Urban Ag said:

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I think what you're failing to see is that most people really don't want politics in their fun at all. As a right winger, I don't need a right wing message in my fun. At all.

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That's the thing, though. What you consider straightforward entertainment, woke Hollywood would consider "problematic" (just go back and re-read all of the reactions to Top Gun Mav on Twitter and Reddit). You just saw a fun, cool, action-packed popcorn flick that made an insane amount of money...what the Left saw was a nationalistic military-industrial complex propaganda piece. The fact that an aging white hero saved America from foreign enemies and that any "underrepresented" characters didn't take the lead is problematic. You didn't think it was political, but to them it is, and it was wrong, and they hated that it made money.

I'd agree, something did happen. Look at the uproar over the Little Mermaid just because it cast a black Ariel. As if mermaids were some real thing that exclusively had white skin to begin with. Who cares if she's black? What does it really matter? But for some people it clearly did.

Rocag said:

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I'd agree, something did happen. Look at the uproar over the Little Mermaid just because it cast a black Ariel. As if mermaids were some real thing that exclusively had white skin to begin with. Who cares if she's black? What does it really matter? But for some people it clearly did.

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Now we found some common ground. The uproar was ridiculous. Could not agree more.

You think the average, conservative, white, hetero, male gave two sh**s about this? I've never even seen the original. I don't have daughters and my wife isn't some Disnerd, so why would I?

I could be wrong, I doubt I am, but I think 90% of the uproar was white Karens in the suburbs holding on to some nostalgia factor from their childhoods.

Cliff.Booth said:

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Urban Ag said:

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I think what you're failing to see is that most people really don't want politics in their fun at all. As a right winger, I don't need a right wing message in my fun. At all.

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That's the thing, though. What you consider straightforward entertainment, woke Hollywood would consider "problematic" (just go back and re-read all of the reactions to Top Gun Mav on Twitter and Reddit). You just saw a fun, cool, action-packed popcorn flick that made an insane amount of money...what the Left saw was a nationalistic military-industrial complex propaganda piece. The fact that an aging white hero saved America from foreign enemies and that any "underrepresented" characters didn't take the lead is problematic. You didn't think it was political, but to them it is, and it was wrong, and they hated that it made money.

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I think Top Gun was somewhat of a military-industrial complex propaganda piece AND a very cool, great movie. They don't have to be mutually exclusive.

It's 2 hour commercial for the Navy, but it's a sick commercial.

While I think it's unnecessary to have changed her look, I don't think that's why it failed. Sure, some actual racists didn't like that part. The same people who weren't jazzed about this new Little Mermaid really loved Moana and Coco. How do you explain that? Selective racism?

I am left and read supposedly liberal news, the left was not "troubled" by Top Gun politics in any significant way. It was even nominated for best picture by the uber-left academy. Only minor gripe I had was the typical bowing down to China that is unavoidable these days.

Personally I despise the whole "let's make a live action remake of every cartoon we've ever made" aspect and I doubt I'm the only one. But beyond that, conservatives were out in full force well before the movie even came out deriding it as being woke.

And did it really "fail"? Looks like it still made $300 million more than it cost to produce.

Some Junkie Cosmonaut said:

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Good thing you guys aren't biased…

Another Doug said:

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I am left and read supposedly liberal news, the left was not "troubled" by Top Gun politics in any significant way. It was even nominated for best picture by the uber-left academy. Only minor gripe I had was the typical bowing down to China that is unavoidable these days.

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Rocag said:

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Personally I despise the whole "let's make a live action remake of every cartoon we've ever made" aspect and I doubt I'm the only one. But beyond that, conservatives were out in full force well before the movie even came out deriding it as being woke.

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I don't know what you are trying to say.

Rocag said:

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I'd agree, something did happen. Look at the uproar over the Little Mermaid just because it cast a black Ariel. As if mermaids were some real thing that exclusively had white skin to begin with. Who cares if she's black? What does it really matter? But for some people it clearly did.

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I think the problem the relatively few, but vocal, people had with black Ariel could be described as "fatigue" regarding the over the top never ending need to change the race, gender or sexuality of so many characters, just for DEI sake. I do think the glaring double standard in Hollywood is annoying to a lot of people though. There would certainly be outrage if the shoe was on the other foot, and black/brown characters were being increasingly exchanged for white.

I personally didn't notice any "uproar" over the race of The Little Mermaid...just a few funny memes similar to Tom Hanks playing MLK (and I think this was more a response to Snow White). Among my conservative friends and family, some just thought the live version of Little Mermaid sucked and some thought it was pretty good.

Another Doug said:

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Some Junkie Cosmonaut said:

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Good thing you guys aren't biased…

Another Doug said:

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I am left and read supposedly liberal news, the left was not "troubled" by Top Gun politics in any significant way. It was even nominated for best picture by the uber-left academy. Only minor gripe I had was the typical bowing down to China that is unavoidable these days.

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Rocag said:

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Personally I despise the whole "let's make a live action remake of every cartoon we've ever made" aspect and I doubt I'm the only one. But beyond that, conservatives were out in full force well before the movie even came out deriding it as being woke.

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I don't know what you are trying to say.

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Maybe try thinking harder.

Some Junkie Cosmonaut said:

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Another Doug said:

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Some Junkie Cosmonaut said:

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Good thing you guys aren't biased…

Another Doug said:

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I am left and read supposedly liberal news, the left was not "troubled" by Top Gun politics in any significant way. It was even nominated for best picture by the uber-left academy. Only minor gripe I had was the typical bowing down to China that is unavoidable these days.

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Rocag said:

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Personally I despise the whole "let's make a live action remake of every cartoon we've ever made" aspect and I doubt I'm the only one. But beyond that, conservatives were out in full force well before the movie even came out deriding it as being woke.

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I don't know what you are trying to say.

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Maybe try thinking harder.

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I think you just misread the post and assumed there was something ironic in it and now are doubling down and hoping no one notices.

Another Doug said:

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I am left and read supposedly liberal news, the left was not "troubled" by Top Gun politics in any significant way. It was even nominated for best picture by the uber-left academy. Only minor gripe I had was the typical bowing down to China that is unavoidable these days.

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In your mind every right of center person who thought the new Little Mermaid was lame and that they should have either not made it or made it more faithful to the animated version is secretly or overtly racist, but you think the Left was cool with Top Gun when you can easily go look on Twitter or Reddit and see thousands of examples of people who hated it because it didn't push the envelope like they want every single movie and show to do. I'm glad if you weren't troubled by it, but you're not going to catch the woke left complimenting Top Gun Maverick.

Cliff.Booth said:

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Another Doug said:

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I am left and read supposedly liberal news, the left was not "troubled" by Top Gun politics in any significant way. It was even nominated for best picture by the uber-left academy. Only minor gripe I had was the typical bowing down to China that is unavoidable these days.

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In your mind every right of center person who thought the new Little Mermaid was lame and that they should have either not made it or made it more faithful to the animated version is secretly or overtly racist, but you think the Left was cool with Top Gun when you can easily go look on Twitter or Reddit and see thousands of examples of people who hated it because it didn't push the envelope like they want every single movie and show to do. I'm glad if you weren't troubled by it, but you're not going to catch the woke left complimenting Top Gun Maverick.

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Cliff.Booth said:

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Which part didn't make sense to you?

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yes

That sure is a lot of words you're putting in his mouth..

I meant that I think you and others on the Left both exaggerate and misconstrue why people didn't like the new Little Mermaid, and I think you're being disingenuous acting as though woke Hollywood approved of Top Gun Mav.

Cliff.Booth said:

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I meant that I think you and others on the Left both exaggerate and misconstrue why people didn't like the new Little Mermaid, and I think you're being disingenuous acting as though woke Hollywood approved of Top Gun Mav.

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you mean like getting 96% on RT, being the belle of Cannes, getting 6 Oscar nominations (1 win). You realize the other post you quoted wasn't me right?

Cliff.Booth said:

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It was an amazing movie in every way, but a lot of people on the left didn't appreciate that it didn't check boxes on their typical checklist. Again, go back and read threads on Twitter and Reddit about it. It's hilarious.

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Spoiler alert, Twitter and Reddit isn't real life. It is literally an algorithm that gives you what you want to read.

Another Doug said:

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Cliff.Booth said:

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Another Doug said:

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I am left and read supposedly liberal news, the left was not "troubled" by Top Gun politics in any significant way. It was even nominated for best picture by the uber-left academy. Only minor gripe I had was the typical bowing down to China that is unavoidable these days.

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In your mind every right of center person who thought the new Little Mermaid was lame and that they should have either not made it or made it more faithful to the animated version is secretly or overtly racist, but you think the Left was cool with Top Gun when you can easily go look on Twitter or Reddit and see thousands of examples of people who hated it because it didn't push the envelope like they want every single movie and show to do. I'm glad if you weren't troubled by it, but you're not going to catch the woke left complimenting Top Gun Maverick.

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Intentionally obtuse?

BadMoonRisin said:

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Dang. This thread just keeps going on and on and on.

Movie was OK. 7/10. Yeah, it brings attention to child trafficking that should make anyone squirm. I have two young children and the subject matter made me want to jump into a murderous rage to save the beleaguered kids and save the day. That's what film does -- evokes emotions that we didnt know we had.

But at the end of the day, it's a movie. Based on a true story. And a decent one.

I dont get why people on the previous 35 pages of this thread dont get that we have more in common than we do apart. It's ridiculous.

Child trafficking is bad. No one is defending that. People that dont like this movie should be able to say it. Some might attack the messenger instead of the message, but who cares? This is why the board is here. To talk about film.

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This is not at all the case IMO. It is insane how divided we are, and it seems to get worse with each passing day. Liberals and conservatives can't even agree on one basic concrete reality. The newly appointed liberal SCOTUS judge does not know what a woman is , because "she's not a biologist". And we have almost zero similar visions or desires for the country or our culture as a whole. We have NEVER been more divided ideologically and culturally. Young men from the north and south killing each other during the civil war had MUCH more in common ideologically and culturally.

We are a powder keg that has a very good chance of erupting if we ever fall on truly hard times economically. The left needs to stand down with the increasingly crazy sh** they embrace., advocate for, and vote for. They have drifted into fringe territory as a whole...while the right has drifted more towards the center. They will deny and weep and gnash teeth over this, but it is true. Anyone with eyeballs and a functioning brain can see it.

Urban Ag said:

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Rocag said:

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"Non-woke" is explicitly conservative and right wing to begin with because it's only the right wing having panic attacks against "wokeness". All you have to do is listen to all of the things being described as "woke" by conservative commentators. The mere existence of minorities and LGBT people isn't "woke". A show having a cast that isn't entirely white isn't "woke". Lots of examples of white actors playing non-white roles that the "woke" brigade never had any issues with but whenever it happens the other way around it is "wokeness" and has to be opposed.

I have no issue with politically neutral films. I'd argue that most are.

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Something has gone terribly wrong when I have to read posts like this.

Way back in yesteryear, what we called the "80's and 90's", these people you label "minorities" were quite common in entertainment media. And in my white bread household with conservative Republican parents, I seem to recall we all liked Eddie Murphy movies, Webster, Different Strokes, The Cosby Show, Fresh Prince, etc. As I noted on F16, 1987's Predator had literally the most diverse cast in Hollywood history. And no one even noticed. We didn't care. Will Smith was the standard bearer. Hammer and Whitney.

Something happened since then.

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Go watch the documentary about the Challenger crew. NASA was more progressive in the 1980s than most of the "progressives" of today. They believed in meritocracy and they ONLY put the best crewmembers on the shuttle. One happened to be a woman, one was of Asian descent, etc.

That is what true diversity looked like. Not this stupid idiot.



This is person is a stupid, ******ed idiot in his late 60's, pretending to be a woman who is fooling absolutely nobody, except the same idiots that would pretend that wearing a t-shirt fabric over your face will protect them from a respiratory virus.

This is not "diversity". It's lunacy. And anyone with a brain should be able to call this out as idiocy...yet...

BadMoonRisin said:

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Urban Ag said:

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Rocag said:

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"Non-woke" is explicitly conservative and right wing to begin with because it's only the right wing having panic attacks against "wokeness". All you have to do is listen to all of the things being described as "woke" by conservative commentators. The mere existence of minorities and LGBT people isn't "woke". A show having a cast that isn't entirely white isn't "woke". Lots of examples of white actors playing non-white roles that the "woke" brigade never had any issues with but whenever it happens the other way around it is "wokeness" and has to be opposed.

I have no issue with politically neutral films. I'd argue that most are.

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Something has gone terribly wrong when I have to read posts like this.

Way back in yesteryear, what we called the "80's and 90's", these people you label "minorities" were quite common in entertainment media. And in my white bread household with conservative Republican parents, I seem to recall we all liked Eddie Murphy movies, Webster, Different Strokes, The Cosby Show, Fresh Prince, etc. As I noted on F16, 1987's Predator had literally the most diverse cast in Hollywood history. And no one even noticed. We didn't care. Will Smith was the standard bearer. Hammer and Whitney.

Something happened since then.

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Go watch the documentary about the Challenger crew. NASA was more progressive in the 1980s than most of the "progressives" of today. They believed in meritocracy and they ONLY put the best crewmembers on the shuttle. One happened to be a woman, one was of Asian descent, etc.

That is what true diversity looked like. Not this stupid idiot.



This is person is a stupid, ******ed idiot in his late 50's, pretending to be a woman.

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Silver Spoons, Facts of Life...could go on and on...it's crazy how diverse casts were as far back as the early 80's. And I don't know one f-ing person who had any problem with it. And everyone loved Family Matters and Fresh Prince.

This modern over-compensating sh** is just completely manufactured and over the top.