Entertainment
Sponsored by

Fahrenheit 9/11

3,403 Views | 83 Replies | Last: 21 yr ago by
Aggie94
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Who's Juan -- here you go:
http://www.cnn.com/2004/SHOWBIZ/Movies/06/23/film.fahrenheit911.r.ap/

LOS ANGELES, California (AP) -- Michael Moore and his distributors lost their appeal Tuesday to lower the R rating for "Fahrenheit 9/11," his scathing assault on President Bush's actions before and after the September 11 attacks.

Lions Gate Films and IFC Films, the movie's distributors, said an appeals board for the Motion Picture Association of America rejected their request to reduce the rating to PG-13.

The R rating prohibits those 17 and younger from seeing "Fahrenheit 9/11" without an adult.

Moore urged younger teenagers to go see the film anyway. "I encourage all teenagers to come see my movie, by any means necessary. If you need me to sneak you in, let me know," he said.

"Fahrenheit 9/11," which won the top honor at last month's Cannes Film Festival, depicts the White House as asleep at the wheel before the Sept. 11 attacks. Moore accuses Bush of fanning fears of future terrorism to win public support for the Iraq war.

The movie was rated R for "violent and disturbing images and for language." The images include an Iraqi man tossing a dead baby into a truckload of bodies, Iraqis burned by napalm and a public beheading in Saudi Arabia.

"Today was a classic example of how the ratings system works to benefit parents, for whom the ratings system was designed," MPAA chief Jack Valenti said.

Tom Ortenberg, president of Lions Gate Films, had argued to the appeals board that 15- and 16-year-olds should be free to see the film on their own because they could end up in military service in Iraq in the next few years.

"I hope the R rating doesn't have a large impact on the box office," Ortenberg said. "I've spoken with many parents, including some on the appeals board, who absolutely said they are going to take their children to see the film. We'll just have to hope the teenagers we're encouraging to see this picture find their way in through parents or adult guardians."

"Fahrenheit 9/11" opens in limited release in New York on Wednesday and nationwide in about 850 theaters Friday.

Jonathan Sehring, president of IFC Films, said the R rating could reduce the film's theatrical revenues by 10 to 20 percent.

The distributors had hoped the appeals board "would step back and see the bigger picture and importance of this film, and one of the key audiences that this film should be seen by," Sehring said. "Some of the images are disturbing, but in a year or two, if kids are off to war, they're going to be faced with those disturbing images for real."

Last-minute challenges to movie ratings are not uncommon, said MPAA spokesman Richard Taylor. The timing depends on how soon before theatrical release the movie is presented to the MPAA for initial rating, he said.

Films are rated by a panel of parents or those with parenting experience. If a distributor challenges the rating, it is screened for an appeals board of Hollywood workers, which also hears oral arguments from the distributor.

The ratings squabble came after a row Moore had with Disney, which refused to let subsidiary Miramax distribute "Fahrenheit 9/11," saying the movie was too politically charged.

Miramax bosses Harvey and Bob Weinstein bought back the film from Disney and lined up Lions Gate and IFC to help release it.

Noble Men
How long do you want to ignore this user?
quote:
I'll say it. I would steal $9 from Michael Moore before I would pay him $9.

Now excuse me while I go print my study guide on the office printer.


Very clever response.
Aggie99
How long do you want to ignore this user?
quote:
I'm curious to see it...if I do I'll just buy a ticket to another movie and go to it instead. No way am I going to financially support Mr. Moore.


Now your talking!!!!
Whos Juan
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Aggie 94, cool. I have to think that he was speaking in gest. At least I hope
1
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Who's Juan?:

NO, he wasn't speaking in JEST.

He wants kids to be persuaded to have his views.

He's not going to let a little thing like theft of service get in the way of that.
AggieBaseball05
How long do you want to ignore this user?
quote:
I'm curious to see it...if I do I'll just buy a ticket to another movie and go to it instead. No way am I going to financially support Mr. Moore.



haha thats great!!
Easy 8
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Mikhial Moore is encouraging theivery!!!!

Where is Tanya's indignation now?
Aggie94
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Here's another article that was in Newsweek:

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/5251769/site/newsweek/

June 28, 2004 issue - Can Michael Moore be believed? It is a question more than a few moviegoers may be asking this week as his new documentary, "Fahrenheit 9/11," hits theaters. Like Moore's previous works, the movie is a melange of investigative journalism, partisan commentary and conspiracy theories. A run-down of some of Moore's most provocative allegations, and how they stack up against the record:

Bush's initial response to the 9/11 attacks. Moore has unearthed video showing Bush attending a photo op in a second-grade classroom in Sarasota, Fla., when chief of staff Andrew Card whispers in his ear: "America is under attack." Card told a TV interviewer in 2002 that the president got up from the classroom "not that many seconds later." Moore's video depicts a seemingly shaken Bush continuing to sit in the classroom for seven agonizing minutes, even reading to the children from a book, "My Pet Goat." The movie suggests Bush reads from the book because he is uncertain about what to do. A report this week by the federal panel investigating 9/11 confirms Bush did remain in the classroom "for another five to seven minutes." It also offers Bush's account: "The president felt he should project strength and calm until he could better understand what was happening," the report states.

Saudi flights out of the United States. The movie claims that in the days after 9/11, when airspace was shut down, the White House approved special charter flights so that prominent Saudis—including members of the bin Laden family—could leave the country. Author Craig Unger appears, claiming that bin Laden family members were never interviewed by the FBI. Not true, according to a recent report from the 9/11 panel. The report confirms that six chartered airplanes flew 142 mostly Saudi nationals out of the country, including one carrying members of the bin Laden family. But the flights didn't begin until Sept. 14—after airspace reopened. Moreover, the report states the Saudi flights were screened by the FBI, and 22 of the 26 people on the bin Laden flight were interviewed. None had any links to terrorism.

The Bush-bin Laden family connection. Moore's film suggests that Bush has close family ties to the bin Laden family—principally through Bush's father's relationship with the Carlyle Group, a private investment firm. The president's father, George H.W. Bush, was a senior adviser to the Carlyle Group's Asian affiliate until recently; members of the bin Laden family—who own one of Saudi Arabia's biggest construction firms—had invested $2 million in a Carlyle Group fund. Bush Sr. and the bin Ladens have since severed ties with the Carlyle Group, which in any case has a bipartisan roster of partners, including Bill Clinton's former SEC chairman Arthur Levitt. The movie quotes author Dan Briody claiming that the Carlyle Group "gained" from September 11 because it owned United Defense, a military contractor. Carlyle Group spokesman Chris Ullman notes that United Defense holds a special distinction among U.S. defense contractors that is not mentioned in Moore's movie: the firm's $11 billion Crusader artillery rocket system developed for the U.S. Army is one of the only weapons systems canceled by the Bush administration.


----------
"you understand, we are tied down to a language which makes up in obscurity what it lacks in style."

-- Player, _Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are Dead_


BIG NASTY 91
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Good movie. Thought provoking. If you are undecided, you should go see this movie. If you are pro Bush you should see this movie.
Parts of the movie were very moving. Very touching.
Some were heavy handed. I would give the movie high ratings.
Orlando Ayala Cant Read
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Big Nasty got it right. Look.....Moore doesnt make up anything in the movie. Yes he is trying to get his point across, but facts are facts and he points em out.

I saw it in CS tonight and was shocked to see it get a rousing standing ovation.

Excellent film though.

However, I find it hard to believe that the stubborn supporters of GWB will change their minds after watching this. There could be proof that Bush was guilty of the most vile crimes and they would still think of him as God, so I wouldnt count on them changing their minds. I dont think anyone who has any real convictions will change their mind one way or the other after watching a film like this.

If you are completely undecided though and have no earthly idea about Iraq and the Bush administration, this might be a starting point to where you cast your vote.

[This message has been edited by Orlando Ayala Cant Read (edited 6/26/2004 10:35a).]
Aggie99
How long do you want to ignore this user?
I hope no one is dumb enough to make their political decision/vote based on what they saw in a movie theater.

PLUM LOCO
How long do you want to ignore this user?
^
|
|
|
AMEN...
BostonAg74
How long do you want to ignore this user?
quote:
I hope no one is dumb enough to make their political decision/vote based on what they saw in a movie theater.



I hope no one is dumb enough to make their political choices based on something they saw in a carefully edited, candidate endorsed, and intentionally misleading attack advertisement produced by a Presidential campaign.

Someone explain to me why Michael Moore is "lying" when he edits film to support his point of view, but it's all just fun and games when a presidential candidate's campaign does the same thing. I'm taking my family to see F-9/11 today, and I'd be surprised if I didn't find that there is less "lying" and misleading information in this two hour film than there is in ten minutes of candidate endorsed political advertising.

If truth is the issue here, and not politics, then where's the outrage over ads produced by a lying P.O.S. like David Bossie and his Citizens United group?
1
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Have all you supporters of the movie been watching interviews with Moore on the big 3 networks that grill him about his creative editing?

Like a previous poster, someone could make a movie that makes the pope look like a serial killer.

Not suprised that liberals would base their political decision on a movie.
Scream Leader
How long do you want to ignore this user?
I saw the movie last night... I paid for another movie and snuck in because 9/11 was sold out anyway.

The movie was entertaining but it was so one sided that I actually think there are some people who will be turned off by it...

The movie was a powerful propaganda tool, but who it benefits or not - who knows?

Interesting thing, I saw it at the Dobie in Austin, the crowd was more subdued than I thought they'd be... there was one poor little rich girl who started to lecture the audience about "changing our lifestyles"... we told her that it was time to change her bong water and she shut up.

Michael Moore is becoming more like a professional wrestler than a filmmaker. He is the "bad guy" who, when he enters the ring, will push everyone's buttons in order to make you hate him. He is a caricature.
hamilton
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Michael Wilson has a made a documentary called "Michael Moore Hates America". It is coming out soon and it described as a film that points how you can edit and splice whatever you want in a documentary to fit your agenda (i.e. propaganda). This was being made before F911 by the way. Go to the website Michael Moore Hates America.com if you are interested and the see the tralier.
BostonAg74
How long do you want to ignore this user?
You do realize that the michaelmoorehatesamerica film is being bankrolled by an Internet porn king, don't you?
LoneStarFree
How long do you want to ignore this user?
^
'
'
'
'
So what does that have to do with anything?
ATM9000
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Moore points out the facts. He obviously has an agenda when he points them out, but who cares? Convservatives and liberals need to understand the issues without seeing this movie and get over his "propaganda." Every politician and activist has an agenda. Why is it different when it happens to be him?

While I don't necessarily agree with his entire agenda, I applaud the man for at least questioning a war that looks more and more shady as things develop instead of falling in line as a yes man to Washington.
HOLDEN, M. D.
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Just got done seeing it. Wow I could write a book on all the inaccuaracies.

Moore does a great job of making it look like 2 ppl are having a conversation usually making 1 person (or both) look bad.

He even somehow associated Enron with Bush. And then ambushing the congressmen, just pathetic.
brotherruss
How long do you want to ignore this user?
On supposed inaccuracies see:

http://www.michaelmoore.com/mustread/f911facts/isikoff.php

B Blessed

R U S S
NoACDamnit
How long do you want to ignore this user?
quote:
He even somehow associated Enron with Bush


Yeah, it's not as if Ken Lay was one of the Bush family's biggest contributers of all time or anything... No connection between the Bushes and Enron...
HOLDEN, M. D.
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Ahhhh yes Ken Lay.

It is also a well known fact that Lay contributed (while not as heavily) to the democrats. Lay and Enron got busted and did they get off b/c Bush was president? Yeah I didn't think so either. Did you know that Ken Lay gave 100,000 dollars to the Anderson Cancer Center at Texas A&M University?

Does that clearly prove all cancer patients were in collusion with Enron? Maybe b/c he gave to A&M as well and I am an Aggie I am responsible? It is these far fetched reaches that Moore makes that absolve himself of any credibility

If you are going to link the fall of enron to Bush b/c they donated money then committed a crime then don't forget about Charlie Trie (sp?), the Buddhist monks, Kerry's new felon friend, etc.

Listen, fact of the matter is Moore was trying to make a broad stroke with his brush and blame EVERYTHING on Bush.


edit: Sorry wanted to provide proof enron gave to the democrats. At least 400,000 to the Democratic Senators Convention http://www.opensecrets.org/alerts/conventions/dem2.asp?Cmte=



[This message has been edited by HOLDENc. (edited 6/27/2004 12:23p).]
HOLDEN, M. D.
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Ok another inaccuracy that chapped my hide.


He talks about all the news channels calling Florida for Gore (incorrectly of course which Moore doesn't point out). Then he says all of the sudden the biased FoxNews, who Moore points out has a cousin of Bush's running the whole thing, declares Florida (correctly) for Bush.

Moore asks how is it possible that all the news stations called FL for Gore then a biased station (Fox) calls it for Bush and then all of the sudden Bush becomes president b/c of it?


Ironically enough Fox was the only one to get it right even though it was "biased" as Moore points out. Maybe another way to look at is they were the only one not biased.

Then Moore goes on to bring out the race card pointing out that blacks were "disenfranchised". I wanted to die here. They said they couldn't find a senator to support them, "They are all missing". The Democrats were the majority party at the time, so most of the ppl in the room were racists according to Moore.


Also he talks about Ashcroft losing the battle in Missouri to "a dead guy". Ironically enough if you remember Ashcroft was ahead in the polls until Mel died essentially pulling in a sympathy vote. Do you remember the Democrats using his funeral as a pulpit? Getting back on track Mel's wife (jeanine?) took over in the race and Ashcroft lost to her and what was obviously a large sympathy swing due to Mel's unfortunate death.

OMG I could go on for days about this movie.

Watch the eagle soar...that was some funny ****.

[This message has been edited by HOLDENc. (edited 6/27/2004 11:58a).]
HOLDEN, M. D.
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Ok sorry another glaring discrepancy.

He refers to "Daddy's suuuuupreme court" as giving the election to W. I decided to look back at the Supreme Court history and the elder Bush appointed TWO of the NINE justices. One was the "disenfranchised" (I'm obviously joking here) Clarence Thomas, the other was the biggest turncoat mother****er of all time ( http://www.aim.org/media_monitor_print/302_0_2_0/ ) David Souter. Souter and Thomas cancel each other out as far as bias are concerned. Heck Clinton appointed TWO actually in the democrat's corner, Ginsburg and Breyer. Gore served as VP for Clinton for two terms as you know so you would think the fact that they actually got two in their corner would make the "Suuuuuupreme Court" a little bit more of their own.
HOLDEN, M. D.
How long do you want to ignore this user?
The Coalition of the Willing!!!!


Another thing popped into my head. Moore started listing the least influential members of the Coalition: Palau, Costa Rica, The Netherlands, and Afghanistan.

Which looks a lot better than England, Spain (not a member anymore), Australia, Japan, South Korea, Poland, Portugal, Italy, Turkey, Kuwait, Phillipines, etc.

Uniformed Americans will come away thinking only are troops are in Iraq. While we have more over there than anyone there are still a substantial number from England and others. Even in the face of the beheading of one of their own, SK is sending in thousands more. We are far from alone.
BostonAg74
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Bush allowed Ken Lay to hand pick the chairman of the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission (his good friend Pat Wood), and Wood is still up to no good when it comes to Enron: http://www.consumerwatchdog.org/utilities/fs/fs004379.php3
GoAgs92
How long do you want to ignore this user?
It's easy to distort a fact...for example if you take my quote.

Michael Moore is very smart for a person with a 55 IQ.

and edit off the end

Michael Moore is very smart...

you have turned a "fact" into a lie all with good editing.

so the people that say the facts are the facts don't really get how this movie was made.
BostonAg74
How long do you want to ignore this user?
I cannot think of any technique that Moore used or is accused of using that has not also been used repeatedly in the Bush campaign's attack ads. Moore is no more guilty of distortion and lies than the Republican National Committee.

I saw the movie, and much of it was vintage Michael Moore: overly dramatic and not to be taken too seriously. However, the most damning segments were simply video clips of Bush being Bush. No lies. No clever editing. Simply straight video of a man who is obviously in way over his head.

[This message has been edited by BostonAg74 (edited 6/27/2004 5:10p).]
Hong Kong Paul
How long do you want to ignore this user?

quote:
It is also a well known fact that Lay contributed (while not as heavily) to the democrats. Lay and Enron got busted and did they get off b/c Bush was president? Yeah I didn't think so either. Did you know that Ken Lay gave 100,000 dollars to the Anderson Cancer Center at Texas A&M University?

Does that clearly prove all cancer patients were in collusion with Enron? Maybe b/c he gave to A&M as well and I am an Aggie I am responsible? It is these far fetched reaches that Moore makes that absolve himself of any credibility


This has got to be the most far-fetched thing I've ever seen posted on this board.
Oh yeah, why don't you tell me how much Lay contributed to the Republicans and Democrats respectively, just curious.

No connections? Wow.
BIG NASTY 91
How long do you want to ignore this user?
I think the coalition of the willing is like Conference USA. Nice, but certainly not the creme de la creme.
I would recommend the movie. It is what it is. Moore does not like Bush, but you cannot avoid the raw human emotions that the film elicits.

I withdraw my previous comments if they insinuated that you should decide to vote for after seeing the movie. You should decide to vote for either man, depending on how you feel about him. Yet, I think you should be informed by as many different opinions as you can find. From the left, right and center. Then decide.
Hong Kong Paul
How long do you want to ignore this user?
^
|
|
|
exactly.

What gets me is that Republicans who know nothing about Moore and refuse to learn anything just assume that since he doesn't like Bush, he likes Clinton so they're always like "well, Clinton did this" but if you read his books you'll find plenty of stuff he exposed about Clinton as well.
mhayden_original
How long do you want to ignore this user?
One of the commentators on one of the major news channels made a point about this movie that I agreed with completely... Yes, it may be one-sided and from a certain person's "point of view" -- but anything that gets the general public actually taking a closer look at politics is a good thing.

What we need now is a pro-Bush movie that is skewed to the right, and so on and so on.

The vast majority of people don't read newspapers, books, really look at different people's stances on the issues, or anything really that should go into voting on a presidential candidate... Having movies like this from both sides I think would go a long way into giving the public at least *SOME* education on who these candidates are and what they stand for.

Hands down the best part of the movie was the last quote though. I'm pretty much anti-Bush, but certainly not Kerry fan... But that last quote just made me laugh my way out of the theater...

Fool me once, shame on............... Shame on... you.

But you aren't going to fool me again.


Classic.
Whoop05
How long do you want to ignore this user?
I think the movie you're looking for is "Michael Moore Hates America." Or that's as close as you're going to get. Personally, I don't plan to see the movie. I think Moore's a jackarse and I'd rather not give a dime to him.
DeangeloVickers
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Michael Moore obviously knows all and has more information then all of our government, Clinton and Bush's staff, and of course everyone in America..His camera sees the WHOLE truth..
This movie should just be seen as a thought provoking movie..
Anywho who takes it more than this is ignorant...


[This message has been edited by 12thmanClass01 (edited 6/28/2004 8:41a).]
Page 2 of 3
 
×
subscribe Verify your student status
See Subscription Benefits
Trial only available to users who have never subscribed or participated in a previous trial.