aTmAg said:

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javajaws said:

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aTmAg said:

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TommyBrady said:

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Dumbest thing I've seen here so far is the Biden needs to just say its an all out war if he invades. Lol the dead would surpass Iraq and Afghanistan in the first day and would lead to two Nuclear Powers battling it out. It might be the dumbest idea I've ever heard.

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That's because you are not smart.

Putin would never invade. That's the point. Chamberlain tried your way. It didn't work out.

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Yes he would, because he knows Biden would be bluffing. There is no way Biden would get involved militarily since it would guarantee a democrat slaughter in the next 2 elections.

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That's the fundamental problem. Biden is an idiot that has no idea what he is doing. The point is to make the threat with 100% willingness to back it up if Putin defies it. That willingness would be obvious to everybody (just as Biden's weakness is obvious to eveybody), and Putin wouldn't go in.

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And for once, THAT decision to not get involved would be the only thing Biden has done right (not that he has handled the situation to date correctly - he has NOT).

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He has done nothing right. And it's gauranteed that if Putin invades, then whatever Biden does will be the wrong response.

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The US cannot afford to go to war. If we do, we lose billions of dollars in military hardware alone. And our current debt to GDP ratio makes military use nearly impossible to recover from. And then there would be the death count he would have to justify. You think ANY democrat voters care about the Ukraine? Yeah, no.

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The US cannot afford being known as weak. Ukraine would be the start. China would have 2 years to invade Taiwan, and who knows who else would invade what. Nobody would ally with the US again (for good reason).

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There is no way Biden can make a 100% (or even 10%) credible threat to invasion because Biden's track record does not make that possible. He and his party are a bunch of cowards and everyone including Putin know's it. If this was a war against trans rights in the Ukraine however, he would be all over it!

The US is already seen as weak under Biden. And the damage has already been done - maybe you are forgetting the Afghanistan withdrawal? NOBODY has any faith in Biden, not even his own party.

javajaws said:

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aTmAg said:

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javajaws said:

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aTmAg said:

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TommyBrady said:

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Dumbest thing I've seen here so far is the Biden needs to just say its an all out war if he invades. Lol the dead would surpass Iraq and Afghanistan in the first day and would lead to two Nuclear Powers battling it out. It might be the dumbest idea I've ever heard.

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That's because you are not smart.

Putin would never invade. That's the point. Chamberlain tried your way. It didn't work out.

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Yes he would, because he knows Biden would be bluffing. There is no way Biden would get involved militarily since it would guarantee a democrat slaughter in the next 2 elections.

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That's the fundamental problem. Biden is an idiot that has no idea what he is doing. The point is to make the threat with 100% willingness to back it up if Putin defies it. That willingness would be obvious to everybody (just as Biden's weakness is obvious to eveybody), and Putin wouldn't go in.

Quote:

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And for once, THAT decision to not get involved would be the only thing Biden has done right (not that he has handled the situation to date correctly - he has NOT).

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He has done nothing right. And it's gauranteed that if Putin invades, then whatever Biden does will be the wrong response.

Quote:

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The US cannot afford to go to war. If we do, we lose billions of dollars in military hardware alone. And our current debt to GDP ratio makes military use nearly impossible to recover from. And then there would be the death count he would have to justify. You think ANY democrat voters care about the Ukraine? Yeah, no.

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The US cannot afford being known as weak. Ukraine would be the start. China would have 2 years to invade Taiwan, and who knows who else would invade what. Nobody would ally with the US again (for good reason).

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There is no way Biden can make a 100% (or even 10%) credible threat to invasion because Biden's track record does not make that possible. He and his party are a bunch of cowards and everyone including Putin know's it. If this was a war against trans rights in the Ukraine however, he would be all over it!

The US is already seen as weak under Biden. And the damage has already been done - maybe you are forgetting the Afghanistan withdrawal? NOBODY has any faith in Biden, not even his own party.

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I agree. But the right thing for Biden to do would be to learn from his past idiocy and do a 180 and do his best to convince everybody that he is serious. Though I don't think US ground troops should be necessary, Biden stationing some near the border would probably convince Putin that he is serious. It's pathetic that such a thing would be necessary because we got a weak ass president. Whatever it takes for us to convince Putin to send his troops home.

I realize this is smoking crack. That is asking a democrat to stop being a weak ass moron. Might as well ask a tiger to change it's stripes.

Think any of this happens if we are in the second term of Trump?

TxAgLaw03RW said:

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He's not just weak, he's compromised if half the stuff about his family's Ukraine and Russian "business" dealings are true.

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Good lord, rest. This is been in the making over multiple admins. This doesn't happen in 14 months. We are lock step with NATO and the EU, which is the right call. Get over it, this goes beyond a politics.

TxAgLaw03RW said:

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He's not just weak, he's compromised if half the stuff about his family's Ukraine and Russian "business" dealings are true.

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Problem being that the Russians are so famous for their propaganda and lies, is exposure of that really that threatening now?

Phat32 said:

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Think any of this happens if we are in the second term of Trump?

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Yes. We've been planning against this for years, we know the playbook and always have. Just because it has t been a headline for the last 7 years doesn't mean it wasn't happening.

wildmen09 said:

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TxAgLaw03RW said:

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He's not just weak, he's compromised if half the stuff about his family's Ukraine and Russian "business" dealings are true.

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Good lord, rest. This is been in the making over multiple admins. This doesn't happen in 14 months. We are lock step with NATO and the EU, which is the right call. Get over it, this goes beyond a politics.

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Life's a lot easier when <insert President here> is the source of all good/evil in this world.

The Russians are going to massacre Ukrainians, I'm afraid. Another page out of a much older and very effective playbook.

Russia's 'Radio of Thousand Hills'. Dehumanising Ukrainians is a way to justify killing them, and Russian propaganda has been doing it for years https://t.co/RaXluNDPRi

— Olga Tokariuk (@olgatokariuk) February 21, 2022

wildmen09 said:

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TxAgLaw03RW said:

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He's not just weak, he's compromised if half the stuff about his family's Ukraine and Russian "business" dealings are true.

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Good lord, rest. This is been in the making over multiple admins. This doesn't happen in 14 months. We are lock step with NATO and the EU, which is the right call. Get over it, this goes beyond a politics.

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For all intents and purposes we ARE NATO. NATO is in "lock step" with us, not the other way around. And we are led by the most incompetent and weak president of our lifetimes. Politics matters. It ALWAYS does.

You forgot Carter and Obama. It might be a tie.

aTmAg said:

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wildmen09 said:

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TxAgLaw03RW said:

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He's not just weak, he's compromised if half the stuff about his family's Ukraine and Russian "business" dealings are true.

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Good lord, rest. This is been in the making over multiple admins. This doesn't happen in 14 months. We are lock step with NATO and the EU, which is the right call. Get over it, this goes beyond a politics.

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For all intents and purposes we ARE NATO. NATO is in "lock step" with us, not the other way around. And we are led by the most incompetent and weak president of our lifetimes. Politics matters. It ALWAYS does.

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Innenpolitik and Ossenpolitik are always balancing each other.

On occasion ossenpoltik trumps innenpolitik. This is one of them.

rangerdanger said:

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wildmen09 said:

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TxAgLaw03RW said:

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He's not just weak, he's compromised if half the stuff about his family's Ukraine and Russian "business" dealings are true.

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Good lord, rest. This is been in the making over multiple admins. This doesn't happen in 14 months. We are lock step with NATO and the EU, which is the right call. Get over it, this goes beyond a politics.

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Life's a lot easier when <insert President here> is the source of all good/evil in this world.

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Understanding the world of politics is certainly a lot easier once you realize that democrats are wrong on basically everything they endeavor to do.

Rossticus said:

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You forgot Carter and Obama. It might be a tie.

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Carter at least sent some arms to Afghanistan, even though they were old and crappy unlike Stingers that Reagan sent.

Obama at least made the call to kill OBL. Which Biden opposed.

So I think Biden is even worse than the previous top 2 foreign policy presidents the US has ever had.

aTmAg said:

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rangerdanger said:

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wildmen09 said:

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TxAgLaw03RW said:

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He's not just weak, he's compromised if half the stuff about his family's Ukraine and Russian "business" dealings are true.

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Good lord, rest. This is been in the making over multiple admins. This doesn't happen in 14 months. We are lock step with NATO and the EU, which is the right call. Get over it, this goes beyond a politics.

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Life's a lot easier when <insert President here> is the source of all good/evil in this world.

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Understanding the world of politics is certainly a lot easier once you realize that democrats are wrong on basically everything they endeavor to do.

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As long as you don't forget that despite being Republicans, Republicans are still politicians and not to be trusted without healthy skepticism and investigation. A snake is a snake, regardless of color.

Ukraine had the third largest nuclear arsenal in the world. It gave it up in exchange for a guarantee of its territorial integrity, a guarantee to which the U.S. and Russia were a party. I cannot imagine why it wants to join NATO now…

— Michael Weiss (@michaeldweiss) February 21, 2022

Rossticus said:

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aTmAg said:

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rangerdanger said:

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wildmen09 said:

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TxAgLaw03RW said:

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He's not just weak, he's compromised if half the stuff about his family's Ukraine and Russian "business" dealings are true.

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Good lord, rest. This is been in the making over multiple admins. This doesn't happen in 14 months. We are lock step with NATO and the EU, which is the right call. Get over it, this goes beyond a politics.

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Life's a lot easier when <insert President here> is the source of all good/evil in this world.

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Understanding the world of politics is certainly a lot easier once you realize that democrats are wrong on basically everything they endeavor to do.

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As long as you don't forget that despite being Republicans, Republicans are still politicians and not to be trusted without healthy skepticism and investigation. A snake is a snake, regardless of color.

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The two are still night and day. On FP, at least the GOP tends to have good instincts.

aTmAg said:

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Rossticus said:

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aTmAg said:

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rangerdanger said:

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wildmen09 said:

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TxAgLaw03RW said:

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He's not just weak, he's compromised if half the stuff about his family's Ukraine and Russian "business" dealings are true.

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Good lord, rest. This is been in the making over multiple admins. This doesn't happen in 14 months. We are lock step with NATO and the EU, which is the right call. Get over it, this goes beyond a politics.

---

Life's a lot easier when <insert President here> is the source of all good/evil in this world.

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Understanding the world of politics is certainly a lot easier once you realize that democrats are wrong on basically everything they endeavor to do.

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As long as you don't forget that despite being Republicans, Republicans are still politicians and not to be trusted without healthy skepticism and investigation. A snake is a snake, regardless of color.

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The two are still night and day. On FP, at least the GOP tends to have good instincts.

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Second Bush administration not included, I trust.

I agree that the Afghanistan debacle was the straw that broke the camel's back so to speak. But given the current situation, what should he be doing now? What do you think Trump or an R would do instead?

Heavy shelling of Schastya and Vrubivka (Luhansk region). Peoples are in shelters.Gas pipeline is damaged. The biggest thermal power plant in region (located in Schastya) was shelled and stopped working. No gas and electricity. No repair works are possible bcs of unstopped fire pic.twitter.com/XKaQn06R0Y

— Maria Zolkina (@Mariia_Zolkina) February 21, 2022

Satellite imagery shows numerous new field deployments of Russian armored vehicles and troops near the border with Ukraine, according to U.S.-based Earth observation company @Maxar.https://t.co/Dm68oKryxF

— The New Voice of Ukraine (@NewVoiceUkraine) February 21, 2022

Rossticus said:

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aTmAg said:

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Rossticus said:

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aTmAg said:

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rangerdanger said:

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wildmen09 said:

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TxAgLaw03RW said:

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He's not just weak, he's compromised if half the stuff about his family's Ukraine and Russian "business" dealings are true.

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Good lord, rest. This is been in the making over multiple admins. This doesn't happen in 14 months. We are lock step with NATO and the EU, which is the right call. Get over it, this goes beyond a politics.

---

Life's a lot easier when <insert President here> is the source of all good/evil in this world.

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Understanding the world of politics is certainly a lot easier once you realize that democrats are wrong on basically everything they endeavor to do.

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As long as you don't forget that despite being Republicans, Republicans are still politicians and not to be trusted without healthy skepticism and investigation. A snake is a snake, regardless of color.

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The two are still night and day. On FP, at least the GOP tends to have good instincts.

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Second Bush administration not included, I trust.

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I don't blame W for our intel being bad on WMDs. I do blame him for not getting OBL when he had the chance in Tora Bora (assuming he made that call.. not sure.. could have been a woke general).

Phat32 said:

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Think any of this happens if we are in the second term of Trump?

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No. This bull**** lay completely at the feet of the Biden administration.
edit spelling

Rossticus said:

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Heavy shelling of Schastya and Vrubivka (Luhansk region). Peoples are in shelters.Gas pipeline is damaged. The biggest thermal power plant in region (located in Schastya) was shelled and stopped working. No gas and electricity. No repair works are possible bcs of unstopped fire pic.twitter.com/XKaQn06R0Y

— Maria Zolkina (@Mariia_Zolkina) February 21, 2022

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So who is shelling whom?

Lukashenko’s fake “referendum” will take place in #Belarus on 27th February and organised when 30 000 of #Russian troops are in the country is the annexation of BY. #EU sanctions are too weak.
We need to act now. pic.twitter.com/W3Xs3HAZZg

— Rasa Juknevičienė (@RJukneviciene) February 21, 2022

aggiehawg said:

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Rossticus said:

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Heavy shelling of Schastya and Vrubivka (Luhansk region). Peoples are in shelters.Gas pipeline is damaged. The biggest thermal power plant in region (located in Schastya) was shelled and stopped working. No gas and electricity. No repair works are possible bcs of unstopped fire pic.twitter.com/XKaQn06R0Y

— Maria Zolkina (@Mariia_Zolkina) February 21, 2022

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So who is shelling whom?

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Russians shelling everything…. Ukrainians aren't doing anything at all. Just laying low.

"Putin needs to understand that there is a real chance of him becoming a convicted war criminal. Ukraine has done nothing to justify this war, and there is no credible explanation why it should take place at all"
By 🇺🇦 ex defense minister @Andriypzag https://t.co/k8LFu2Ef14

— Olga Tokariuk (@olgatokariuk) February 21, 2022

The Key to Blunting Russia’s Strategic Victory in Ukraine and Beyond? Irregular Warfare https://t.co/rjI8Nf4xCB

— Modern War Institute (@WarInstitute) February 21, 2022

The United Kingdom and the United States have agreed to impose sanctions on Russia, more far-reaching than those discussed earlier, if it invades Ukraine, U.K. Prime Minister @BorisJohnson has said.https://t.co/yhPHkJZEw3

— The New Voice of Ukraine (@NewVoiceUkraine) February 21, 2022

Rossticus said:

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aggiehawg said:

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Rossticus said:

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Heavy shelling of Schastya and Vrubivka (Luhansk region). Peoples are in shelters.Gas pipeline is damaged. The biggest thermal power plant in region (located in Schastya) was shelled and stopped working. No gas and electricity. No repair works are possible bcs of unstopped fire pic.twitter.com/XKaQn06R0Y

— Maria Zolkina (@Mariia_Zolkina) February 21, 2022

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So who is shelling whom?

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Russians shelling everything…. Ukrainians aren't doing anything at all. Just laying low.

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So not the separatists that live there normally? Actual Russian troops shelling from Belarus or still on Russian soil? Get confused about the geography in that region. Town names, for instance. Finding them on a map.

Thanks for your efforts to keep this thread abreast of developments, BTW.

rangerdanger said:

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I agree that the Afghanistan debacle was the straw that broke the camel's back so to speak. But given the current situation, what should he be doing now? What do you think Trump or an R would do instead?

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When leading from behind there are rarely any good choices...especially days before a potential invasion. A republican would have at least have been working hard at this problem long before last week.

Let's also not forget that Germany shares a lot of the blame in this situation as well.

rangerdanger said:

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I agree that the Afghanistan debacle was the straw that broke the camel's back so to speak. But given the current situation, what should he be doing now? What do you think Trump or an R would do instead?

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I think he should be doing everything he can to make it clear that he is not weak THIS time. If he has to deploy troops on the line to make sure Putin does not dare invade, then he should do it. Though a real president would have to do that.

And Trump or another R wouldn't be in this situation. There is a reason Russia went into Crimea during Obama, did nothing for Trump's 4 years, and is now massing on Ukraine.

PUTIN TO ADDRESS NATION SOON ON TELEVISION - STATE TV

— *Walter Bloomberg (@DeItaone) February 21, 2022

Putting American lives at risk to act like we are tough is idiotic. It isn't our fight if the EU wants to get slaughtered than go for it.

We sanction the hell out of them and make life miserable but thousands of dead Americans isn't the answer.

Europe loves to act like they don't need us so let them solve their own issues. If it's so important than let their soldiers die.