ramblin_ag02 said:

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They won't work because they destroy the individual. If you can't interact with the community around you in a similar manner as the majority then your identity will destroyed or molded to the
margin.

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Congrats. This is probably the most tone-deaf statement I've seen in months

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The margin isn't inherently bad. It contains a necessary purpose for reality.

PacifistAg said:

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Orthodox Texan said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Clearly this is even seen on this board where you see people who are totally lost on what reality is and really what they even believe in. The best line is just "get another job". Ok. Thanks for brining nothing of use haha. I would assume we will begin to see a huge backlash from unions and groups of people who will fight back against the possibility of losing their job. It already started last last week.

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Just because we disagree with your perception of reality doesn't mean we're "totally lost". Hubris is not a good look, brother. But as we discussed on the previous thread, you aren't entitled to a job. You aren't entitled to be compensated for your labor by a private employer when you're unwilling to adhere to the conditions set by that private employer. And you don't get to whine about government overreach while also calling for attacks on the private sector and infringements on the rights of business owners.

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Government overreach is nothing new but this is an important time because it's already looking like they want everything to revolve around covid. All citizens religious and non religious (lol I mean the secular are kind of a joke piggy back riding on Christianity but whatever) will have some interesting battles coming up.

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Yes, government overreach is nothing new. You seem to embrace it when it suits you, hence your entitled demands that government infringe on the rights of private business owners simply because you don't want to play by the rules they set forth for anyone seeking to perform labor for them.

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Ya don't agree. The new conditions being set by the employer are being fully influenced by government overreach. It's almost like you think these employers just got this out of nowhere or on their own haha.

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Or, you know, they got there because we're in the middle of a pandemic which has already caused significant impacts on operations due to employees going out with COVID.

So, your solution is even more government overreach. Interesting strategy. Use government overreach to violate the rights of business owners in order to guard against your perception of government overreach in voluntarily enacted policies of private companies. Again, you have no problem with government overreach here. You just want government overreach with a flavor you find palatable.

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Totally agree. These people that complain about a private business mandating something and then say it's government overreach is ridiculous. Most of these people would identify themselves as conservatives but they are not. They are populist, they want the government to step in and stop things they don't like, even if it infringes on someone else, such as the right of a private business. I wish they would just admit who they are.

AGC said:

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Dilettante said:

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AGC said:

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People have made their choices and vaccinated people have mutated this thing and are spreading it.

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Really? We have tons of experience with infections and bacteria that are drug resistant not only from hospitals but foreign countries where multiple doses of treatment wind up changing what they're trying to eradicate. The vaccine also suppresses certain kinds of the virus which makes others more prevalent. Neither of these statements are controversial or even assailable.

Now we've deployed, what, 5+ vaccines? worldwide in first and third world countries, some of which worked and some of which didn't with some requiring multiple doses and boosters. Do you really think the unvaccinated during the first wave created delta? Evolutionary biologists could have told you this would happen.

Edit: we also need to funnel the doctor mistrust through a lense that views these decisions as dependent, not independent. Each model, each statement, each recommendation is viewed very differently by you than others. For all intents and purposes, yes, science may now dictate that getting vaccinated is the best thing to do. But tomorrow or two years from now it may say something else, like horrendous side effects make it not worth it or it creates a super bug (not a prediction, just an example). It's not realistic or prudent for anyone including doctors and scientists to simply discard all prior information and go with the current directive. Credentials are granted but just as easily taken away by screw ups. You wouldn't tolerate putting your mother or father in a nursing home pre-COVID with someone who changed their mind, advice, and guidance this much over the course of one year. There's a paralysis, a fear of getting something wrong but the consequences of a coherent well thought strategy must be applied over time.

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The delta variant originated in India that had extremely low vaccination rates. Here is a something for you to learn every single RNA virus mutates and mutates a lot. It's the way they survive. There have been breakthrough cases with delta in the vaccinated but most new cases are still unvaccinated and the overwhelming majority of the current hospitalized and deaths are in the unvaccinated. Vaccinated people that have breakthroughs are having mild to no symptoms most of the time. This alone tells you the vaccines work, but keep using your ignorance and seeking out ridiculous stuff to feed your confirmation bias. Please tell me when any vaccine ever created a super bug? It hasn't happened, super bugs are created by over use of antibiotics. Your ignorance is embarrassing.

Irwin M. Fletcher said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Orthodox Texan said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Clearly this is even seen on this board where you see people who are totally lost on what reality is and really what they even believe in. The best line is just "get another job". Ok. Thanks for brining nothing of use haha. I would assume we will begin to see a huge backlash from unions and groups of people who will fight back against the possibility of losing their job. It already started last last week.

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Just because we disagree with your perception of reality doesn't mean we're "totally lost". Hubris is not a good look, brother. But as we discussed on the previous thread, you aren't entitled to a job. You aren't entitled to be compensated for your labor by a private employer when you're unwilling to adhere to the conditions set by that private employer. And you don't get to whine about government overreach while also calling for attacks on the private sector and infringements on the rights of business owners.

Quote:

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Government overreach is nothing new but this is an important time because it's already looking like they want everything to revolve around covid. All citizens religious and non religious (lol I mean the secular are kind of a joke piggy back riding on Christianity but whatever) will have some interesting battles coming up.

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Yes, government overreach is nothing new. You seem to embrace it when it suits you, hence your entitled demands that government infringe on the rights of private business owners simply because you don't want to play by the rules they set forth for anyone seeking to perform labor for them.

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Ya don't agree. The new conditions being set by the employer are being fully influenced by government overreach. It's almost like you think these employers just got this out of nowhere or on their own haha.

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Or, you know, they got there because we're in the middle of a pandemic which has already caused significant impacts on operations due to employees going out with COVID.

So, your solution is even more government overreach. Interesting strategy. Use government overreach to violate the rights of business owners in order to guard against your perception of government overreach in voluntarily enacted policies of private companies. Again, you have no problem with government overreach here. You just want government overreach with a flavor you find palatable.

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Totally agree. These people that complain about a private business mandating something and then say it's government overreach is ridiculous. Most of these people would identify themselves as conservatives but they are not. They are populist, they want the government to step in and stop things they don't like, even if it infringes on someone else, such as the right of a private business. I wish they would just admit who they are.

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Hear me out here. How about not having a constant stream of propaganda that is rapidly dividing our society? The truth is that people like you want this to happen. It's so obvious.

Orthodox Texan said:

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Irwin M. Fletcher said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Orthodox Texan said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Clearly this is even seen on this board where you see people who are totally lost on what reality is and really what they even believe in. The best line is just "get another job". Ok. Thanks for brining nothing of use haha. I would assume we will begin to see a huge backlash from unions and groups of people who will fight back against the possibility of losing their job. It already started last last week.

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Just because we disagree with your perception of reality doesn't mean we're "totally lost". Hubris is not a good look, brother. But as we discussed on the previous thread, you aren't entitled to a job. You aren't entitled to be compensated for your labor by a private employer when you're unwilling to adhere to the conditions set by that private employer. And you don't get to whine about government overreach while also calling for attacks on the private sector and infringements on the rights of business owners.

Quote:

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Government overreach is nothing new but this is an important time because it's already looking like they want everything to revolve around covid. All citizens religious and non religious (lol I mean the secular are kind of a joke piggy back riding on Christianity but whatever) will have some interesting battles coming up.

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Yes, government overreach is nothing new. You seem to embrace it when it suits you, hence your entitled demands that government infringe on the rights of private business owners simply because you don't want to play by the rules they set forth for anyone seeking to perform labor for them.

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Ya don't agree. The new conditions being set by the employer are being fully influenced by government overreach. It's almost like you think these employers just got this out of nowhere or on their own haha.

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Or, you know, they got there because we're in the middle of a pandemic which has already caused significant impacts on operations due to employees going out with COVID.

So, your solution is even more government overreach. Interesting strategy. Use government overreach to violate the rights of business owners in order to guard against your perception of government overreach in voluntarily enacted policies of private companies. Again, you have no problem with government overreach here. You just want government overreach with a flavor you find palatable.

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Totally agree. These people that complain about a private business mandating something and then say it's government overreach is ridiculous. Most of these people would identify themselves as conservatives but they are not. They are populist, they want the government to step in and stop things they don't like, even if it infringes on someone else, such as the right of a private business. I wish they would just admit who they are.

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Hear me out here. How about not having a constant stream of propaganda that is rapidly dividing our society? The truth is that people like you want this to happen. It's so obvious.

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You are so clueless. I really could care less if a business mandates a vaccine or not. I DONT CARE! You do. That's what separates conservatives from populist. I leave it up to the individual person or entity to decide what they want to do.

Irwin M. Fletcher said:

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Orthodox Texan said:

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Irwin M. Fletcher said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Orthodox Texan said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Clearly this is even seen on this board where you see people who are totally lost on what reality is and really what they even believe in. The best line is just "get another job". Ok. Thanks for brining nothing of use haha. I would assume we will begin to see a huge backlash from unions and groups of people who will fight back against the possibility of losing their job. It already started last last week.

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Just because we disagree with your perception of reality doesn't mean we're "totally lost". Hubris is not a good look, brother. But as we discussed on the previous thread, you aren't entitled to a job. You aren't entitled to be compensated for your labor by a private employer when you're unwilling to adhere to the conditions set by that private employer. And you don't get to whine about government overreach while also calling for attacks on the private sector and infringements on the rights of business owners.

Quote:

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Government overreach is nothing new but this is an important time because it's already looking like they want everything to revolve around covid. All citizens religious and non religious (lol I mean the secular are kind of a joke piggy back riding on Christianity but whatever) will have some interesting battles coming up.

---

Yes, government overreach is nothing new. You seem to embrace it when it suits you, hence your entitled demands that government infringe on the rights of private business owners simply because you don't want to play by the rules they set forth for anyone seeking to perform labor for them.

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Ya don't agree. The new conditions being set by the employer are being fully influenced by government overreach. It's almost like you think these employers just got this out of nowhere or on their own haha.

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Or, you know, they got there because we're in the middle of a pandemic which has already caused significant impacts on operations due to employees going out with COVID.

So, your solution is even more government overreach. Interesting strategy. Use government overreach to violate the rights of business owners in order to guard against your perception of government overreach in voluntarily enacted policies of private companies. Again, you have no problem with government overreach here. You just want government overreach with a flavor you find palatable.

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Totally agree. These people that complain about a private business mandating something and then say it's government overreach is ridiculous. Most of these people would identify themselves as conservatives but they are not. They are populist, they want the government to step in and stop things they don't like, even if it infringes on someone else, such as the right of a private business. I wish they would just admit who they are.

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Hear me out here. How about not having a constant stream of propaganda that is rapidly dividing our society? The truth is that people like you want this to happen. It's so obvious.

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You are so clueless. I really could care less if a business mandates a vaccine or not. I DONT CARE! You do. That's what separates conservatives from populist. I leave it up to the individual person or entity to decide what they want to do.

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Oh man I wonder who is giving all of these individuals and entities that information to make this historical society dividing decision?? I wonder who it could be??? Do you think it's possibly the federal government, CDC, and social media companies that are the major influencers that are all spewing out the same information on a daily basis????

Come on man. You're the clueless one and spineless as well. So glad we have rational people in the state government defending this onslaught of propaganda. I laughed so hard at these Austin restaurants. Love it. You guys are pathetic.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.texastribune.org/2021/08/12/texas-restaurants-vaccination-proof/amp/

Orthodox Texan said:

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Irwin M. Fletcher said:

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Orthodox Texan said:

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Irwin M. Fletcher said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Orthodox Texan said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Clearly this is even seen on this board where you see people who are totally lost on what reality is and really what they even believe in. The best line is just "get another job". Ok. Thanks for brining nothing of use haha. I would assume we will begin to see a huge backlash from unions and groups of people who will fight back against the possibility of losing their job. It already started last last week.

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Just because we disagree with your perception of reality doesn't mean we're "totally lost". Hubris is not a good look, brother. But as we discussed on the previous thread, you aren't entitled to a job. You aren't entitled to be compensated for your labor by a private employer when you're unwilling to adhere to the conditions set by that private employer. And you don't get to whine about government overreach while also calling for attacks on the private sector and infringements on the rights of business owners.

Quote:

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Government overreach is nothing new but this is an important time because it's already looking like they want everything to revolve around covid. All citizens religious and non religious (lol I mean the secular are kind of a joke piggy back riding on Christianity but whatever) will have some interesting battles coming up.

---

Yes, government overreach is nothing new. You seem to embrace it when it suits you, hence your entitled demands that government infringe on the rights of private business owners simply because you don't want to play by the rules they set forth for anyone seeking to perform labor for them.

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Ya don't agree. The new conditions being set by the employer are being fully influenced by government overreach. It's almost like you think these employers just got this out of nowhere or on their own haha.

---

Or, you know, they got there because we're in the middle of a pandemic which has already caused significant impacts on operations due to employees going out with COVID.

So, your solution is even more government overreach. Interesting strategy. Use government overreach to violate the rights of business owners in order to guard against your perception of government overreach in voluntarily enacted policies of private companies. Again, you have no problem with government overreach here. You just want government overreach with a flavor you find palatable.

---

Totally agree. These people that complain about a private business mandating something and then say it's government overreach is ridiculous. Most of these people would identify themselves as conservatives but they are not. They are populist, they want the government to step in and stop things they don't like, even if it infringes on someone else, such as the right of a private business. I wish they would just admit who they are.

---

Hear me out here. How about not having a constant stream of propaganda that is rapidly dividing our society? The truth is that people like you want this to happen. It's so obvious.

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You are so clueless. I really could care less if a business mandates a vaccine or not. I DONT CARE! You do. That's what separates conservatives from populist. I leave it up to the individual person or entity to decide what they want to do.

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Oh man I wonder who is giving all of these individuals and entities that information to make this historical society dividing decision?? I wonder who it could be??? Do you think it's possibly the federal government, CDC, and social media companies that are the major influencers that are all spewing out the same information on a daily basis????

Come on man. You're the clueless one and spineless as well. So glad we have rational people in the state government defending this onslaught of propaganda. I laughed so hard at these Austin restaurants. Love it. You guys are pathetic.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.texastribune.org/2021/08/12/texas-restaurants-vaccination-proof/amp/

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Oh so it's a conspiracy. Yeah it's not, 99% of hospitalizations and deaths are in the unvaccinated, while there have been breakthrough cases in vaccinated unless that patient is immunocompromised or has serious co morbidities then those patients have mild to moderate symptoms. I know this is a fact from speaking with many physicians that I know in the ICU in many towns in Texas I go to. You see I talk with knowledgeable people who can say yes this or that is happening, you get your information from end of times news or Alex Jones or a litany of other conspiracy theory sources that have zero scientific knowledge or education. I'll vote you as the clueless one.
So yeah if a company reads what I put that is fact a decides I want my employees vaccinated that is THEIR prerogative. It's also their choice to not require it. It certainly is your right to not patronize a entity that requires this as well even protest them if you wish, but it's not the government mandating it and the data on who is dying from this is NOT propaganda or lie in a conspiracy.

Dilettante said:

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Don't make up stats. If you don't know the number, use words, not a number. If I'm the person you're talking to, I tune out as soon as I see the number 99 because I know that's not even close.

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No that's the number. It's actually 99% plus of deaths happening now are in the unvaccinated. I'll look for the link but it's less than 1% of Covid deaths are happening in fully vaccinated individuals. Hospitalizations are around 95% in the unvaccinated. I'll post the data when I find it. I have also talked with many doctors all over Texas and they verify this as well as what's happening in their hospitals.

EDIT: Here ya go

https://www.kff.org/policy-watch/covid-19-vaccine-breakthrough-cases-data-from-the-states/

Interesting. Looks like I was confused. Sorry about that. You didn't edit the relevant part of your post after I posted, did you? I'm not accusing you, just making sure that you didn't change "cases" to "hospitalizations and deaths" or something like that.

No that's cool, no it is just hospitalizations and deaths that I referenced. There have definitely been breakthrough cases in vaccinated individuals no doubt, but most of them experience very mild symptoms if any at all. I just read Greg Abbot has been diagnosed but is vaccinated, I would expect him to experience a very mild case. The serious cases in the hospital now are among the unvaccinated. The vaccine works, it just does whether people want to believe it or not. If you get this thing and have been vaccinated your body has been taught how to fight it off fairly quick.

Irwin M. Fletcher said:

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Orthodox Texan said:

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Irwin M. Fletcher said:

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Orthodox Texan said:

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Irwin M. Fletcher said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Orthodox Texan said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Clearly this is even seen on this board where you see people who are totally lost on what reality is and really what they even believe in. The best line is just "get another job". Ok. Thanks for brining nothing of use haha. I would assume we will begin to see a huge backlash from unions and groups of people who will fight back against the possibility of losing their job. It already started last last week.

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Just because we disagree with your perception of reality doesn't mean we're "totally lost". Hubris is not a good look, brother. But as we discussed on the previous thread, you aren't entitled to a job. You aren't entitled to be compensated for your labor by a private employer when you're unwilling to adhere to the conditions set by that private employer. And you don't get to whine about government overreach while also calling for attacks on the private sector and infringements on the rights of business owners.

Quote:

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Government overreach is nothing new but this is an important time because it's already looking like they want everything to revolve around covid. All citizens religious and non religious (lol I mean the secular are kind of a joke piggy back riding on Christianity but whatever) will have some interesting battles coming up.

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Yes, government overreach is nothing new. You seem to embrace it when it suits you, hence your entitled demands that government infringe on the rights of private business owners simply because you don't want to play by the rules they set forth for anyone seeking to perform labor for them.

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Ya don't agree. The new conditions being set by the employer are being fully influenced by government overreach. It's almost like you think these employers just got this out of nowhere or on their own haha.

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Or, you know, they got there because we're in the middle of a pandemic which has already caused significant impacts on operations due to employees going out with COVID.

So, your solution is even more government overreach. Interesting strategy. Use government overreach to violate the rights of business owners in order to guard against your perception of government overreach in voluntarily enacted policies of private companies. Again, you have no problem with government overreach here. You just want government overreach with a flavor you find palatable.

---

Totally agree. These people that complain about a private business mandating something and then say it's government overreach is ridiculous. Most of these people would identify themselves as conservatives but they are not. They are populist, they want the government to step in and stop things they don't like, even if it infringes on someone else, such as the right of a private business. I wish they would just admit who they are.

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Hear me out here. How about not having a constant stream of propaganda that is rapidly dividing our society? The truth is that people like you want this to happen. It's so obvious.

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You are so clueless. I really could care less if a business mandates a vaccine or not. I DONT CARE! You do. That's what separates conservatives from populist. I leave it up to the individual person or entity to decide what they want to do.

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Oh man I wonder who is giving all of these individuals and entities that information to make this historical society dividing decision?? I wonder who it could be??? Do you think it's possibly the federal government, CDC, and social media companies that are the major influencers that are all spewing out the same information on a daily basis????

Come on man. You're the clueless one and spineless as well. So glad we have rational people in the state government defending this onslaught of propaganda. I laughed so hard at these Austin restaurants. Love it. You guys are pathetic.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.texastribune.org/2021/08/12/texas-restaurants-vaccination-proof/amp/

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Oh so it's a conspiracy. Yeah it's not, 99% of hospitalizations and deaths are in the unvaccinated, while there have been breakthrough cases in vaccinated unless that patient is immunocompromised or has serious co morbidities then those patients have mild to moderate symptoms. I know this is a fact from speaking with many physicians that I know in the ICU in many towns in Texas I go to. You see I talk with knowledgeable people who can say yes this or that is happening, you get your information from end of times news or Alex Jones or a litany of other conspiracy theory sources that have zero scientific knowledge or education. I'll vote you as the clueless one.
So yeah if a company reads what I put that is fact a decides I want my employees vaccinated that is THEIR prerogative. It's also their choice to not require it. It certainly is your right to not patronize a entity that requires this as well even protest them if you wish, but it's not the government mandating it and the data on who is dying from this is NOT propaganda or lie in a conspiracy.

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Do you know how propaganda works? This fight is just getting started here and covid workplace discrimination will be at the front. Only a matter of time buddy.

This is exactly why I won't be quiet about these issues. Keep feeding into their narrative.

Meanwhile in Australia police pepper spray children for not wearing masks pic.twitter.com/L0ZPhUH8c6

— 🦋𝕂𝕖𝕝𝕝𝕚𝕖🦋 (@WinterAsh12) August 17, 2021

Yeah that didn't happen in America and if it does I would be the first to protest. Yes I understand propaganda but I also understand science and fact (you don't) and its easy to see the vaccine works. If you want to get it great if not that is your choice as well. If a company wants to require employees to get it well that is their choice also, I am a conservative and let individuals decide whether I agree with them or not. You are a populist and will want the government to not infringe on what you think are your rights but will be happy to let the government infringe on someone else if what they are doing offends you in some way.

Irwin M. Fletcher said:

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Yeah that didn't happen in America and if it does I would be the first to protest. Yes I understand propaganda but I also understand science and fact (you don't) and its easy to see the vaccine works. If you want to get it great if not that is your choice as well. If a company wants to require employees to get it well that is their choice also, I am a conservative and let individuals decide whether I agree with them or not. You are a populist and will want the government to not infringe on what you think are your rights but will be happy to let the government infringe on someone else if what they are doing offends you in some way.

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Something tells me you wouldn't protest it. You're already yelling "find another job!!!" to people who are being forced to take an injection. I don't have objections to the vaccine working haha. I do have a massive objection to forcing this vaccine on society through the workplace and governments. It's a slippery slope and a huge part of society will not take it for long.

Tell me Fletcher what risk does an unvaccinated person potentially have on his workplace? We know the vaccinated and unvaccinated transmit the virus. What risk can an unvaccinated person hold at the workplace vs the vaccinated? If we are going off the science then an employer doesn't have enough data to justify rules like this. Also what are sick days for? Someone at work gets covid (which can be from anyone) and they have to go out for a bit. That can range widely from case to case. You can't pin all of this on society by forcing someone to quit their job. Such pathetic scum.

Oh so you understand science? What does that have to do with governments enforcing passports and companies forcing their employee to get a vaccination or face termination? Do you think science tells you what to do? That's an honest question and I'm interested in your response. By the way I'm a scientist with a consulting firm haha. Not that I care if you believe it or not but it's hilarious when people like you make statements of "I also understand science and facts". Some of the followers (you) of science are some of the most clueless when it comes to how society properly functions.

It's very hard for me to believe that you are a scientist. Do you have a PhD?

Religious objection to the vaccine. (My spouse and family are currently being required to get the vaccine or lose their employment).

From a Biblical perspective I think Romans chapter 14 addresses gray areas or matters of conscious. I believe in the example in Romans 14 the underlying question is: As a Christian is it sinful to eat meat or regard one day over another. The clear answer is that it not a sin to eat meat however if you are convinced in your mind that eating meat is wrong or not regarding a special day as different then the other, then you are not doing so out of faith and whatever is not of faith is sin. Faith is not wishful thinking but a conviction that something is true.

Likewise getting the vaccine or not getting it is not a sin. If you are convinced or convicted that you should get it, then it would be sinful to not go forward with it.

Religious objection specifically to the vaccine.
1. Is the vaccine a true vaccine or gene therapy?
2. Does the vaccine prevent me from spreading the disease if I catch it?
3. What are the long term effects of the vaccine?
4. What if I've already had COVID?

If one is convinced they are saving lives or saving their own life, they should take it. If one is not convinced that the vaccine will not have long term effects on their heart, reproductive system, etc, they should not take it. It should not be mandated upon anyone. If a Doctor is not convinced that it's healthy for them to take the drug, do we stop that person from being a doctor and helping others?

1. It's not gene therapy. Whether it's a vaccine depends on your definition, but for most definitions it is a vaccine.
2. The vaccine reduces your risk of catching and spreading the virus.
3. There is no reason to believe the vaccine is associated with long term effects which exceed the long term effects associated with the virus. There are several reasons to view that belief as silly, including the history of liposomal drug delivery, the fact that exposure is acute and not chronic, and various ADME studies.

Ok- look you're a populist I got it. You don't want this forced on employees by employers. You will find agreement with union leaders in this. I feel like employers have the right to mandate things for their employees. Yes vaccinated can spread it especially to others that are unvaccinated, if you are vaccinated and are exposed good chance you don't get it at all or it's very mild. That can not be said of the unvaccinated, an employer might look at that and think I don't want to have anyone get exposed especially someone that has a weak immune system amd a break through case would be bad. Who knows?? Who cares?! As far as I'm concerned they could make their employees get this if it had no data behind it. ITS THEIR CHOICE! You are free to take your grievances to the Union Mr. Populist! Maybe you can strike or form a Union. I am not a pro union guy - I think they suck. Mainly because they force ridiculous standards on employers and drive up the cost of labor. You and I are never going to see eye to eye on this.

It's not gene therapy, but so what if it was? If it's been tested and safe then it's still awesome new technology to help us fight all kinds of diseases. Antibiotics, laparoscopic surgery, airplanes and the internet were once "new and 'untested'" technology that have changed the world for the better. No reason to freeze the medical field in 1980 when it comes to vaccines and disease prevention. If we have newer and better tools, then we should use them to save lives. That's exactly what's happening right now

Irwin M. Fletcher said:

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Ok- look you're a populist I got it. You don't want this forced on employees by employers. You will find agreement with union leaders in this. I feel like employers have the right to mandate things for their employees. Yes vaccinated can spread it especially to others that are unvaccinated, if you are vaccinated and are exposed good chance you don't get it at all or it's very mild. That can not be said of the unvaccinated, an employer might look at that and think I don't want to have anyone get exposed especially someone that has a weak immune system amd a break through case would be bad. Who knows?? Who cares?! As far as I'm concerned they could make their employees get this if it had no data behind it. ITS THEIR CHOICE! You are free to take your grievances to the Union Mr. Populist! Maybe you can strike or form a Union. I am not a pro union guy - I think they suck. Mainly because they force ridiculous standards on employers and drive up the cost of labor. You and I are never going to see eye to eye on this.

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Not a populist. I'm against government propaganda used through a massive social media network that is influencing business owners at a level never seen before. I'm also against major corporations being in bed with the government. Some idiot on here mentioned the free market earlier in this thread hahahah. Right. Good luck running with your narrative.

ramblin_ag02 said:

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It's not gene therapy, but so what if it was? If it's been tested and safe then it's still awesome new technology to help us fight all kinds of diseases. Antibiotics, laparoscopic surgery, airplanes and the internet were once "new and 'untested'" technology that have changed the world for the better. No reason to freeze the medical field in 1980 when it comes to vaccines and disease prevention. If we have newer and better tools, then we should use them to save lives. That's exactly what's happening right now

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Cool story. Numerous countries including ours are using it for control. Did you see the news in Canada today? What about Biden coming down on Republican governors that are fighting against school district mask mandates? NYC passports regardless of medical exemptions?

Oh yes you are. It is not propaganda it is just facts, did you look at the link I sent earlier. Almost all hospitalizations and deaths are in the unvaccinated. It is understandable how a business can see that and decide to mandate their employees be vaccinated. It is funny how populist can look at raw data not from a news source and call it propaganda! You may not like who you are, but if you are wanting someone to step in and tell business owners what they can or can not mandate for their employees you are 100% a populist. And by the way YOU calling anyone on this board an idiot is just too rich!! Pot meet kettle.

Orthodox Texan said:

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ramblin_ag02 said:

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It's not gene therapy, but so what if it was? If it's been tested and safe then it's still awesome new technology to help us fight all kinds of diseases. Antibiotics, laparoscopic surgery, airplanes and the internet were once "new and 'untested'" technology that have changed the world for the better. No reason to freeze the medical field in 1980 when it comes to vaccines and disease prevention. If we have newer and better tools, then we should use them to save lives. That's exactly what's happening right now

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Cool story. Numerous countries including ours are using it for control. Did you see the news in Canada today? What about Biden coming down on Republican governors that are fighting against school district mask mandates? NYC passports regardless of medical exemptions?

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You are such a joke. They just point out that the vaccine is not gene therapy and how this is a breakthrough and you start into government control and mask mandates. They are just talking about innovation in the medical field and you jump to all these other issues that had nothing to do with what they posted. Its like you have no clue so you make a jump to something else.

Irwin M. Fletcher said:

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Oh yes you are. It is not propaganda it is just facts, did you look at the link I sent earlier. Almost all hospitalizations and deaths are in the unvaccinated. It is understandable how a business can see that and decide to mandate their employees be vaccinated. It is funny how populist can look at raw data not from a news source and call it propaganda! You may not like who you are, but if you are wanting someone to step in and tell business owners what they can or can not mandate for their employees you are 100% a populist. And by the way YOU calling anyone on this board an idiot is just too rich!! Pot meet kettle.

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Learn to read dude. Did I say the unvaccinated aren't dying? Did I label that as propaganda? Read slowly if you need to. You're assuming so many things because that's probably what you do with anyone who has objections to what the federal government and corporations are pushing.

"Almost all hospitalizations and deaths are in the unvaccinated. It is understandable how a business can see that and decide to mandate their employees be vaccinated."

Explain this. Go ahead Fletcher. Why is it understandable to enforce a blanket rule for covid? Even a company like Google. What are the age groups for those hospitalizations and deaths? Overall health? Are the majority of the deaths even currently working?

"It is funny how populist can look at raw data not from a news source and call it propaganda!"

Hahahahaha. Oh my god give me a break dude. This is the most pathetic line I've seen in a long time. I'll ask you again, do you think science tells you what to do?

Irwin M. Fletcher said:

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Orthodox Texan said:

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ramblin_ag02 said:

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It's not gene therapy, but so what if it was? If it's been tested and safe then it's still awesome new technology to help us fight all kinds of diseases. Antibiotics, laparoscopic surgery, airplanes and the internet were once "new and 'untested'" technology that have changed the world for the better. No reason to freeze the medical field in 1980 when it comes to vaccines and disease prevention. If we have newer and better tools, then we should use them to save lives. That's exactly what's happening right now

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Cool story. Numerous countries including ours are using it for control. Did you see the news in Canada today? What about Biden coming down on Republican governors that are fighting against school district mask mandates? NYC passports regardless of medical exemptions?

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You are such a joke. They just point out that the vaccine is not gene therapy and how this is a breakthrough and you start into government control and mask mandates. They are just talking about innovation in the medical field and you jump to all these other issues that had nothing to do with what they posted. Its like you have no clue so you make a jump to something else.

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Wrong again Fletcher. Im pointing out that none of that narrative matters now when we clearly see what is going around all across the world. It's about control as I've said from the beginning of this thread. Quit acting like you will actually do something when things get serious here like they are in other countries. You won't because you're a coward.

You're not going to do anything either, and you're the one who actually has a big issue with the things going on in the world.

Quote:

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Explain this. Go ahead Fletcher. Why is it understandable to enforce a blanket rule for covid? Even a company like Google. What are the age groups for those hospitalizations and deaths? Overall health? Are the majority of the deaths even currently working?

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Know how I know you don't have P/L responsibility for a business that has been impacted by people missing work from COVID?

Dilettante said:

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You're not going to do anything either, and you're the one who actually has a big issue with the things going on in the world.

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Some of you are men without chests as CS Lewis said. Interesting days ahead.

Zobel said:

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Quote:

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Explain this. Go ahead Fletcher. Why is it understandable to enforce a blanket rule for covid? Even a company like Google. What are the age groups for those hospitalizations and deaths? Overall health? Are the majority of the deaths even currently working?

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Know how I know you don't have P/L responsibility for a business that has been impacted by people missing work from COVID?

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PTO. I'm sure you've heard of it.

As if to prove my point.

You do realize that many people have jobs they can't do from home, right? PTO does not replace employee labor. How many people can your business shed for a week or more before it impacts operations?

Orthodox Texan said:

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Zobel said:

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Quote:

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Explain this. Go ahead Fletcher. Why is it understandable to enforce a blanket rule for covid? Even a company like Google. What are the age groups for those hospitalizations and deaths? Overall health? Are the majority of the deaths even currently working?

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Know how I know you don't have P/L responsibility for a business that has been impacted by people missing work from COVID?

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PTO. I'm sure you've heard of it.

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Companies tend to prefer to pay employees for being at work. Yes, PTO is available, but most employees won't have enough cover prolonged COVID-related absences. Prolonged absences have a severe impact on business operations.

Companies would love to limit the impact of COVID on business operations. One way of doing that is vaccines. It's why even in companies not mandating them, they're still pushing that their employees get vaccinated. It's just better for business.

Orthodox Texan said:

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Dilettante said:

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You're not going to do anything either, and you're the one who actually has a big issue with the things going on in the world.

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Some of you are men without chests as CS Lewis said. Interesting days ahead.

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Just curious, since you're apparently a man with a chest, what would you do?

Zobel said:

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As if to prove my point.

You do realize that many people have jobs they can't do from home, right? PTO does not replace employee labor. How many people can your business shed for a week or more before it impacts operations?

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Wow I had no idea. Pull up some stats to prove your opinion on this. This is the game you want to play. How many people in the workforce are out sick because of covid?

Orthodox Texan said:

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Zobel said:

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As if to prove my point.

You do realize that many people have jobs they can't do from home, right? PTO does not replace employee labor. How many people can your business shed for a week or more before it impacts operations?

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Wow I had no idea. Pull up some stats to prove your opinion on this. This is the game you want to play. How many people in the workforce are out sick because of covid?

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I'm an HR Manager in an industry that cannot be done remotely. COVID has had a tremendous impact on us.

And you also don't get demand stats to "prove your opinion" when your entire argument is based on your baseless opinion that companies are instituting policies because of government pressure.

PacifistAg said:

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Orthodox Texan said:

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Dilettante said:

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You're not going to do anything either, and you're the one who actually has a big issue with the things going on in the world.

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Some of you are men without chests as CS Lewis said. Interesting days ahead.

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Just curious, since you're apparently a man with a chest, what would you do?

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Obviously that comment wasn't directed at you. I'm going to voice my opinion while I still have it. I'll protest if we go down the same path as NYC, Canada, France, UK, Australia, etc. I'll stick up for my neighbors, friends, family, anyone who can clearly see how evil this is becoming. I'll do my best to love my enemy as well I certainly learn a lot from listening to people like you and how this ideology is forming. A forum is one thing but the conversations in person are starting to shift as well. Not as nice as they were before.