*** THE ODYSSEY *** (Christopher Nolan)

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FL_Ag1998
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Quote:

Here are some spoiler-free points from a French critic who just saw The Odyssey:


- Compares its emotional journey home to Interstellar and its fragmented timeline to Dunkirk.




Oof, this one comment may actually concern me the most out of all of them. Dunkirk, to me, was the worst when it came to Nolan's little time swapping tendency. On first viewing of Dunkirk in the theater, I literally had no idea what the f*** was going on, because the movie jumped so much all over the place time wise. To me, that movie was an example of Nolan getting too fancy for his own good with his penchant for playing with time and I thought it hurt the movie.

FL_Ag1998
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AggieEP said:


If Alec Guinness can play a Saudi prince then certainly this woman can play Helen of Troy. Actors pretend to be other people that they really aren't.... that's the job. It might surprise you to find out the Chris Hemsworth isn't Norse. That Christian Bale didn't grow up in Gotham and that Tom Cruise isn't German. These are adults in costumes playing roles, not historical reenactors working for the Smithsonian..


First, your insistence on calling anyone who disagrees with you idiots just exemplifies what many of those so call "idiots" are complaining about in their posts.

Second, Alec Guinness playing an Arab was just as dumb as John Wayne playing a Mongol or any of the other examples of white people playing Asian, Hispanic or Arab characters back in the 50's and 60's. Please point to one post in this thread where anybody said those would be acceptable casting decisions today.

Third, your other comparisons are even lamer... our logic in the Odyssey casting dictates that Christian Bale wasn't from Gotham so he shouldn't have played Batman? You really think that's a fair comparison to the logic being implemented by those you call idiots? Really? Lol. I truly hope you can see the difference in Alec Guinness not being an Arab versus Bale not being from Gotham.

If all you have is name calling and extremely weak straw man arguments, you should probably just sit this out.
Lathspell
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PatAg said:

Doesnt help that they arent even really here to discuss movies/shows. One forum wasnt enough, need to have the same discussions in this one.


Lol... posts like this. So, because we have issues with a movie dipping its toe into the culture war, we arent here to discuss movies/shows? That's some sound logic, there!

You do realize the majority of us participate in MANY threads on this board where there are no culture war discussions? Same tired argument which takes zero brain power to make. Thank you for your contribution.

The way some people think just makes me laugh.
veryfuller
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We just keep going round and round. You and others think the casting means that it's a woke movie, others want to wait and see what Nolan actually made to decide. Can we just move on to normal release week conversation now?

I got my tickets for Thursday night and I'm going to 70mm in August. Interesting to see how much different the screenings will be on the different formats.
Tea Party
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veryfuller said:

We just keep going round and round. You and others think the casting means that it's a woke movie, others want to wait and see what Nolan actually made to decide. Can we just move on to normal release week conversation now?

I got my tickets for Thursday night and I'm going to 70mm in August. Interesting to see how much different the screenings will be on the different formats.

The Odyssey is likely going to do very well financially, and not have as many major issues as some make it out to be, but there certainly are questionable choices made known now that are worthy of discussion before the movie comes out. Nolan may get the benefit of the doutbt in most peoples eyes, but others may be more skeptical. Nothing wrong with either opinion.

If people don't want to discuss those things and would rather wait and see, no one is forcing them to join in on the discussion. They can wait and see just like you say.
wangus12
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Quote:

- Says it's one of the best peplums ever made, ranks it above Gladiator, and believes it will stand the test of time.
- Concludes that the film is "truly a remarkable achievement."
- Final rating: 4.55/5.

This guy rates Gladiator less than 91%. I don't think so pal.

Everyone seems to be mentioning the Circe scenes. Guess they go full body horror into the pig transformation of the crew.
Lathspell
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veryfuller said:

We just keep going round and round. You and others think the casting means that it's a woke movie, others want to wait and see what Nolan actually made to decide. Can we just move on to normal release week conversation now?

I got my tickets for Thursday night and I'm going to 70mm in August. Interesting to see how much different the screenings will be on the different formats.

Lol... I literally told you my opinion because you made a post acting like you want to actually have a good faith conversation. Now you're back to telling me what I think and completely ignoring what I actually said.

This is why these threads devolve into the poop-slinging. You are party to this.

I still bet you that, if the movie does end up being very good, posters will rush to this thread to act like that's some slam dunk on those criticizing the casting choices, ignoring the many times we've all said "we'll see" and "I hope it's good". 100% that happens.
M.C. Swag
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The other day I was just having dinner with my parents and I casually asked my dad (69 yrs old): "So are you excited about The Odyssey coming out soon?"

He's not a cinephile or anything but he's also not some hermit. When I was a younger, the first 3 movies he bought when we got our first DVD player were: Top Gun (obvs), The Matrix, and Gladiator. The man loves a big action movie and this is the biggest one in YEARS. Assumed it would be right up his alley...

But his response to my question was something I was completely unprepared for: "What's The Odyssey?"

WHAT IS THE ODYSSEY?! As in, he had NEVER HEARD OF THE STORY OF THE ODYSSEY. I'm not shocked he didn't read it, or even shocked he didn't know there was a movie coming out about it, but I am absolutely FLUMMOXED that he has never HEARD of Homer's Odyssey.

I told him the story is almost as old as he is and he should read it. He didn't like that part.

Anyways, just thought I'd share because it baffled me.
AggieEP
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FL_Ag1998 said:

AggieEP said:


If Alec Guinness can play a Saudi prince then certainly this woman can play Helen of Troy. Actors pretend to be other people that they really aren't.... that's the job. It might surprise you to find out the Chris Hemsworth isn't Norse. That Christian Bale didn't grow up in Gotham and that Tom Cruise isn't German. These are adults in costumes playing roles, not historical reenactors working for the Smithsonian..


First, your insistence on calling anyone who disagrees with you idiots just exemplifies what many of those so call "idiots" are complaining about in their posts.

Second, Alec Guinness playing an Arab was just as dumb as John Wayne playing a Mongol or any of the other examples of white people playing Asian, Hispanic or Arab characters back in the 50's and 60's. Please point to one post in this thread where anybody said those would be acceptable casting decisions today.

Third, your other comparisons are even lamer... our logic in the Odyssey casting dictates that Christian Bale wasn't from Gotham so he shouldn't have played Batman? You really think that's a fair comparison to the logic being implemented by those you call idiots? Really? Lol. I truly hope you can see the difference in Alec Guinness not being an Arab versus Bale not being from Gotham.

If all you have is name calling and extremely weak straw man arguments, you should probably just sit this out.



First, I used idiots in a general sense invoking it in the way one of our beloved posters on this board would use the term, I did not specifically call anyone an idiot or quote any specific posts. But since my post caught your attention, I guess you self identified.


Second, I don't think you understood what I wrote. My point was that what matters is the movie and the performances of the actors, not some imposed specificity on the national origin or skin color of the characters being played by the actors. You actually unintentionally helped make my point by reiterating the absurdity of caring if Bale is from Gotham. Sure casting a black woman to play what we might imagine to be a white woman is more of a change than casting a British man to play an American super hero, but at the end of the day Bale gives a good performance and I accept him as Batman. The job of the actor is to play the role, if this woman falls short and the movie is bad, let's judge her on those merits not purely on her skin color.

You just want to be upset at something, and this film has caught your fancy for the next couple of days. You likely won't even watch it, yet here you are as if the casting of a black woman in a bit role in a fantasy movie has personally aggrieved you. And I'll tell you that it's just as ridiculous when liberals mobilize against things like having Gal Gadot play Cleopatra because that character "should be black." I think most directors are just trying to make a good movie and they aren't the SJW crusaders that message boards make them out to be. They might lean more left than I do, but I am positive that they work hard to cast actors in order to make good movies. And if you look at Nolan's filmography, I think he's earned the benefit of the doubt.

FL_Ag1998
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AggieEP said:

FL_Ag1998 said:

AggieEP said:


If Alec Guinness can play a Saudi prince then certainly this woman can play Helen of Troy. Actors pretend to be other people that they really aren't.... that's the job. It might surprise you to find out the Chris Hemsworth isn't Norse. That Christian Bale didn't grow up in Gotham and that Tom Cruise isn't German. These are adults in costumes playing roles, not historical reenactors working for the Smithsonian..


First, your insistence on calling anyone who disagrees with you idiots just exemplifies what many of those so call "idiots" are complaining about in their posts.

Second, Alec Guinness playing an Arab was just as dumb as John Wayne playing a Mongol or any of the other examples of white people playing Asian, Hispanic or Arab characters back in the 50's and 60's. Please point to one post in this thread where anybody said those would be acceptable casting decisions today.

Third, your other comparisons are even lamer... our logic in the Odyssey casting dictates that Christian Bale wasn't from Gotham so he shouldn't have played Batman? You really think that's a fair comparison to the logic being implemented by those you call idiots? Really? Lol. I truly hope you can see the difference in Alec Guinness not being an Arab versus Bale not being from Gotham.

If all you have is name calling and extremely weak straw man arguments, you should probably just sit this out.



First, I used idiots in a general sense invoking it in the way one of our beloved posters on this board would use the term, I did not specifically call anyone an idiot or quote any specific posts. But since my post caught your attention, I guess you self identified.


Second, I don't think you understood what I wrote. My point was that what matters is the movie and the performances of the actors, not some imposed specificity on the national origin or skin color of the characters being played by the actors. You actually unintentionally helped make my point by reiterating the absurdity of caring if Bale is from Gotham. Sure casting a black woman to play what we might imagine to be a white woman is more of a change than casting a British man to play an American super hero, but at the end of the day Bale gives a good performance and I accept him as Batman. The job of the actor is to play the role, if this woman falls short and the movie is bad, let's judge her on those merits not purely on her skin color.

You just want to be upset at something, and this film has caught your fancy for the next couple of days. You likely won't even watch it, yet here you are as if the casting of a black woman in a bit role in a fantasy movie has personally aggrieved you. And I'll tell you that it's just as ridiculous when liberals mobilize against things like having Gal Gadot play Cleopatra because that character "should be black." I think most directors are just trying to make a good movie and they aren't the SJW crusaders that message boards make them out to be. They might lean more left than I do, but I am positive that they work hard to cast actors in order to make good movies. And if you look at Nolan's filmography, I think he's earned the benefit of the doubt.




Thanks for doubling down on the insults and proving your quality. Lol.

You're clearly new to this thread or you'd have seen my numerous posts from weeks (even months ago) about how big a Nolan fan I am and regardless of my trepidation I'll still be checking this out and hoping it holds up to his previous movies. You'd also have a clearer, more informed understanding of my grievances with what this film is shaping up to be. But you don't care about that, you just want to generalize and throw insults.

Again, you should probably sit this one out instead of jumping in this late in the comversation solely to show how enlightened you are compared to the rest of us (in your mind, of course).
Thunderstruck xx
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We did it boys! Page 70! I feel like this thing is going to 100 before the release date.

FL_Ag1998
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Thunderstruck xx said:

We did it boys! Page 70! I feel like this thing is going to 100 before the release date.




Oh man, that would be thirty in less than a week...nah, no way. I'll take the under on that.
Sea Speed
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Plot twist

Thunderstruck xx
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FL_Ag1998 said:

Thunderstruck xx said:

We did it boys! Page 70! I feel like this thing is going to 100 before the release date.




Oh man, that would be thirty in less than a week...nah, no way. I'll take the under on that.


We just need to talk more about how much woke culture war stuff is in The Odyssey. That'll get it rolling.

And more 50 x-posts in a row about movie reactions.
veryfuller
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Lathspell said:

veryfuller said:

We just keep going round and round. You and others think the casting means that it's a woke movie, others want to wait and see what Nolan actually made to decide. Can we just move on to normal release week conversation now?

I got my tickets for Thursday night and I'm going to 70mm in August. Interesting to see how much different the screenings will be on the different formats.

Lol... I literally told you my opinion because you made a post acting like you want to actually have a good faith conversation. Now you're back to telling me what I think and completely ignoring what I actually said.

This is why these threads devolve into the poop-slinging. You are party to this.

I still bet you that, if the movie does end up being very good, posters will rush to this thread to act like that's some slam dunk on those criticizing the casting choices, ignoring the many times we've all said "we'll see" and "I hope it's good". 100% that happens.

I'm not ignoring you. I am summarizing you and myself, oversimplifying on purpose because the thread is just a merry-go-round at this point with everyone repeating the same arguments. And I think we had a good back and forth. The problem is there are other people on the thread who would rather this devolve into name calling and scoring points for their team (on both sides).

I reject that I am party to the "poop-slinging". In fact, I do carefully try not to personalize any of my responses but to focus on arguments and ideas and not the people posting them.

And there are for sure going to be people who come back and dunk if the movies is good, just as there will be people who will, no matter how good the movie is, come back and say they were right it was a woke movie based on whatever flavor of woke they can identify in the movie because they have already decided it is going to be that. But I do think there are reasonable people on both sides of the argument who aren't here to score points and want to actually discuss the movie.

veryfuller
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You know what, this exact thing happened to me with my dad the other day. I guess they just didn't teach it to him in his school growing up, but I feel like I started learning stuff from the Odyssey in like 4th or 5th grade.
Cliff.Booth
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AggieEP
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I'm surprised that saying "we should judge the actors by their performances and the film on its own merits" registers as an attempt at an "enlightened" position in your mind. I thought that was just a common sense position to take in the midst of the asinine back and forth on this thread.

All I've posted is that any perceived grievance over the ethnicity of actors is a stupid thing to get caught up in and that we should judge the film on its own merits and the actors by the quality of their performances. That's all I'm doubling down on. It's literally the simplest argument of all time, not some attempt at haughty enlightened talk.
AggieEP
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Lathspell said:

PatAg said:

Doesnt help that they arent even really here to discuss movies/shows. One forum wasnt enough, need to have the same discussions in this one.


Lol... posts like this. So, because we have issues with a movie dipping its toe into the culture war, we arent here to discuss movies/shows? That's some sound logic, there!

You do realize the majority of us participate in MANY threads on this board where there are no culture war discussions? Same tired argument which takes zero brain power to make. Thank you for your contribution.

The way some people think just makes me laugh.

Because I'm curious, what makes you so sure that Nolan is trying to get involved in the culture war? Has he outwardly stated anything that makes you believe that statement to be true?

PatAg is 100% spot on, F16 has it's own long thread on this film already discussing the perceived political implications of the film, and it doesn't take too much thinking to see that a few of the regular posters over there decided to come over here to troll the entertainment board.
Cliff.Booth
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I wonder why they don't do that on most other threads here.
MW03
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Sea Speed said:

Plot twist




Imagine getting hit with this immediately


CheeseSndwch
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I mean to be fair one is from a battle scene and the other is from what appears to be a hunting scene.
AggieEP
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Cliff.Booth said:

I wonder why they don't do that on most other threads here.

You don't think that the 8 page thread started a couple of days ago on F16 (Latest woke movie (Odyssey) - screening critics - another incoming bomb) has anything to do with some of the characters that suddenly popped up here? https://texags.com/forums/16/topics/3613954

I value my time too much to do the research on this, but when an movie related thread pops up on F16, it doesn't take long for the thread on this board relating to the same film to devolve into nothing but political talk.

And for the reason why they aren't on other threads... pretty obvious, until their bat signal is lit over there on F16 they don't bother over here for the most part.
Hardcore Greg
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Cliff.Booth said:

Except for that I try to keep my angst directed at the choices in the movie rather than at people who see it the other way. You're the one who doesn't seem to be able to disagree without always wanting to make it personal and name-call, again which is why you've gone to banned camp multiple times in the past. The last few days on here you've labeled like half the people posting weird, deranged, desperate, stupid, etc etc. Do yourself a favor and relax. **** isn't worth getting riled up and insulting people all the time.

When men live by themselves, they get used to having their way over time...they have a system, everything is on their time, their preferences are always met. They get impatient and frustrated outside of their little isolated world. I think this is a large part of the problem with the attitude of many in Hollywood...they're self absorbed little babies, but those with families, or at least a serious significant other get "broken" in a good way over time.

Having a family humbles you, you finally have to let go and realize that your preferences are almost never met, but that's ok. It is constant curveballs and lots of inconvenience...but it's more than worth it. Hell, just having a wife or girlfiend changes you in the same way. I think all of this applies to women as well.

You may debate others or have differing opinions, but that's ok it doesn't shatter your world or spike your blood pressure. It doesn't send you into an unhealthy fit. Hoping that a few on here can realize this and do a self-inventory of sorts. Realizing that there is a problem is the first step, and then you can make the necessary adjustments.
CheeseSndwch
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The bat signal went up the second people started commenting/posting/generalizing about F16 in this thread.
Thunderstruck xx
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CheeseSndwch said:

The bat signal went up the second people started commenting/posting/generalizing about F16 in this thread.


That's correct. As soon as people started mentioning the woke casting choices, they were labeled as F16-ers as if it was some kind of insult before the F16 thread was made.
zap
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Hardcore Greg
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AggieEP said:

To a certain extent these discussions on casting have always existed, but at the end of the day a film was judged on its merits and not on the ethnic accuracy of the casting.

The problem, as the late great FAST FRED always reminded us is that the Internet has allowed the village idiots out of their villages to express their opinions. Now before we can even see a new show or movie there are thousands of rage baiting idiots looking for reasons to be offended. When they find something, they race to their computers to gleefully declare how offended they are. The result has mostly been that it has sucked the fun and the wonder out of movies because I'm fatigued of hearing all the stupid chatter surrounding a film before it even comes out.

If Alec Guinness can play a Saudi prince then certainly this woman can play Helen of Troy. Actors pretend to be other people that they really aren't.... that's the job. It might surprise you to find out the Chris Hemsworth isn't Norse. That Christian Bale didn't grow up in Gotham and that Tom Cruise isn't German. These are adults in costumes playing roles, not historical reenactors working for the Smithsonian.

It's a different discussion to an extent if Nolan queered all the characters as that might substantively change the plot and theme, but the skin color of a person pretending to be a mythical person is a nothing burger.

To be fair, there is so much advance detailed PR and leaks with regards to major blockbuster movies compared to back in the day that it is a completely different world. They may have hyped "Batman" up a year in advance of it's release but it was basically just the logo and merch everywhere. There wasn't a constant stream of internet discussions and click bait stories about casting choices. The entire hollywood hype/critic business model is different now.

There is a lot of fodder for discussion nowadays, for just about any movie...especially when it turns out they cast a woman who looks like an African princess to play Helen of Troy in ancient Greece and a FIVE FOOT ONE female to play a Greek Warrior. That is going to garner some discussion. Not sure why people can't just deal with it.

There is a lot more discussion around movies nowadays because there are a million online accounts dedicated to discussing movies and releasing information (not always accurate...like Elliot Page playing Achilles).

The sheer volume of information and tweets that TCTTS (I actually appreciate this from him) is able to share on any given movie is staggering, compared to how it used to be.
FL_Ag1998
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AggieEP said:

I'm surprised that saying "we should judge the actors by their performances and the film on its own merits" registers as an attempt at an "enlightened" position in your mind. I thought that was just a common sense position to take in the midst of the asinine back and forth on this thread.

All I've posted is that any perceived grievance over the ethnicity of actors is a stupid thing to get caught up in and that we should judge the film on its own merits and the actors by the quality of their performances. That's all I'm doubling down on. It's literally the simplest argument of all time, not some attempt at haughty enlightened talk.


I could certainly be wrong with all of the thousands of posts over these seventy pages, but I don't recall anybody judging any of the actor's performances in The Odyssey, because nobody here has seen those performances yet. The complaints are not about the actor's performances or potential performances. It's about the casting of certain actors and or potential motivations behind those casting decisions.

And many of those raising complaints or concerns state that they will still see the movie and judge it on its own merits at that point.

And you can backtrack all you want, but your initial post in fact called many of the posters on here "rage baiting idiots".

Hardcore Greg
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AggieEP said:

Lathspell said:

PatAg said:

Doesnt help that they arent even really here to discuss movies/shows. One forum wasnt enough, need to have the same discussions in this one.


Lol... posts like this. So, because we have issues with a movie dipping its toe into the culture war, we arent here to discuss movies/shows? That's some sound logic, there!

You do realize the majority of us participate in MANY threads on this board where there are no culture war discussions? Same tired argument which takes zero brain power to make. Thank you for your contribution.

The way some people think just makes me laugh.

Because I'm curious, what makes you so sure that Nolan is trying to get involved in the culture war? Has he outwardly stated anything that makes you believe that statement to be true?

PatAg is 100% spot on, F16 has it's own long thread on this film already discussing the perceived political implications of the film, and it doesn't take too much thinking to see that a few of the regular posters over there decided to come over here to troll the entertainment board.

In today's climate, casting Lupita to play Helen of Troy is enough to make one wonder if he has succumbed to the culture wars to some degree. It is well known that many casting choices are made to fill racial quotas nowadays, and I can see how this casting decision gives that impression.

I have no problem with Lupita, or her skin color. Some of us are just sick of the DEI stuff and are supicious of CN's motivations here.

Also, Most of us frequent the Entertanment board and were aware of this thread long before the one on F16. In fact, I don't see a single outsider who isn't a regular on this board.
Hardcore Greg
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CheeseSndwch said:

The bat signal went up the second people started commenting/posting/generalizing about F16 in this thread.




No one from F16 is on this thread who isn't also a regular here. Me, Urban Ag, Cliff.Booth, Lathspell...all regularly post over here. I haven;t spotted a single outside or newcomer to be honest.

Hardcore Greg
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Cliff.Booth said:



Homeboy's geared up for Texas Ren Fest

CharleyKerfeld
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Hardcore Greg said:

Cliff.Booth said:



Homeboy's geared up for Texas Ren Fest



1,6,2,5,3,4
CheeseSndwch
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HRC!? This thread has got everything.
Cliff.Booth
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Hardcore Greg said:

Cliff.Booth said:



Homeboy's geared up for Texas Ren Fest




Which one of those is you, Greg?
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