I remember hearing that he also had pulmonary edema.

Defense has to thread the needle here though. Even if something else was going on that caused Floyd to die, which is likely the case, he complained of shortness of breath before being put on the ground with the knee on the neck. If the officer put him in a compromising position like that knowing he was already complaining of not being able to breathe, that's a reason to convict on the second-degree manslaughter charge.

aggiehawg said:

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NPH- said:

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aggiehawg said:

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Oxygen deprivation also happens when someone has 3 times the lethal dose of fentanyl and meth in their system.

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I'm sure a knee to the neck and majority of someone's body weight doesn't help the situation either.

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His lungs were filled with fluid and were filling with fluid before the first cop arrived as he had foam around his mouth.

He was complaining he couldn't breathe when he was standing upright next to squad car. He was having trouble breathing well before he asked to lie down on the ground.

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This isn't true. They found fluid in the lungs afterward. They don't know if it was a result of drugs or possibly the CPR applied by the EMS. They didn't examine the lungs between those two periods so they cannot say which action caused fluid in the lungs.

aggiehawg said:

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NPH- said:

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aggiehawg said:

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Oxygen deprivation also happens when someone has 3 times the lethal dose of fentanyl and meth in their system.

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I'm sure a knee to the neck and majority of someone's body weight doesn't help the situation either.

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His lungs were filled with fluid and were filling with fluid before the first cop arrived as he had foam around his mouth.

He was complaining he couldn't breathe when he was standing upright next to squad car. He was having trouble breathing well before he asked to lie down on the ground.

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so with that being said... shouldn't the officer have picked up on that and acted accordingly?

if someone says they can't breathe before getting put on the ground, with majority of body weight on them, and knee to the neck... how would that improve the situation?

Cactus Jack said:

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I remember hearing that he also had pulmonary edema.

Defense has to thread the needle here though. Even if something else was going on that caused Floyd to die, which is likely the case, he complained of shortness of breath before being put on the ground with the knee on the neck. If the officer put him in a compromising position like that knowing he was already complaining of not being able to breathe, that's a reason to convict on the second-degree manslaughter charge.

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The EMS had been called even before he was placed on the ground. When they went to the maximum restraint technique, the EMS was called again increasing the emergency.

That's why I think he'll get second-degree manslaughter at least. There's enough evidence that he increased the risk of death, even if he didn't directly cause it.

I don't want anyone here to get the wrong impression: I am a law enforcement fan first and foremost. Some of my closest friends serve, I have family that has served. The are the front line and I will always side with them in the heat of any situation.

I'm just solely asking questions and prompting discussion based on this particular video & situation.

Good Poster said:

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Floyd is a criminal

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Then arrest and try him. Extrajudicial killings bad.

Isn't this bolstering opening the door to his prior behavior (home invasion)?

ETA- the prosecution talking about "who George Floyd was as a person"

Good Poster said:

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2PacShakur said:

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Good Poster said:

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Floyd is a criminal

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Then arrest and try him. Extrajudicial killings bad.

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There was an attempt to arrest and Floyd resisted. Again.

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Resist is very subjective, people also have a first amendment right to protest their arrest.

Nelson is up.

Honestly, I think the dude was a POS, especially if it's true he pointed a loaded gun at a pregnant woman's stomach. Can't believe people are buying in to the Saint Floyd b.s.

However, make the system punish him, not some guy on the street who might have known who he was with previous dealings.

Mr. AGSPRT04 said:

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Isn't this bolstering opening the door to his prior behavior (home invasion)?

ETA- the prosecution talking about "who George Floyd was as a person"

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Not yet. The possible prejudice still outweighs the probative value.

2PacShakur said:

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Good Poster said:

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2PacShakur said:

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Good Poster said:

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Floyd is a criminal

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Then arrest and try him. Extrajudicial killings bad.

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There was an attempt to arrest and Floyd resisted. Again.

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Resist is very subjective, people also have a first amendment right to protest their arrest.

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Haha what a load of hot ***** Floyd was a POS thug criminal. Let me guess in your eyes, he didn't do nuffin? When you don't comply with cops and have a system full of drugs, you will probably die.

Good Poster said:

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Floyd is a criminal

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True but not relevant to the trial at hand. It's embarrassing how people have tried to deify Floyd given his history, especially the evidence of violence even against a pregnant women, but none of that is at issue in this case.

This is about Chauvin, whether he used excessive force, and whether there was intent behind it.

Jbob04 said:

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2PacShakur said:

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Good Poster said:

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2PacShakur said:

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Good Poster said:

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Floyd is a criminal

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Then arrest and try him. Extrajudicial killings bad.

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There was an attempt to arrest and Floyd resisted. Again.

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Resist is very subjective, people also have a first amendment right to protest their arrest.

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Haha what a load of hot ***** Floyd was a POS thug criminal. Let me guess in your eyes, he didn't do nuffin? When you don't comply with cops and have a system full of drugs, you will probably die.

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No, he tried to pass a counterfeit bill and should have been arrested. Would he not have still been arrested in the resting position?

Ugh! 50,000 Bates Stamped pieces of evidence? Hate to be the document organizer.

DTP02 said:

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Good Poster said:

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Floyd is a criminal

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True but not relevant to the trial at hand. It's embarrassing how people have tried to deify Floyd given his history, especially the evidence of violence even against a pregnant women, but now of that is at issue in this case.

This is about Chauvin, whether he used excessive force, and whether there was intent behind it.

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Chauvin wouldn't have been there if Floyd wasn't committing a crime.

DTP02 said:

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Good Poster said:

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Floyd is a criminal

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True but not relevant to the trial at hand. It's embarrassing how people have tried to deify Floyd given his history, especially the evidence of violence even against a pregnant women, but now of that is at issue in this case.

This is about Chauvin, whether he used excessive force, and whether there was intent behind it.

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Yes, unless the state emphasizes the St. Floyd narrative to try to gain a conviction. At some point, the defense is allowed to introduce evidence to refute that narrative.

So now Mr. Floyd's body language, from the perspective of a clerk at Cup Foods, matters to the defense but his body language didn't matter while under the knee?

Prosecutor mentions that not having physical signs on body/neck area is not necessary for death by oxygen deprivation and that medical experts will later testify to that.

I got roasted here by BMX and others who claimed that theory has been disproven. They said my example of pro athletes being choked unconcious with deadly force all the time, with no bodily damage, is irrelevant. BMX even had to resort to marginalizing me as a MMA fan boy because all he could counter with was "petichiae" (tiny spots).

I'm sure we will get to see the defense explain we would certainly see spots or other damage on Floyd's dark black skin if he died of a knee to neck..

Jbob04 said:

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DTP02 said:

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Good Poster said:

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Floyd is a criminal

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True but not relevant to the trial at hand. It's embarrassing how people have tried to deify Floyd given his history, especially the evidence of violence even against a pregnant women, but now of that is at issue in this case.

This is about Chauvin, whether he used excessive force, and whether there was intent behind it.

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Chauvin wouldn't have been there if Floyd wasn't committing a crime.

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Nobody is trying to convict Chauvin of being there. Pointless response.

thirdcoast said:

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Prosecutor mentions that not having physical signs on body/neck area is not necessary for death by oxygen deprivation and that medical experts will later testify to that.

I got roasted here by BMX and others who claimed that theory has been disproven. They said my example of pro athletes being choked unconcious with deadly force all the time, with no bodily damage, is irrelevant. BMX even had to resort to marginalizing me as a MMA fan boy because all he could counter with was "petichiae" (tiny spots).

I'm sure we will get to see the defense explain we would certainly see spots or other damage on Floyd's dark black skin if he died of a knee to neck..

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I know that I, personally, am shocked that the prosecution has experts who will support a critical point in the prosecution's case.

2PacShakur said:

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Good Poster said:

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2PacShakur said:

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Good Poster said:

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Floyd is a criminal

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Then arrest and try him. Extrajudicial killings bad.

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There was an attempt to arrest and Floyd resisted. Again.

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Resist is very subjective, people also have a first amendment right to protest their arrest.

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Protest? Yes. Resist? No.

Mr. AGSPRT04 said:

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DTP02 said:

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Good Poster said:

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Floyd is a criminal

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True but not relevant to the trial at hand. It's embarrassing how people have tried to deify Floyd given his history, especially the evidence of violence even against a pregnant women, but now of that is at issue in this case.

This is about Chauvin, whether he used excessive force, and whether there was intent behind it.

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Yes, unless the state emphasizes the St. Floyd narrative to try to gain a conviction. At some point, the defense is allowed to introduce evidence to refute that narrative.

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Sure, but would be incredibly sloppy of prosecution to go that route.

No jury wants to see anyone killed for passing a counterfeit bill. If he was being arrested for rape or murder then they might have to try to bolster Floyd's character. But for a relativity minor crime, they don't need to touch it.

They'll focus on demeanor at the time of the incident, not character.

DTP02 said:

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thirdcoast said:

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Prosecutor mentions that not having physical signs on body/neck area is not necessary for death by oxygen deprivation and that medical experts will later testify to that.

I got roasted here by BMX and others who claimed that theory has been disproven. They said my example of pro athletes being choked unconcious with deadly force all the time, with no bodily damage, is irrelevant. BMX even had to resort to marginalizing me as a MMA fan boy because all he could counter with was "petichiae" (tiny spots).

I'm sure we will get to see the defense explain we would certainly see spots or other damage on Floyd's dark black skin if he died of a knee to neck..

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I know that I, personally, am shocked that the prosecution has experts who will support a critical point in the prosecution's case.

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Not my point. You should be shocked that prosecution would argue a supposedly weak point that has been thoroughly disproven per others here and attorneys like BMX.

Told you Floyd was speedballing that day and showed signs of intoxication that was observed by the store clerks well before the police got there.