Death traps.
Bombs on wheels.
Unquenchable firemobiles.

It's to the point I think I will have to have a conversation if the neighbor on either side gets one. Don't think it will happen in the next couple years anyway but you never know. I'll probably ask them to keep it outside just out of respect. They are good people, and I think they'd be receptive to hearing about the dangers.

Kansas Kid said:

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PlaneCrashGuy said:

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Oh look, another derail from an EV supporter pretending all vehicle fires are created equal.

Next.

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Actually, it was Torrid posting it hoping/assuming it was EVs since we know only those fires can burn a house down. Please tell me how this was a derail? Was it because it doesn't fit your narrative.

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What are you even asking, "how"? This is the EV thread. Thats an ICE fire. Should be self evident. Accidentally derailing is still off topic.

3 million potential families killed by those ICE Hyundais. Just insane. EV's are already safer on the road, but now safer at home.

nortex97 said:

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It's to the point I think I will have to have a conversation if the neighbor on either side gets one. Don't think it will happen in the next couple years anyway but you never know. I'll probably ask them to keep it outside just out of respect. They are good people, and I think they'd be receptive to hearing about the dangers.

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And they'll just continue to park their car where the charger is installed … inside the garage

PlaneCrashGuy said:

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Kansas Kid said:

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PlaneCrashGuy said:

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Oh look, another derail from an EV supporter pretending all vehicle fires are created equal.

Next.

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Actually, it was Torrid posting it hoping/assuming it was EVs since we know only those fires can burn a house down. Please tell me how this was a derail? Was it because it doesn't fit your narrative.

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What are you even asking, "how"? This is the EV thread. Thats an ICE fire. Should be self evident. Accidentally derailing is still off topic.

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....

Slow down and read. A person with a history of mocking EV technology on this forum posted a recall notice for vehicles in an attempt to portray EVs as a fire danger. They did not read the recall notice, because on their jump to conclusion mat vehicle fire recall = EV fire related recall. Then a poster that does have a history of defending EV technology responded pointing out that the recall is exclusively for ICE vehicles, and you piped in claiming that the person doing the correcting is the one doing the derailing.


Could you please stop derailing the thread by making unfounded claims against other posters?

I'll try again, in simpler terms.

A story about ICE fires is not "on topic" in a thread about EV's; no matter who posts it. So I'll repeat myself. Another derail, next.

So. Just let people post incorrect information without any correction? Do you not understand this is a forum for discussion? i.e. people post things and open it up for commentary.

Lacking in capacity to admit to an error is a horrible quality in a human. I can understand why you don't like corrections if that's your mode of operating.


The thread is also about the relative benefits and drawbacks between EVs and ICE vehicles, so an ICE vehicle fire recall is absolutely "on topic."

It's so much easier to call out what is off topic. I'm not sure why you're gatekeeping this so hard? It was yet another derail by yet another poster that mistook "the EV thread" for "the vehicle fire thread."

Which is an easy mistake to make, but a derail nonetheless.

PlaneCrashGuy said:

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I'll try again, in simpler terms.

A story about ICE fires is not "on topic" in a thread about EV's; no matter who posts it. So I'll repeat myself. Another derail, next.

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It actually is because it shows that the real fire danger is ICE vehicles rendering the fire risk talk about EV's moot and largely laughable.

Wow, this turned out better than I could have hoped.

PlaneCrashGuy said:

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It's so much easier to call out what is off topic. I'm not sure why you're gatekeeping this so hard? It was yet another derail by yet another poster that mistook "the EV thread" for "the vehicle fire thread."

Which is an easy mistake to make, but a derail nonetheless.

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Go look at his followup post when I called it out. He posted it here because he thought it was EVs. You can also see in his original post he thought it was 3.3mm EVs being recalled because they could catch houses on fire because I know this will come as a shock but any car catching fire in a garage can catch the whole house on fire. He admitted to his mistake.

Why don't you call out Nortex for posting about a fire in a utility size electricity storage unit or is that also an EV?!?!

torrid said:

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Wow, this turned out better than I could have hoped.

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You are now an EV lover.

Kansas Kid said:

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torrid said:

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Wow, this turned out better than I could have hoped.

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You are now an EV lover.

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If I had the bread I might consider an E-Ray.

Kansas Kid said:

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PlaneCrashGuy said:

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It's so much easier to call out what is off topic. I'm not sure why you're gatekeeping this so hard? It was yet another derail by yet another poster that mistook "the EV thread" for "the vehicle fire thread."

Which is an easy mistake to make, but a derail nonetheless.

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Go look at his followup post when I called it out. He posted it here because he thought it was EVs. You can also see in his original post he thought it was 3.3mm EVs being recalled because they could catch houses on fire because I know this will come as a shock but any car catching fire in a garage can catch the whole house on fire. He admitted to his mistake.

Why don't you call out Nortex for posting about a fire in a utility size electricity storage unit or is that also an EV?!?!

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Derailing on purpose is derailing.
Derailing on accident is still derailing.

Do you get it yet?

The only one derailing is you with nagging about it

"I was wrong."

Try it. It'll make you feel better. Everything about your post was wrong. You claimed an EV supporter derailed the thread, they are not an EV supporter.

You claimed that it was a derail at all, which it is not, because the entire premise of the thread is that EVs are an inferior vehicle technology that requires a counterpoint discussion to be a discussion at all. That's an all encompassing topic with respect to the benefits and drawbacks of each technology, which includes their propensity to catch on fire.


I noticed you had no qualms about a person discussing grid battery fires. Which is certainly more off topic than a vehicle recall due to fire risk (though in my opinion still on topic).

There are many posts about how great ICE vehicles are such as speed of refueling, less violent fires when they catch fire, ability to get them serviced, towing capability and you have don't think those are a derail. Someone accidentally posts something that shows ICE fires can burn down a house and you say derail. Talk about hypocrisy and inability to handle a fact that goes against your beliefs. Let's make sure we don't show both sides of an issue. Are you a professor of anthropology?

This thread.

Let me add my 2 cents .. you would have to be absolutely nuts and not give a F about your family if you park one of these cars in your garage at night …. No way I put a fire prone battery from and EV in the garage and burn the house down…. A friend has one and already had some battery heating up issue .. he won't park it in the garage anymore.. it's stays in the driveway way away from the house, he likes driving it but he doesn't trust it to burn his house down

Since this thread has already jumped the shark (great post btw) and I have allegedly already derailed this thread, let me give this PSA on leading causes of house fires so you can also protect your family from those as well as EVs. I assume some of you make sure your next door neighbors don't have these risks either.

1) cooking
2) heating equipment
3) electrical shorts
4) candles
5) smoking

https://www.statefarm.com/simple-insights/residence/protect-your-home-against-these-common-causes-of-house-fires

Fire incidences of EVs are 1/30th of ICE vehicles. The average ICE vehicle fire causes $10,000 in damage. When you say more prone, you mean less prone. The issue with lithium battery fires is not the frequency, but the intensity and difficulty of extinguishing the fires not the frequency with which they occur.

The tradeoffs are less frequent, more energetic, more difficult to extinguish.

Or

More frequent, less energetic, easier to extinguish.

Make no mistake, ICE fires still cause a lot of damage and they are fully capable of occurring while you're not driving the car. i.e. while it's parked in your garage.

Statistics suggest you should expect to have one car related fire in your life with a gas vehicle. Statistics suggest you shouldn't experience an EV fire in 30 lifetimes.



Whether those incidence differentiations persist into the future as EVs age is undetermined, but the technology around batteries is shifting to allow for less volatile, less likely to experience thermal runaway batteries. Any increase in incidence due to age is mitigated by that reality.

LFP and LMFP batteries will likely dominant the passenger vehicle market and sodium ion batteries (even less volatile, cheaper) will likely dominate grid storage systems.


This is a decent video that explains cost reductions, volatility and use case for each current battery chemistries in production.

hph6203 said:

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Fire incidences of EVs are 1/30th of ICE vehicles. The average ICE vehicle fire causes $10,000 in damage. When you say more prone, you mean less prone. The issue with lithium battery fires is not the frequency, but the intensity and difficulty of extinguishing the fires not the frequency with which they occur.

The tradeoffs are less frequent, more energetic, more difficult to extinguish.

Or

More frequent, less energetic, easier to extinguish.

Make no mistake, ICE fires still cause a lot of damage and they are fully capable of occurring while you're not driving the car. i.e. while it's parked in your garage.

Statistics suggest you should expect to have one car related fire in your life with a gas vehicle. Statistics suggest you shouldn't experience an EV fire in 30 lifetimes.



Whether those incidence differentiations persist into the future as EVs age is undetermined, but the technology around batteries is shifting to allow for less volatile, less likely to experience thermal runaway batteries. Any increase in incidence due to age is mitigated by that reality.

LFP and LMFP batteries will likely dominant the passenger vehicle market and sodium ion batteries (even less volatile, cheaper) will likely dominate grid storage systems.


This is a decent video that explains cost reductions, volatility and use case for each current battery chemistries in production.

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So let me get this straight, internal combustion engines have been around for literally 100 plus years and have been using parking garages in big cities for years and they (the property owners) have never had to ban them from parking in garages, I've literally parked in garages at least 10,000 times maybe more over the years. I'm fact garages were specifically built to park regular fueled cars and trucks..

Then along comes EV vehicles in the last 5-10 years and many parking garage owners are banning them from their garages because of the severe fires (lithium) they can cause.

Something you said doesn't add up…. EVs fired are problems and property owners are wising up on them and banning them to prevent severe fires in their concrete garages…. Let me know when the parking garages start banning ICE vehicles that have been around for 100 plus years..

Hog wash I say

Property owners don't necessarily act rationally. I'm unaware of any widespread movement to ban EVs from parking garages and I can't find any reference to it being a major trend.

That data is based upon information gathered by insurance company analysis and data from Sweden's transportation department.

hph6203 said:

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Property owners don't necessarily act rationally. I'm unaware of any widespread movement to ban EVs from parking garages and I can't find any reference to it being a major trend.

That data is based upon information gathered by insurance company analysis and data from Sweden's transportation department.

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My buddies building in Houston just tuned down putting EV chargers in the garage due to fire potential…you seem oddly un informed

We don't want to invest money in additional infrastructure and we shall blame it on an edge case scenario as justification!


I'll point out that not adding chargers is not the same as banning the vehicle. Now you're swapping stories.

I will further add that I don't own an EV. I rented one to troll my Elon hating brother for Christmas last year. The one time I charged it? In a parking garage next to 7 other Superchargers. Guess those chargers aren't banned everywhere.

hph6203 said:

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We don't want to invest money in additional infrastructure and we shall blame it on an edge case scenario as justification!


I'll point out that not adding chargers is not the same as banning the vehicle. Now you're swapping stories.

I will further add that I don't own an EV. I rented one to troll my Elon hating brother for Christmas last year. The one time I charged it? In a parking garage next to 7 other Superchargers. Guess those chargers aren't banned everywhere.

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Your way off base bro .. let me help you out with a dose of reality.. this is happening all over now, we just had an HOA meeting at our patio home subdivision in Houston last month and we had a liability attorney present to talk about the liabilities that could be associated if someone has an EV fire and burs the neighborhood down. The HOA is hesitant to tell people what they can and can't do but they don't want all the houses burning down .. there are no discussions on regular fueled cars ..

So here is a way to start to educate yourself about the REAL issues people are looking at regarding EVs.. and remember most of the HOAs now looking at this issue are not published online.. they are having a hard time separating liability vs trying to regulate these EVs. HOAs where houses are spread out or far enough apart don't care about this issue, it's where people live closer together and fires could cause liability to spread across larger groups of people .. it's a real concern

Go to Yahoo
Type EV banned HOAs Parking Garages

More articles than you can read pop up.. and remember Most HOAs are not publishing these discussions .. they are concerned about real liability asso w these lithium fires .. this is not just internet dribble

Good posts.

fullback44 said:

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hph6203 said:

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We don't want to invest money in additional infrastructure and we shall blame it on an edge case scenario as justification!


I'll point out that not adding chargers is not the same as banning the vehicle. Now you're swapping stories.

I will further add that I don't own an EV. I rented one to troll my Elon hating brother for Christmas last year. The one time I charged it? In a parking garage next to 7 other Superchargers. Guess those chargers aren't banned everywhere.

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Your way off base bro .. let me help you out with a dose of reality.. this is happening all over now, we just had an HOA meeting at our patio home subdivision in Houston last month and we had a liability attorney present to talk about the liabilities that could be associated if someone has an EV fire and burs the neighborhood down. The HOA is hesitant to tell people what they can and can't do but they don't want all the houses burning down .. there are no discussions on regular fueled cars ..

So here is a way to start to educate yourself about the REAL issues people are looking at regarding EVs.. and remember most of the HOAs now looking at this issue are not published online.. they are having a hard time separating liability vs trying to regulate these EVs. HOAs where houses are spread out or far enough apart don't care about this issue, it's where people live closer together and fires could cause liability to spread across larger groups of people .. it's a real concern

Go to Yahoo
Type EV banned HOAs Parking Garages

More articles than you can read pop up.. and remember Most HOAs are not publishing these discussions .. they are concerned about real liability asso w these lithium fires .. this is not just internet dribble

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Fun fact, all of this is made up. Or surely you could share woth the us the data and hard numbers these Illuminati HOA's are using to justify their fear?

As someone who just majorly stuck his foot in his mouth, let me say using HOAs to make your point is not a winning argument.

Quote:

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Fire incidences of EVs are 1/30th of ICE vehicles.

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Not for stationary, vehicle turned off, it's not. If you have supporting data, by all means, share it.

torrid said:

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As someone who just majorly stuck his foot in his mouth, let me say using HOAs to make your point is not a winning argument.

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Amen. Once you start using the HOA as a tool, or confronting neighbors on their car choices like a Karen then it's time to just let it go.

cecil77 said:

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Quote:

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Fire incidences of EVs are 1/30th of ICE vehicles.

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Not for stationary, vehicle turned off, it's not. If you have supporting data, by all means, share it.

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You keep making this claim yet provide no data of your own.

No EV bro .. don't be be lazy and look up the facts .. I don't need to show those that are too lazy to look it up when it's right in front of you …

btw .. your new round boosters are ready ! Safe free and effective

fullback44 said:

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No EV bro .. don't be be lazy and look up the facts .. I don't need to show those that are too lazy to look it up when it's right in front of you …

btw .. your new round boosters are ready ! Safe free and effective

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So you've got nothing. Just as we suspected.