Pinche Abogado said:

---

As far as I can tell, SJL's sole qualifications for office are skin color and the ability to pander.

---

"Muss I die?"

No one can have their own opinion any longer. The other sides "mob" will get you if you disagree with them. And he is a liberal, and liberals are after him.

Every future President, Republican and Democrat will have free reign to solicit foreign interference in US elections under the guise of foreign policy.

Stressboy said:

---

BusterAg said:

---

I agree that this might be the best place to clean house, but I think that it is best to get in and out and back to business if at all possible. The Republican's win in 2020 if they don't use this to pander to their base, but use it to win the independents. A long trial is not going to do that. Make the case that Trump's actions are legal and ethical if there was credible suspicion of corruption, demonstrate that there was, claim quick victory, and ask the Democrats to put this behind them and get back to work.

They won't. They will continue to ***** and moan about how things were unfair. That will kill them, and make the GOP look more responsible.

---

You may be right but I think exposing how the Russian and Ukrainian hoaxes were political hit jobs by the dem party to overthrow the election would be of great benefit. If the Dems have hidden enough evidence to make that impractical in the impeachment Trial then you go your route.

---

Regardless of how long the trial takes, the media will make it out to be a Carthyist witch hunt to try and shift blame from Trump to others. The longer the trial goes on, the more the drum beat will be that investigations into other's corruptions are a distraction from Trump's guilt.

We will see what happens. I think the best play is to make one really, really good point, make it sharp, make it hurt, and get out.

Not if that is made more specifically unlawful and courts uphold the law.

What it tells me is fewer people wanting to run for President should get themselves involved in questionable overseas business dealings.

Jimmy Valentine said:

---

Every future President, Republican and Democrat will have free reign to solicit foreign interference in US elections under the guise of foreign policy.

---

Nice.

Question: If Biden really is guilty of corruption related to Burisma, would you characterize what Trump did as soliciting foreign interference into US elections, or would you characterize it as investigating corruption?

Question 2: If Trump had asked Zelensky to build a Trump Tower hotel in Kyiv in exchange for US foreign aid, would it be unethical for a leader of the Democratic party to ask Zelensky to cooperate with the US government in gathering evidence of that crime, even during election season?

Jimmy Valentine said:

---

Every future President, Republican and Democrat will have free reign to solicit foreign interference in US elections under the guise of foreign policy.

---

LOL

Jimmy Valentine said:

---

Every future President, Republican and Democrat will have free reign to solicit foreign interference in US elections under the guise of foreign policy.

---

Your pearl clutching is boring. If a foreign government had knowledge of Trump corruption. You would cheer like a fanatic if they released that information to the public. And honestly, I would want to know too.

I also hope you start working for the censorship of things like the BBC, Al Jezzera, RT. Can't have pesky foreigners commenting on US politics.

will25u said:

---

No one can have their own opinion any longer. The other sides "mob" will get you if you disagree with them. And he is a liberal, and liberals are after him.

---

Turley getting the Dershowitz treatment, now. There is absolutely no daylight between what the radical Dems demand "their people" do and say. Our legal system is adversarial by specific design. That is for the protection of the minority's rights. A difference of opinion is fundamental to the adversarial system.

A point that I have repeatedly failed to persuade certain people that lawyers disagree all of the time and that is a good thing. It isn't necessarily who is "right" or who is "wrong" as it is who made the winning argument to convince a judge, a jury or an appellate court to side with their view.

BusterAg said:

---

Jimmy Valentine said:

---

Every future President, Republican and Democrat will have free reign to solicit foreign interference in US elections under the guise of foreign policy.

---

Nice.

Question: If Biden really is guilty of corruption related to Burisma, would you characterize what Trump did as soliciting foreign interference into US elections, or would you characterize it as investigating corruption?

Question 2: If Trump had asked Zelensky to build a Trump Tower hotel in Kyiv in exchange for US foreign aid, would it be unethical for a leader of the Democratic party to ask Zelensky to cooperate with the US government in gathering evidence of that crime, even during election season?

---

1. If Biden was really guilty of corruption, the DOJ and FBI would have been the ones investigating Biden's actions, and if they were investigation Biden and President Trump asked Zelensky for help, I would characterize it as investigating corruption.

2. Once again, I would expect the FBI & DOJ, and likely a special counsel, would handle the investigation, not the Democrat party.

hbtheduce said:

---

Jimmy Valentine said:

---

Every future President, Republican and Democrat will have free reign to solicit foreign interference in US elections under the guise of foreign policy.

---

Your pearl clutching is boring. If a foreign government had knowledge of Trump corruption. You would cheer like a fanatic if they released that information to the public. And honestly, I would want to know too.

I also hope you start working for the censorship of things like the BBC, Al Jezzera, RT. Can't have pesky foreigners commenting on US politics.

---

If a foreign government had knowledge of Trump corruption, I would expect the FBI and DOJ to handle the investigation.

will25u said:

---

No one can have their own opinion any longer. The other sides "mob" will get you if you disagree with them. And he is a liberal, and liberals are after him.

---

This is beyond insane. He didn't vote for Trump, and is not a supporter, and is a Democrat. Though maybe he will realize that mere liberals need to get the hell away from the Left-sjw-Democrats and just stay home regarding voting till the Left can be imploded. Then fix the party.

Jimmy Valentine said:

---

Every future President, Republican and Democrat will have free reign to solicit foreign interference in US elections under the guise of foreign policy.

---

Are you not frightened of the possibility that every future president could have free reign to unleash our intelligence agencies to spy on opposition candidates under the guise of national security?

stetson said:

---

Jimmy Valentine said:

---

Every future President, Republican and Democrat will have free reign to solicit foreign interference in US elections under the guise of foreign policy.

---

Are you not frightened of the possibility that every future president could have free reign to unleash our intelligence agencies to spy on opposition candidates under the guise of national security?

---

• Obama admin did it to Trump under false pretenses
• Trump is doing it based of actual evidence and public admission of guilt by Biden
• We have a treaty with Ukraine to root out corruption signed by Bill Clinton.

Jimmy Valentine said:

---

hbtheduce said:

---

Jimmy Valentine said:

---

Every future President, Republican and Democrat will have free reign to solicit foreign interference in US elections under the guise of foreign policy.

---

Your pearl clutching is boring. If a foreign government had knowledge of Trump corruption. You would cheer like a fanatic if they released that information to the public. And honestly, I would want to know too.

I also hope you start working for the censorship of things like the BBC, Al Jezzera, RT. Can't have pesky foreigners commenting on US politics.

---

If a foreign government had knowledge of Trump corruption, I would expect the FBI and DOJ to handle the investigation.

---

Wouldn't the DOJ and FBI need assistance for the foreign country when the crime happened on their turf? Wouldn't an investigation by Ukraine strengthen the domestic investigation?

Jimmy Valentine said:

---

BusterAg said:

---

Jimmy Valentine said:

---

Every future President, Republican and Democrat will have free reign to solicit foreign interference in US elections under the guise of foreign policy.

---

Nice.

Question: If Biden really is guilty of corruption related to Burisma, would you characterize what Trump did as soliciting foreign interference into US elections, or would you characterize it as investigating corruption?

Question 2: If Trump had asked Zelensky to build a Trump Tower hotel in Kyiv in exchange for US foreign aid, would it be unethical for a leader of the Democratic party to ask Zelensky to cooperate with the US government in gathering evidence of that crime, even during election season?

---

1. If Biden was really guilty of corruption, the DOJ and FBI would have been the ones investigating Biden's actions, and if they were investigation Biden and President Trump asked Zelensky for help, I would characterize it as investigating corruption.

2. Once again, I would expect the FBI & DOJ, and likely a special counsel, would handle the investigation, not the Democrat party.

---

Why isn't the FBI handling the Trump inquiry, then?

Why is OK for Schiff to make a big deal out of alleged Trump corruption, but Democrat corruption has to be handled by the FBI?

Biden was VP of the US when the worst of this was going down. I don't understand the double standard.

I would expect the political opposition to be the ones to point fingers and spur investigations on the corruption of government officials. I would not trust the bureaucracy to be the ones raising hell, especially against powerful elected officials.

Jimmy Valentine said:

---

BusterAg said:

---

Jimmy Valentine said:

---

Every future President, Republican and Democrat will have free reign to solicit foreign interference in US elections under the guise of foreign policy.

---

Nice.

Question: If Biden really is guilty of corruption related to Burisma, would you characterize what Trump did as soliciting foreign interference into US elections, or would you characterize it as investigating corruption?

Question 2: If Trump had asked Zelensky to build a Trump Tower hotel in Kyiv in exchange for US foreign aid, would it be unethical for a leader of the Democratic party to ask Zelensky to cooperate with the US government in gathering evidence of that crime, even during election season?

---

1. If Biden was really guilty of corruption, the DOJ and FBI would have been the ones investigating Biden's actions, and if they were investigation Biden and President Trump asked Zelensky for help, I would characterize it as investigating corruption.

2. Once again, I would expect the FBI & DOJ, and likely a special counsel, would handle the investigation, not the Democrat party.

---

Oh good grief let me talk slow so you can understand. The DOJ was/is investigating 2016 election interference (dossier). Sounds like Bursima/Biden might have gotten roped into some investigation too.

It is wholly appropriate and proper for one head of state to tell another head of state that there is an investigation going on an he would like the other country to assist if possible.

That's what happened here. Your conspiracy theory lost.

You think the Biden investigation happened because Trump told Ukraine to dig up some dirt?

...and Trump wouldn't be interfering with an investigation by talking to the Ukraine president. That's how it should work.

Trump told Zelensky to speak with Barr. It seems that everyone forgets that part of the conversation.

Y'all are all proving my original point correct.

Just checking in have they got him yet? Lol

Jimmy Valentine said:

---

Y'all are all proving my original point correct.

---

When you have to state that your own point is correct in absence of any evidence or agreement from rational people, it's generally an indication of it not only being an opinion, but likely an unfounded one at that.

BuddysBud said:

---

Trump told Zelensky to speak with Barr. It seems that everyone forgets that part of the conversation.

---

And to Rudy.

1872walker said:

---

Jimmy Valentine said:

---

Y'all are all proving my original point correct.

---

When you have to state that your own point is correct in absence of any evidence or agreement from rational people, it's generally an indication of it not only being an opinion, but likely an unfounded one at that.

---

So a future Democrat President could not solicit foreign interference in a US election under the guise of foreign policy or stamping out corruption?

It seems everyone just defended President Trump's actions as legitimate, so wouldn't those same actions be legitimate for a Democrat President?

There is zero evidence the intent was to influence the 2020 election. It's not like Biden has made it through a primary. Trump ran I'm draining the swamp and his actions during the past three years have proven that.

The 2020 election is a straw man argument used by Democrats to find a crime in order to attempt to achieve their goal of removing a man from office that they don't like.

1872walker said:

---

There is zero evidence the intent was to influence the 2020 election. It's not like Biden has made it through a primary. Trump ran I'm draining the swamp and his actions during the past three years have proven that.

The 2020 election is a straw man argument used by Democrats to find a crime in order to attempt to achieve their goal of removing a man from office that they don't like.

---

Is that a yes or a no?

Why can't anyone give a straight answer? Can a future President ask a foreign country to investigate a political opponent because they believe the opponent is corrupt? Yes or No?

Sure, since it's already been happening throughout our history as a nation. Stop being weak minded and complaining all the time.

Jimmy Valentine said:

---

1872walker said:

---

There is zero evidence the intent was to influence the 2020 election. It's not like Biden has made it through a primary. Trump ran I'm draining the swamp and his actions during the past three years have proven that.

The 2020 election is a straw man argument used by Democrats to find a crime in order to attempt to achieve their goal of removing a man from office that they don't like.

---

Is that a yes or a no?

Why can't anyone give a straight answer? Can a future President ask a foreign country to investigate a political opponent because they believe the opponent is corrupt? Yes or No?

---

I don't care what he does as long as he stops liberalism/socialism.


That's the real threat to our country.

aggie2812-2 said:

---

Sure, since it's already been happening throughout our history as a nation. Stop being weak minded and complaining all the time.

---

Does the alleged corruption have to be proven to make it ok? Or does the President have the authority to do it without any proof?

Jimmy Valentine said:

---

1872walker said:

---

There is zero evidence the intent was to influence the 2020 election. It's not like Biden has made it through a primary. Trump ran I'm draining the swamp and his actions during the past three years have proven that.

The 2020 election is a straw man argument used by Democrats to find a crime in order to attempt to achieve their goal of removing a man from office that they don't like.

---

Is that a yes or a no?

Why can't anyone give a straight answer? Can a future President ask a foreign country to investigate a political opponent because they believe the opponent is corrupt? Yes or No?

---

Yes. A President can absolutely utilize foreign governments in aid of an investigation of a US citizen for crimes against the United States. That person being a politician does not shield them from justice. That is what happened here.

No, a President cannot abuse their power to force a foreign government to fabricate charges against a political opponent. That is not what happened here.

Here's a question for you. If the desire to investigate a crime is off limits, what should be done with the underlying crime?

1872walker said:

---

Jimmy Valentine said:

---

1872walker said:

---

There is zero evidence the intent was to influence the 2020 election. It's not like Biden has made it through a primary. Trump ran I'm draining the swamp and his actions during the past three years have proven that.

The 2020 election is a straw man argument used by Democrats to find a crime in order to attempt to achieve their goal of removing a man from office that they don't like.

---

Is that a yes or a no?

Why can't anyone give a straight answer? Can a future President ask a foreign country to investigate a political opponent because they believe the opponent is corrupt? Yes or No?

---

Yes. A President can absolutely utilize foreign governments in aid of an investigation of a US citizen for crimes against the United States. That person being a politician does not shield them from justice. That is what happened here.

No, a President cannot abuse their power to force a foreign government to fabricate charges against a political opponent. That is not what happened here.

Here's a question for you. If the desire to investigate a crime is off limits, what should be done with the underlying crime?

---

I don't think investigating a crime is off limits. I'm more focused on the unique situation of the President involving himself in a foreign investigation of an alleged crime or a political opponent.

Is the President not obligated to ensure that aid is not squandered or misused by foreign companies by way of corruption?

Does a party in a criminal enterprise deserve immunity because they have registered to run in an election?