Mueller dismisses top FBI agent in Russia probe for anti-Trump texts

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aggiehawg
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In reply to MooreTrucker • 10:11a, 9/12/18
AG
MooreTrucker said:
FriscoKid said:
It's pretty amazing what's going on with this FISA application release. Trump can't use anyone outside of the WH for help. The AG, DOJ, and FBI would normally help with redactions but they are implicated is all of this so WH lawyers are helping.

Trump is on an island by himself in this swamp of corruption.
That's why the involvement of the military has been suggested, right?
I'd slow my roll on the military tribunal stuff, if I were you. Although not absolutely impossible it is highly unlikely as too many things would have to happen to alter established jurisdiction and make it pass Constitutional muster.

I'm highly skeptical of that ever coming to fruition.
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ThunderCougarFalconBird
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In reply to aggiehawg • 10:14a, 9/12/18
AG
aggiehawg said:
MouthBQ98 said:
Part of me wonders if some establishment republicans do not want these means and methods of subtly interfering with an administration in the future in hopes they will one day be able to exploit the same means? Many sure seem mostly apathetic about it considering the implications. Business as usual is fine as long as all the politicians and top bureaucrats are able to cash in, right?
Why the Strzok/Page texts were so jarring to me.
I think you've captured at least the essence of a big part of the problem. People are numb to the same ongoing reality because of partisanship.

Which is why there is a part of me that is perfectly fine with declassifying it all. You can feel numb all you want but once you pull off the bandage, the festering wound will be staring you in the face. If that means that many of the three-letter agencies are adrift without leadership, then so be it.
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aggiehawg
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In reply to ThunderCougarFalconBird • 10:19a, 9/12/18
AG
Quote:
Which is why there is a part of me that is perfectly fine with declassifying it all. You can feel numb all you want but once you pull off the bandage, the festering wound will be staring you in the face. If that means that many of the three-letter agencies are adrift without leadership, then so be it.
Can't disagree that it will likely be necessary. Talk about inmates running the asylum though.

Were I Trump I'd be looking at beefing up the budgets of the Inspector Generals in the meantime, along with more oversight by Congress.
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MooreTrucker
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In reply to aggiehawg • 10:24a, 9/12/18
AG
aggiehawg said:
MooreTrucker said:
FriscoKid said:
It's pretty amazing what's going on with this FISA application release. Trump can't use anyone outside of the WH for help. The AG, DOJ, and FBI would normally help with redactions but they are implicated is all of this so WH lawyers are helping.

Trump is on an island by himself in this swamp of corruption.
That's why the involvement of the military has been suggested, right?
I'd slow my roll on the military tribunal stuff, if I were you. Although not absolutely impossible it is highly unlikely as too many things would have to happen to alter established jurisdiction and make it pass Constitutional muster.

I'm highly skeptical of that ever coming to fruition.
Maybe not full-on tribunals, but at least some of the interim grand jury stuff, or something to get around the DOJ?
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coyote68
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In reply to aggiehawg • 10:30a, 9/12/18
I agree.

The issue is very simple. Leaders in our DOJ and FBI made the choice to disobey the law and Constitution and dishonor the organizations they served.

The solution is simple. They must be removed and punished. That is the only way our Constitutional Republic will survive. To fail to remove and punish the perpetrators is the highest form of obstruction of justice.

There is no method or source that is greater than the rule of law under our Constitution and laws. Any person that uses that as an excuse to prevent the transparency of possible criminal wrong doing by people inside our government is obstructing justice. Plain and simple.

This will be great conflict. There will be firings and resignations. The Republic will survive and be stronger.
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aggiehawg
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In reply to MooreTrucker • 10:35a, 9/12/18
AG
MooreTrucker said:
aggiehawg said:
MooreTrucker said:
FriscoKid said:
It's pretty amazing what's going on with this FISA application release. Trump can't use anyone outside of the WH for help. The AG, DOJ, and FBI would normally help with redactions but they are implicated is all of this so WH lawyers are helping.

Trump is on an island by himself in this swamp of corruption.
That's why the involvement of the military has been suggested, right?
I'd slow my roll on the military tribunal stuff, if I were you. Although not absolutely impossible it is highly unlikely as too many things would have to happen to alter established jurisdiction and make it pass Constitutional muster.

I'm highly skeptical of that ever coming to fruition.
Maybe not full-on tribunals, but at least some of the interim grand jury stuff, or something to get around the DOJ?
Anything that is a function of Article III courts, including grand juries, would require legislation to change the Federal Judiciary Act (as amended), IMO.
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MouthBQ98
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In reply to aggiehawg • 10:49a, 9/12/18
AG
There are plenty of capable younger leaders out there with less "experience" being corrupted and co-opted by the bureaucratic machine. It may take work to identify them. Frankly, all too often the types of persons that rise to the top in government aren't really the types you wish to do that due to the personality traits that seem successful in that environment.
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AgInTheColony
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10:50a, 9/12/18
AG
People don't want to believe that the XYZ agencies are corrupt, much less an entire administration. It would destroy their worldview. There was blatant evidence that at least the DOJ, IRS, FBI and Hillary were corrupt under Obama, but all he had to do was tell the MSM to hide the truth and the public was happy to be oblivious.
The only way to do it is to rip the band-aid off and uncover the whole s*** show. Leave no doubt as to level of corruption and cover up that has taken place. Some people still will not believe it. So be it. Facts are facts.
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aggiehawg
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In reply to MouthBQ98 • 10:54a, 9/12/18
AG
MouthBQ98 said:
There are plenty of capable younger leaders out there with less "experience" being corrupted and co-opted by the bureaucratic machine. It may take work to identify them. Frankly, all too often the types of persons that rise to the top in government aren't really the types you wish to do that due to the personality traits that seem successful in that environment.
Peter Principle.
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richardag
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In reply to drcrinum • 11:03a, 9/12/18
drcrinum said:


Wow! Recommended watching. 3 minutes.
If true, and it probably is to some extent, does the statute of limitations come into play?

The statute of limitations could reduce the number of investigations to maybe just the last 5 years?

If these abuses are and have occurred they must come to light for the public to see and the system/laws need to change.
Among the latter, under pretence of governing they have divided their nations into two classes, wolves and sheep.”
Thomas Jefferson, Letter to Edward Carrington, January 16, 1787
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RoscoePColtrane
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In reply to richardag • 11:05a, 9/12/18
richardag said:
drcrinum said:


Wow! Recommended watching. 3 minutes.
If true, and it probably is to some extent, does the statute of limitations come into play?

The statute of limitations could reduce the number of investigations to maybe just the last 5 years?

If these abuses are and have occurred they must come to light for the public to see and the system/laws need to change.
Statute of Limitation means nothing anymore. Mueller waved it to go after Manafort for things a dozen years ago.
Never take a hostage you aren't willing to shoot,
Remember, America doesn’t negotiate with terrorists.
Code 7 10-42
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RoscoePColtrane
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11:08a, 9/12/18
Never take a hostage you aren't willing to shoot,
Remember, America doesn’t negotiate with terrorists.
Code 7 10-42
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RoscoePColtrane
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11:17a, 9/12/18
Never take a hostage you aren't willing to shoot,
Remember, America doesn’t negotiate with terrorists.
Code 7 10-42
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richardag
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In reply to RoscoePColtrane • 11:29a, 9/12/18
RoscoePColtrane said:
richardag said:
drcrinum said:
9.......
If true, and it probably is to some extent, does the statute of limitations come into play?

The statute of limitations could reduce the number of investigations to maybe just the last 5 years?

If these abuses are and have occurred they must come to light for the public to see and the system/laws need to change.
Statute of Limitation means nothing anymore. Mueller waved it to go after Manafort for things a dozen years ago.
I doubt Mueller and his hatchet squad of goons would be involved in investigating the last 10 - 20 years of FISA abuses. Maybe the investigators assigned would follow the rule of law? There has to be many ethical employees in the alphabet agencies.

ETA: I only bring this up because it seems that some believe prosecution for the last 10-20 years of abuses could cripple agencies. If only the last few years are investigated and convictions obtained, that could open the door for Congress to change the FISA laws/regulations to better protect our rights. Bonus points for nailing Obama era corruption.
Among the latter, under pretence of governing they have divided their nations into two classes, wolves and sheep.”
Thomas Jefferson, Letter to Edward Carrington, January 16, 1787
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RoscoePColtrane
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12:46p, 9/12/18
Logan Act anyone?


Never take a hostage you aren't willing to shoot,
Remember, America doesn’t negotiate with terrorists.
Code 7 10-42
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Stressboy
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In reply to richardag • 12:54p, 9/12/18
AG
richardag said:
RoscoePColtrane said:
richardag said:
drcrinum said:
9.......
If true, and it probably is to some extent, does the statute of limitations come into play?

The statute of limitations could reduce the number of investigations to maybe just the last 5 years?

If these abuses are and have occurred they must come to light for the public to see and the system/laws need to change.
Statute of Limitation means nothing anymore. Mueller waved it to go after Manafort for things a dozen years ago.
I doubt Mueller and his hatchet squad of goons would be involved in investigating the last 10 - 20 years of FISA abuses. Maybe the investigators assigned would follow the rule of law? There has to be many ethical employees in the alphabet agencies.

ETA: I only bring this up because it seems that some believe prosecution for the last 10-20 years of abuses could cripple agencies. If only the last few years are investigated and convictions obtained, that could open the door for Congress to change the FISA laws/regulations to better protect our rights. Bonus points for nailing Obama era corruption.


If these tainted warrants were used to convict the worst of the worst I want those convictions overturned because you know a lot of innocent people would be taken down too. Destroy any agency that operates this way.

Truthfully, If the abuse was great enough Congress should use this to destroy a lot of executive power and regain balance.
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captkirk
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In reply to drcrinum • 1:51p, 9/12/18
AG
drcrinum said:
freidbergr said:
Have Wray or Rosy made any statement regarding declassification? I can't remember hearing much from either of them anytime recently.


Lawyers from the White House Counsel's Office are the ones performing the declassification process, not members of the DOJ/FBI. That pretty much tells you that Rosenstein & Wray oppose the declassification. The latter are the ones who have stonewalled Congress over releasing many documents in the past.
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Whens lunch
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2:06p, 9/12/18
AG
From the article:

"Kerry's comments are in line with previous reporting on his behind-the-scenes attempts to save the nuclear deal and ensure that Iran continues receiving billions in cash windfalls. These payments were brought to a halt by the Trump administration when it abandoned the nuclear agreement and reimposed harsh sanctions on Iran that have nearly toppled its economy and sparked a popular revolution."

Apparently, Kerry wasn't smart enough to get paid up front.
Not when I'm done with it.
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oysterbayAG
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2:58p, 9/12/18
AG
The absolute joke of all this is that Mueller is trying to get Trump for Obstruction of Justice in the Flynn and then Comey situations, whereas, the Deep State Crooks in the DOJ & FBI etc. have committed Obstruction of Justice probably thousands of times in the last 3 years !!
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drcrinum
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6:26p, 9/12/18


http://directorblue.blogspot.com/2017/12/a-timeline-of-treason-how-fbi.html

Quote:
A TIMELINE OF TREASON: How the DNC and FBI Leadership Tried to Fix a Presidential Election

Good reference document including links.

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drcrinum
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7:22p, 9/12/18
For anyone interesting, Steve Bannon's "Trump @War" is going to be shown on OAN at 7:30pm this evening. Prior to this showing, there is a panel discussion ongoing that began at 7pm with Bannon -- Erik Prince is one of the participants.
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whatthehey78
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7:33p, 9/12/18
AG
...and so, most posters on here think that eventually most/some/a few are really going to be convicted and serve jail time? In our life times?

Your faith > mine.
Alexander, Caesar, Charlemagne, and myself founded empires; but upon what foundation did we rest the creations of our genius? Upon force! But Jesus Christ founded His upon love; and at this hour millions of men would die for Him. - Napoleon Bonaparte
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tsuag10
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In reply to drcrinum • 7:37p, 9/12/18
AG
Great resource.

Here's the Google Docs link to it. I found it easier to view.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1cialWWJ907vV3b9HPS2lhEspZh0WoPHqixUuKed_hFI/
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Rapier108
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7:39p, 9/12/18

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RoscoePColtrane
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8:24p, 9/12/18
Never take a hostage you aren't willing to shoot,
Remember, America doesn’t negotiate with terrorists.
Code 7 10-42
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JTA1029
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8:35p, 9/12/18
AG
Can someone address this:
The claim from the left is that George P knew in advance about Russia having and possibly releasing *Hillary Clinton's* emails. But those never got released, instead we got DNC emails.

Have people just been saying "Hillary's emails" when they meant "DNC"?
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drcrinum
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9:07p, 9/12/18


The State Department rears its ugly head again.
I thought Nunes was going to investigate the State Department concerning its role with the Steele dossier. Haven't heard anything about it at all lately. Something must have happened. Maybe too many Deep State people still in power in the State Department.
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Rapier108
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In reply to JTA1029 • 9:11p, 9/12/18
JTA1029 said:
Can someone address this:
The claim from the left is that George P knew in advance about Russia having and possibly releasing *Hillary Clinton's* emails. But those never got released, instead we got DNC emails.

Have people just been saying "Hillary's emails" when they meant "DNC"?
People often confuse the two, even the media does it.
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RoscoePColtrane
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In reply to JTA1029 • 11:08p, 9/12/18
JTA1029 said:
Can someone address this:
The claim from the left is that George P knew in advance about Russia having and possibly releasing *Hillary Clinton's* emails. But those never got released, instead we got DNC emails.

Have people just been saying "Hillary's emails" when they meant "DNC"?
First off, the entire narrative is a lie. Papadopoulos didn't know anything about any emails. Even the person that they claimed told him that, said himself that nothing about emails was ever mentioned.

So do lose any sleep of left wing disinformation.
Never take a hostage you aren't willing to shoot,
Remember, America doesn’t negotiate with terrorists.
Code 7 10-42
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policywonk98
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In reply to drcrinum • 7:52a, 9/13/18
AG
drcrinum said:


The State Department rears its ugly head again.
I thought Nunes was going to investigate the State Department concerning its role with the Steele dossier. Haven't heard anything about it at all lately. Something must have happened. Maybe too many Deep State people still in power in the State Department.


When I was working inside the beltway State was considered far more "progressive" at a career and leadership level than any of the intelligence agencies.

Try not to let your head explode, but here is your reminder of the head of the agency since 1993 prior to Trump:
Warren Christopher
Madeleine Albright
Collin Powell
Condi Rice
Hillary Clinton
John Kerry


So yeah, I think State is an enormous problem. Call it deep state or whatever you want. Alot of unchecked power in that department IMHO. I've assumed that was part of the problem faced by Tillerson. Pompeo possibly more equipped to handle it.



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RoscoePColtrane
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8:02a, 9/13/18
The left just can't beat this guy at 1600 Pennsylvania

Yesterday the left starts blaming Trump for the Cat 4 hurricane. Overnight the hurricane weakened to a Cat 2 hurricane.
Never take a hostage you aren't willing to shoot,
Remember, America doesn’t negotiate with terrorists.
Code 7 10-42
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RoscoePColtrane
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8:02a, 9/13/18
Jail is hell

Never take a hostage you aren't willing to shoot,
Remember, America doesn’t negotiate with terrorists.
Code 7 10-42
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ThunderCougarFalconBird
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In reply to RoscoePColtrane • 9:13a, 9/13/18
AG
RoscoePColtrane said:
The left just can't beat this guy at 1600 Pennsylvania

Yesterday the left starts blaming Trump for the Cat 4 hurricane. Overnight the hurricane weakened to a Cat 2 hurricane.
So Trump has wrested control of the George W. Bush Hurricane Machine back from the Deep State?
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tsuag10
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In reply to ThunderCougarFalconBird • 9:15a, 9/13/18
AG
With great power, comes great responsibility.
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RoscoePColtrane
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9:35a, 9/13/18
1984






Never take a hostage you aren't willing to shoot,
Remember, America doesn’t negotiate with terrorists.
Code 7 10-42
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