Church Organization

8,841 Views | 116 Replies | Last: 2 yr ago by FTACo88-FDT24dad
PacifistAg
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In reply to aggiedad20 • 4:53p, 4/5/21
AG
aggiedad20 said:
Wrong. Texas A&M is founded by men, like denominations. The Lord's church was purchased by the shed blood of Christ.

Big difference.
Whooosh! That's the point going right over your head. Church of Christ is a denomination. It's okay. It's still part of the body of Christ, which is the universal Church. One not need be part of the Church of Christ denomination to be a member of the Church. Fortunately, you are not the gatekeeper of our faith, so you can deny me as your sister all you want if it makes you feel better.

And intervention for what exactly? Come on. You can say it.
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Zobel
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In reply to aggiedad20 • 5:12p, 4/5/21
AG

Quote:
The early church had the inspired instruction of the Apostles and mail. We don't have them here today. We have God's Word as intended.

Gasp! No red letter edition NIV to guide folks from the baptist to Methodist to the rcc back then. Oh wait
I'm trying to follow what you're saying.

You said that a "true" church is identical in structure, methodology, and worship practice. One of the points you listed as identical was that your only doctrine is the bible.

But when I asked how this could be, you say they were different than yours (which, I imagine means "not identical") in that they have the inspired instruction of the apostles, which you say you don't have.

So at least one difference between the church you attend and the NT church was that they steadfastly continued in the teaching of the apostles (Acts 2:42) and followed the traditions they were taught by word or by letter (2 Thessalonians 2:15) just as they were passed on to them (1 Corinthians 11:2) - versus the bible as your only doctrine.

You say God's Word as intended. Intended by whom? How do you know? Where is this intent outlined in the scriptures, and how do you know what this word is, and how it should be, and how you should apply it?
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05AG
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In reply to Zobel • 7:22p, 4/5/21
AG
He claims Bible only, but the canon he uses to make this claim came from somewhere besides bible. That alone discredits his claim to be Bible alone.
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ramblin_ag02
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In reply to 05AG • 11:37p, 4/5/21
AG
05AG said:
He claims Bible only, but the canon he uses to make this claim came from somewhere besides bible. That alone discredits his claim to be Bible alone.


It's actually several levels worse than that. When he says Bible only he really means New Testament only. However, the first Christians didn't have a New Testament, but they did have a Bible consisting of just the Old Testament called the Septuagint. So not only does he meticulously follow the Scriptures that the earliest Christians didn't have, he also does not meticulously follow the Scriptures they did have. All while claiming to exactly mirror the earliest Christian churches
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dermdoc
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In reply to aggiedad20 • 6:09a, 4/6/21
AG
aggiedad20 said:
Zobel said:

Quote:
our only doctrine is the Bible.
Let's start here.

Can you explain how the NT churches would have had this belief, before the bible existed?


The early church had the inspired instruction of the Apostles and mail. We don't have them here today. We have God's Word as intended.

Gasp! No red letter edition NIV to guide folks from the baptist to Methodist to the rcc back then. Oh wait
https://www.godsmessageontheweb.com/index.php/2014/06/02/why-i-left-the-church-of-christ/

And the only reason I posted this was because you keep criticizing people moving from denomination to denomination. I do not believe Christians should constantly berate other Christians and promote disunity and exclusivity. Jesus excluded no one to my knowledge.

I continue to pray for you my brother in Christ.

God bless
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dermdoc
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6:29a, 4/6/21
AG
And more
https://www.reddit.com/r/churchofchrist/comments/7dvkg6/an_open_letter_on_why_i_left_the_church_of_christ/
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dermdoc
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10:07a, 4/6/21
AG
And here is a rebuttal for your criticism of my church and other believer's churches/beliefs on here

http://www.cofcdilemma.org/church_of_christ_beliefs.aspx

And again, not meant to foment division as I do not agree with all the criticisms listed. But I am tired of the constant ridicule and the refusal to debate and only state.
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aggiedad20
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2:48p, 4/6/21
Matthew 7

21 "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?' 23 And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!'

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PacifistAg
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In reply to aggiedad20 • 2:53p, 4/6/21
AG
aggiedad20 said:
Matthew 7

21 "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?' 23 And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!'
Who is this directed at? Assuming you're directing this at someone here, do you then acknowledge that these verses could be describing you? Or does it only apply to others who disagree?
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aggiedad20
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2:55p, 4/6/21
Matthew 28:18 And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth.

John 16:13However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come. 14 He will glorify Me, for He will take of what is Mine and declare it to you. 15 All things that the Father has are Mine. Therefore I said that He [c]will take of Mine and declare it to you.

Matthew 28:19-20 Go [c]therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 TEACHING THEM TO OBSERVE ALL THINGS THAT I HAVE COMMANDED YOU; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age."


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aggiedad20
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3:00p, 4/6/21
1 Cor 2 12-13

Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God.
13 These things we also speak, not in words which man's wisdom teaches but which the [d]Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

Acts 20:27 For I have not shunned to declare to you THE WHOLE COUNSEL of God. (To ELDERS in Ephesus)


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PacifistAg
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In reply to aggiedad20 • 3:00p, 4/6/21
AG
Who are you directing these at?
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PacifistAg
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3:10p, 4/6/21
AG
John 11:35 Jesus wept

Song of Solomon 1:9 To me, my darling, you are like My mare among the chariots of Pharaoh.

Song of Solomon 4:2
Your teeth are like a flock of newly shorn sheep
Which have come up from their watering place,
All of which bear twins,
And not one among them has lost her young.


I figure we're just posting random verses, so might as well join in.
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aggiedad20
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In reply to PacifistAg • 3:20p, 4/6/21
PacifistAg said:
Who are you directing these at?


To everyone who believes that the NT church didn't have the whole counsel of God until 100s of years later?

And to anyone who believes that any old church will do...

Among others
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diehard03
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3:26p, 4/6/21
Quote:
Matthew 7

21 "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?' 23 And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!'

I find it interesting that whenever this is used, it's always assumed by the referencer that they are part of the group that will allowed to enter into the kingdom of heaven.

What makes you so sure that you aren't the one practicing lawlessness?
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aggiedad20
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In reply to diehard03 • 3:31p, 4/6/21
diehard03 said:
Quote:
Matthew 7

21 "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?' 23 And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!'

I find it interesting that whenever this is used, it's always assumed by the referencer that they are part of the group that will allowed to enter into the kingdom of heaven.

What makes you so sure that you aren't the one practicing lawlessness?


So you agree Jesus does exclude some then?

Because a comment above said Jesus doesn't exclude anyone...

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dermdoc
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In reply to aggiedad20 • 4:15p, 4/6/21
AG
aggiedad20 said:
diehard03 said:
Quote:
Matthew 7

21 "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?' 23 And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!'

I find it interesting that whenever this is used, it's always assumed by the referencer that they are part of the group that will allowed to enter into the kingdom of heaven.

What makes you so sure that you aren't the one practicing lawlessness?


So you agree Jesus does exclude some then?

Because a comment above said Jesus doesn't exclude anyone...


I was talking about with his personal encounters in the NT. The only ones he excluded(if he did) were the legalistic religious people, correct? Not the adulteress, prostitutes, tax collectors, etc. In fact, He was chastised by the holy rollers for hanging around sinners, feasting, and being a wine bibber(sound familiar?).

Who does the Church of Christ exclude?
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dermdoc
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In reply to aggiedad20 • 4:16p, 4/6/21
AG
aggiedad20 said:
Matthew 28:18 And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth.

John 16:13However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come. 14 He will glorify Me, for He will take of what is Mine and declare it to you. 15 All things that the Father has are Mine. Therefore I said that He [c]will take of Mine and declare it to you.

Matthew 28:19-20 Go [c]therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 TEACHING THEM TO OBSERVE ALL THINGS THAT I HAVE COMMANDED YOU; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age."




What did Jesus command? I believe that was love God and love your neighbor.

And what does your church demand?
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PacifistAg
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In reply to diehard03 • 4:20p, 4/6/21
AG
diehard03 said:
Quote:
Matthew 7

21 "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?' 23 And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!'

I find it interesting that whenever this is used, it's always assumed by the referencer that they are part of the group that will allowed to enter into the kingdom of heaven.

What makes you so sure that you aren't the one practicing lawlessness?
Exactly. I asked if he thought it could be in reference to himself, but he conveniently didn't answer.
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PacifistAg
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In reply to aggiedad20 • 4:20p, 4/6/21
AG
aggiedad20 said:
diehard03 said:
Quote:
Matthew 7

21 "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?' 23 And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!'

I find it interesting that whenever this is used, it's always assumed by the referencer that they are part of the group that will allowed to enter into the kingdom of heaven.

What makes you so sure that you aren't the one practicing lawlessness?


So you agree Jesus does exclude some then?

Because a comment above said Jesus doesn't exclude anyone...

Why not answer the question rather than deflecting?
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dermdoc
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In reply to aggiedad20 • 4:22p, 4/6/21
AG
aggiedad20 said:
Matthew 7

21 "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?' 23 And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!'



That is Jesus saying that. Not you or the Church of Christ or any man.
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dermdoc
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In reply to aggiedad20 • 4:30p, 4/6/21
AG
aggiedad20 said:
PacifistAg said:
Who are you directing these at?


To everyone who believes that the NT church didn't have the whole counsel of God until 100s of years later?

And to anyone who believes that any old church will do...

Among others


May I ask what are your qualifications to condemn other Christians? Are you a preacher? Elder? Prophet?

Or just someone who likes to judge other Christians? And enjoy their imagined exclusive status?
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aggiedad20
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In reply to dermdoc • 9:06a, 4/7/21
dermdoc said:
aggiedad20 said:
PacifistAg said:
Who are you directing these at?


To everyone who believes that the NT church didn't have the whole counsel of God until 100s of years later?

And to anyone who believes that any old church will do...

Among others


May I ask what are your qualifications to condemn other Christians? Are you a preacher? Elder? Prophet?

Or just someone who likes to judge other Christians? And enjoy their imagined exclusive status?


I've never condemned another Christian. That's your high browed opinion. I despise some people's lack of knowledge of scripture which leads to division and confusion. Just like you were confused on the thief on the cross a long time ago. I tried to use the Bible to change your thinking, and for the most part did I think? Or maybe that was someone else. Doesn't matter. I've pointed out numerous errors on this board and always get a fight, but it's nothing personal. I'm sure everyone are good Ags, but division is disgusting, imo. Christ is not divided.
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dermdoc
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In reply to aggiedad20 • 9:23a, 4/7/21
AG
Agree.

So is the CofC exclusive or inclusive in your opinion? And is that divisive or not?

And you called me a liar for posting a link that said the CofC was a denomination, correct? Is that condemnation?
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PacifistAg
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In reply to dermdoc • 9:28a, 4/7/21
AG
Goodness, he has the audacity to accuse someone else of being "high browed".
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JoeM
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In reply to aggiedad20 • 2:39p, 4/15/21
Just curious...what was there before the Bible?
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one MEEN Ag
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In reply to JoeM • 2:46p, 4/15/21
AG
JoeM said:
Just curious...what was there before the Bible?
The Church



............of Christ!


The Church of Christ!












Welcome to this ongoing 'discussion' over the last few threads.
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ramblin_ag02
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In reply to JoeM • 2:58p, 4/15/21
AG
JoeM said:
Just curious...what was there before the Bible?
A mixed multitude just escaped from Egypt
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dermdoc
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In reply to JoeM • 3:30p, 4/15/21
AG
JoeM said:
Just curious...what was there before the Bible?
Also curious as to where are the churches of Christ in Turkey, Greece, Italy, and the Middle East where Christianity began?

They disappeared apparently until the Restoration and the Campbell/Stone movement.

And everybody on here is free to post their views and engage in civil discussion. No problem with that at all. But the constant personal attacks and ridicule still tick me off. Sorry and forgive me.
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swimmerbabe11
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In reply to ramblin_ag02 • 3:33p, 4/15/21
ramblin_ag02 said:
JoeM said:
Just curious...what was there before the Bible?
A mixed multitude just escaped from Egypt


I read "a minxed multitude"
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dermdoc
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In reply to swimmerbabe11 • 3:38p, 4/15/21
AG
swimmerbabe11 said:
ramblin_ag02 said:
JoeM said:
Just curious...what was there before the Bible?
A mixed multitude just escaped from Egypt


I read "a minxed multitude"
Interesting
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powerbelly
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In reply to dermdoc • 3:52p, 4/15/21
AG
dermdoc said:
JoeM said:
Just curious...what was there before the Bible?
Also curious as to where are the churches of Christ in Turkey, Greece, Italy, and the Middle East where Christianity began?

They disappeared apparently until the Restoration and the Campbell/Stone movement.

And everybody on here is free to post their views and engage in civil discussion. No problem with that at all. But the constant personal attacks and ridicule still tick me off. Sorry and forgive me.
More than certain SEC umpires?
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dermdoc
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In reply to powerbelly • 3:54p, 4/15/21
AG
Warming up for being in Arkansas tomorrow.

I need to be better.
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aggiedad20
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In reply to JoeM • 8:30p, 4/22/21
JoeM said:
Just curious...what was there before the Bible?


Have you ever tried reading the Bible? It's self explanatory and pretty much interprets itself. Or maybe you need a professional "pastor" to explain it to you since the entire NT was written by and to the upper echelon types

*eye roll*
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aggiedad20
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In reply to dermdoc • 8:34p, 4/22/21
dermdoc said:
aggiedad20 said:
PacifistAg said:
Who are you directing these at?


To everyone who believes that the NT church didn't have the whole counsel of God until 100s of years later?

And to anyone who believes that any old church will do...

Among others


May I ask what are your qualifications to condemn other Christians? Are you a preacher? Elder? Prophet?

Or just someone who likes to judge other Christians? And enjoy their imagined exclusive status?


Didn't like my answer doc? Lol

Nice deflection
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