stops a year beats 100 stops a year at a gas station.

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I have a big gas guzzling pickup and I don't fill up 100 times a year. More like 40-50 tops. And I drive more than the average person.

techno-ag said:

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Medaggie said:

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3 Year Model Y ownership, over 100K miles. This is by far the best and most convenient car I have owned. I can't think of anything an ICE car would be better other than the occasional Supercharging 20 min vs Gas 5 minute stops. But even then, doing 3 supercharging stops a year beats 100 stops a year at a gas station.

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I have a big gas guzzling pickup and I don't fill up 100 times a year. More like 40-50 tops. And I drive more than the average person.

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100 stops per year would be twice per week. No one does that.

Oh no, I spent an hour of my year filling up at the gas station!

Lololol

Logos Stick said:

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techno-ag said:

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Medaggie said:

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3 Year Model Y ownership, over 100K miles. This is by far the best and most convenient car I have owned. I can't think of anything an ICE car would be better other than the occasional Supercharging 20 min vs Gas 5 minute stops. But even then, doing 3 supercharging stops a year beats 100 stops a year at a gas station.

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I have a big gas guzzling pickup and I don't fill up 100 times a year. More like 40-50 tops. And I drive more than the average person.

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100 stops per year would be twice per week. No one does that.

Oh no, I spent an hour of my year filling up at the gas station!

Lololol

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No one gets gas twice a week? All of TexAgs commutes 500 miles each way uphill towing a horse trailer. That's why they can't ever have an EV. Didn't you know that?

Go look at the first few pages of this thread and tell me "no one does that".

In retaliation for the liberals I switched to a 10mpg lifted 97 LC as my daily driver. I fill up twice a week with it. Once a months my f-250.

$50/week in gas for my lawnmower to cut my property and probably 3-4g a week on my SxS. Feels great offsetting all these climate psychos efforts

That's just me.. my wife drives a jeep and commutes 50m a day

Quote:

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I fill up twice a week with it.

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No one does that

GAC06 said:

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Quote:

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I fill up twice a week with it.

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No one does that

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My Nissan Altima can go 500 miles before fill up. 25 miles from work 50 miles round trip. 2 fill ups in a 2 week period.

I love stopping at gas stations.

I leave my house at least once a day to drive down to the local gas station with my dogs to grab an energy drink, a pack of chicken nuggets for the dogs, top off my tank of needed, and shoot the **** with the the workers to see what's new.

Why would you not want to go to the gas station?

Psycho Bunny said:

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GAC06 said:

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Quote:

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I fill up twice a week with it.

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No one does that

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My Nissan Altima can go 500 miles before fill up. 25 miles from work 50 miles round trip. 2 fill ups in a 2 week period.

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You some kind of liberal?

I don't like stopping at gas stations because I don't like wasting my time

You must be miserable to have such a stacked schedule that you don't have time for a stop at the gas station

You got it, I'm your local liberal bunny.

Woods Ag said:

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In retaliation for the liberals I switched to a 10mpg lifted 97 LC as my daily driver. I fill up twice a week with it. Once a months my f-250.

$50/week in gas for my lawnmower to cut my property and probably 3-4g a week on my SxS. Feels great offsetting all these climate psychos efforts

That's just me.. my wife drives a jeep and commutes 50m a day

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There's a 100% chance this guy has white framed oakleys

Teslag said:

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Woods Ag said:

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In retaliation for the liberals I switched to a 10mpg lifted 97 LC as my daily driver. I fill up twice a week with it. Once a months my f-250.

$50/week in gas for my lawnmower to cut my property and probably 3-4g a week on my SxS. Feels great offsetting all these climate psychos efforts

That's just me.. my wife drives a jeep and commutes 50m a day

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There's a 100% chance this guy has a white framed oakleys

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What's wrong with oakleys.